Blu-Ray sales tank for good reasons

Discussion in 'DVD Video' started by Gander, May 5, 2008.

  1. Gander

    Gander Guest

    http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/news/2008/05/03/blu-ray-sales-tank-reason

    http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/news/2007/11/22/bd-crack-released

    http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/news/2005/11/03/sony-drm-is-worse-than-you-might-think

    Blu-Ray sales tank for good reasons

    DRM, Price and BD-J

    By Charlie Demerjian: Monday, 05 May 2008, 9:16 AM

    BLU-RAY PLAYER SALES are sucking wind as well they should. According to
    Cnet, sales of the DRM infected format players are dropping like rocks.

    The not so bright people out there had expected sales to skyrocket once the
    format war was done, but it didn't. They thought was people would ignore the
    massive defects of Blu-ray and buy like the dumb sheep that they are,
    handcuffing themselves to the Sony bank account.

    Surprise, it didn't happen. US consumers are still dumb sheep, but this time
    they are realizing what is being done to them and they aren't biting. Sony's
    hope of having 50% of disc sales this year be Blu-ray are more likely to
    happen because of falling DVD sales than rocketing Blu-ray.

    The format has three problems, DRM infections, BD-J and greed. The greed
    part is obvious, Sony won the format war and are trying to charge people
    between 50 and 100% more for a product with marginally better quality. Sure,
    it looks better, and the 0.07% of people with 7.1 channel audio setups will
    be overjoyed, but for the rest, it is a small step at best over an
    upconverting DVD.

    Are you going to buy the DVD version for $16.99 on new release sale or
    $29.99 for the BD? It doesn't take a genius to realize that the next
    iteration of Hollywood Formula #7 with Big Stars #3 and #8 isn't worth it.
    The movie studios have yet to convince me that The Water Horse is worth
    spending my money on at all, much less at twice the price for DRM'd HD
    versions.

    That brings us to the next down side, there is no up, DRM. Every Blu-ray
    disc is DRM infected even if the producer doesn't want it to be, in order to
    get a company to manufacture it, it must be infected. Sony gets an infection
    kickback fee as well, so don't think it is purely for protection unless you
    mean it in the -racket sense.

    Blu-ray DRM infections do not protect anything, Slysoft has cracked it with
    their excellent AnyDVD HD product, something I can't recommend enough.
    Basically, new DRM schemes are broken before you can buy discs with them on
    it, protecting nothing. It will however prevent legitimate users from using
    legally purchased media on legally purchased hardware. If you pirate though,
    no more compatibility issues, once again making Piracy the Better Choice
    (TM)(C)(R).

    Basically the new format has DRM baked in and in your face. It costs you
    money, hurts only legitimate users, and is laughably insecure. Until it is
    abolished, just say no to Blu-ray and spend your money elsewhere, try books
    for example. If you must stoop to the DRM infected media, crack it and run
    it from your HD, it will save you immense frustration.

    The last thing that makes people want to run for the hills is the badly
    broken BD-J abomination. Basically, when Blu-ray was 'finished', it wasn't
    close to done. HD-DVD on the other hand was well thought out and thorough,
    HD had a robust virtual machine that did all the work it needed to, and BD
    had none. Sony rushed a hacked BD v1.1 out, followed by 2.0, and instantly
    obsoleted all the money spent by the early adopters. All except those who
    bought Sony players of course.

    There are two problems with this, other than the fact that morons spent
    money on a Sony format, it works like crap and it phones home, both comprise
    the third negative. Working like crap is the obvious one, to test it, look
    at one of the flagship titles, Pirates of the Caribbean 3. Disney insists on
    BD-J, customer be damned, and it shows. If you click on any of the options
    from the title menu, it pauses, you hear the disc seek, you wait, it loads,
    you wait more, and it decrypts, you wait a little more, and then the menu
    animates. It is nothing short of a disaster that you can't skip. Unless you
    pirate the title, once a gain making piracy the better choice (TM)(R)(C).

    In any case, the BD-J support is so half-assed and broken that using it is
    nothing less than misery, but you also get the BD benefits as well. That is
    incompatibility and higher prices to soothe you while you wait and wait and
    wait. Whoever forced this on people should be shot.

    The other down side is that to support the so called Profile 2.0, you must
    have internet capabilities and access. Anyone here trust Sony? Remember,
    these are the people who unashamedly rootkit paying customers and then tries
    as hard as they can to bury it, but never apologizes.

    With the new BD Profile 2.0, they can run arbitrary code on your player,
    download and install whatever they want (You read the EULA didn't you?), and
    take any data they want. In return, you get the privilege of watching your
    legally purchased media on your legally purchased players. Fair trade,
    right? Once again, Piracy is the Better Choice(R)(TM)(C), it doesn't rat you
    out to unrepentant rootkitters even if they have a EULA behind them this
    time.

    In the end, if you buy Blu-ray, you get a more expensive product that is
    likely incompatible with your hardware, DRM'd to the hilt, slow as dirt and
    it rats you out for good measure. All this for slightly better rez, be still
    my beating heart. Player sales are tanking when they should be soaring and
    Sony is probably wondering why. Caveat emptor.µ
    Gander, May 5, 2008
    #1
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  2. Gander

    Morgan Guest

    "Gander" <> wrote in message
    news:x2JTj.116906$Cj7.51928@pd7urf2no

    > Are you going to buy the DVD version for $16.99 on new
    > release sale or $29.99 for the BD?


    I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more for noticeable and
    desired increase in picture quality. If you don't care about the difference
    then you've got the choice to opt for a DVD instead. I don't see the big
    deal.
    Morgan, May 5, 2008
    #2
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  3. Gander

    RCE Defiant Guest

    "Morgan" <> wrote in message
    news:hlJTj.121375$...
    > "Gander" <> wrote in message
    > news:x2JTj.116906$Cj7.51928@pd7urf2no
    >
    >> Are you going to buy the DVD version for $16.99 on new
    >> release sale or $29.99 for the BD?

    >
    > I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more for noticeable and
    > desired increase in picture quality. If you don't care about the
    > difference then you've got the choice to opt for a DVD instead. I don't
    > see the big deal.


    The big deal is when they are obviously trying to take the piss with the
    diff in price between BD and DVD on the exact same film. It's people's
    choice though innit. If we don't buy it they won't charge it.

    --
    RCE Defiant
    RCE Defiant, May 5, 2008
    #3
  4. Gander

    Klark Kent Guest

    In message news:hlJTj.121375$, "Morgan"
    <> burned some brain cells writing:

    > I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more


    17 - 14 = 3.

    Gotta love that British math. Almost as good as their cars and their food.
    Klark Kent, May 5, 2008
    #4
  5. Gander

    Morgan Guest

    "Klark Kent" <`> wrote in message
    news:Xns9A95A0FFFC652KlarkKent@66.250.146.128
    > In message
    > news:hlJTj.121375$,
    > "Morgan" <> burned some brain cells
    > writing:
    >
    > > I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more

    >
    > 17 - 14 = 3.
    >
    > Gotta love that British math. Almost as good as their
    > cars and their food.


    A typeo rather than my maths. should have read £13.99.
    Morgan, May 5, 2008
    #5
  6. Gander

    Morgan Guest

    "RCE Defiant" <> wrote in message
    news:
    > "Morgan" <> wrote in message
    > news:hlJTj.121375$...
    > > "Gander" <> wrote in message
    > > news:x2JTj.116906$Cj7.51928@pd7urf2no
    > >
    > > > Are you going to buy the DVD version for $16.99 on new
    > > > release sale or $29.99 for the BD?

    > >
    > > I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more for
    > > noticeable and desired increase in picture quality. If
    > > you don't care about the difference then you've got the
    > > choice to opt for a DVD instead. I don't see the big
    > > deal.

    >
    > The big deal is when they are obviously trying to take
    > the piss with the diff in price between BD and DVD on the
    > exact same film. It's people's choice though innit. If
    > we don't buy it they won't charge it.


    But is £4 really an extortionate amount for such a new format. Bearing in
    mind they will currently sell far fewer units when compared to DVD. I
    wouldn't pay full wack for an older film (unless it was a particular
    favorite of mine) But I think £4 more on a new release is fair enough.
    Morgan, May 5, 2008
    #6
  7. Gander

    RCE Defiant Guest

    "Klark Kent" <`> wrote in message
    news:Xns9A95A0FFFC652KlarkKent@66.250.146.128...
    > In message news:hlJTj.121375$, "Morgan"
    > <> burned some brain cells writing:
    >
    >> I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more

    >
    > 17 - 14 = 3.
    >
    > Gotta love that British math. Almost as good as their cars and their
    > food.


    LOL!

    --
    RCE Defiant
    RCE Defiant, May 5, 2008
    #7
  8. Gander

    Michael C Guest

    "Klark Kent" <`> wrote in message
    news:Xns9A95A0FFFC652KlarkKent@66.250.146.128...
    > In message news:hlJTj.121375$, "Morgan"
    > <> burned some brain cells writing:
    >
    >> I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more

    >
    > 17 - 14 = 3.
    >
    > Gotta love that British math. Almost as good as their cars and their
    > food.


    You should see our teeth!
    Michael C, May 5, 2008
    #8
  9. Gander

    scoopex Guest

    Michael C wrote:
    > "Klark Kent" <`> wrote in message
    > news:Xns9A95A0FFFC652KlarkKent@66.250.146.128...
    >> In message news:hlJTj.121375$, "Morgan"
    >> <> burned some brain cells writing:
    >>
    >>> I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more

    >> 17 - 14 = 3.
    >>
    >> Gotta love that British math. Almost as good as their cars and their
    >> food.

    >
    > You should see our teeth!
    >
    >


    much better than fat americans.
    scoopex, May 5, 2008
    #9
  10. Gander

    Pantyhose Guest

    "Michael C" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > "Klark Kent" <`> wrote in message
    > news:Xns9A95A0FFFC652KlarkKent@66.250.146.128...
    >> In message news:hlJTj.121375$, "Morgan"
    >> <> burned some brain cells writing:
    >>
    >>> I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more

    >>
    >> 17 - 14 = 3.
    >>
    >> Gotta love that British math. Almost as good as their cars and their
    >> food.

    >
    > You should see our teeth!
    >


    Everyone on planet earth has the same teeth, it's just in N Amerika they
    spend thousands to fill, straiten, cap, whiten, veneer, replace,
    dentures..etc because were so vain and fake.
    Not many have real original teeth left to nature.

    Beta Ray sucks btw.
    Pantyhose, May 5, 2008
    #10
  11. Gander

    Pantyhose Guest

    "Morgan" <> wrote in message
    news:WBJTj.108939$...
    > "Klark Kent" <`> wrote in message
    > news:Xns9A95A0FFFC652KlarkKent@66.250.146.128
    >> In message
    >> news:hlJTj.121375$,
    >> "Morgan" <> burned some brain cells
    >> writing:
    >>
    >> > I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more

    >>
    >> 17 - 14 = 3.
    >>
    >> Gotta love that British math. Almost as good as their
    >> cars and their food.

    >
    > A typeo rather than my maths. should have read £13.99.


    happens to everyone..
    Pantyhose, May 5, 2008
    #11
  12. Gander

    Morgan Guest

    "Klark Kent" <`> wrote in message
    news:Xns9A95A0FFFC652KlarkKent@66.250.146.128
    > In message
    > news:hlJTj.121375$,
    > "Morgan" <> burned some brain cells
    > writing:
    >
    > > I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more

    >
    > 17 - 14 = 3.
    >
    > Gotta love that British math. Almost as good as their
    > cars and their food.


    Thought I will point out that we have far better Chocolate than you and from
    what I've been told, our cars are far more economical and corner much
    better. Either way I wouldn't get a British or American car. German is
    another matter. I would also comment about our electorate, but the fools in
    London have denied me that ability to do that. Bloody Boris. :)
    Morgan, May 5, 2008
    #12
  13. Gander

    Morgan Guest

    "Tom" <> wrote in message
    news:
    > "Morgan" <> wrote in message
    > news:hlJTj.121375$...
    > > "Gander" <> wrote in message
    > > news:x2JTj.116906$Cj7.51928@pd7urf2no
    > >
    > > > Are you going to buy the DVD version for $16.99 on new
    > > > release sale or $29.99 for the BD?

    > >
    > > I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more for
    > > noticeable and desired increase in picture quality. If
    > > you don't care about the difference then you've got the
    > > choice to opt for a DVD instead. I don't see the big
    > > deal.

    >
    > But you gave s different price than the article (which
    > sounded more like an op-ed piece than a real fact based
    > article). The difference was $29.99 over $16.99, that's almost double the
    > price. Even converted to pounds, you're
    > not going to see the £17.99 price for BD as the
    > difference for a £14.99 DVD, the DVD would be more like
    > £7.99 (or less even).


    That's because I'm using my own figures from BRs I've bought. Most recently
    I am Legend. was £17.99 from both HMV (a *major* UK high street shop) and
    play.com whre as the DVD special edition (the standard was cheaper but less
    extras) was £13.99. This is pretty much the norm for the UK at them moment
    and I'd be surprised if the US was any different. The only massive price
    difference in the UK is on older films that are new to BR but that have been
    out for a long time on DVD.
    Morgan, May 5, 2008
    #13
  14. Gander

    Steve Irving Guest

    scoopex wrote:
    > Michael C wrote:
    >> "Klark Kent" <`> wrote in message
    >> news:Xns9A95A0FFFC652KlarkKent@66.250.146.128...
    >>> In message news:hlJTj.121375$, "Morgan"
    >>> <> burned some brain cells writing:
    >>>
    >>>> I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more
    >>> 17 - 14 = 3.
    >>>
    >>> Gotta love that British math. Almost as good as their cars and their
    >>> food.

    >>
    >> You should see our teeth!
    >>

    >
    > much better than fat americans.


    If they had good dental care, like here in the US, they'd be fat too.

    Well, maybe......if their food was any good <grin>.
    Steve Irving, May 5, 2008
    #14
  15. Gander

    Telstar Guest

    "Morgan" <> wrote in message
    news:bDKTj.108949$...
    > "Klark Kent" <`> wrote in message
    > news:Xns9A95A0FFFC652KlarkKent@66.250.146.128
    >> In message
    >> news:hlJTj.121375$,
    >> "Morgan" <> burned some brain cells
    >> writing:
    >>
    >> > I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more

    >>
    >> 17 - 14 = 3.
    >>
    >> Gotta love that British math. Almost as good as their
    >> cars and their food.

    >
    > Thought I will point out that we have far better Chocolate than you


    I bought a bunch of chocolate brands while in London. They were without
    fail *terrible*. Now Belgium is another matter entirely....
    Telstar, May 6, 2008
    #15
  16. On May 5, 5:04 pm, "Morgan" <> wrote:
    > "Klark Kent" <`> wrote in message
    >
    > news:Xns9A95A0FFFC652KlarkKent@66.250.146.128
    >
    > > In message
    > >news:hlJTj.121375$,
    > > "Morgan" <> burned some brain cells
    > > writing:

    >
    > > > I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more

    >
    > > 17 - 14 = 3.

    >
    > > Gotta love that British math. Almost as good as their
    > > cars and their food.

    >
    > Thought I will point out that we have far better Chocolate than you and from
    > what I've been told, our cars are far more economical and corner much
    > better.


    British chocolate is no better than American chocolate. I like a lot
    of the British candy bars but it's because of what's in them rather
    than the chocolate itself. The Lion Bar rocks. I thought I would like
    those Cadbury Flake bars but they're rather chalky...

    Both are put to shame by Swiss and Belgian chocolate.
    The alMIGHTY N, May 6, 2008
    #16
  17. On May 5, 5:44 pm, "Morgan" <> wrote:
    > "Tom" <> wrote in message
    >
    > news:
    >
    >
    >
    > > "Morgan" <> wrote in message
    > >news:hlJTj.121375$...
    > > > "Gander" <> wrote in message
    > > >news:x2JTj.116906$Cj7.51928@pd7urf2no

    >
    > > > > Are you going to buy the DVD version for $16.99 on new
    > > > > release sale or $29.99 for the BD?

    >
    > > > I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more for
    > > > noticeable and desired increase in picture quality. If
    > > > you don't care about the difference then you've got the
    > > > choice to opt for a DVD instead. I don't see the big
    > > > deal.

    >
    > > But you gave s different price than the article (which
    > > sounded more like an op-ed piece than a real fact based
    > > article). The difference was $29.99 over $16.99, that's almost double the
    > > price. Even converted to pounds, you're
    > > not going to see the £17.99 price for BD as the
    > > difference for a £14.99 DVD, the DVD would be more like
    > > £7.99 (or less even).

    >
    > That's because I'm using my own figures from BRs I've bought. Most recently
    > I am Legend. was £17.99 from both HMV (a *major* UK high street shop) and
    > play.com whre as the DVD special edition (the standard was cheaper but less
    > extras) was £13.99. This is pretty much the norm for the UK at them moment
    > and I'd be surprised if the US was any different. The only massive price
    > difference in the UK is on older films that are new to BR but that have been
    > out for a long time on DVD.


    Blu-Ray movies come in at $34.99+ at retail, compared to DVDs coming
    in at $17.99+ at retail.
    The alMIGHTY N, May 6, 2008
    #17
  18. Gander

    Jordan Guest

    On May 5, 12:16 pm, "Gander" <> wrote:

    > The format has three problems, DRM infections, BD-J and greed.


    Those are all good reasons for Blu-Ray to fail, but they aren't the
    reason it is failing.

    The average consumer has no clue what DRM is or why it's bad. In fact,
    the average consumer will never be affected by DRM.

    The colossal failure of BD-J would only matter if large numbers of
    people were buying discs that didn't work. Fortunately the disc sales
    are so pitiful the state of BD-J doesn't matter.

    No... the reason Blu-Ray is tanking is poor marketing decisions
    combined with a lack of killer applications.

    For some strange reason Sony thinks that kids with PS3s are just going
    to run out and snap up crappy movies like Ghost Rider or Click or
    Resident Evil: Apocalypse. They aren't. In huge numbers they aren't.

    Sony is caught in a deadly catch 22. The public won't buy Blu-Ray
    until the format has decent movies, but the studios are reluctant to
    release decent movies until the user-base is larger.

    I got an email from Universal today announcing their big move to Blu-
    Ray... Care to guess what their first title is?

    Doomsday. 38% on Rotten Tomatoes:
    http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/doomsday/

    Besides the fact that it's yet another crappy movie on Blu-Ray, the
    target demo isn't going to buy it, they already pirated it off the
    Internet months ago.

    - Jordan
    Jordan, May 6, 2008
    #18
  19. Gander

    Strmo Guest

    NEVER buy new technology in the first few years of release. It is always
    over priced and lower quality. Always wait a few years for prices to settle
    to a realistic amount and quality and bug fixes to be improved. If people
    didn't rush out to buy this new stuff prices would come down quicker and
    products would be better. So stop bowing down to manufacturers and being
    ripped off. Please refrain from buying until prices and quality are worth
    it. Because of people rushing out to buy these things I have to wait longer
    until I am not ripped off anymore.

    This high def war had another reason.... there was always going to be one
    winner. So WHY did people rush out and buy one or the other??? Half of them
    were always going to end up with an abandoned format and lose their money!!
    Did you not learn anything from VHS and Betamax? So in future DO NOT BUY
    until the war is won, and manufacturers cannot sell the product until they
    offer it at the right price.

    I have the same gripes with brands like Apple. WHY do people spend more for
    an overpriced product stuck with one phone network so no competition on
    price. Clearly you pay for the brand, but what the hell for. Wait a year or
    two and you'll be able to get better phones from other manufacturers for
    half the price. Same for my mp3, I LOVE my Creative Zen Touch, god knows why
    you would want an iPod to drain your finances on all the overpriced
    accessories that only work for Apple and can only pay DRM songs that dont
    work on non apple mp3s when you can get better products for less price that
    play non drm mp3s.

    I wish people would stop being sheep, stop following the hype, stop handing
    over their wallets to these manufacturers, wait for the quality to go up,
    the price to come down, the competition to increase and allow us the people
    to drive the market instead of these big companies. Buy only when the
    products are ready. Never by products that dont have competition you are
    ripped off.

    I got really carried away there.
    Strmo, May 6, 2008
    #19
  20. Gander

    Sean Black Guest

    In message <nEJTj.108940$>, Morgan
    <> writes
    >"RCE Defiant" <> wrote in message
    >news:
    >> "Morgan" <> wrote in message
    >> news:hlJTj.121375$...
    >> > "Gander" <> wrote in message
    >> > news:x2JTj.116906$Cj7.51928@pd7urf2no
    >> >
    >> > > Are you going to buy the DVD version for $16.99 on new
    >> > > release sale or $29.99 for the BD?
    >> >
    >> > I'll but the £17.99 BR over a £14.99 DVD. £4 more for
    >> > noticeable and desired increase in picture quality. If
    >> > you don't care about the difference then you've got the
    >> > choice to opt for a DVD instead. I don't see the big
    >> > deal.

    >>
    >> The big deal is when they are obviously trying to take
    >> the piss with the diff in price between BD and DVD on the
    >> exact same film. It's people's choice though innit. If
    >> we don't buy it they won't charge it.

    >
    >But is £4 really an extortionate amount for such a new format. Bearing
    >in mind they will currently sell far fewer units when compared to DVD.
    >I wouldn't pay full wack for an older film (unless it was a particular
    >favorite of mine) But I think £4 more on a new release is fair enough.


    Yeah, £4 is reasonable enough. You can usually pick up most new release
    titles for around £18 (unless it's a Fox release of course, most
    expensive, least special features and region coded too!) It's when you
    get older catalogue movies, take Speed for instance, you can get it for
    probably £3 now (certainly less than a fiver, anyway) or on Blu Ray
    you're probably looking at £25-30 on the high street or maybe £17-18
    online, which isn't too bad as long as it's been done properly with a
    decent transfer and a HD soundtrack.
    --
    Sean Black
    Sean Black, May 6, 2008
    #20
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