Bill Gates

Discussion in 'Computer Support' started by EW105, Oct 16, 2005.

  1. EW105

    EW105 Guest

    Being the richest man in the world, was he just at the right place at
    the right time or does he actually have the smarts to be in such a
    position? I've gone through win95, 98 and xp and I have given my pc to
    the kids to deal with it. MS operating systems seem to get better but
    are still crap, for lack of a better word, hence the increasing
    popularity of linux. EVERYONE I know who use MS OS has big problems with
    their PCs. These people all have young kids who browse the net and are
    not techies.
    If IBM had chosen someone else's os back in the 80's....?
    As for me, I've gone to the Dark side and am now using an Imac. Great
    machine, it works and I just use it without any worries. BTW, Macs now
    run on a Unix based OS.
    EW105, Oct 16, 2005
    #1
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  2. EW105

    why? Guest

    On Sun, 16 Oct 2005 09:17:10 -0400, EW105 wrote:

    >Being the richest man in the world, was he just at the right place at
    >the right time or does he actually have the smarts to be in such a


    Right Place Right Time, Business Smarts,

    IBM looking for an OS, he didn't have one, someone else did Bill bought
    it.

    http://inventors.about.com/library/weekly/aa033099.htm

    See the business smarts in action, from the link above -


    Microsoft bought the rights to QDOS for $50,000, keeping the IBM deal a
    secret from Seattle Computer Products.

    Gates then talked IBM into letting Microsoft retain the rights, to
    market MS DOS separate from the IBM PC project, Gates proceeded to make
    a fortune from the licensing of MS-DOS.


    >position? I've gone through win95, 98 and xp and I have given my pc to
    >the kids to deal with it. MS operating systems seem to get better but


    <snip>

    Me
    why?, Oct 16, 2005
    #2
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  3. EW105

    Mitch Guest

    In article <>, EW105
    <> wrote:

    > Being the richest man in the world, was he just at the right place at
    > the right time or does he actually have the smarts to be in such a
    > position?

    Gates got his opportunity because his foresight was different from
    IBM's. He was right, but he was just guessing.
    His skill isn't about the computer industry at all -- that's merely his
    interest. His skill is corporate strategy. And most of his strategies
    are distinctly negative. Bully competitors, buy them out, mire
    competition in court, marketing is more important than product,
    threaten retail, threaten manufacturing, and make huge unsubstantiated
    claims about what your products do or change or give to users.

    Their latest campaign claims that everything you get to do with your
    computer, everything you accomplish or create, even the programs that
    you use, are because of Windows. Arrogant?

    > EVERYONE I know who use MS OS has big problems with
    > their PCs.

    It's amazing, isn't it? And users seem convinced that it is necessary
    and normal and just how it has to be.
    Forgetting about other platforms -- users should be getting a LOT more
    from Microsoft by now. It isn't too much to ask that the OS be stable.
    There don't have to be major conflicts and huge design changes in each
    version. There shouldn't be virus or spyware or security hole issues.

    > If IBM had chosen someone else's os back in the 80's....?

    Gates might have found some other opportunity; he's good enough for
    that. But without the opportunity to take advantage of someone,
    Microsoft would be peers of Lotus or Borland or Corel, and nothing
    more.
    Mitch, Oct 16, 2005
    #3
  4. EW105

    aleX Guest

    EW105 wrote:
    > Being the richest man in the world, was he just at the right place at
    > the right time or does he actually have the smarts to be in such a
    > position? I've gone through win95, 98 and xp and I have given my pc to
    > the kids to deal with it. MS operating systems seem to get better but
    > are still crap, for lack of a better word, hence the increasing
    > popularity of linux. EVERYONE I know who use MS OS has big problems with
    > their PCs. These people all have young kids who browse the net and are
    > not techies.
    > If IBM had chosen someone else's os back in the 80's....?
    > As for me, I've gone to the Dark side and am now using an Imac. Great
    > machine, it works and I just use it without any worries. BTW, Macs now
    > run on a Unix based OS.


    I read an article online where some coders took a look at Gates' code
    way back when Gates actually did the coding for MS products. Maybe it
    was on the 'Eniac' machine for DOS(apologies if this is completely
    wrong, I'm guessing the name) They were impressed, he was obviously a
    very skilled programmer. Of course, once the company grew you have many
    people working on the software, and all the problems that ensue from that.

    That article is probably still around somewhere, it might have been at
    theregister.com, I can't recall.
    aleX, Oct 16, 2005
    #4
  5. EW105

    philo Guest

    EW105 wrote:
    > Being the richest man in the world, was he just at the right place at
    > the right time or does he actually have the smarts to be in such a
    > position?


    Both.
    He was in the right place at the right time...
    but also bright enough to know what to do.


    I've gone through win95, 98 and xp and I have given my pc to
    > the kids to deal with it. MS operating systems seem to get better but
    > are still crap, for lack of a better word, hence the increasing
    > popularity of linux. EVERYONE I know who use MS OS has big problems with
    > their PCs. These people all have young kids who browse the net and are
    > not techies.



    Yep...MS is full of security holes...
    but people barely know there's an alternative.

    > If IBM had chosen someone else's os back in the 80's....?
    > As for me, I've gone to the Dark side and am now using an Imac. Great
    > machine, it works and I just use it without any worries. BTW, Macs now
    > run on a Unix based OS.



    Yep...
    but if a Mac only cost $2 more than a PC...
    no one would buy them
    philo, Oct 16, 2005
    #5
  6. EW105

    philo Guest


    > I read an article online where some coders took a look at Gates' code
    > way back when Gates actually did the coding for MS products. Maybe it
    > was on the 'Eniac'


    Einiac was befe Gate's time...
    that was the very early vacuum tube computer!!!


    machine for DOS(apologies if this is completely
    > wrong, I'm guessing the name) They were impressed, he was obviously a
    > very skilled programmer.


    Yes, he was quite a skillful programmer

    Of course, once the company grew you have many
    > people working on the software, and all the problems that ensue from that.
    >
    > That article is probably still around somewhere, it might have been at
    > theregister.com, I can't recall.
    philo, Oct 16, 2005
    #6
  7. EW105

    aleX Guest

    philo wrote:
    >
    >> I read an article online where some coders took a look at Gates' code
    >> way back when Gates actually did the coding for MS products. Maybe it
    >> was on the 'Eniac'

    >
    >
    > Einiac was befe Gate's time...
    > that was the very early vacuum tube computer!!!


    Yep, sorry for the misinfo, I was guessing. Didn't he write software
    though for the first 'portable' computer? That's the one I meant, with
    the rows of little switches on the front. Not an 'eniac' as you say,
    maybe it was a numerical name.
    aleX, Oct 16, 2005
    #7
  8. EW105

    why? Guest

    On Sun, 16 Oct 2005 16:41:24 +0100, aleX wrote:

    >philo wrote:
    >>
    >>> I read an article online where some coders took a look at Gates' code
    >>> way back when Gates actually did the coding for MS products. Maybe it
    >>> was on the 'Eniac'

    >>
    >>
    >> Einiac was befe Gate's time...
    >> that was the very early vacuum tube computer!!!

    >
    >Yep, sorry for the misinfo, I was guessing. Didn't he write software
    >though for the first 'portable' computer? That's the one I meant, with
    >the rows of little switches on the front. Not an 'eniac' as you say,
    >maybe it was a numerical name.


    Not the portable, that the luggable Osborne?
    http://www.computercloset.org/Osborne1a.htm
    I remember those, they were CP/M

    Altair 8800 is the one you are thinking of?
    http://www.virtualaltair.com/

    Me
    why?, Oct 16, 2005
    #8
  9. EW105

    Dan Evans Guest

    "EW105" <> wrote in message
    news:...

    > MS operating systems seem to get better


    Only in the same way that shitting your pants is better than diarrhoea'ing
    your pants. Both spectacularly un nice things to happen.

    Dan







    .................................................................
    Posted via TITANnews - Uncensored Newsgroups Access
    >>>> at http://www.TitanNews.com <<<<

    -=Every Newsgroup - Anonymous, UNCENSORED, BROADBAND Downloads=-
    Dan Evans, Oct 16, 2005
    #9
  10. EW105

    why? Guest

    On Sun, 16 Oct 2005 15:55:56 +0100, aleX wrote:

    >EW105 wrote:
    >> Being the richest man in the world, was he just at the right place at
    >> the right time or does he actually have the smarts to be in such a
    >> position? I've gone through win95, 98 and xp and I have given my pc to

    <snip>

    >
    >I read an article online where some coders took a look at Gates' code
    >way back when Gates actually did the coding for MS products. Maybe it
    >was on the 'Eniac' machine for DOS(apologies if this is completely


    <grin> Gates is just turned 50, and MS 30. 'Eniac' was 1943-46.

    >wrong, I'm guessing the name) They were impressed, he was obviously a
    >very skilled programmer. Of course, once the company grew you have many
    >people working on the software, and all the problems that ensue from that.
    >
    >That article is probably still around somewhere, it might have been at
    >theregister.com, I can't recall.


    Me
    why?, Oct 16, 2005
    #10
  11. EW105

    Guest

    Well said about Bill. But as for why people have problems with Windows
    over the years, there are a lot of us who either tinker too much with
    our systems, or are careless enough to install products that end up
    causing havoc. All in all, I'd rather have what we have now in Windows,
    problems and all, than it never have been developed by gates. No matter
    what people say about him, good or bad, he worked hard for what he got,
    and deserves it.
    , Oct 16, 2005
    #11
  12. EW105

    aleX Guest

    aleX, Oct 16, 2005
    #12
  13. aleX wrote:

    > I read an article online where some coders took a look at Gates'
    > code way back when Gates actually did the coding for MS
    > products. Maybe it was on the 'Eniac' machine for DOS(apologies
    > if this is completely wrong, I'm guessing the name) They were


    For the record: "As computer technology advanced, the ENIAC itself
    became obsolete. During its time, it was the fastest computer in
    the world, but less expensive machines made it economically
    uncompetitive. At 11:45 PM on October 2, 1955 -- almost ten years
    after its dedication, the Electronic Numerical Integrator And
    Computer was shut down."[1]

    26 days later, Bill Gates was born.

    [1]http://ei.cs.vt.edu/~history/ENIAC.Richey.HTML


    --
    Blinky
    Killing all Google Groups posts.
    http://blinkynet.net/comp/uip5.html
    Blinky the Shark, Oct 16, 2005
    #13
  14. EW105

    why? Guest

    On 16 Oct 2005 10:15:24 -0700, wrote:

    Since you cut all of the OP and previous post, which comments are you
    referring to?

    >Well said about Bill. But as for why people have problems with Windows
    >over the years, there are a lot of us who either tinker too much with
    >our systems, or are careless enough to install products that end up


    It's not just take what MS give you.

    Look at some of the TCP/IP / stack patches. The fixes in MS products
    were exactly the same as non MS products. Not because TCP/IP design as
    such was faulty the implementation of the code was , and a few sources
    were the basis of the code everyone used. What about code development /
    testing / vetting?

    The multiple stack overflows in many parts of Win. That's all down to
    code development / testing / data / buffer validation , surely not a
    major task for that many programmers?

    The same faults patched from 1 version to the next, rather then recoded.

    What about the joys of the various Office 'packages' that never quite
    meshed together as they were worked on by different teams.

    The havoc with PCs using DRDOS, and Windows not running because of 1
    little 'Gates' flag in the code.

    >causing havoc. All in all, I'd rather have what we have now in Windows,
    >problems and all, than it never have been developed by gates. No matter


    Someone else couldn't have done better? So what's his personal
    involvement in coding / testing nowdays?

    Also don't forget the early documented history about a GUI interface, as
    long as you stick to the term 'Windows' lets skip -

    The early visits everyone made to Xerox PARC to see the first GUIs/mice
    , and later on other products came out.

    Did you ever use Atari GEM, I don't recall it crasing , it must have
    maybe / could have sometimes. 1 of my first jobs was working with mixed
    systems PCs with Win 1.x/2.0 early 3.x crashing and the non Windows PCs
    didn't.

    >what people say about him, good or bad, he worked hard for what he got,
    >and deserves it.


    Whatever one says, he knows how to make a business deal.

    Me
    why?, Oct 16, 2005
    #14
  15. EW105

    Guest

    Well, one thing is for sure, out of this subject that everyone will
    have different opinions on. Absolutely ANYONE could go out there and
    develop an operating system, or attempt to perfect Windows....and there
    will no doubt be just as many critics and fault finders. Yes, there are
    many wonderful programs to add with Windows, but there are a lot of
    untrusted ones too. I am just as guilty of tinkering with my system,
    but it's my right to make adjustments as I please...as long as I take
    the blame for it if I mess it up, and not blame Bill Gates and a non
    fault free operating system.

    The great thing is....Bill Gates brought us a wonderful system, and no
    matter what faults we find (or not), the fact that we have such a
    system to complain about, or tinker with, is a blessing. The majority
    of people out here have enough sense to enjoy their systems, instead of
    devote most of their time to being a fault finding critic. This isn't
    pointing blame on anyone here. Just pointing out what it appears to be
    in today's world. I enjoy reading and learning from the postings out
    here, as well
    , Oct 16, 2005
    #15
  16. EW105

    mnb Guest

    wrote:
    > Well, one thing is for sure, out of this subject that everyone will
    > have different opinions on. Absolutely ANYONE could go out there and
    > develop an operating system, or attempt to perfect Windows....and there
    > will no doubt be just as many critics and fault finders. Yes, there are
    > many wonderful programs to add with Windows, but there are a lot of
    > untrusted ones too. I am just as guilty of tinkering with my system,
    > but it's my right to make adjustments as I please...as long as I take
    > the blame for it if I mess it up, and not blame Bill Gates and a non
    > fault free operating system.
    >
    > The great thing is....Bill Gates brought us a wonderful system, and no
    > matter what faults we find (or not), the fact that we have such a
    > system to complain about, or tinker with, is a blessing. The majority
    > of people out here have enough sense to enjoy their systems, instead of
    > devote most of their time to being a fault finding critic. This isn't
    > pointing blame on anyone here. Just pointing out what it appears to be
    > in today's world. I enjoy reading and learning from the postings out
    > here, as well
    >


    Gates transformed the *scientific* world of computers to the *point &
    click* inhabitants of the mass market. At the end of the day what was
    it? Word processing and a spreadsheet. A PowerPoint presentation if
    you really wanted to show off. Maybe design a Christmas card.
    mnb, Oct 16, 2005
    #16
  17. EW105

    Toolman Tim Guest

    Blinky the Shark wrote:
    > aleX wrote:
    >
    >> I read an article online where some coders took a look at Gates'
    >> code way back when Gates actually did the coding for MS
    >> products. Maybe it was on the 'Eniac' machine for DOS(apologies
    >> if this is completely wrong, I'm guessing the name) They were

    >
    > For the record: "As computer technology advanced, the ENIAC itself
    > became obsolete. During its time, it was the fastest computer in
    > the world, but less expensive machines made it economically
    > uncompetitive. At 11:45 PM on October 2, 1955 -- almost ten years
    > after its dedication, the Electronic Numerical Integrator And
    > Computer was shut down."[1]
    >
    > 26 days later, Bill Gates was born.
    >
    > [1]http://ei.cs.vt.edu/~history/ENIAC.Richey.HTML


    And it's been downhill ever since...

    --
    When cryptography is outlawed, bayl bhgynjf jvyy unir cevinpl.
    Toolman Tim, Oct 16, 2005
    #17
  18. EW105

    Toolman Tim Guest

    Dan Evans wrote:
    > "EW105" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >
    >> MS operating systems seem to get better

    >
    > Only in the same way that shitting your pants is better than
    > diarrhoea'ing your pants. Both spectacularly un nice things to happen.
    >
    > Dan
    >
    >

    Now *there's* a quality word picture for ya...
    Toolman Tim, Oct 16, 2005
    #18
  19. EW105

    Toolman Tim Guest

    wrote:
    > Well, one thing is for sure, out of this subject that everyone will
    > have different opinions on. Absolutely ANYONE could go out there and
    > develop an operating system, or attempt to perfect Windows....and
    > there will no doubt be just as many critics and fault finders. Yes,
    > there are many wonderful programs to add with Windows, but there are
    > a lot of untrusted ones too. I am just as guilty of tinkering with my
    > system, but it's my right to make adjustments as I please...as long
    > as I take the blame for it if I mess it up, and not blame Bill Gates
    > and a non fault free operating system.
    >
    > The great thing is....Bill Gates brought us a wonderful system, and no
    > matter what faults we find (or not), the fact that we have such a
    > system to complain about, or tinker with, is a blessing. The majority
    > of people out here have enough sense to enjoy their systems, instead
    > of devote most of their time to being a fault finding critic. This
    > isn't pointing blame on anyone here. Just pointing out what it
    > appears to be in today's world. I enjoy reading and learning from the
    > postings out here, as well


    I have to add that the ability of ONE operating system to integrate
    components from hundreds of thousands of manufaturers in millions of
    possible combinations with all kinds of software (good, bad, and ugly)
    combinations and still run (most of the time) is pretty impressive.

    --
    When cryptography is outlawed, bayl bhgynjf jvyy unir cevinpl.
    Toolman Tim, Oct 16, 2005
    #19
  20. EW105

    Toolman Tim Guest

    mnb wrote:
    > wrote:
    >> Well, one thing is for sure, out of this subject that everyone will
    >> have different opinions on. Absolutely ANYONE could go out there and
    >> develop an operating system, or attempt to perfect Windows....and
    >> there will no doubt be just as many critics and fault finders. Yes,
    >> there are many wonderful programs to add with Windows, but there are
    >> a lot of untrusted ones too. I am just as guilty of tinkering with
    >> my system, but it's my right to make adjustments as I please...as
    >> long as I take the blame for it if I mess it up, and not blame Bill
    >> Gates and a non fault free operating system.
    >>
    >> The great thing is....Bill Gates brought us a wonderful system, and
    >> no matter what faults we find (or not), the fact that we have such a
    >> system to complain about, or tinker with, is a blessing. The majority
    >> of people out here have enough sense to enjoy their systems, instead
    >> of devote most of their time to being a fault finding critic. This
    >> isn't pointing blame on anyone here. Just pointing out what it
    >> appears to be in today's world. I enjoy reading and learning from
    >> the postings out here, as well
    >>

    >
    > Gates transformed the *scientific* world of computers to the *point &
    > click* inhabitants of the mass market. At the end of the day what was
    > it? Word processing and a spreadsheet. A PowerPoint presentation if
    > you really wanted to show off. Maybe design a Christmas card.


    But the scientific world still has their computers. And the scientific world
    needed and created Velcro. The mass market now has that too. What is wrong
    with the idea of science developing products that end up in the mass market?
    That is just about stupid.

    --
    When cryptography is outlawed, bayl bhgynjf jvyy unir cevinpl.
    Toolman Tim, Oct 16, 2005
    #20
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