Can Vonage et al. be used FROM foreign countries?

Discussion in 'VOIP' started by Ramon F Herrera, Jul 3, 2005.

  1. I was told something that I find hard to believe:
    Supposedly Vonage and the other VoIP telcos perform a traceroute and if
    they determine that the SIP phone's IP address is outside the US (and
    that's VERY hard to determine), then the service is not provided.

    Any truth to that?

    -Ramon
     
    Ramon F Herrera, Jul 3, 2005
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Ramon F Herrera wrote:
    > I was told something that I find hard to believe:
    > Supposedly Vonage and the other VoIP telcos perform a traceroute and if
    > they determine that the SIP phone's IP address is outside the US (and
    > that's VERY hard to determine), then the service is not provided.
    >
    > Any truth to that?


    Determining the geografic location of an IP address is not that hard,
    unless special precautions (VPN, proxying etc.) are taken: there are
    several methods providing reasonable guesses. For example,
    http://www.hostip.info/api/rough.html?ip=24.128.127.111 locates you at
    Somerville, MA, whereas http://www.bbox.ch/default.asp?m=15 traces you
    at Mt Laurel, NJ (which is the place of your ISP, Comcast Cable
    Communications LLC).

    The question is: why should Vonage decline to serve a new customer,
    provided that the bills get paid? In no case would they have to bear a
    bigger cost for non-US customers, given the way the Internet works.

    Enzo
     
    Enzo Michelangeli, Jul 4, 2005
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Ramon F Herrera <> wrote:

    > I was told something that I find hard to believe:
    > Supposedly Vonage and the other VoIP telcos perform a traceroute and if
    > they determine that the SIP phone's IP address is outside the US (and
    > that's VERY hard to determine), then the service is not provided.
    >
    > Any truth to that?


    they would not use traceroute to do that; there are other means of
    making an educated guess to the country of origin of an IP address.
    This said, I remember Vonage explicitly mentioning on their web pages
    the option of using their phone service while travelling outside the US.
    They just mentioned that they would not take subscribers with non-US
    postal addresses, i.e. did not maket their service outside the US.
    I do not know whether this is still on their web pages. In any case I
    think whar you heard is not true.

    --
    Georg Schwarz http://home.pages.de/~schwarz/
    +49 178 8545053
     
    Georg Schwarz, Jul 4, 2005
    #3
  4. On 3 Jul 2005 16:14:05 -0700, "Enzo Michelangeli"
    <-ip.com> wrote:

    >The question is: why should Vonage decline to serve a new customer,
    >provided that the bills get paid?


    taxation and regulatory issues perhaps. If for example they were
    required to provide a 911 service with some sort of location data, or
    if a jurisdiction banned VoIP or applied a tax or USO fee - I could
    see why they might not want the hassle of subscribers in Nepal or
    wherever.

    Phil
    --
    spamcop.net address commissioned 18/06/04
    Come on down !
     
    Phil Thompson, Jul 4, 2005
    #4
  5. Phil Thompson wrote:
    > On 3 Jul 2005 16:14:05 -0700, "Enzo Michelangeli"
    > <-ip.com> wrote:
    >
    > >The question is: why should Vonage decline to serve a new customer,
    > >provided that the bills get paid?

    >
    > taxation and regulatory issues perhaps. If for example they were
    > required to provide a 911 service with some sort of location data, or
    > if a jurisdiction banned VoIP or applied a tax or USO fee - I could
    > see why they might not want the hassle of subscribers in Nepal or
    > wherever.


    This is true, but I seriously doubt that US regulations could apply to
    subscribers outside the US territory. This both if we accept a "benign"
    view of regulation (to protect own citizens from abuse -- hardly
    applicable to citizens in other jurisdictions) and a "realistic" one in
    the spirit of the Nobel laureate Robert Lucas (who once said he'd never
    seen a regulator who actually gives a damn about consumers). I
    personally suspect that mandatory 911 services etc. are just expedients
    to protect the incumbents (conventional telcos), so why should a US
    regulator bother and do anything to prevent a US company from competing
    with a foreign telco?

    Enzo

    P.S. This case of less-than-honest motives is quite enlightening:
    http://www.teletruth.org/USF.html
     
    Enzo Michelangeli, Jul 5, 2005
    #5
  6. On 4 Jul 2005 18:55:57 -0700, "Enzo Michelangeli"
    <-ip.com> wrote:

    >so why should a US
    >regulator bother and do anything to prevent a US company from competing
    >with a foreign telco?


    no reason, however requiring them to produce 911 location data for all
    theri subscribers could be an issue if, for example, a European
    subscriber declined to provide it.

    Also Vonage charge differently in different markets, so they don't
    want to compete with themselves for example in the UK.

    Phil
    --
    spamcop.net address commissioned 18/06/04
    Come on down !
     
    Phil Thompson, Jul 5, 2005
    #6
  7. Ramon F Herrera

    Miguel Cruz Guest

    Ramon F Herrera <> wrote:
    > I was told something that I find hard to believe:
    > Supposedly Vonage and the other VoIP telcos perform a traceroute and if
    > they determine that the SIP phone's IP address is outside the US (and
    > that's VERY hard to determine), then the service is not provided.
    >
    > Any truth to that?


    No, of course not.

    1) A traceroute? They'd look at the AS number.

    2) They specifically say in their support pages that you can take it with
    you when you travel overseas.

    3) I've done it.

    miguel
    --
    Hit The Road! Photos from 36 countries on 5 continents: http://travel.u.nu
    Latest photos: Queens Day in Amsterdam; the Grand Canyon; Amman, Jordan
     
    Miguel Cruz, Jul 5, 2005
    #7
  8. Miguel Cruz <> wrote:

    > 1) A traceroute? They'd look at the AS number.


    which is not 100% accurate either, BTW (but admittingly worth a good
    guess)

    --
    Georg Schwarz http://home.pages.de/~schwarz/
    +49 178 8545053
     
    Georg Schwarz, Jul 9, 2005
    #8
  9. Ramon F Herrera

    Miguel Cruz Guest

    Georg Schwarz <> wrote:
    > Miguel Cruz <> wrote:
    >> 1) A traceroute? They'd look at the AS number.

    >
    > which is not 100% accurate either, BTW (but admittingly worth a good
    > guess)


    Right, the point is that it's much faster.

    miguel
    --
    Hit The Road! Photos from 36 countries on 5 continents: http://travel.u.nu
    Latest photos: Queens Day in Amsterdam; the Grand Canyon; Amman, Jordan
     
    Miguel Cruz, Jul 9, 2005
    #9
    1. Advertising

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

It takes just 2 minutes to sign up (and it's free!). Just click the sign up button to choose a username and then you can ask your own questions on the forum.
Similar Threads
  1. Ramon F Herrera
    Replies:
    11
    Views:
    687
    Walter Roberson
    Jul 6, 2005
  2. wuchieh
    Replies:
    3
    Views:
    374
    Black Baptist
    Mar 6, 2004
  3. Frank
    Replies:
    1
    Views:
    608
    Ivor Jones
    Jan 13, 2007
  4. KOS
    Replies:
    8
    Views:
    1,117
    sandy58
    May 21, 2009
  5. Gordon Henderson

    Re: Vonage question - multiple sockets on vonage

    Gordon Henderson, Feb 11, 2010, in forum: UK VOIP
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    1,117
    Gordon Henderson
    Feb 11, 2010
Loading...

Share This Page