Beware Dimdows 7

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Apr 6, 2008.

  1. Dimdows XP started the modularization trend by coming in two versions: XP
    Home and XP Pro. Dimdows Vista expanded this into about half a dozen
    different flavours, not counting 32-bit versus 64-bit variants. And it's
    becoming clear that the next version of Dimdows is going to carry this idea
    even further
    <http://arstechnica.com/articles/culture/modular-windows-will-suck.ars>.

    On the one hand, the modularity idea sounds good: why pay for, and have your
    system bogged down by, stuff you don't need? But on the other hand, the
    reason why Microsoft is doing it is for their own benefit, not yours: it's
    so they can slap on an extra charge for every little bit of stuff you
    decide you _do_ need.

    Vista doesn't quite go to this extreme, but it shows what happens when the
    choices are made by the marketing department as a revenue-maximization
    measure, rather than based on what the customer actually needs: the Ars
    article mentions the "Previous Versions" feature (sounds like where Apple
    got its "Time Machine" idea from). For some reason, Microsoft has decided
    that this feature is not relevant to the typical home user, so it's not
    available in either the Home Basic or Home Premium versions of Vista.

    It's worth contrasting this with the way Linux distributions work. For
    example, Ubuntu might offer you a choice of 20,000 different packages from
    which you can mix and match a setup to suit yourself. Why isn't this _more_
    troublesome than having a dozen different versions of Vista--in fact, it is
    _less_ of a bother? Several reasons:

    * Open-source software means much less licensing bother. Want to add more
    stuff? Just go to the package manager and check a few boxes, no need to
    keep pulling out your credit card all the time. Changed your mind and want
    to go back? You can go right ahead and uninstall stuff, without feeling that
    you're out of pocket and unable to get a refund.

    * Integrated package management makes the whole process so much simpler.
    Want to install a Gimp plugin that does JPEG-2000 import/export? The package
    manager will automatically ensure that you actually have Gimp and the
    JPEG-2000 library installed. Does the plugin need a newer version of Gimp?
    The package manager will take care of that, too.

    * The very fact that there _is_ package management. Microsoft's marketing
    department thinks in terms of specific "roles" that you might want a
    machine to perform, whereas Linux distributions avoid such artificial
    distinctions--the roles are whatever you want your machines to do.

    For instance, "web server" could be one role. But there are different kinds
    of reasons for setting up a web server: I might want a simple interface for
    being able to remotely manage my household appliances via the Internet while
    I'm out of town, and rather than use full-blown Apache for this, perhaps I
    run a small script built on Perl's HTTP::Server::Simple module.

    So the role in this case is "custom home appliance controller". Think that
    will appear as a selection item in any of Microsoft's installation
    dialogs? Not likely.

    So, what would you like to see Microsoft do? Return to the old
    one-size-fits-all approach, or would you rather they nickel-and-dime you to
    death?
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Apr 6, 2008
    #1
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  2. In article <47f9f0a8$>, Max Burke did write:

    > We're still waiting Sam. Got an ACTUAL date?


    Uhh ... October 2007. That's when the Eee first went on sale.
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Apr 7, 2008
    #2
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  3. In article <1207548910.6100@ftpsrv1>, *sling did write:

    > Unlike you I prefer to have what can easily afford to.


    You were really looking forward to Dimdows 7, weren't you?
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Apr 7, 2008
    #3
  4. In article <1207623013.981197@ftpsrv1>, *sling did write:

    > "Lawrence D'Oliveiro" <_zealand> wrote in message
    > news:ftcvts$dh5$...
    >
    >> You were really looking forward to Dimdows 7, weren't you?

    >
    > It wouldn't offer any more for me that XP can't already do.


    What happens when XP stops being available after July? You can't live in the
    past forever, you know.
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Apr 9, 2008
    #4
  5. In article <1207638548.542717@ftpsrv1>, *sling did write:

    > Hardware companies have never supported Linux like they do with Windows
    > and Apple.


    According to Greg Kroah-Hartman <http://lwn.net/Articles/276973/>:

    I stated then, and still do that:

    Linux supports more different types of devices than any other
    operating system ever has in the history of computing.

    Later on, a representative from Microsoft validated this statement
    saying that their research agreed with it, so this is not an unproven
    statement.
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Apr 9, 2008
    #5
  6. In article <1207717043.400978@ftpsrv1>, *sling did write:

    > "Lawrence D'Oliveiro" <_zealand> wrote in message
    > news:fthhhe$4js$...
    >
    >> What happens when XP stops being available after July? You can't live in
    >> the past forever, you know.

    >
    > The Athlon has done over 6 years so far.


    Sure, but the Athlon doesn't have Dimdows Genuine Disadvantage infecting it.
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Apr 9, 2008
    #6
  7. In article <>, "geoff" <> wrote:
    >David Goodwin wrote:
    >> On Wed, 9 Apr 2008 11:05:32 +1200, "geoff" <>
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >>> David Goodwin wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>> Linux just doesnt have the market share that Apple and Microsoft
    >>>> have.
    >>>
    >>> Why not ?

    >>
    >> Because linux doesnt have the financial backing that Windows does -

    >
    >Why not ?


    Um ... different marketing strategies ? :)
    Bruce Sinclair, Apr 10, 2008
    #7
  8. In article <1207779732.971891@ftpsrv1>, *sling did write:

    >
    > "Lawrence D'Oliveiro" <_zealand> wrote in message
    > news:fthhod$4js$...
    >> In article <1207638548.542717@ftpsrv1>, *sling did write:
    >>
    >>> Hardware companies have never supported Linux like they do with Windows
    >>> and Apple.

    >>
    >> According to Greg Kroah-Hartman <http://lwn.net/Articles/276973/>:
    >>
    >> I stated then, and still do that:
    >>
    >> Linux supports more different types of devices than any other
    >> operating system ever has in the history of computing.
    >>
    >> Later on, a representative from Microsoft validated this statement
    >> saying that their research agreed with it, so this is not an unproven
    >> statement.

    >
    > I didn't get a Linux CD with my Canon printer ...


    Why would you need a whole CD? Besides, everybody knows CD drivers are
    obsolete by the time you get them, anyway
    <http://www.canon-europe.com/Support/software/linux/>
    <http://canon.codehost.com/>.

    > , and I didn't get Linux CDs with any of my digital cameras.


    Why did you need them? Just plug the camera in, and watch your common,
    everyday Linux distro immediately pop up a photo browser/manager app.

    > When someone bought a very nasty Casio camera after I suggested they buy a
    > Fuji camera that was at a good special price at the time. I had the Casio
    > CD manual on my PC taking screenshots of every fucking page of it so that
    > the screenshots of the Casio manual could then be seen on their Linux only
    > PC.


    What kind of stupid documentation format were they using? Not
    common-or-garden PDF or HTML?
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Apr 10, 2008
    #8
  9. In article <>, "geoff" <> wrote:
    >Bruce Sinclair wrote:
    >> In article <>, "geoff"
    >> <> wrote:
    >>> David Goodwin wrote:
    >>>> On Wed, 9 Apr 2008 11:05:32 +1200, "geoff" <>
    >>>> wrote:
    >>>>> David Goodwin wrote:
    >>>>>> Linux just doesnt have the market share that Apple and Microsoft
    >>>>>> have.
    >>>>> Why not ?
    >>>> Because linux doesnt have the financial backing that Windows does -
    >>> Why not ?

    >>
    >> Um ... different marketing strategies ? :)

    >
    >Q. If one has a marketing strategy that clearly doesn't work, what should
    >one do ?
    >A. Recruit Greasy Larry to whinge online for you.


    Larry is not a marketing strategy ... i'd suggest exactly the opposite of
    one ... as I have said to him before I plonked him. :)
    I'd suggest that the differences in 'real' marketing strategy reflect only
    one thing ... the marketing budget. Now, you can believe marketers if you
    like, but for me, marketers and advertisers will be "first against the wall
    when the revolution comes". :)
    They add nothing to product quality but everything tocost and a whole heap
    of out and out lies. Where else (apart from politics :) ) can you lie and
    not only get away with it ... it's even expected of you ! Imagine if MS (and
    macdonalds and coke and ...) had zero advertising money. Do you think they
    would still sell anywhere near as many items based on the "quality" of their
    product ? :)
    I think not. They simply aren't that good. :)
    Bruce Sinclair, Apr 10, 2008
    #9
  10. In article <1207805355.378445@ftpsrv1>, *sling did write:

    >
    > "Lawrence D'Oliveiro" <_zealand> wrote in message
    > news:ftjqk2$fmm$...
    >> In article <1207779732.971891@ftpsrv1>, *sling did write:
    >>
    >>>
    >>> "Lawrence D'Oliveiro" <_zealand> wrote in
    >>> message news:fthhod$4js$...
    >>>> In article <1207638548.542717@ftpsrv1>, *sling did write:
    >>>>
    >>>>> Hardware companies have never supported Linux like they do with
    >>>>> Windows and Apple.
    >>>>
    >>>> According to Greg Kroah-Hartman <http://lwn.net/Articles/276973/>:
    >>>>
    >>>> I stated then, and still do that:
    >>>>
    >>>> Linux supports more different types of devices than any other
    >>>> operating system ever has in the history of computing.
    >>>>
    >>>> Later on, a representative from Microsoft validated this statement
    >>>> saying that their research agreed with it, so this is not an
    >>>> unproven statement.
    >>>
    >>> I didn't get a Linux CD with my Canon printer ...

    >>
    >> Why would you need a whole CD? Besides, everybody knows CD drivers are
    >> obsolete by the time you get them, anyway
    >> <http://www.canon-europe.com/Support/software/linux/>
    >> <http://canon.codehost.com/>.
    >>
    >>> , and I didn't get Linux CDs with any of my digital cameras.

    >>
    >> Why did you need them? Just plug the camera in, and watch your common,
    >> everyday Linux distro immediately pop up a photo browser/manager app.

    >
    > The Olympus software has some good calendar making options included.


    Get a proper app for the purpose. Why does it have to be camera-specific?
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Apr 10, 2008
    #10
  11. Re: Beware Windows 7

    In article <>, whoisthis did
    write:

    > In article <ftkdcn$rdc$>,
    > Lawrence D'Oliveiro <_zealand> wrote:
    >
    >> > The Olympus software has some good calendar making options included.

    >>
    >> Get a proper app for the purpose. Why does it have to be camera-specific?

    >
    > Because it can then make the best use of the camera....


    What exactly is it about the Olympus that makes good calendars?
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Apr 11, 2008
    #11
  12. Re: Beware Windows 7

    In article <>, whoisthis did
    write:

    > In article <ftn17e$dpj$>,
    > Lawrence D'Oliveiro <_zealand> wrote:
    >
    >> In article <>, whoisthis did
    >> write:
    >>
    >> > In article <ftkdcn$rdc$>,
    >> > Lawrence D'Oliveiro <_zealand> wrote:
    >> >
    >> >> > The Olympus software has some good calendar making options included.
    >> >>
    >> >> Get a proper app for the purpose. Why does it have to be
    >> >> camera-specific?
    >> >
    >> > Because it can then make the best use of the camera....

    >>
    >> What exactly is it about the Olympus that makes good calendars?

    >
    > my guess is it makes it easy...


    What, a "shoot for calendar" button on the camera?? A "select month for this
    picture" menu? I mean, what, really?
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Apr 11, 2008
    #12
  13. In article <>, ChrisOD <> wrote:
    (snip)

    >Oh the irony, you say that marketeers add nothing to product quality, when
    >everyone should know that in a capitalistic (freeish) market then marketeers
    >make the difference between product sales and company death. I don't care
    >if you have the best product in the world if noone buys it.


    Yep ... but the quality of the product remains unaffected. :)

    >Now you may want to argue that capitalism in its current form (or any) is
    >innefficient, bad, evil or even a collective delusion, but that should be
    >argued in another group.


    Yep :)

    >But yes marketeers are the kings of hype public relations are the kings of
    >spin. Hype is lying about the future and spin is lying about the past. We
    >all do it even to ourselves.


    ... and worse ... we not only let them do it ... we expect it. As you
    suggest ... off topic here tho. :)
    Bruce Sinclair, Apr 14, 2008
    #13
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