Advice for the IT job Seeker.

Discussion in 'Microsoft Certification' started by The Rev \(MCT\), Mar 15, 2005.

  1. I can understand anyone's frustration as I've been there in the past. For
    recent graduates as well as recently certified professionals who are coming
    into what seems like a daunting field. I heed a small piece of personal
    wisdom.

    With the understanding that the IT field is on an upward force in relation
    to jobs people still seem to be unemployed. Look left then right and you
    will find two people in the same boat as yourself. The IT industry is not
    lacking in jobs, but is lacking in an experienced workforce. (Proof of which
    is in my inbox or on my voice mail daily with one job offer after another.)
    With that please understand there is room for the newly graduated IT
    professional, just not necessarily the job one may want right from the get
    go. An MCSE Certification does not automatically grant you the job of your
    dreams, that comes from a coupling of education, hard work, and experience.
    The certifications you earn will help you in the long run, just remember you
    don't always get instant gratification. (For this and countless other
    reasons don't fall to temptation and use Brain Dumps to fast track your
    certifications. It devalues the certification across the entire industry.
    Not to mention it does you no good in the long run, because you really
    haven't learned any of the necessary skills to be productive at your job.)

    IT staffing agencies have so many applicants to choose from so you must make
    yourself stand out. If you use an online job site (i.e. monster.com or
    careerbuilder.com) for your searches I would recommend, if you have not
    already, that you list your certifications or degrees in the title of your
    online resume. Also don't be afraid of the "cold call." Start getting in
    touch with the HR manager of the prospective employer. While experience is
    always a plus, initiative is constantly looked upon as a positive factor for
    the average job seeker.

    Also don't be discouraged. Try, try and try again. You can and will land the
    job you want and deserve. Just have patience and don't be ad versed to
    taking a lower job at first to get your "proverbial" foot in the door. And
    if you're uncommitted to a physical locality think about jobs that require
    travel or consider relocation. Put yourself out there if you have to. Take a
    temporary or contract job. Don't be afraid of contract positions, because
    they can turn into, occasionally lucrative, full-time positions. Get in
    contact with IT contact companies like Teksystems and K-Force. These
    companies have built an industry on filling small contract jobs, some of
    which only last days or weeks, but they are always loyal to their contract
    employees.

    And lastly.Good Luck! Anytime you change careers it's a big step. I know
    when I decided to move from IT Administration to IT training I was taking a
    big leap. I do still consult on the side, but for the most part I went
    through the same things all of you are going through right now. So keep
    going and I truly hope each of you find what you're looking for. If you need
    anything let me know. Believe it or not, I'd be happy to answer questions or
    look at resumes and help you, if and when I can. And I know I'm not the only
    one here that will help you.
    --
    "The Rev" MCT/MCNGP #44
    I may sound arrogant at times, but that's only because I'm always right.

    Memories fade but a Google search never forgets.
    justafreak.com
    ..
    The Rev \(MCT\), Mar 15, 2005
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. The Rev (MCT) wrote:
    > I can understand anyone's frustration as I've been there in the past.
    > For recent graduates as well as recently certified professionals who
    > are coming into what seems like a daunting field. I heed a small
    > piece of personal wisdom.


    "It brought tears to my eyes!" W. Gates

    "One thumb WAY up!" Roger Ebert

    "Out friggin' standing!" Frisbee®. MCNGP
    =?Windows-1252?Q?Frisbee=AE?=, Mar 15, 2005
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. The Rev \(MCT\)

    Bart Guest

    You have job offers in your "inbox?" You're not in Florida or Texas.

    You recommend Tek Systems and K-Force? Those two agencies are the biggest
    ripoff artists in the industry. They will take you for every dime you've
    got, whether you're the client or the contractor.

    Otherwise you offer excellent advice and encouragement, but you lost me on
    those two points. The only other thing I would advise against is putting a
    degree or certification in your one-line description on Monster. I know
    plenty of IT guys in hiring positions that are immediately put off by that.

    What part of the country are you in? It must be way north and very cold.
    In the south, for every IT job opening there are at least 250 résumés
    submitted for it.
    Bart, Mar 15, 2005
    #3
  4. As for K-Force and TekSystems I've personally done work for them in the past
    and had no problems with pay. I'm not in Texas or Florida, but I am in the
    South East United States right now. I've lived in several parts of the
    country however. As for Monster.com headlines while it may be true some
    agencies are put off by what would seem bragged, if you want your name at
    the top of more employer searches that will get you there.

    --
    "The Rev" MCT/MCNGP #44
    I may sound arrogant at times, but that's only because I'm always right.

    Memories fade but a Google search never forgets.
    justafreak.com
    ..
    "Bart" <> wrote in message
    news:B7IZd.146481$...
    > You have job offers in your "inbox?" You're not in Florida or Texas.
    >
    > You recommend Tek Systems and K-Force? Those two agencies are the biggest
    > ripoff artists in the industry. They will take you for every dime you've
    > got, whether you're the client or the contractor.
    >
    > Otherwise you offer excellent advice and encouragement, but you lost me on
    > those two points. The only other thing I would advise against is putting

    a
    > degree or certification in your one-line description on Monster. I know
    > plenty of IT guys in hiring positions that are immediately put off by

    that.
    >
    > What part of the country are you in? It must be way north and very cold.
    > In the south, for every IT job opening there are at least 250 résumés
    > submitted for it.
    The Rev \(MCT\), Mar 15, 2005
    #4
  5. The Rev \(MCT\)

    Bart Guest

    "The Rev (MCT)" <> wrote in message
    news:%23%...
    > As for K-Force and TekSystems I've personally done work for them in the
    > past
    > and had no problems with pay.


    I've done work for them both, too. Although Tek Systems was called Aerotek
    back then, and I guess they still are in some parts of the country. Anyway,
    K-Force was better when they were called Romac -- after that they became
    just like Aerotek. Charge out at $120 an hour, give you maybe $30 to $40,
    back in "the good old days." They also treat their contractors like crap.
    I lump Technisource with these clowns.
    Bart, Mar 15, 2005
    #5
  6. The Rev \(MCT\)

    catwalker63 Guest

    "Bart" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    news:B7IZd.146481$:


    > What part of the country are you in? It must be way north and very
    > cold. In the south, for every IT job opening there are at least 250
    > résumés submitted for it.
    >


    Only 250 huh? I've seen positions here in the Great Northwest with 600-
    1000 applicants. A daunting proposition.

    --
    Catwalker
    aka Pu$$y Feet
    BS, MCP
    MCNGP #43
    www.mcngp.com
    faq.mcngp.com

    “If man could be crossed with the cat, it would improve man, but it would
    deteriorate the cat.” Mark Twain
    catwalker63, Mar 16, 2005
    #6
  7. The Rev \(MCT\)

    Bart Guest

    "catwalker63" <> wrote in message
    news:Xns961AA575399E6catwalker63athotmail@216.196.97.136...
    > "Bart" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    > news:B7IZd.146481$:
    >
    >
    >> What part of the country are you in? It must be way north and very
    >> cold. In the south, for every IT job opening there are at least 250
    >> résumés submitted for it.
    >>

    >
    > Only 250 huh? I've seen positions here in the Great Northwest with 600-
    > 1000 applicants. A daunting proposition.


    I manage the Exchange server for a local IT placement firm, and their resume
    account gets about 800 to 1000 resumes for every job posted on Monster and
    Dice. An ad in the local paper generates less email, but much more paper
    resumes, which they hate. Their selection process consists of first
    eliminating everyone not having a bachelor's degree. Then they go from
    there. Certification importance depends upon the client, but it never ranks
    above education.
    Bart, Mar 16, 2005
    #7
  8. The Rev \(MCT\)

    Rowdy Yates Guest

    Rowdy Yates, Mar 16, 2005
    #8
  9. The Rev \(MCT\)

    Rowdy Yates Guest

    "Bart" <> wrote in
    news:pFLZd.182913$:

    > "catwalker63" <> wrote in message
    > news:Xns961AA575399E6catwalker63athotmail@216.196.97.136...
    >> "Bart" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    >> news:B7IZd.146481$:
    >>
    >>
    >>> What part of the country are you in? It must be way north and very
    >>> cold. In the south, for every IT job opening there are at least 250
    >>> résumés submitted for it.
    >>>

    >>
    >> Only 250 huh? I've seen positions here in the Great Northwest with
    >> 600- 1000 applicants. A daunting proposition.

    >
    > I manage the Exchange server for a local IT placement firm, and their
    > resume account gets about 800 to 1000 resumes for every job posted on
    > Monster and Dice. An ad in the local paper generates less email, but
    > much more paper resumes, which they hate. Their selection process
    > consists of first eliminating everyone not having a bachelor's degree.
    > Then they go from there. Certification importance depends upon the
    > client, but it never ranks above education.
    >
    >
    >
    >


    yup. yet another reason why the kids today need to stop being lazy and
    get a good university education whole they are young.

    --
    Rowdy Yates, MCNGP #39
    http://www.mcngp.com/
    "Shhhh... Do you smell that? I think is't Albanian Goat Smegma!"
    http://www.geocities.com/rowdy_yates_mcngp/
    http://www.geocities.com/rowdy_yates_mcngp/google.gif
    Rowdy Yates, Mar 16, 2005
    #9
  10. The Rev \(MCT\)

    Bart Guest

    "Rowdy Yates" <rowdy_yates_mcngpATyahooDOTcom> wrote in message
    > yup. yet another reason why the kids today need to stop being lazy and
    > get a good university education whole they are young.


    And get to work on their master's after they get placed out of college. It
    is very important -- more important than ever -- for young people to hit the
    ground running. The older you are, the more difficult it is to go back to
    college and get any consideration from an employer. They will always prefer
    the younger candidates.
    Bart, Mar 16, 2005
    #10
  11. The Rev \(MCT\)

    Bart Guest

    "Rowdy Yates" <rowdy_yates_mcngpATyahooDOTcom> wrote in message
    news:Xns961ACE5CB2553rowdyyates2124@207.46.248.16...
    > "Bart" <> wrote in news:B7IZd.146481$qB6.33850
    > @tornado.tampabay.rr.com:
    >
    >> IT job opening there are at least 250 r,sum,s
    >> submitted for it.

    >
    > wrong. 500! thats what we got for assist admin.


    And how do you sort them?
    Bart, Mar 16, 2005
    #11
  12. The Rev \(MCT\)

    Rowdy Yates Guest

    "Bart" <> wrote in news:i1MZd.182917$JF2.105015
    @tornado.tampabay.rr.com:

    > "Rowdy Yates" <rowdy_yates_mcngpATyahooDOTcom> wrote in message
    > news:Xns961ACE5CB2553rowdyyates2124@207.46.248.16...
    >> "Bart" <> wrote in news:B7IZd.146481$qB6.33850
    >> @tornado.tampabay.rr.com:
    >>
    >>> IT job opening there are at least 250 r,sum,s
    >>> submitted for it.

    >>
    >> wrong. 500! thats what we got for assist admin.

    >
    > And how do you sort them?
    >
    >
    >


    i didn't. HR did. but i heard about the number.

    --
    Rowdy Yates, MCNGP #39
    http://www.mcngp.com/
    http://profiles.yahoo.com/rowdy_yates_mcngp
    Rowdy Yates, Mar 16, 2005
    #12
  13. The Rev \(MCT\)

    Guest

    I'd really like to take you up on reviewing my resume and giving me
    your advice on how to start my IT career. How can I directly contact
    you? I greatly appreciate it! Thanks!
    , Mar 16, 2005
    #13
  14. The Rev \(MCT\)

    Ogre Guest

    wrote:

    > giving me your advice on how to start my IT career.
    >

    Like a deer in the headlights
    Ogre, Mar 16, 2005
    #14
  15. The Rev \(MCT\)

    Neil Guest

    did you hear Ogre <iamogreatgmaildotcom> say in news:#Iyqs3jKFHA.604
    @TK2MSFTNGP10.phx.gbl:

    > wrote:
    >
    >> giving me your advice on how to start my IT career.
    >>

    > Like a deer in the headlights


    ooooo, you're good...

    --
    Neil MCNGP#30

    - Linux: because rebooting is for adding new hardware.
    Neil, Mar 16, 2005
    #15
  16. The Rev \(MCT\)

    Neil Guest

    did you hear "The Rev \(MCT\)" <> say in
    news:#:

    > Believe it or not, I'd be happy to answer questions or
    > look at resumes and help you, if and when I can. And I know I'm not
    > the only one here that will help you.
    >


    you know not what you are setting yourself up for...

    --
    Neil MCNGP#30

    - Friends don't let friends drive naked.
    Neil, Mar 16, 2005
    #16
  17. The Rev \(MCT\)

    JaR Guest

    In microsoft.public.cert.exam.mcse, climbed on a soapbox
    & opined:

    > I'd really like to take you up on reviewing my resume and giving me
    > your advice on how to start my IT career. How can I directly contact
    > you? I greatly appreciate it! Thanks!
    >


    First, we need to work on that reading comprehension problem.

    --
    JaR
    Thug 10110
    Click on MCNGP.com. What more do you need to know?
    JaR, Mar 16, 2005
    #17
  18. Yeah I know, but I really don't mind. I do it all the time now for my
    students. As for the contact method I have an older gmail account I used for
    anonymous stuff and will use that for filtering out the real emails form the
    bad.

    You can contact me here: ireportbadpeopleATgmailDOTcom

    --
    "The Rev" MCT/MCNGP #44
    I may sound arrogant at times, but that's only because I'm always right.

    Memories fade but a Google search never forgets.
    justafreak.com
    ..
    "Neil" <guess!!!@gmail.com> wrote in message
    news:Xns961B7117B9190neilmcsegmailcom@207.46.248.16...
    > did you hear "The Rev \(MCT\)" <> say in
    > news:#:
    >
    > > Believe it or not, I'd be happy to answer questions or
    > > look at resumes and help you, if and when I can. And I know I'm not
    > > the only one here that will help you.
    > >

    >
    > you know not what you are setting yourself up for...
    >
    > --
    > Neil MCNGP#30
    >
    > - Friends don't let friends drive naked.
    The Rev \(MCT\), Mar 16, 2005
    #18
  19. The Rev \(MCT\)

    Bad Advice Guest

    Get a job, requiring a security clearance, even if it is
    a janitor. Then take that, your newly minted certs, and
    apply everywhere you can and get any entry level IT job.

    I have seen some real idiots with clearances and very
    good jobs. Thus, they can't harm anyone or anything and
    they are almost always guaranteed a job in D.C. as long
    as they don't screw up. I worked with two guys that had
    clearances, one was brilliant, the other was an idiot,
    and they both slept on the evening shift or at
    night. ...and were paid quite handsomely.

    For non-cleared positions you will have several hundred
    resumes submitted, some not even relevant. For cleared
    positions, it is harder to find qualified candidates.

    Joe
    >-----Original Message-----
    >I can understand anyone's frustration as I've been there

    in the past. For
    >recent graduates as well as recently certified

    professionals who are coming
    >into what seems like a daunting field. I heed a small

    piece of personal
    >wisdom.
    >
    >With the understanding that the IT field is on an upward

    force in relation
    >to jobs people still seem to be unemployed. Look left

    then right and you
    >will find two people in the same boat as yourself. The

    IT industry is not
    >lacking in jobs, but is lacking in an experienced

    workforce. (Proof of which
    >is in my inbox or on my voice mail daily with one job

    offer after another.)
    >With that please understand there is room for the newly

    graduated IT
    >professional, just not necessarily the job one may want

    right from the get
    >go. An MCSE Certification does not automatically grant

    you the job of your
    >dreams, that comes from a coupling of education, hard

    work, and experience.
    >The certifications you earn will help you in the long

    run, just remember you
    >don't always get instant gratification. (For this and

    countless other
    >reasons don't fall to temptation and use Brain Dumps to

    fast track your
    >certifications. It devalues the certification across the

    entire industry.
    >Not to mention it does you no good in the long run,

    because you really
    >haven't learned any of the necessary skills to be

    productive at your job.)
    >
    >IT staffing agencies have so many applicants to choose

    from so you must make
    >yourself stand out. If you use an online job site (i.e.

    monster.com or
    >careerbuilder.com) for your searches I would recommend,

    if you have not
    >already, that you list your certifications or degrees in

    the title of your
    >online resume. Also don't be afraid of the "cold call."

    Start getting in
    >touch with the HR manager of the prospective employer.

    While experience is
    >always a plus, initiative is constantly looked upon as a

    positive factor for
    >the average job seeker.
    >
    >Also don't be discouraged. Try, try and try again. You

    can and will land the
    >job you want and deserve. Just have patience and don't

    be ad versed to
    >taking a lower job at first to get your "proverbial"

    foot in the door. And
    >if you're uncommitted to a physical locality think about

    jobs that require
    >travel or consider relocation. Put yourself out there if

    you have to. Take a
    >temporary or contract job. Don't be afraid of contract

    positions, because
    >they can turn into, occasionally lucrative, full-time

    positions. Get in
    >contact with IT contact companies like Teksystems and K-

    Force. These
    >companies have built an industry on filling small

    contract jobs, some of
    >which only last days or weeks, but they are always loyal

    to their contract
    >employees.
    >
    >And lastly.Good Luck! Anytime you change careers it's a

    big step. I know
    >when I decided to move from IT Administration to IT

    training I was taking a
    >big leap. I do still consult on the side, but for the

    most part I went
    >through the same things all of you are going through

    right now. So keep
    >going and I truly hope each of you find what you're

    looking for. If you need
    >anything let me know. Believe it or not, I'd be happy to

    answer questions or
    >look at resumes and help you, if and when I can. And I

    know I'm not the only
    >one here that will help you.
    >--
    >"The Rev" MCT/MCNGP #44
    >I may sound arrogant at times, but that's only because

    I'm always right.
    >
    >Memories fade but a Google search never forgets.
    >justafreak.com
    >..
    >
    >
    >.
    >
    Bad Advice, Mar 23, 2005
    #19
    1. Advertising

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