ASB - Firefox ... Never heard of it !

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Stephen P, Nov 7, 2005.

  1. Stephen P

    Stephen P Guest

    Just when you thought that the banks were getting the IT stuff, and making a
    reasonable job of it ASB roll out a fastnet upgrade that balks at Firefox.


    The solution ... clear the cache restart the browser.

    Really looking forward to the much touted 2 factor authorisation as
    trumpeted on Infotech.

    Ups to the helpdesk lady there who persisted enough to make it so, and even
    took notes when I tranlated the windows/Firefox fix to Linux/Firefox.

    I sense a bill coming on ...

    --
    get me direct by removing the word.
    Stephen P, Nov 7, 2005
    #1
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  2. Stephen P wrote:
    > Just when you thought that the banks were getting the IT stuff, and making a
    > reasonable job of it ASB roll out a fastnet upgrade that balks at Firefox.
    >
    >
    > The solution ... clear the cache restart the browser.
    >
    > Really looking forward to the much touted 2 factor authorisation as
    > trumpeted on Infotech.


    More details please?

    ASB is about to lose my business for their retarded NetCode system.

    > Ups to the helpdesk lady there who persisted enough to make it so, and even
    > took notes when I tranlated the windows/Firefox fix to Linux/Firefox.
    >
    > I sense a bill coming on ...


    I had problems with Firefox at work, but I used Firefox 1.5 RC1 at home
    this morning without any problems.

    The Other Guy
    The Other Guy, Nov 7, 2005
    #2
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  3. Stephen P

    Steven Ellis Guest

    The Other Guy wrote:
    >
    > ASB is about to lose my business for their retarded NetCode system.


    The new corporate look really annoys me for some reason. Whats with the
    awful choice in yellow.

    Steve
    Steven Ellis, Nov 7, 2005
    #3
  4. Stephen P

    ~misfit~ Guest

    Steven Ellis wrote:
    > The Other Guy wrote:
    >>
    >> ASB is about to lose my business for their retarded NetCode system.

    >
    > The new corporate look really annoys me for some reason. Whats with
    > the awful choice in yellow.


    ....and their "Goldstein" ads have annoyed me for so long now that I'd rather
    give my money to the Mongrel Mob to look after than ASB.
    --
    ~misfit~
    ~misfit~, Nov 7, 2005
    #4
  5. Stephen P

    Sharktyymbfj Guest

    "The Other Guy" <> wrote in message
    news:436ebefc$...
    > Stephen P wrote:
    >> Just when you thought that the banks were getting the IT stuff, and
    >> making a
    >> reasonable job of it ASB roll out a fastnet upgrade that balks at
    >> Firefox.
    >>
    >>
    >> The solution ... clear the cache restart the browser.
    >>
    >> Really looking forward to the much touted 2 factor authorisation as
    >> trumpeted on Infotech.

    >
    > More details please?
    >
    > ASB is about to lose my business for their retarded NetCode system.


    Same. The same week they send me a Gold card with an $8000 limit, without me
    applying for it, to the wrong address, they can't trust me with more than
    $800!



    --
    Sharktyymbfj
    Sharktyymbfj, Nov 7, 2005
    #5
  6. Stephen P

    Not Dave Guest

    On Mon, 07 Nov 2005 15:38:16 +1300, The Other Guy
    <> growled these words from under a rock:

    >
    >ASB is about to lose my business for their retarded NetCode system.


    You wouldn't be saying that if you were victim of a Phishing attack,
    and someone cleaned out your account.

    Whilst I agree that it is a little annoying, top marks to them for
    their initiative. The fact of the matter is that in these times
    security is paramount. All they are doing is protecting *you*.
    Not Dave, Nov 7, 2005
    #6
  7. Sharktyymbfj wrote:
    > "The Other Guy" <> wrote in message
    > news:436ebefc$...
    >> Stephen P wrote:
    >>> Just when you thought that the banks were getting the IT stuff, and
    >>> making a
    >>> reasonable job of it ASB roll out a fastnet upgrade that balks at
    >>> Firefox.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> The solution ... clear the cache restart the browser.
    >>>
    >>> Really looking forward to the much touted 2 factor authorisation as
    >>> trumpeted on Infotech.

    >> More details please?
    >>
    >> ASB is about to lose my business for their retarded NetCode system.

    >
    > Same. The same week they send me a Gold card with an $8000 limit, without me
    > applying for it, to the wrong address, they can't trust me with more than
    > $800!


    Even those who applied for a higher daily limit (which is an effort in
    itself) are still limited by NetCode.

    I personally demand the customer service people refund the fee, and they
    will. Some of them are nice about it, but usually you have to argue.

    I go in to FastNet, then call the bank and tell them I am going to make
    the transfer and I want the fee refunded when I do. I enter the details
    for the transaction while they argue or ask their supervisor, and by the
    time they agree my FastNet session has timed out and they have to wait
    while I enter it again. They will politely suggest I call back when I
    have the NetCode request, but I tell them I can't, otherwise I'll have
    to argue with the next person who might not be willing to honour my
    request for a refund.

    The last time I did this, it took seven minutes of their time, called
    from a cellphone to their 0800 number, and they refunded the $0.25.

    I'm not a totally evil person, and I often wonder if the 'notes' about
    me say I'm hard to deal with. Clearly they don't say they should refund
    my NetCode fee no questions asked.

    I have requested information on the bank regarding NetCode, and none of
    the responses were satisfactory. In fact, I would call them lies. Nobody
    has yet given me a reason why NetCode even exists. The way I see it,
    NetCode protects people who get caught by phishing scams and in do so
    violate their agreements with the bank, which as far as I'm concerned
    means they _DESERVE_ to lose their money. What part of statements like
    "Give you password to nobody, not even us" is do damn hard to understand?

    The Other Guy
    The Other Guy, Nov 7, 2005
    #7
  8. Not Dave wrote:
    > On Mon, 07 Nov 2005 15:38:16 +1300, The Other Guy
    > <> growled these words from under a rock:
    >
    >> ASB is about to lose my business for their retarded NetCode system.

    >
    > You wouldn't be saying that if you were victim of a Phishing attack,
    > and someone cleaned out your account.
    >
    > Whilst I agree that it is a little annoying, top marks to them for
    > their initiative. The fact of the matter is that in these times
    > security is paramount. All they are doing is protecting *you*.


    That is bull shit. My agreement with the bank clearly states I will not
    provide account access details to anyone, not even banking staff. Even
    setting up the password in the first place was a strictly human-free
    process.

    Anyone who submits their details in response to an e-mail is violating
    their agreement with the bank, and they deserve no protection. Those of
    us who follow the rules do not need our hands held.

    Access to account details via other means, such as key grabbing software
    _is_ a real threat to anyone, but that is NOT phishing. The banks claim
    their reduction in limits is in response to _phishing_. Also, key
    grabbers and other software that 'call home' are usually used for denial
    of service attacks, not information gathering.

    NetCode exists soely for the purpose of making money from additional
    fees. There is no reason it couldn't be used to _exceed_ your daily
    limit, instead it is implemented in such a way as to keep you well under it.

    In the Herald last week it stated that transactions were reversed by the
    (unnamed) bank, yet ASB has perviously informed me they _cannot_ reverse
    transactions via FastNet without the recipients permission. Well, I've
    seen the bank 'errors' corrected without asking me if I want to give it
    back. The Internet should be no different.

    If fraud were a serious problem, the money would be held for a clearance
    period (in your account but not usable). More likely the cost savings of
    Internet banking greatly outweigh the small amount of fraud that occurs.
    NetCode and similar fees simply add a little more in fees, pretending to
    offer you protection.

    The Other Guy
    The Other Guy, Nov 7, 2005
    #8
  9. In article <436ebefc$>, lhost says...
    > Stephen P wrote:
    > > Just when you thought that the banks were getting the IT stuff, and making a
    > > reasonable job of it ASB roll out a fastnet upgrade that balks at Firefox.
    > >
    > >
    > > The solution ... clear the cache restart the browser.
    > >
    > > Really looking forward to the much touted 2 factor authorisation as
    > > trumpeted on Infotech.

    >
    > More details please?


    I've not had any issues whatsoever. Did ASB online banking today.

    >
    > ASB is about to lose my business for their retarded NetCode system.
    >


    I really got my hackles up on that. Then I heard of friends of a friend
    who had $40000 leached out of their check account via Western Union to
    Russia - they managed to recover half since it hadn't cleared Western
    Union yet ... they had a keylogger trojan on their system.

    Suddenly the netcode started to make sense!

    Originally I hated it. I often have to shift large sums of money (in
    excess of 12 grand) - and we have no texting, indeed no mobile coverage
    around here. I rang them and blew them up over it and got nearly
    nowhere. Then I read the online docs carefully and found this:

    There's a way around. First up, if you had set up the payee before the
    whole netcode started, the payee will be exempt. Secondly, if you call
    the Fastnet helpline and get THEM to set up the payee, it will ALSO be
    excempt - so I have no problem sending 20 grand to Wrightson with no
    netcode whatsoever.

    Funnily enough, not all ASB employees seem to know this, particularly if
    you ring 0800 803804 - but get them to put you through to the fastnet
    guys and you will get your problems sorted. I didn't even get charted a
    setup fee for the excempt payees ...

    >
    > The Other Guy
    >


    -Peter

    --
    =========================================
    firstname dot lastname at gmail fullstop com
    Peter Huebner, Nov 7, 2005
    #9
  10. Peter Huebner wrote:
    > In article <436ebefc$>, lhost says...
    >> Stephen P wrote:
    >>> Just when you thought that the banks were getting the IT stuff, and making a
    >>> reasonable job of it ASB roll out a fastnet upgrade that balks at Firefox.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> The solution ... clear the cache restart the browser.
    >>>
    >>> Really looking forward to the much touted 2 factor authorisation as
    >>> trumpeted on Infotech.

    >> More details please?

    >
    > I've not had any issues whatsoever. Did ASB online banking today.
    >
    >> ASB is about to lose my business for their retarded NetCode system.
    >>

    >
    > I really got my hackles up on that. Then I heard of friends of a friend
    > who had $40000 leached out of their check account via Western Union to
    > Russia - they managed to recover half since it hadn't cleared Western
    > Union yet ... they had a keylogger trojan on their system.
    >
    > Suddenly the netcode started to make sense!
    >
    > Originally I hated it. I often have to shift large sums of money (in
    > excess of 12 grand) - and we have no texting, indeed no mobile coverage
    > around here. I rang them and blew them up over it and got nearly
    > nowhere. Then I read the online docs carefully and found this:
    >
    > There's a way around. First up, if you had set up the payee before the
    > whole netcode started, the payee will be exempt. Secondly, if you call
    > the Fastnet helpline and get THEM to set up the payee, it will ALSO be
    > excempt - so I have no problem sending 20 grand to Wrightson with no
    > netcode whatsoever.


    It looks like they may have altered their restrictions, or at least
    documented them better. I have been told repeatedly there is no way
    around it, unless the recipient was added before the introduction, or is
    a pre-defined recipient (like power companies). Oddly, the payments you
    describe can only bet set up at a branch, according to the ASB Web site.

    What really annoys me is I have a pre-defined payee to one of the
    accounts I regularly transfer cash to, but the account suffix no longer
    exists... I want to pay in to the 000 account, not 057.

    The Other Guy
    The Other Guy, Nov 7, 2005
    #10
  11. Stephen P

    Guest

    I just rang ASB to try and register for Netcode, and they asked me for
    my account password, which apparently I created when I signed up for
    Fastnet. Since I tend to use the same password for everything (naughty,
    I know!) I gave that, but apparently that wasn't it. So now I have to
    go to a branch to register for Netcode! What a pain in the butt.
    Couldn't they have asked for alternative forms of ID, or even phoned me
    back on the number they have in their system to confirm it's me??? Or
    are they scared hackers have gotten into their system and changed my
    contact details (in which case why would they bother ringing up to
    register for Netcode!?). Or perhaps they're worried that they're hacked
    the phone lines and diverted my number to their phones....
    , Nov 7, 2005
    #11
  12. wrote:
    > I just rang ASB to try and register for Netcode, and they asked me for
    > my account password, which apparently I created when I signed up for
    > Fastnet. Since I tend to use the same password for everything (naughty,
    > I know!) I gave that, but apparently that wasn't it. So now I have to
    > go to a branch to register for Netcode! What a pain in the butt.
    > Couldn't they have asked for alternative forms of ID, or even phoned me
    > back on the number they have in their system to confirm it's me??? Or
    > are they scared hackers have gotten into their system and changed my
    > contact details (in which case why would they bother ringing up to
    > register for Netcode!?). Or perhaps they're worried that they're hacked
    > the phone lines and diverted my number to their phones....


    ASB staff will not ask for your FastNet password, they aren't even
    involved in setting it up, it is all automated using the phone/Net, or
    at least it was when I signed up.

    Your default account password used to be your mothers maiden name. I
    guess these days it isn't so appropriate, but my complaining about that
    is a whole different thread :)

    The Other Guy
    The Other Guy, Nov 7, 2005
    #12
  13. > wrote:
    >> I just rang ASB to try and register for Netcode, and they asked me for
    >> my account password, which apparently I created when I signed up for
    >> Fastnet. Since I tend to use the same password for everything (naughty,
    >> I know!) I gave that, but apparently that wasn't it. So now I have to
    >> go to a branch to register for Netcode! What a pain in the butt.
    >> Couldn't they have asked for alternative forms of ID, or even phoned me
    >> back on the number they have in their system to confirm it's me??? Or
    >> are they scared hackers have gotten into their system and changed my
    >> contact details (in which case why would they bother ringing up to
    >> register for Netcode!?). Or perhaps they're worried that they're hacked
    >> the phone lines and diverted my number to their phones....



    I should have also mentioned the phone lines. Analogue phone lines and
    cordless phones are horribly insecure. I personally think I'm better off
    taking my chances with 128bit encryption, and the small risk of key
    loggers, than I am ringing the bank up on the phone.

    Invest a small amount in a scanner, and you've got more than enough
    information to access your neighbours accounts. The banks seemed to have
    done something about that though, they now ask me two questions, and the
    password question is not always requesting the password, sometimes it is
    just the first and last letters from the password. Still, if you know
    the name of their cats, you've probably got a good chance of guessing
    from the limited information you may get on your first call.

    The Other Guy
    The Other Guy, Nov 7, 2005
    #13
  14. Stephen P

    Richard Guest

    The Other Guy wrote:

    > I should have also mentioned the phone lines. Analogue phone lines and
    > cordless phones are horribly insecure. I personally think I'm better off
    > taking my chances with 128bit encryption, and the small risk of key
    > loggers, than I am ringing the bank up on the phone.
    >
    > Invest a small amount in a scanner, and you've got more than enough
    > information to access your neighbours accounts. The banks seemed to have
    > done something about that though, they now ask me two questions, and the
    > password question is not always requesting the password, sometimes it is
    > just the first and last letters from the password. Still, if you know
    > the name of their cats, you've probably got a good chance of guessing
    > from the limited information you may get on your first call.


    Something that pisses me off is that bankdirect are issuing secure ids to people
    to use, but its just a replacement for the netcode.

    for me, if someone was to get in because of a key logger and piss away $799.99
    to another account, it would be just as annoying as if they tried to move
    $10,000 (because there isnt even 799 in the account ever) - but there fancy
    authentication is useless to stop it.

    I would rather have a secure id number used to log INTO internet banking, and
    then no stupid limits from there.

    Im sure with enough motivation someone could write a trojen that worked
    specifically with the net banking and waited till they had logged in and the
    cookie was set and then triggered a netcode to come to them and they enter it
    into a browser-like window and then it does the transfer to someone elses
    accound with the resulting netcode value. If someone setup for netcode had a
    text come thru and a window on the screen appear asking for it, they would most
    likly enter it in no questions asked, so I have to question the added security
    that it offers for the typical dumb user. I would think that asb would be big
    enough that some russian hacker would take the time to author a trojen like that.
    Richard, Nov 7, 2005
    #14
  15. Stephen P

    Rob J Guest

    In article <436efd65$>, lhost says...
    > wrote:
    > > I just rang ASB to try and register for Netcode, and they asked me for
    > > my account password, which apparently I created when I signed up for
    > > Fastnet. Since I tend to use the same password for everything (naughty,
    > > I know!) I gave that, but apparently that wasn't it. So now I have to
    > > go to a branch to register for Netcode! What a pain in the butt.
    > > Couldn't they have asked for alternative forms of ID, or even phoned me
    > > back on the number they have in their system to confirm it's me??? Or
    > > are they scared hackers have gotten into their system and changed my
    > > contact details (in which case why would they bother ringing up to
    > > register for Netcode!?). Or perhaps they're worried that they're hacked
    > > the phone lines and diverted my number to their phones....

    >
    > ASB staff will not ask for your FastNet password, they aren't even
    > involved in setting it up, it is all automated using the phone/Net, or
    > at least it was when I signed up.


    A point here. Although I am not familiar with this product, you could
    have an account password that is different from the one you sign on the
    web site with. The account password is used over the phone to verify
    that you are who you say you are.
    Rob J, Nov 7, 2005
    #15
  16. Stephen P

    SNOman Guest

    Stephen P wrote:
    > Just when you thought that the banks were getting the IT stuff, and making a
    > reasonable job of it ASB roll out a fastnet upgrade that balks at Firefox.
    >
    >
    > The solution ... clear the cache restart the browser.
    >
    > Really looking forward to the much touted 2 factor authorisation as
    > trumpeted on Infotech.

    8><

    Shame it's not free like HSBC though
    SNOman, Nov 7, 2005
    #16
  17. "SNOman" <> wrote in message
    news:dkoo8u$4au$...
    > Stephen P wrote:
    >> Just when you thought that the banks were getting the IT stuff, and
    >> making a
    >> reasonable job of it ASB roll out a fastnet upgrade that balks at
    >> Firefox.
    >>
    >>
    >> The solution ... clear the cache restart the browser.
    >>
    >> Really looking forward to the much touted 2 factor authorisation as
    >> trumpeted on Infotech.

    > 8><
    >
    > Shame it's not free like HSBC though


    ASB used to have the best internet banking - 8 odd years ago.

    In that 8 years - virtually nothing has changed with their online banking
    services.

    UK banks have far superior internet banking products - funny thing is that
    most kiwis laugh at uk banks as being backward. Think again hobos.

    HSBC NZ seems pretty good though.
    news.xtra.co.nz, Nov 8, 2005
    #17
  18. Stephen P

    PAM. Guest

    "news.xtra.co.nz" <> wrote in message

    > UK banks have far superior internet banking products - funny thing is that
    > most kiwis laugh at uk banks as being backward. Think again hobos.
    >
    > HSBC NZ seems pretty good though.


    Most secure banking I've used would be First direct.

    You have to give 2 10+ numbers (which you can save on your PC under a name
    if you want)
    Then 3 characters from your password. You don't type the whole thing. EG,
    1st, 3rd & 4th letter.
    Much harder to crack.

    Phone banking to them is even harder :)

    PAM.
    PAM., Nov 8, 2005
    #18
  19. Stephen P

    Stephen P Guest

    news.xtra.co.nz wrote:

    >
    > "SNOman" <> wrote in message
    > news:dkoo8u$4au$...
    >> Stephen P wrote:
    >>> Just when you thought that the banks were getting the IT stuff, and
    >>> making a
    >>> reasonable job of it ASB roll out a fastnet upgrade that balks at
    >>> Firefox.
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> The solution ... clear the cache restart the browser.
    >>>
    >>> Really looking forward to the much touted 2 factor authorisation as
    >>> trumpeted on Infotech.

    >> 8><
    >>
    >> Shame it's not free like HSBC though

    >
    > ASB used to have the best internet banking - 8 odd years ago.
    >
    > In that 8 years - virtually nothing has changed with their online banking
    > services.
    >
    > UK banks have far superior internet banking products - funny thing is that
    > most kiwis laugh at uk banks as being backward. Think again hobos.
    >
    > HSBC NZ seems pretty good though.


    Another bank that fails the firefox test . <sigh>

    User Agent Switcher .. a friend since I can remeber.

    --
    get me direct by removing the word.
    Stephen P, Nov 8, 2005
    #19
  20. Stephen P

    ~misfit~ Guest

    Stephen P wrote:
    > Another bank that fails the firefox test . <sigh>
    >
    > User Agent Switcher .. a friend since I can remeber.


    I use Firefox and use Westpac with no trouble at all. BTW, that's not* an
    endorsement of Westpac, they suck.
    --
    ~misfit~
    ~misfit~, Nov 8, 2005
    #20
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