AMD Opteron: 1-way, 2-way, ... Up to 8-way.

Discussion in 'Windows 64bit' started by John John, Dec 24, 2005.

  1. John John

    John John Guest

    Sorry if I'm a pest...

    Could someone point me in the right direction or explain the concept
    behind that.

    "The AMD Opteron™ processor is offered in three series: the 100 series
    "(1-way), the 200 series (Up to 2-way), and the 800 series (Up to 8-way)."

    What does it do in multiple ways? Which kind of user or what kind of
    application would benefit from the different 1 or 2-way chips? I know
    for sure I have no need for 8-way, but I would like to know the trade
    off between saving now and sacrificing future performance between the
    100 and 200 series.

    John
     
    John John, Dec 24, 2005
    #1
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  2. John John

    M. Murcek Guest

    The multi-way architecture refers to the means by which the CPUs share
    system memory. Multi-processing has long been the common approach to
    getting satisfactory server performance where demand for CPU cycles is high
    and system and applications software has been optimized to make the most of
    multiple processors, commonly, but not always, by means of a programming
    technique called multi-threading.

    You are right, you probably don't need 8-way capability on the desktop -
    yet. Likewise, the Opteron chip was targeted at the outset on servers, but
    I'm sitting in front of a dual CPU Opteron workstation right now. With the
    advent of dual core 200 series Opterons, I could upgrade to the equivalent
    of 4-way processing on the desktop. It's a bit too pricey to consider right
    now, but that will change over time.

    OTOH, if you are running a honking huge domain, you might want an 8-way
    machine to handle any of a variety of compute-intensive roles. And 8-way is
    just the low end of the high end. There are 16, 32 and 64 way systems out
    there running Enterprise and Datacenter versions of Windows right now. And
    Microsoft's push into the hight performance computing space means there may
    be complexes of hundreds, or even thousands of CPUs running Windows cluster
    software doing supercomputing chores in the near future.

    "John John" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Sorry if I'm a pest...
    >
    > Could someone point me in the right direction or explain the concept
    > behind that.
    >
    > "The AMD Opteron™ processor is offered in three series: the 100 series
    > "(1-way), the 200 series (Up to 2-way), and the 800 series (Up to 8-way)."
    >
    > What does it do in multiple ways? Which kind of user or what kind of
    > application would benefit from the different 1 or 2-way chips? I know for
    > sure I have no need for 8-way, but I would like to know the trade off
    > between saving now and sacrificing future performance between the 100 and
    > 200 series.
    >
    > John
     
    M. Murcek, Dec 25, 2005
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. The 100 chips are designed to be the only CPU in the system, the 200 is
    designed to be one of two chips. A 2x200 series with dual cores would give
    you 4 opterons, effectively. A monster board, capable of doing just about
    anything you're likely to need. An 8way is really only for servers..

    Realistically, a single CPU, with dual cores, is probably more than pretty
    much any normal user needs.


    --
    Charlie.
    http://msmvps.com/xperts64

    John John wrote:
    > Sorry if I'm a pest...
    >
    > Could someone point me in the right direction or explain the concept
    > behind that.
    >
    > "The AMD Opteron™ processor is offered in three series: the 100 series
    > "(1-way), the 200 series (Up to 2-way), and the 800 series (Up to 8-way)."
    >
    > What does it do in multiple ways? Which kind of user or what kind of
    > application would benefit from the different 1 or 2-way chips? I know
    > for sure I have no need for 8-way, but I would like to know the trade
    > off between saving now and sacrificing future performance between the
    > 100 and 200 series.
    >
    > John
     
    Charlie Russel - MVP, Dec 25, 2005
    #3
  4. John John wrote:

    >Sorry if I'm a pest...
    >
    >Could someone point me in the right direction or explain the concept
    >behind that.
    >
    >"The AMD Opteron™ processor is offered in three series: the 100 series
    >"(1-way), the 200 series (Up to 2-way), and the 800 series (Up to 8-way)."
    >
    >What does it do in multiple ways? Which kind of user or what kind of
    >application would benefit from the different 1 or 2-way chips? I know for
    >sure I have no need for 8-way, but I would like to know the trade off
    >between saving now and sacrificing future performance between the 100 and
    >200 series.


    They mean how many of the processors are supported on a single
    motherboard. So the 100 series are intended to be used on single CPU
    motherboards, the 200 series can be used on dual processor motherboards,
    and the 800 series can be used on motherboards with as many as 8 CPU
    sockets.

    On top of this, some Opterons are dual-core, which means AMD have squeezed
    the equivalent of two standard Opterons onto a single chip, and you need
    to make sure any motherboard you choose supports dual-core chips if you
    intend to buy a dual-core Opteron.

    AMD's roadmap has processors with even more cores, so a single physical
    chip of tomorrow will work like multiple chips of today.

    --
    Steve Foster [SBS MVP]
    ---------------------------------------
    MVPs do not work for Microsoft. Please reply only to the newsgroups.
     
    Steve Foster [SBS MVP], Dec 25, 2005
    #4
  5. John John

    John John Guest

    Thanks, very informative.

    John

    M. Murcek wrote:

    > The multi-way architecture refers to the means by which the CPUs share
    > system memory. Multi-processing has long been the common approach to
    > getting satisfactory server performance where demand for CPU cycles is high
    > and system and applications software has been optimized to make the most of
    > multiple processors, commonly, but not always, by means of a programming
    > technique called multi-threading.
    >
    > You are right, you probably don't need 8-way capability on the desktop -
    > yet. Likewise, the Opteron chip was targeted at the outset on servers, but
    > I'm sitting in front of a dual CPU Opteron workstation right now. With the
    > advent of dual core 200 series Opterons, I could upgrade to the equivalent
    > of 4-way processing on the desktop. It's a bit too pricey to consider right
    > now, but that will change over time.
    >
    > OTOH, if you are running a honking huge domain, you might want an 8-way
    > machine to handle any of a variety of compute-intensive roles. And 8-way is
    > just the low end of the high end. There are 16, 32 and 64 way systems out
    > there running Enterprise and Datacenter versions of Windows right now. And
    > Microsoft's push into the hight performance computing space means there may
    > be complexes of hundreds, or even thousands of CPUs running Windows cluster
    > software doing supercomputing chores in the near future.
    >
    > "John John" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >
    >>Sorry if I'm a pest...
    >>
    >>Could someone point me in the right direction or explain the concept
    >>behind that.
    >>
    >>"The AMD Opteron™ processor is offered in three series: the 100 series
    >>"(1-way), the 200 series (Up to 2-way), and the 800 series (Up to 8-way)."
    >>
    >>What does it do in multiple ways? Which kind of user or what kind of
    >>application would benefit from the different 1 or 2-way chips? I know for
    >>sure I have no need for 8-way, but I would like to know the trade off
    >>between saving now and sacrificing future performance between the 100 and
    >>200 series.
    >>
    >>John

    >
    >
    >
     
    John John, Dec 26, 2005
    #5
  6. John John

    John John Guest

    Thanks, interesting about the AMD roadmap. I'm wondering if Intel isn't
    secretly reworking its Itanium... maybe when 64 bit computing is a bit
    more mainstream they might come back with a vengeance.

    John

    Steve Foster [SBS MVP] wrote:

    > John John wrote:
    >
    >> Sorry if I'm a pest...
    >>
    >> Could someone point me in the right direction or explain the concept
    >> behind that.
    >>
    >> "The AMD Opteron™ processor is offered in three series: the 100 series
    >> "(1-way), the 200 series (Up to 2-way), and the 800 series (Up to
    >> 8-way)."
    >>
    >> What does it do in multiple ways? Which kind of user or what kind of
    >> application would benefit from the different 1 or 2-way chips? I know
    >> for sure I have no need for 8-way, but I would like to know the trade
    >> off between saving now and sacrificing future performance between the
    >> 100 and 200 series.

    >
    >
    > They mean how many of the processors are supported on a single
    > motherboard. So the 100 series are intended to be used on single CPU
    > motherboards, the 200 series can be used on dual processor motherboards,
    > and the 800 series can be used on motherboards with as many as 8 CPU
    > sockets.
    >
    > On top of this, some Opterons are dual-core, which means AMD have
    > squeezed the equivalent of two standard Opterons onto a single chip, and
    > you need to make sure any motherboard you choose supports dual-core
    > chips if you intend to buy a dual-core Opteron.
    >
    > AMD's roadmap has processors with even more cores, so a single physical
    > chip of tomorrow will work like multiple chips of today.
    >
     
    John John, Dec 26, 2005
    #6
  7. John John

    John John Guest

    Thanks Charlie. The pc is for my 13 year old nephew. He called me
    about 3 weeks ago and told me he wanted money for Christmas! Then he
    explained that he mowed lawns all summer and that he does odd jobs and
    is saving his money for a computer, he figures he's going to have 8 or
    900 dollars available. So I said ok. I asked him what kind of computer
    and where was he going to buy it. He told me he was going to go to a
    big box or big office supply chain type of store, I told him to look
    around but that I would go with him to buy the pc, to make sure he
    doesn't get taken for a ride.

    Then his mother told me she wanted to buy him a laptop! Because her
    girlfriends at work told her that when he goes to college or university
    the laptop would be useful! I told her that in 4 or 5 years from now
    the laptop will make a fine doorstop or a nice Frisbee for 18 year old
    university students on a Friday night drunk! To make matters worse he
    told a clerk at a big office supply chain that he didn't want a flat
    panel monitor (for gaming) and the clerk told him that CRT's were no
    longer available and that they don't even work on new pc's! So I told
    him that my gift to him would be the monitor and that I would find him a
    suitable pc with the money he manages to save. I got him one of the
    last Aperture Grill monitor still available today.

    Then I thought to myself, what is the best thing to get for a 13 year
    old kid? I figured when he's 17 or 18 if he needs extra power he
    probably won't have money to buy a new pc. I also figured I may as well
    get him a 64 bit ready pc and make sure it has lots of room and options
    for future upgradability. I think I will get him a dual core, dual
    Opteron ready motherboard but I will only throw a single core 200 in
    there. Also, I think I will only put XP 32 bit on there for now, I
    think he's too young and inexperienced for Windows x64. Later on if he
    needs more he can pay for it himself! And if he does get that from me
    you can be sure that "Uncle John" will have his lawn mowed for free next
    summer!

    John

    Charlie Russel - MVP wrote:

    > The 100 chips are designed to be the only CPU in the system, the 200 is
    > designed to be one of two chips. A 2x200 series with dual cores would give
    > you 4 opterons, effectively. A monster board, capable of doing just about
    > anything you're likely to need. An 8way is really only for servers..
    >
    > Realistically, a single CPU, with dual cores, is probably more than pretty
    > much any normal user needs.
    >
    >
     
    John John, Dec 26, 2005
    #7
  8. Don't waste your (and his) money on a dual opteron board. Get a good "gamer"
    board that does Athlon64 and put a dual-core in there. Spend the money on
    the graphics card(s) for it, and plenty of RAM. He'll be fine for years.

    --
    Charlie.
    http://msmvps.com/xperts64

    John John wrote:
    > Thanks Charlie. The pc is for my 13 year old nephew. He called me
    > about 3 weeks ago and told me he wanted money for Christmas! Then he
    > explained that he mowed lawns all summer and that he does odd jobs and
    > is saving his money for a computer, he figures he's going to have 8 or
    > 900 dollars available. So I said ok. I asked him what kind of computer
    > and where was he going to buy it. He told me he was going to go to a
    > big box or big office supply chain type of store, I told him to look
    > around but that I would go with him to buy the pc, to make sure he
    > doesn't get taken for a ride.
    >
    > Then his mother told me she wanted to buy him a laptop! Because her
    > girlfriends at work told her that when he goes to college or university
    > the laptop would be useful! I told her that in 4 or 5 years from now
    > the laptop will make a fine doorstop or a nice Frisbee for 18 year old
    > university students on a Friday night drunk! To make matters worse he
    > told a clerk at a big office supply chain that he didn't want a flat
    > panel monitor (for gaming) and the clerk told him that CRT's were no
    > longer available and that they don't even work on new pc's! So I told
    > him that my gift to him would be the monitor and that I would find him a
    > suitable pc with the money he manages to save. I got him one of the
    > last Aperture Grill monitor still available today.
    >
    > Then I thought to myself, what is the best thing to get for a 13 year
    > old kid? I figured when he's 17 or 18 if he needs extra power he
    > probably won't have money to buy a new pc. I also figured I may as well
    > get him a 64 bit ready pc and make sure it has lots of room and options
    > for future upgradability. I think I will get him a dual core, dual
    > Opteron ready motherboard but I will only throw a single core 200 in
    > there. Also, I think I will only put XP 32 bit on there for now, I
    > think he's too young and inexperienced for Windows x64. Later on if he
    > needs more he can pay for it himself! And if he does get that from me
    > you can be sure that "Uncle John" will have his lawn mowed for free next
    > summer!
    >
    > John
    >
    > Charlie Russel - MVP wrote:
    >
    >> The 100 chips are designed to be the only CPU in the system, the 200 is
    >> designed to be one of two chips. A 2x200 series with dual cores would
    >> give you 4 opterons, effectively. A monster board, capable of doing just
    >> about anything you're likely to need. An 8way is really only for
    >> servers.. Realistically, a single CPU, with dual cores, is probably more
    >> than
    >> pretty much any normal user needs.
     
    Charlie Russel - MVP, Dec 26, 2005
    #8
  9. Oh - and don't go to Office Depot/Max/Whatever. Stick with a place that
    specializes in building PCs. So a local system builder, if you have one, or
    www.directron.com, www.ncix.com, www.newegg.com, etc., etc.

    --
    Charlie.
    http://msmvps.com/xperts64

    John John wrote:
    > Thanks Charlie. The pc is for my 13 year old nephew. He called me
    > about 3 weeks ago and told me he wanted money for Christmas! Then he
    > explained that he mowed lawns all summer and that he does odd jobs and
    > is saving his money for a computer, he figures he's going to have 8 or
    > 900 dollars available. So I said ok. I asked him what kind of computer
    > and where was he going to buy it. He told me he was going to go to a
    > big box or big office supply chain type of store, I told him to look
    > around but that I would go with him to buy the pc, to make sure he
    > doesn't get taken for a ride.
    >
    > Then his mother told me she wanted to buy him a laptop! Because her
    > girlfriends at work told her that when he goes to college or university
    > the laptop would be useful! I told her that in 4 or 5 years from now
    > the laptop will make a fine doorstop or a nice Frisbee for 18 year old
    > university students on a Friday night drunk! To make matters worse he
    > told a clerk at a big office supply chain that he didn't want a flat
    > panel monitor (for gaming) and the clerk told him that CRT's were no
    > longer available and that they don't even work on new pc's! So I told
    > him that my gift to him would be the monitor and that I would find him a
    > suitable pc with the money he manages to save. I got him one of the
    > last Aperture Grill monitor still available today.
    >
    > Then I thought to myself, what is the best thing to get for a 13 year
    > old kid? I figured when he's 17 or 18 if he needs extra power he
    > probably won't have money to buy a new pc. I also figured I may as well
    > get him a 64 bit ready pc and make sure it has lots of room and options
    > for future upgradability. I think I will get him a dual core, dual
    > Opteron ready motherboard but I will only throw a single core 200 in
    > there. Also, I think I will only put XP 32 bit on there for now, I
    > think he's too young and inexperienced for Windows x64. Later on if he
    > needs more he can pay for it himself! And if he does get that from me
    > you can be sure that "Uncle John" will have his lawn mowed for free next
    > summer!
    >
    > John
    >
    > Charlie Russel - MVP wrote:
    >
    >> The 100 chips are designed to be the only CPU in the system, the 200 is
    >> designed to be one of two chips. A 2x200 series with dual cores would
    >> give you 4 opterons, effectively. A monster board, capable of doing just
    >> about anything you're likely to need. An 8way is really only for
    >> servers.. Realistically, a single CPU, with dual cores, is probably more
    >> than
    >> pretty much any normal user needs.
     
    Charlie Russel - MVP, Dec 26, 2005
    #9
  10. John John

    John John Guest

    Don't worry about that... the only thing I buy in these places are
    staples... and pencils...

    Charlie Russel - MVP wrote:

    > Oh - and don't go to Office Depot/Max/Whatever. Stick with a place that
    > specializes in building PCs. So a local system builder, if you have one, or
    > www.directron.com, www.ncix.com, www.newegg.com, etc., etc.
    >
     
    John John, Dec 26, 2005
    #10
  11. John John

    John John Guest

    Thanks for the advice. An x2 or an FX? The graphic card is a given.

    John

    Charlie Russel - MVP wrote:

    > Don't waste your (and his) money on a dual opteron board. Get a good "gamer"
    > board that does Athlon64 and put a dual-core in there. Spend the money on
    > the graphics card(s) for it, and plenty of RAM. He'll be fine for years.
    >
     
    John John, Dec 26, 2005
    #11
  12. FX is not dual core. FX is very popular among gamers, however, and is a
    reasonable choice. Dual core is also a reasonable choice for gaming. Dual
    core is more forward looking but there are no bad choices being suggested
    here. I use a dual core and they are slick.

    --
    Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
    (Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)
    "John John" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Thanks for the advice. An x2 or an FX? The graphic card is a given.
    >
    > John
    >
    > Charlie Russel - MVP wrote:
    >
    >> Don't waste your (and his) money on a dual opteron board. Get a good
    >> "gamer" board that does Athlon64 and put a dual-core in there. Spend the
    >> money on the graphics card(s) for it, and plenty of RAM. He'll be fine
    >> for years.
    >>
     
    Colin Barnhorst, Dec 27, 2005
    #12
  13. I agree, there are no bad choices. In fact, this is a case where everybody
    can be right, and you'll end up wasting money. If this is a 'First PC', I
    usually recommend going for a 'Second Hand', in this case, I would suggest
    checking with an 'Internet Cafe'. They typically change their gear maybe
    twice a year. First Rate, last years machines. Gives the person a chance to
    sink in to the 'Driver's Seat', let's them develop their own ideas about
    what they would realy like to have - which probably is quite different from
    anything that is foreseeable 1 - 3 years in advance.

    So, if you'd like to have your lawn tended to over a reasonable period -
    save 'some' of the money now, and help him get that next machine that he
    configures himself.

    (The Brit's have a saying: "If you fail to prepare, you'll prepare to
    fail!")

    Tony. . .


    "Colin Barnhorst" <colinbarharst(remove)@msn.com> wrote in message
    news:O%...
    > FX is not dual core. FX is very popular among gamers, however, and is a
    > reasonable choice. Dual core is also a reasonable choice for gaming.
    > Dual core is more forward looking but there are no bad choices being
    > suggested here. I use a dual core and they are slick.
    >
    > --
    > Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
    > (Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)
    > "John John" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> Thanks for the advice. An x2 or an FX? The graphic card is a given.
    >>
    >> John
    >>
    >> Charlie Russel - MVP wrote:
    >>
    >>> Don't waste your (and his) money on a dual opteron board. Get a good
    >>> "gamer" board that does Athlon64 and put a dual-core in there. Spend the
    >>> money on the graphics card(s) for it, and plenty of RAM. He'll be fine
    >>> for years.
    >>>

    >
    >
     
    Tony Sperling, Dec 27, 2005
    #13
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