Bye Bye Xtra

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Who Am I, Jan 14, 2007.

  1. Who Am I

    Who Am I Guest

    Tried to watch Steve Jobs webcast....... and well couldn't.

    I am PAYING for Go Large, ie "as fast as your line will allow", which
    according to my ADSL modem is about 6150kb/sec. HOWEVER, this does not
    allow streaming video because..... wait for it...real world tests show I
    am getting between 82kb/s and 94kb/s (ie less than 1/60th of my line
    speed), though I do get 127kb/s UPLOAD speed.


    Now the very Indian sounding person at Xtra told me that this was infact
    NORMAL... well its a known problem, BUT if I care to give Xtra MORE
    money I can go on a capped plan where I will actualy get the speed that
    I am paying for.

    Now, I ask, why would I do this, pay more to a company that has shown
    that it is incapable of supplying what they are selling.

    AM I going to pay more money.... yes, but it will be to Orcon, so both
    my ADSL and my tolls have been shifted to Orcon.

    It is time the government stepped in and forced XTRA to become a
    separate company and not have Telecom subsidise it. If they had to
    compete on an equal footing with all the other ISPs (ie actually had to
    make a profit to stay in business) then Xtra would have to improve its
    quality, reliability, and actually deliver on its promises.
    Who Am I, Jan 14, 2007
    #1
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  2. Who Am I

    whome Guest

    "Who Am I" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Tried to watch Steve Jobs webcast....... and well couldn't.
    >
    > I am PAYING for Go Large, ie "as fast as your line will allow", which
    > according to my ADSL modem is about 6150kb/sec. HOWEVER, this does not
    > allow streaming video because..... wait for it...real world tests show I
    > am getting between 82kb/s and 94kb/s (ie less than 1/60th of my line
    > speed), though I do get 127kb/s UPLOAD speed.
    >
    >
    > Now the very Indian sounding person at Xtra told me that this was infact
    > NORMAL... well its a known problem, BUT if I care to give Xtra MORE
    > money I can go on a capped plan where I will actualy get the speed that
    > I am paying for.
    >
    > Now, I ask, why would I do this, pay more to a company that has shown
    > that it is incapable of supplying what they are selling.
    >
    > AM I going to pay more money.... yes, but it will be to Orcon, so both
    > my ADSL and my tolls have been shifted to Orcon.
    >
    > It is time the government stepped in and forced XTRA to become a
    > separate company and not have Telecom subsidise it. If they had to
    > compete on an equal footing with all the other ISPs (ie actually had to
    > make a profit to stay in business) then Xtra would have to improve its
    > quality, reliability, and actually deliver on its promises.



    Tell us what Orcon are like after a month or so.

    What plan did you go on?
    whome, Jan 14, 2007
    #2
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  3. Who Am I

    Fred Guest

    "Who Am I" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Tried to watch Steve Jobs webcast....... and well couldn't.
    >
    > I am PAYING for Go Large, ie "as fast as your line will allow", which
    > according to my ADSL modem is about 6150kb/sec. HOWEVER, this does not
    > allow streaming video because..... wait for it...real world tests show I
    > am getting between 82kb/s and 94kb/s (ie less than 1/60th of my line
    > speed), though I do get 127kb/s UPLOAD speed.
    >
    >
    > Now the very Indian sounding person at Xtra told me that this was infact
    > NORMAL... well its a known problem,


    Bet he didn't. These clowns don't have the word 'problem' in their
    vocabulary. It's a known issue.
    Fred, Jan 14, 2007
    #3
  4. Who Am I

    Earl Grey Guest

    Who Am I wrote:

    >
    > It is time the government stepped in and forced XTRA to become a
    > separate company and not have Telecom subsidise it. If they had to
    > compete on an equal footing with all the other ISPs (ie actually had to
    > make a profit to stay in business) then Xtra would have to improve its
    > quality, reliability, and actually deliver on its promises.


    Have you been in a coma for a while ?
    Earl Grey, Jan 14, 2007
    #4
  5. Who Am I

    Who Am I Guest

    In article <>,
    "whome" <> wrote:

    > "Who Am I" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > Tried to watch Steve Jobs webcast....... and well couldn't.
    > >
    > > I am PAYING for Go Large, ie "as fast as your line will allow", which
    > > according to my ADSL modem is about 6150kb/sec. HOWEVER, this does not
    > > allow streaming video because..... wait for it...real world tests show I
    > > am getting between 82kb/s and 94kb/s (ie less than 1/60th of my line
    > > speed), though I do get 127kb/s UPLOAD speed.
    > >
    > >
    > > Now the very Indian sounding person at Xtra told me that this was infact
    > > NORMAL... well its a known problem, BUT if I care to give Xtra MORE
    > > money I can go on a capped plan where I will actualy get the speed that
    > > I am paying for.
    > >
    > > Now, I ask, why would I do this, pay more to a company that has shown
    > > that it is incapable of supplying what they are selling.
    > >
    > > AM I going to pay more money.... yes, but it will be to Orcon, so both
    > > my ADSL and my tolls have been shifted to Orcon.
    > >
    > > It is time the government stepped in and forced XTRA to become a
    > > separate company and not have Telecom subsidise it. If they had to
    > > compete on an equal footing with all the other ISPs (ie actually had to
    > > make a profit to stay in business) then Xtra would have to improve its
    > > quality, reliability, and actually deliver on its promises.

    >
    >
    > Tell us what Orcon are like after a month or so.
    >
    > What plan did you go on?


    The Max/Max with zero surprises.By shifting my tolls as well its
    $59/month only $10 over what I am paying. However I will then have
    usenet news again at home.
    Who Am I, Jan 14, 2007
    #5
  6. Who Am I

    whome Guest

    "Who Am I" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > In article <>,
    > "whome" <> wrote:
    >
    >> "Who Am I" <> wrote in message
    >> news:...
    >> > Tried to watch Steve Jobs webcast....... and well couldn't.
    >> >
    >> > I am PAYING for Go Large, ie "as fast as your line will allow", which
    >> > according to my ADSL modem is about 6150kb/sec. HOWEVER, this does not
    >> > allow streaming video because..... wait for it...real world tests show
    >> > I
    >> > am getting between 82kb/s and 94kb/s (ie less than 1/60th of my line
    >> > speed), though I do get 127kb/s UPLOAD speed.
    >> >
    >> >
    >> > Now the very Indian sounding person at Xtra told me that this was
    >> > infact
    >> > NORMAL... well its a known problem, BUT if I care to give Xtra MORE
    >> > money I can go on a capped plan where I will actualy get the speed that
    >> > I am paying for.
    >> >
    >> > Now, I ask, why would I do this, pay more to a company that has shown
    >> > that it is incapable of supplying what they are selling.
    >> >
    >> > AM I going to pay more money.... yes, but it will be to Orcon, so both
    >> > my ADSL and my tolls have been shifted to Orcon.
    >> >
    >> > It is time the government stepped in and forced XTRA to become a
    >> > separate company and not have Telecom subsidise it. If they had to
    >> > compete on an equal footing with all the other ISPs (ie actually had to
    >> > make a profit to stay in business) then Xtra would have to improve its
    >> > quality, reliability, and actually deliver on its promises.

    >>
    >>
    >> Tell us what Orcon are like after a month or so.
    >>
    >> What plan did you go on?

    >
    > The Max/Max with zero surprises.By shifting my tolls as well its
    > $59/month only $10 over what I am paying. However I will then have
    > usenet news again at home.



    Pah! 0 surprises? This is not zero shock. This is , use more than 20gig and
    we kick you.


    From their site...

    How does the reasonable use policy work for the ZeroShock plan?
    This plan is designed for people who want to enjoy the internet without
    worrying about being surprised by how much it costs at the end of the month.

    With that in mind we created a plan which is charged the same each month,
    but if people use an unreasonably large amount of data, which we define as
    more than 20GB in one month, we will contact you and let you know that this
    isn't the right plan for you. You can choose to slow down on your internet
    usage, or get moved onto another plan that better suits your needs.

    If you continue to use an unreasonable amount of data we will move you onto
    another plan and you won't be able to move back onto this plan.
    whome, Jan 14, 2007
    #6
  7. Who Am I

    whome Guest

    >
    > The Max/Max with zero surprises.By shifting my tolls as well its
    > $59/month only $10 over what I am paying. However I will then have
    > usenet news again at home.


    Did you look at telstraclear pdq?

    Unlimited speed for $44, and, $10 for each 10gig you use.

    Although , i guess if you plan on using under 20gig then orcon no suprises
    looks quite good.
    whome, Jan 14, 2007
    #7
  8. Who Am I

    Who Am I Guest

    In article <>,
    "whome" <> wrote:


    > Pah! 0 surprises? This is not zero shock. This is , use more than 20gig and
    > we kick you.
    >


    Well we use 7-10 g /month so its a big overhead at this stage.
    Who Am I, Jan 14, 2007
    #8
  9. Who Am I

    Vista Guest

    "whome" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > >
    >> The Max/Max with zero surprises.By shifting my tolls as well its
    >> $59/month only $10 over what I am paying. However I will then have
    >> usenet news again at home.

    >
    > Did you look at telstraclear pdq?
    >
    > Unlimited speed for $44, and, $10 for each 10gig you use.
    >
    > Although , i guess if you plan on using under 20gig then orcon no suprises
    > looks quite good.
    >
    >
    >


    Telstras actually wose than telecom for customer service, and they are also
    Australian owned, unlike telecom that has lots of NZ shareholders. Don't
    telstra/paradise have a really bad newsgroup service?
    Vista, Jan 14, 2007
    #9
  10. Who Am I

    Who Am I Guest

    In article <>,
    "whome" <> wrote:

    > >
    > > The Max/Max with zero surprises.By shifting my tolls as well its
    > > $59/month only $10 over what I am paying. However I will then have
    > > usenet news again at home.

    >
    > Did you look at telstraclear pdq?
    >
    > Unlimited speed for $44, and, $10 for each 10gig you use.
    >
    > Although , i guess if you plan on using under 20gig then orcon no suprises
    > looks quite good.


    Yep, as do the 2 months free access.
    Who Am I, Jan 14, 2007
    #10
  11. Who Am I

    David Empson Guest

    Who Am I <> wrote:

    > Tried to watch Steve Jobs webcast....... and well couldn't.
    >
    > I am PAYING for Go Large, ie "as fast as your line will allow", which
    > according to my ADSL modem is about 6150kb/sec. HOWEVER, this does not
    > allow streaming video because..... wait for it...real world tests show I
    > am getting between 82kb/s and 94kb/s (ie less than 1/60th of my line
    > speed), though I do get 127kb/s UPLOAD speed.


    Yes, as far as I'm concerned, this "Go Large" plan is a complete hoax
    and someone should take Telecom to court for selling a product which is
    not usable.

    I tried it for about three weeks (on Actrix, who are just on selling the
    Telecom Go Large plan) and it was very similar to what you described.
    Completely unusable during peak periods (for simple web browsing),
    sluggish at relatively quiet times (e.g. 2 in morning) and with random
    DNS delays or failures at any time which caused connection problems.

    I switched back to a normal plan (and paid a lot more for the privilege)
    and there is no comparison.

    Actrix's normal CyberJet plans are run to a larger extent by Actrix
    themselves, but they are still dependent on Telecom for the physical
    ADSL connection to the customer.

    The same goes for all other ISPs offering residential ADSL services.

    TelstraClear might be an exception, but in Wellington and Christchurch
    they sell cable modem services on their network and don't offer ADSL to
    customers unless they don't have cable service in that area. In this
    case they are on-selling Telecom's ADSL connection. They might be able
    to supply their own independent DSL service to business customers (we
    have something like this at work).

    > Now the very Indian sounding person at Xtra told me that this was infact
    > NORMAL... well its a known problem, BUT if I care to give Xtra MORE
    > money I can go on a capped plan where I will actualy get the speed that
    > I am paying for.
    >
    > Now, I ask, why would I do this, pay more to a company that has shown
    > that it is incapable of supplying what they are selling.
    >
    > AM I going to pay more money.... yes, but it will be to Orcon, so both
    > my ADSL and my tolls have been shifted to Orcon.


    That will mean you are paying less money in total to Telecom, but they
    are still getting a large chunk of it for providing the telephone
    network and ADSL service (plus the international and maybe national and
    regional links).

    > It is time the government stepped in and forced XTRA to become a
    > separate company and not have Telecom subsidise it.


    Xtra isn't the problem, except in Telecom's ability to push it as the
    default ISP for telephone customers.

    There are two main reasons that Go Large is so bad:

    1. Telecom's backhaul network is overloaded.
    2. International traffic is expensive.

    Dealing with these issues requires network traffic to be prioritised so
    that customers on unlimited ADSL plans like Go Large have lower priority
    than people on normal plans where you have to pay more or get slowed
    down when you use up your data allocation.

    --
    David Empson
    David Empson, Jan 15, 2007
    #11
  12. Who Am I

    jasen Guest

    On 2007-01-15, David Empson <> wrote:

    > TelstraClear might be an exception, but in Wellington and Christchurch
    > they sell cable modem services on their network and don't offer ADSL to
    > customers unless they don't have cable service in that area. In this
    > case they are on-selling Telecom's ADSL connection. They might be able
    > to supply their own independent DSL service to business customers (we
    > have something like this at work).


    They sell do dsl on streets with cable. (well it looked like cable in december)
    maybe they don't sell it to customers with cable?

    Bye.
    Jasen
    jasen, Jan 16, 2007
    #12
  13. Who Am I

    Dave Taylor Guest

    (David Empson) wrote in news:1hrzk6l.ni72ns1celm3hN%
    :

    > There are two main reasons that Go Large is so bad:
    >
    > 1. Telecom's backhaul network is overloaded.


    Oversubscribed?


    > 2. International traffic is expensive.


    I heard Southern Cross was paid off. This affects all internet users in
    NZ. It is certainly expensive for a generic consumer. I think the reality
    is that there are profit margins in the costs.



    --
    Ciao, Dave
    Dave Taylor, Jan 16, 2007
    #13
  14. In article <Xns98BBFB47D0daveytaynospamplshot@203.97.37.6>,
    says...
    >
    > I heard Southern Cross was paid off. This affects all internet users in
    > NZ. It is certainly expensive for a generic consumer. I think the reality
    > is that there are profit margins in the costs.
    >


    And they won't be marginal, either. Those people are doing what they are doing
    in order to squeeze as much net-profit out of us as they can barely just get
    away with - not because they are running a social service or because they are
    here as a communally owned infrastructure asset. <sigh> I didn't much care for
    the telecom of old when nz post was running it ever so inefficiently, but
    things were already moving towards modernisation when Douglas and Co sold them
    off for peanuts. Gods, but those neo-cons are thick. About as much vision as a
    short sighted badger on a moonless night. Then again, a state-owned telecom
    might be not one little bit better at all.

    -P.

    --
    =========================================
    firstname dot lastname at gmail fullstop com
    Peter Huebner, Jan 16, 2007
    #14
  15. Who Am I

    David Empson Guest

    Dave Taylor <> wrote:

    > (David Empson) wrote in news:1hrzk6l.ni72ns1celm3hN%
    > :
    >
    > > There are two main reasons that Go Large is so bad:
    > >
    > > 1. Telecom's backhaul network is overloaded.

    >
    > Oversubscribed?


    Yes, that would be a better description.

    > > 2. International traffic is expensive.

    >
    > I heard Southern Cross was paid off. This affects all internet users in
    > NZ. It is certainly expensive for a generic consumer. I think the reality
    > is that there are profit margins in the costs.


    No dispute there. I think there are _significant_ profit margins in
    international traffic for Telecom and the other Southern Cross partners.

    --
    David Empson
    David Empson, Jan 16, 2007
    #15
  16. Who Am I

    whoisthis Guest

    In article <1hs2u14.70x7ta15xom9wN%>,
    (David Empson) wrote:

    > Dave Taylor <> wrote:
    >
    > > (David Empson) wrote in news:1hrzk6l.ni72ns1celm3hN%
    > > :
    > >
    > > > There are two main reasons that Go Large is so bad:
    > > >
    > > > 1. Telecom's backhaul network is overloaded.

    > >
    > > Oversubscribed?

    >
    > Yes, that would be a better description.
    >
    > > > 2. International traffic is expensive.

    > >
    > > I heard Southern Cross was paid off. This affects all internet users in
    > > NZ. It is certainly expensive for a generic consumer. I think the reality
    > > is that there are profit margins in the costs.

    >
    > No dispute there. I think there are _significant_ profit margins in
    > international traffic for Telecom and the other Southern Cross partners.


    So much so I heard that Telstra/Clear/Saturn were looking at putting in
    their own fiber to Aussie
    whoisthis, Jan 19, 2007
    #16
  17. Who Am I

    whoisthis Guest

    In article <1hrzk6l.ni72ns1celm3hN%>,
    (David Empson) wrote:


    > Xtra isn't the problem, except in Telecom's ability to push it as the
    > default ISP for telephone customers.
    >


    Well as a power company you can not be a generator, lines company, and
    retailer all at the same time.

    ISPs are an additional service and should be broken away from the phone
    companies.

    > There are two main reasons that Go Large is so bad:
    >
    > 1. Telecom's backhaul network is overloaded.
    > 2. International traffic is expensive.
    >
    > Dealing with these issues requires network traffic to be prioritised so
    > that customers on unlimited ADSL plans like Go Large have lower priority
    > than people on normal plans where you have to pay more or get slowed
    > down when you use up your data allocation.


    Well I am on Orcon now and I am at 7:32pm getting 10-15x the speed I was
    on go-large, ie I am now getting over 1Mb/s as opposed to 84kb/s on the
    go large plan. BOTH plans have "as fast as your line allows", ONE plan
    was obviously NOT achieving this by a significant margin.
    whoisthis, Jan 19, 2007
    #17
  18. Who Am I

    Earl Grey Guest

    whoisthis wrote:
    > In article <1hs2u14.70x7ta15xom9wN%>,
    > (David Empson) wrote:
    >
    >> Dave Taylor <> wrote:
    >>
    >>> (David Empson) wrote in news:1hrzk6l.ni72ns1celm3hN%
    >>> :
    >>>
    >>>> There are two main reasons that Go Large is so bad:
    >>>>
    >>>> 1. Telecom's backhaul network is overloaded.
    >>> Oversubscribed?

    >> Yes, that would be a better description.
    >>
    >>>> 2. International traffic is expensive.
    >>> I heard Southern Cross was paid off. This affects all internet users in
    >>> NZ. It is certainly expensive for a generic consumer. I think the reality
    >>> is that there are profit margins in the costs.

    >> No dispute there. I think there are _significant_ profit margins in
    >> international traffic for Telecom and the other Southern Cross partners.

    >
    > So much so I heard that Telstra/Clear/Saturn were looking at putting in
    > their own fiber to Aussie


    How about the rest of the way ?
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Southern-X-Cable-Route.png
    Earl Grey, Jan 19, 2007
    #18
  19. In message <>, whoisthis wrote:

    > ISPs are an additional service and should be broken away from the phone
    > companies.


    I think you'd get lots of complaints from ISPs like iHug, Slingshot etc who
    want to offer you toll services to go along with their broadband.
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Jan 22, 2007
    #19
  20. Who Am I

    whoisthis Guest

    In article <ep3h8q$gu4$>,
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro <_zealand> wrote:

    > In message <>, whoisthis wrote:
    >
    > > ISPs are an additional service and should be broken away from the phone
    > > companies.

    >
    > I think you'd get lots of complaints from ISPs like iHug, Slingshot etc who
    > want to offer you toll services to go along with their broadband.


    except they do not own the lines etc, so they are NOT a monopoly.
    whoisthis, Jan 23, 2007
    #20
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