best format for copyrighting film / video ? what form?

Discussion in 'DVD Video' started by Mad Scientist Jr, Dec 30, 2004.

  1. to copyright film(s) or video, what form do you use?
    also, what format?
    is it best to send in 2 copies of VHS,
    or DVD? which kind of DVD?
    or will a CD-R with MPEG-2, windows media, MPEG 4 or DIVX work?
    i am looking for the cheapest/easiest method, but also one that is
    reliable and which the copyright office would accept.
    many thanks in advance...
     
    Mad Scientist Jr, Dec 30, 2004
    #1
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  2. Mad Scientist Jr

    Mike Kohary Guest

    Mad Scientist Jr wrote:
    > to copyright film(s) or video, what form do you use?
    > also, what format?
    > is it best to send in 2 copies of VHS,
    > or DVD? which kind of DVD?
    > or will a CD-R with MPEG-2, windows media, MPEG 4 or DIVX work?
    > i am looking for the cheapest/easiest method, but also one that is
    > reliable and which the copyright office would accept.
    > many thanks in advance...


    Any format is fine, they really don't care. It just needs to be something
    that can be played to prove it's yours.

    --
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Mike Kohary mike at kohary dot com http://www.kohary.com

    Karma Photography: http://www.karmaphotography.com
    Seahawks Historical Database: http://www.kohary.com/seahawks
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
     
    Mike Kohary, Dec 31, 2004
    #2
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  3. Mad Scientist Jr

    Jay G. Guest

    On 30 Dec 2004 09:40:31 -0800, Mad Scientist Jr wrote:

    > to copyright film(s) or video, what form do you use?
    > also, what format?


    I'd imagine the website for the copyright office would answer most of
    these questions:

    http://www.copyright.gov/

    And it looks like it does. This page details what process and forms to
    go through for registering:
    http://www.copyright.gov/register/performing.html

    And this one details what type of copy they need:
    http://www.copyright.gov/register/pa-deposit-mp.html

    -Jay
     
    Jay G., Dec 31, 2004
    #3
  4. My question is what is a physically durable (eg CD-Rs deterioriate over
    time, VHS tapes deteriorate with each play, etc) and compatable (in 10
    years will anyone be using DIVX? which DVD-R format will be standard?)
    and good quality (will a VCD copy be good enough to protect a higher
    quality copy of the work in court?) media and format to send them video
    in?
     
    Mad Scientist Jr, Dec 31, 2004
    #4
  5. thanks for the links.. this helps
     
    Mad Scientist Jr, Dec 31, 2004
    #5
  6. Mad Scientist Jr

    luminos Guest

    "Mad Scientist Jr" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > My question is what is a physically durable (eg CD-Rs deterioriate over
    > time, VHS tapes deteriorate with each play, etc) and compatable (in 10
    > years will anyone be using DIVX? which DVD-R format will be standard?)
    > and good quality (will a VCD copy be good enough to protect a higher
    > quality copy of the work in court?) media and format to send them video
    > in?
    >


    The library of congress has analyzed this and gone with only analog formats.
     
    luminos, Dec 31, 2004
    #6
  7. Mad Scientist Jr

    Mike Kohary Guest

    Mad Scientist Jr wrote:
    > My question is what is a physically durable (eg CD-Rs deterioriate
    > over time, VHS tapes deteriorate with each play, etc) and compatable
    > (in 10 years will anyone be using DIVX? which DVD-R format will be
    > standard?) and good quality (will a VCD copy be good enough to
    > protect a higher quality copy of the work in court?) media and format
    > to send them video in?


    Believe it or not, in terms of sheer longevity, I'd place my bets on VHS
    tape.

    --
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Mike Kohary mike at kohary dot com http://www.kohary.com

    Karma Photography: http://www.karmaphotography.com
    Seahawks Historical Database: http://www.kohary.com/seahawks
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
     
    Mike Kohary, Jan 2, 2005
    #7
  8. Mad Scientist Jr

    Black Locust Guest

    In article <cr7eqk$v8c$>, "Mike Kohary" <>
    wrote:

    > Believe it or not, in terms of sheer longevity, I'd place my bets on VHS
    > tape.


    Reinhart, you better take this one.
    --
    "Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we.
    They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people,
    and neither do we." - George Dumbya Bush
     
    Black Locust, Jan 2, 2005
    #8
  9. Mad Scientist Jr

    Mike Kohary Guest

    Black Locust wrote:
    > In article <cr7eqk$v8c$>, "Mike Kohary" <>
    > wrote:
    >
    >> Believe it or not, in terms of sheer longevity, I'd place my bets on
    >> VHS tape.

    >
    > Reinhart, you better take this one.


    I am of course talking about things you can make for yourself. The
    longevity of home-burned CDs and DVDs is in question, but a VHS tape should
    basically last forever (for copyright purposes). Quality isn't important at
    all in this case.

    --
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Mike Kohary mike at kohary dot com http://www.kohary.com

    Karma Photography: http://www.karmaphotography.com
    Seahawks Historical Database: http://www.kohary.com/seahawks
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
     
    Mike Kohary, Jan 3, 2005
    #9
  10. Mad Scientist Jr

    Black Locust Guest

    In article <cra1sh$uo2$>, "Mike Kohary" <>
    wrote:

    > I am of course talking about things you can make for yourself. The
    > longevity of home-burned CDs and DVDs is in question, but a VHS tape should
    > basically last forever (for copyright purposes). Quality isn't important at
    > all in this case.


    I question the life span of home made CDs and DVDs as well, but I don't
    believe any VHS tape will last forever, not even close to it. Infact,
    I've only seen a handful of tapes that are over 20 years old and still
    ticking, and they were in pretty horrid condition. Barely watchable even
    if you have low standards. I still think a well cared for DVD-R will
    outlive a VHS tape. Though I guess only time will tell for sure.
    --
    "Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we.
    They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people,
    and neither do we." - George Dumbya Bush
     
    Black Locust, Jan 3, 2005
    #10
  11. Mad Scientist Jr

    Dick Sidbury Guest

    Black Locust wrote:
    > In article <cra1sh$uo2$>, "Mike Kohary" <>
    > wrote:
    >
    >
    >>I am of course talking about things you can make for yourself. The
    >>longevity of home-burned CDs and DVDs is in question, but a VHS tape should
    >>basically last forever (for copyright purposes). Quality isn't important at
    >>all in this case.

    >
    >
    > I question the life span of home made CDs and DVDs as well, but I don't
    > believe any VHS tape will last forever, not even close to it. Infact,
    > I've only seen a handful of tapes that are over 20 years old and still
    > ticking, and they were in pretty horrid condition. Barely watchable even
    > if you have low standards. I still think a well cared for DVD-R will
    > outlive a VHS tape. Though I guess only time will tell for sure.


    I have several 20 year old tapes and the last time I watched them they
    were pretty much in the same shape as they were originally. They were
    home videos and probably haven't been watched more than half a dozen
    times totally. So I think I agree with Mike here.

    dick
    -- needless to say I don't have any burned CD's or DVDs
     
    Dick Sidbury, Jan 3, 2005
    #11
  12. Mad Scientist Jr

    Mike Kohary Guest

    Black Locust wrote:
    > In article <cra1sh$uo2$>, "Mike Kohary" <>
    > wrote:
    >
    >> I am of course talking about things you can make for yourself. The
    >> longevity of home-burned CDs and DVDs is in question, but a VHS tape
    >> should basically last forever (for copyright purposes). Quality
    >> isn't important at all in this case.

    >
    > I question the life span of home made CDs and DVDs as well, but I
    > don't believe any VHS tape will last forever, not even close to it.
    > Infact, I've only seen a handful of tapes that are over 20 years old
    > and still ticking, and they were in pretty horrid condition. Barely
    > watchable even if you have low standards. I still think a well cared
    > for DVD-R will outlive a VHS tape. Though I guess only time will tell
    > for sure.


    But if just a few bits on the DVD-R get lost, the whole thing is kaput (or
    at least quite difficult to recover). Tape isn't the same way; as long as
    he has something on record to show it's his, he's good to go. The tape may
    suck after 20-30 years, but it'll probably be playable enough to view what's
    on it.

    --
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Mike Kohary mike at kohary dot com http://www.kohary.com

    Karma Photography: http://www.karmaphotography.com
    Seahawks Historical Database: http://www.kohary.com/seahawks
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
     
    Mike Kohary, Jan 3, 2005
    #12
  13. Mad Scientist Jr

    Black Locust Guest

    In article <>,
    Dick Sidbury <> wrote:

    > I have several 20 year old tapes and the last time I watched them they
    > were pretty much in the same shape as they were originally. They were
    > home videos and probably haven't been watched more than half a dozen
    > times totally. So I think I agree with Mike here.


    Nah. They probably just appeared to be in the same condition as they
    were originally because it had been so long since you last viewed them
    that you had forgotten how they looked all those years ago. Home videos
    are a bad example anyway, as most of them are very low quality to begin
    with(it's only been in the past few years that video cameras have been
    able to produce even semi-decent picture quality). A better indicator of
    the inherent detoration of magnetic tape is pre-recorded VHS(or Betamax
    if you have any lying around and a working Betamax VCR). I have a 20
    year old copy of Indiana Jones and The Temple of Doom and it's
    unwatchable now. Not even my mother(who's by no means a videophile) can
    stand to watch it. The picture is horribly faded, there's countless
    dropouts and lines appearing all over the tape. The colors are all
    brownish. This tape has only been viewed 9 or 10 times. I compared it
    with the DVD version and it was night and day.

    > dick
    > -- needless to say I don't have any burned CD's or DVDs

    --
    "Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we.
    They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people,
    and neither do we." - George Dumbya Bush
     
    Black Locust, Jan 3, 2005
    #13
  14. Mad Scientist Jr

    Black Locust Guest

    In article <crah2v$2om$>, "Mike Kohary" <>
    wrote:

    > But if just a few bits on the DVD-R get lost, the whole thing is kaput (or
    > at least quite difficult to recover).


    Maybe. DVD-R hasn't been around long enough yet for anyone to truly know
    for sure.

    > Tape isn't the same way; as long as
    > he has something on record to show it's his, he's good to go. The tape may
    > suck after 20-30 years, but it'll probably be playable enough to view what's
    > on it.


    Now correct me if I'm wrong here(i'm by no means an expert on video
    formats; that honor goes to reinhart above anyone else i've chatted with
    online), but doesn't the magnetic rust on tapes begin to flake off after
    20 years? And what if the VCR eats the tape? Every time you stick a tape
    in a VCR, there's a good 20% chance the VCR will chew that fucker up.
    Everyone I've ever known has had countless tapes destroyed by their
    VCRs. It's possibly the single biggest flaw in the VHS format. At least
    with DVDs(and CDs), you're completely safe from the player doing any
    significant damage to the disc.
    --
    "Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we.
    They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people,
    and neither do we." - George Dumbya Bush
     
    Black Locust, Jan 3, 2005
    #14
  15. Mad Scientist Jr

    Black Locust Guest

    In article <crao49$jts$>, "Mike Kohary" <>
    wrote:

    > But you can see what's on it. You understand we're talking about something
    > to send in to the copyright office, right? Context?


    No, I missed the beginning of the thread. Forgive me if I'm way off
    subject here.
    --
    "Our enemies are innovative and resourceful, and so are we.
    They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people,
    and neither do we." - George Dumbya Bush
     
    Black Locust, Jan 3, 2005
    #15
  16. Mad Scientist Jr

    Mike Kohary Guest

    Black Locust wrote:
    > In article <>,
    > Dick Sidbury <> wrote:
    >
    >> I have several 20 year old tapes and the last time I watched them
    >> they were pretty much in the same shape as they were originally.
    >> They were home videos and probably haven't been watched more than
    >> half a dozen times totally. So I think I agree with Mike here.

    >
    > Nah. They probably just appeared to be in the same condition as they
    > were originally because it had been so long since you last viewed them
    > that you had forgotten how they looked all those years ago. Home
    > videos are a bad example anyway, as most of them are very low quality
    > to begin with(it's only been in the past few years that video cameras
    > have been able to produce even semi-decent picture quality). A better
    > indicator of the inherent detoration of magnetic tape is pre-recorded
    > VHS(or Betamax if you have any lying around and a working Betamax
    > VCR). I have a 20 year old copy of Indiana Jones and The Temple of
    > Doom and it's unwatchable now. Not even my mother(who's by no means a
    > videophile) can stand to watch it. The picture is horribly faded,
    > there's countless dropouts and lines appearing all over the tape. The
    > colors are all brownish. This tape has only been viewed 9 or 10
    > times. I compared it with the DVD version and it was night and day.


    But you can see what's on it. You understand we're talking about something
    to send in to the copyright office, right? Context?

    --
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Mike Kohary mike at kohary dot com http://www.kohary.com

    Karma Photography: http://www.karmaphotography.com
    Seahawks Historical Database: http://www.kohary.com/seahawks
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
     
    Mike Kohary, Jan 3, 2005
    #16
  17. Mad Scientist Jr

    Mike Kohary Guest

    Black Locust wrote:
    > In article <crah2v$2om$>, "Mike Kohary" <>
    > wrote:
    >
    >> But if just a few bits on the DVD-R get lost, the whole thing is
    >> kaput (or at least quite difficult to recover).

    >
    > Maybe. DVD-R hasn't been around long enough yet for anyone to truly
    > know for sure.


    Not maybe, definitely! DVD-R hasn't been around long enough for us to know
    for sure how long it lasts, but that's not what I was addressing. If the
    dye fades, the OP is fucked.

    >> Tape isn't the same way; as long as
    >> he has something on record to show it's his, he's good to go. The
    >> tape may suck after 20-30 years, but it'll probably be playable
    >> enough to view what's on it.

    >
    > Now correct me if I'm wrong here(i'm by no means an expert on video
    > formats; that honor goes to reinhart above anyone else i've chatted
    > with online), but doesn't the magnetic rust on tapes begin to flake
    > off after 20 years? And what if the VCR eats the tape? Every time you
    > stick a tape in a VCR, there's a good 20% chance the VCR will chew
    > that fucker up. Everyone I've ever known has had countless tapes
    > destroyed by their VCRs. It's possibly the single biggest flaw in the
    > VHS format. At least with DVDs(and CDs), you're completely safe from
    > the player doing any significant damage to the disc.


    The OP was asking about what to send in to the copyright office. This isn't
    something he's making to send as an heirloom to his sickly mother. Do you
    understand the context of the discussion?

    He might need to prove copyright on something in 50 years. Does he send in
    a DVD-R, a CD-R, or a VHS tape? Safest among those formats, for the express
    purpose described, is VHS tape, if only because we don't know that DVD-R or
    CD-R will last at all! The tape, on the other hand, crappy as it is in
    comparison, will almost certainly be playable and viewable. If he could
    somehow get a disc pressed professionally, with physical pits instead of
    colored dye, my answer would probably be different, because that disc would
    literally last forever, but I assume that's beyond his means. Case closed!
    :)

    --
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Mike Kohary mike at kohary dot com http://www.kohary.com

    Karma Photography: http://www.karmaphotography.com
    Seahawks Historical Database: http://www.kohary.com/seahawks
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
     
    Mike Kohary, Jan 3, 2005
    #17
  18. Mad Scientist Jr

    Mike Kohary Guest

    Black Locust wrote:
    > In article <crao49$jts$>, "Mike Kohary" <>
    > wrote:
    >
    >> But you can see what's on it. You understand we're talking about
    >> something to send in to the copyright office, right? Context?

    >
    > No, I missed the beginning of the thread. Forgive me if I'm way off
    > subject here.


    Ok, I kind of thought so, so I was going easy. ;) Yeah, the guy just wants
    to know what to send into the copyright office. I say tape, because we
    don't know if DVD-R or CD-R will last more than a decade or so. The tape
    may look crappy in comparison, but who cares, it's not for viewing anyway.
    At least we know it will last well enough for legal purposes.

    --
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Mike Kohary mike at kohary dot com http://www.kohary.com

    Karma Photography: http://www.karmaphotography.com
    Seahawks Historical Database: http://www.kohary.com/seahawks
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
     
    Mike Kohary, Jan 3, 2005
    #18
  19. On Sun, 2 Jan 2005 16:00:28 -0800, "Mike Kohary" <>
    wrote:

    >Black Locust wrote:
    >> In article <cr7eqk$v8c$>, "Mike Kohary" <>
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >>> Believe it or not, in terms of sheer longevity, I'd place my bets on
    >>> VHS tape.

    >>
    >> Reinhart, you better take this one.

    >
    >I am of course talking about things you can make for yourself. The
    >longevity of home-burned CDs and DVDs is in question, but a VHS tape should
    >basically last forever (for copyright purposes). Quality isn't important at
    >all in this case.



    I recently found 7 VHS family tapes from 1985 and decided to convert
    them to DVD; they were all totally unviewable and they were premium
    tapes (for their day). The tape snapped on 2 of them when inserted
    into the player.
     
    E. Barry Bruyea, Jan 3, 2005
    #19
  20. Mad Scientist Jr

    Justin Guest

    Mike Kohary wrote on [Sun, 2 Jan 2005 22:29:02 -0800]:
    > Black Locust wrote:
    >> In article <crao49$jts$>, "Mike Kohary" <>
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >>> But you can see what's on it. You understand we're talking about
    >>> something to send in to the copyright office, right? Context?

    >>
    >> No, I missed the beginning of the thread. Forgive me if I'm way off
    >> subject here.

    >
    > Ok, I kind of thought so, so I was going easy. ;) Yeah, the guy just wants
    > to know what to send into the copyright office. I say tape, because we
    > don't know if DVD-R or CD-R will last more than a decade or so. The tape
    > may look crappy in comparison, but who cares, it's not for viewing anyway.
    > At least we know it will last well enough for legal purposes.


    In that case, wouldn't film stock of some sort be a better option?
     
    Justin, Jan 3, 2005
    #20
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