Best file format to edit

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Neal Matthis, Dec 27, 2003.

  1. Neal Matthis

    Neal Matthis Guest

    What is the best file format to have your image in when you are editing it
    with Photoshop or other image editors? My Canon Digital Rebel can capture
    in JPG and CRW (Canon RAW), so about half my images are JPG and the other
    CRW. So I really have two questions:

    1) For my images that were captured in JPG format, what file format should I
    convert them to to edit them? They're high quality 6.3MP JPG images, so the
    JPG compression loss shouldn't be too noticeable. I understand that
    converting to some other non-lossy format will not recover the data that was
    lost due to the JPG compression.

    2) For my CRW files, until I get the RAW image plug-in for Photoshop, I will
    have to convert them to something else. What should I convert to? I have
    the option of JPG, 8bit/channel TIFF and 16bit/channel TIFF. Even if I
    select TIFF, should I then convert to something else that's better for
    editing? Thanks.
    Neal Matthis, Dec 27, 2003
    #1
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  2. On 2003-12-27, Neal Matthis <> wrote:
    > What is the best file format to have your image in when you are editing it
    > with Photoshop or other image editors? My Canon Digital Rebel can capture
    > in JPG and CRW (Canon RAW), so about half my images are JPG and the other
    > CRW. So I really have two questions:
    >
    > 1) For my images that were captured in JPG format, what file format should I
    > convert them to to edit them? They're high quality 6.3MP JPG images, so the
    > JPG compression loss shouldn't be too noticeable. I understand that
    > converting to some other non-lossy format will not recover the data that was
    > lost due to the JPG compression.


    Each time you save a jpeg, it is recompressed. So you will lose
    quality after each editing. So save in TIFF or Photoshop format.

    > 2) For my CRW files, until I get the RAW image plug-in for Photoshop, I will
    > have to convert them to something else. What should I convert to? I have
    > the option of JPG, 8bit/channel TIFF and 16bit/channel TIFF. Even if I
    > select TIFF, should I then convert to something else that's better for
    > editing? Thanks.


    TIFF is lossless, even with compression. So stick to that or Phtoshop
    native.
    >
    Povl H. Pedersen, Dec 27, 2003
    #2
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  3. Neal Matthis

    Jim Townsend Guest

    Neal Matthis wrote:

    > What is the best file format to have your image in when you are editing it
    > with Photoshop or other image editors? My Canon Digital Rebel can capture
    > in JPG and CRW (Canon RAW), so about half my images are JPG and the other
    > CRW. So I really have two questions:


    Depends what you mean by best.. RAW gives you the most versatility, but it's
    also more work. If you enjoy spending time in front of your computer monitor,
    have lots of hard disk space and have lots of cash for flash memory, go for
    RAW.

    JPEG is OK too.. I use JPEG myself most of the time. (But I *do* use RAW, I'm
    not discounting it). It all depends..

    Whether you use JPEG or RAW... Always keep your original untouched. If you're
    editing an original JPEG file, use the [save as] feature.. Don't save over top
    of the original or the 'negative' will be lost.

    > 1) For my images that were captured in JPG format, what file format should I
    > convert them to to edit them? They're high quality 6.3MP JPG images, so the
    > JPG compression loss shouldn't be too noticeable. I understand that
    > converting to some other non-lossy format will not recover the data that was
    > lost due to the JPG compression.


    Y'know what.. One JPEG save to a second generation doesn't do that much. I
    can't tell the difference.. However, before you do this, try it yourself.

    Otherwise, if you've got *lots* of disk space, save as TIFF. That way you
    don't recompress and lose data. Tiff is also good if you plan on opening and
    modifying the file several times.. The 3rd and subsequent savings start
    showing enough artifacts that an old set of blind eyes like me can see 'em.
    Jim Townsend, Dec 27, 2003
    #3
  4. Neal Matthis

    Neal Matthis Guest

    Thank for the reply. I did a little searching on the newsgroup and found a
    link to a website that explained JPG, PNG, TIF and GIF. I never knew that
    GIFs were 8-bit color only. It also explained color spaces a little. The
    site said the same thing as you; use TIFF if you can spare the disk space.
    I do have a lot of disk space, so I'll probably stick with TIFF then make a
    JPEG copy when I want to share or email them.

    The only other question I have regarding CRW files (Canon RAW), is whether I
    should go ahead and immediately convert them to TIFF or leave them in CRW
    format with the Photoshop RAW plugin? My Digital Rebel came with software
    that can read the CRW files and can change the contrast, saturation, white
    balance, and other settings that are set when the image was taken. The CRW
    format keeps those settings separate so that this software can change them
    later. From what I understand, changing the white balance with the software
    is just like setting it to that setting on the camera before you take the
    picture. I just wander if the Photoshop RAW plugin has this same ability.

    Neal

    "Jim Townsend" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Neal Matthis wrote:
    >
    > > What is the best file format to have your image in when you are editing

    it
    > > with Photoshop or other image editors? My Canon Digital Rebel can

    capture
    > > in JPG and CRW (Canon RAW), so about half my images are JPG and the

    other
    > > CRW. So I really have two questions:

    >
    > Depends what you mean by best.. RAW gives you the most versatility, but

    it's
    > also more work. If you enjoy spending time in front of your computer

    monitor,
    > have lots of hard disk space and have lots of cash for flash memory, go

    for
    > RAW.
    >
    > JPEG is OK too.. I use JPEG myself most of the time. (But I *do* use

    RAW, I'm
    > not discounting it). It all depends..
    >
    > Whether you use JPEG or RAW... Always keep your original untouched. If

    you're
    > editing an original JPEG file, use the [save as] feature.. Don't save over

    top
    > of the original or the 'negative' will be lost.
    >
    > > 1) For my images that were captured in JPG format, what file format

    should I
    > > convert them to to edit them? They're high quality 6.3MP JPG images, so

    the
    > > JPG compression loss shouldn't be too noticeable. I understand that
    > > converting to some other non-lossy format will not recover the data that

    was
    > > lost due to the JPG compression.

    >
    > Y'know what.. One JPEG save to a second generation doesn't do that much.

    I
    > can't tell the difference.. However, before you do this, try it yourself.
    >
    > Otherwise, if you've got *lots* of disk space, save as TIFF. That way you
    > don't recompress and lose data. Tiff is also good if you plan on opening

    and
    > modifying the file several times.. The 3rd and subsequent savings start
    > showing enough artifacts that an old set of blind eyes like me can see

    'em.
    >
    Neal Matthis, Dec 28, 2003
    #4
  5. Neal Matthis

    Bobby Guest

    Neil - Could you post the link?

    "Neal Matthis" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Thank for the reply. I did a little searching on the newsgroup and found

    a
    > link to a website that explained JPG, PNG, TIF and GIF. I never knew that
    > GIFs were 8-bit color only. It also explained color spaces a little. The
    > site said the same thing as you; use TIFF if you can spare the disk space.
    > I do have a lot of disk space, so I'll probably stick with TIFF then make

    a
    > JPEG copy when I want to share or email them.
    >
    > The only other question I have regarding CRW files (Canon RAW), is whether

    I
    > should go ahead and immediately convert them to TIFF or leave them in CRW
    > format with the Photoshop RAW plugin? My Digital Rebel came with software
    > that can read the CRW files and can change the contrast, saturation, white
    > balance, and other settings that are set when the image was taken. The

    CRW
    > format keeps those settings separate so that this software can change them
    > later. From what I understand, changing the white balance with the

    software
    > is just like setting it to that setting on the camera before you take the
    > picture. I just wander if the Photoshop RAW plugin has this same ability.
    >
    > Neal
    >
    > "Jim Townsend" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > Neal Matthis wrote:
    > >
    > > > What is the best file format to have your image in when you are

    editing
    > it
    > > > with Photoshop or other image editors? My Canon Digital Rebel can

    > capture
    > > > in JPG and CRW (Canon RAW), so about half my images are JPG and the

    > other
    > > > CRW. So I really have two questions:

    > >
    > > Depends what you mean by best.. RAW gives you the most versatility, but

    > it's
    > > also more work. If you enjoy spending time in front of your computer

    > monitor,
    > > have lots of hard disk space and have lots of cash for flash memory, go

    > for
    > > RAW.
    > >
    > > JPEG is OK too.. I use JPEG myself most of the time. (But I *do* use

    > RAW, I'm
    > > not discounting it). It all depends..
    > >
    > > Whether you use JPEG or RAW... Always keep your original untouched. If

    > you're
    > > editing an original JPEG file, use the [save as] feature.. Don't save

    over
    > top
    > > of the original or the 'negative' will be lost.
    > >
    > > > 1) For my images that were captured in JPG format, what file format

    > should I
    > > > convert them to to edit them? They're high quality 6.3MP JPG images,

    so
    > the
    > > > JPG compression loss shouldn't be too noticeable. I understand that
    > > > converting to some other non-lossy format will not recover the data

    that
    > was
    > > > lost due to the JPG compression.

    > >
    > > Y'know what.. One JPEG save to a second generation doesn't do that

    much.
    > I
    > > can't tell the difference.. However, before you do this, try it

    yourself.
    > >
    > > Otherwise, if you've got *lots* of disk space, save as TIFF. That way

    you
    > > don't recompress and lose data. Tiff is also good if you plan on

    opening
    > and
    > > modifying the file several times.. The 3rd and subsequent savings start
    > > showing enough artifacts that an old set of blind eyes like me can see

    > 'em.
    > >

    >
    >
    Bobby, Dec 28, 2003
    #5
  6. Neal Matthis

    HANSTEIS Guest

    >The only other question I have regarding CRW files (Canon RAW), is whether I
    >should go ahead and immediately convert them to TIFF or leave them in CRW
    >format with the Photoshop RAW plugin?


    I've read warnings about old formats becoming unreadable after a while because
    they fall out of favor. Is there any reason to expect that CRW or TIFF is more
    likely than the other to meet this fate?

    (John Stanley)
    Oh, threats of hell and hopes of Paradise--
    One thing at least is certain: This life flies.
    One thing is certain, and the rest is lies:
    The rose that once has blown forever dies.
    HANSTEIS, Dec 28, 2003
    #6
  7. Neal Matthis

    Rafe B. Guest

    On Sat, 27 Dec 2003 16:26:25 -0500, "Neal Matthis"
    <> wrote:

    >What is the best file format to have your image in when you are editing it
    >with Photoshop or other image editors? My Canon Digital Rebel can capture
    >in JPG and CRW (Canon RAW), so about half my images are JPG and the other
    >CRW. So I really have two questions:
    >
    >1) For my images that were captured in JPG format, what file format should I
    >convert them to to edit them? They're high quality 6.3MP JPG images, so the
    >JPG compression loss shouldn't be too noticeable. I understand that
    >converting to some other non-lossy format will not recover the data that was
    >lost due to the JPG compression.
    >
    >2) For my CRW files, until I get the RAW image plug-in for Photoshop, I will
    >have to convert them to something else. What should I convert to? I have
    >the option of JPG, 8bit/channel TIFF and 16bit/channel TIFF. Even if I
    >select TIFF, should I then convert to something else that's better for
    >editing? Thanks.



    While you're still working on the image, save to any lossless
    format. PSD is Photoshop's native format, and quite a safe
    bet, as is TIF.

    Once you have completely finished messing with the image
    in Photoshop or your chosed image editor, save to JPG format
    if you like -- I'd use a high quality (low compression) setting,
    because memory is cheap.

    JPG is extremely memory efficient, and at high-quality settings
    the image degradation is minimal and in many cases not even
    observable. But what you want to avoid is opening a JPG,
    editing, and re-saving as JPG.

    I typically save my archival originals as TIF to CDs and DVDs,
    and leave a high-quality JPG of each image on the hard drive.


    rafe b.
    http://www.terrapinphoto.com
    Rafe B., Dec 28, 2003
    #7
  8. On 2003-12-28, HANSTEIS <> wrote:
    >>The only other question I have regarding CRW files (Canon RAW), is whether I
    >>should go ahead and immediately convert them to TIFF or leave them in CRW
    >>format with the Photoshop RAW plugin?

    >
    > I've read warnings about old formats becoming unreadable after a while because
    > they fall out of favor. Is there any reason to expect that CRW or TIFF is more
    > likely than the other to meet this fate?


    TIFF is a standard, and some cameras even save in TIFF.
    Raw format is proprietary, and so is Photoshop (but they
    have been rever engineered).
    Povl H. Pedersen, Dec 28, 2003
    #8
  9. Neal Matthis

    Neal Matthis Guest

    http://www.scantips.com/basics09.html

    "Bobby" <> wrote in message
    news:bsmdi3$eb0ds$-berlin.de...
    > Neil - Could you post the link?
    >
    > "Neal Matthis" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > Thank for the reply. I did a little searching on the newsgroup and

    found
    > a
    > > link to a website that explained JPG, PNG, TIF and GIF. I never knew

    that
    > > GIFs were 8-bit color only. It also explained color spaces a little.

    The
    > > site said the same thing as you; use TIFF if you can spare the disk

    space.
    > > I do have a lot of disk space, so I'll probably stick with TIFF then

    make
    > a
    > > JPEG copy when I want to share or email them.
    > >
    > > The only other question I have regarding CRW files (Canon RAW), is

    whether
    > I
    > > should go ahead and immediately convert them to TIFF or leave them in

    CRW
    > > format with the Photoshop RAW plugin? My Digital Rebel came with

    software
    > > that can read the CRW files and can change the contrast, saturation,

    white
    > > balance, and other settings that are set when the image was taken. The

    > CRW
    > > format keeps those settings separate so that this software can change

    them
    > > later. From what I understand, changing the white balance with the

    > software
    > > is just like setting it to that setting on the camera before you take

    the
    > > picture. I just wander if the Photoshop RAW plugin has this same

    ability.
    > >
    > > Neal
    > >
    > > "Jim Townsend" <> wrote in message
    > > news:...
    > > > Neal Matthis wrote:
    > > >
    > > > > What is the best file format to have your image in when you are

    > editing
    > > it
    > > > > with Photoshop or other image editors? My Canon Digital Rebel can

    > > capture
    > > > > in JPG and CRW (Canon RAW), so about half my images are JPG and the

    > > other
    > > > > CRW. So I really have two questions:
    > > >
    > > > Depends what you mean by best.. RAW gives you the most versatility,

    but
    > > it's
    > > > also more work. If you enjoy spending time in front of your computer

    > > monitor,
    > > > have lots of hard disk space and have lots of cash for flash memory,

    go
    > > for
    > > > RAW.
    > > >
    > > > JPEG is OK too.. I use JPEG myself most of the time. (But I *do* use

    > > RAW, I'm
    > > > not discounting it). It all depends..
    > > >
    > > > Whether you use JPEG or RAW... Always keep your original untouched.

    If
    > > you're
    > > > editing an original JPEG file, use the [save as] feature.. Don't save

    > over
    > > top
    > > > of the original or the 'negative' will be lost.
    > > >
    > > > > 1) For my images that were captured in JPG format, what file format

    > > should I
    > > > > convert them to to edit them? They're high quality 6.3MP JPG

    images,
    > so
    > > the
    > > > > JPG compression loss shouldn't be too noticeable. I understand that
    > > > > converting to some other non-lossy format will not recover the data

    > that
    > > was
    > > > > lost due to the JPG compression.
    > > >
    > > > Y'know what.. One JPEG save to a second generation doesn't do that

    > much.
    > > I
    > > > can't tell the difference.. However, before you do this, try it

    > yourself.
    > > >
    > > > Otherwise, if you've got *lots* of disk space, save as TIFF. That way

    > you
    > > > don't recompress and lose data. Tiff is also good if you plan on

    > opening
    > > and
    > > > modifying the file several times.. The 3rd and subsequent savings

    start
    > > > showing enough artifacts that an old set of blind eyes like me can see

    > > 'em.
    > > >

    > >
    > >

    >
    >
    Neal Matthis, Dec 30, 2003
    #9
  10. Neal Matthis

    Fuzzy Logic Guest

    [posted and mailed]

    "Neal Matthis" <> wrote in
    news:D:

    > What is the best file format to have your image in when you are editing
    > it with Photoshop or other image editors? My Canon Digital Rebel can
    > capture in JPG and CRW (Canon RAW), so about half my images are JPG and
    > the other CRW. So I really have two questions:
    >
    > 1) For my images that were captured in JPG format, what file format
    > should I convert them to to edit them? They're high quality 6.3MP JPG
    > images, so the JPG compression loss shouldn't be too noticeable. I
    > understand that converting to some other non-lossy format will not
    > recover the data that was lost due to the JPG compression.
    >
    > 2) For my CRW files, until I get the RAW image plug-in for Photoshop, I
    > will have to convert them to something else. What should I convert to?
    > I have the option of JPG, 8bit/channel TIFF and 16bit/channel TIFF.
    > Even if I select TIFF, should I then convert to something else that's
    > better for editing? Thanks.


    http://www.scantips.com/basics09.html

    To summarize TIFF or PNG is recommended for master copies, JPG for pretty
    well everything else.
    Fuzzy Logic, Jan 6, 2004
    #10
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