ADSL Router Recommendations

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by RL, Feb 20, 2008.

  1. RL

    RL Guest

    Hi,

    I've absolutely had enough with ADSL. I have four routers (Allied
    Telesyn, DSE, D-Link, and Dynalink), none of which work reliably,
    particularly when it comes to lots of concurrent connections. The DSE
    one is the most reliable if you're curious.

    The longest the connection has remained up is three days, but it isn't
    unusual to have to restart the router a few times in a day. The
    situation is so bad that I'm installing a power switching device to
    restart the router automatically when it goes down. No sense paying for
    off peak bandwidth we can't use because the router goes down shortly
    after the off peak period starts.

    What I'd like to know, other than why Natcom has never contacted me
    about their WiMax trial, is what ADSL (preferably ADSL2+) router
    actually works?

    I just want to turn the thing on, and never have to touch it. Line
    conditions are marginal, but good enough that ADSL should work, and
    there really is no excuse for the routers to just freeze up when things
    go bad, like they all seem to.

    I'd prefer something that supported half bridge mode, as I a
    FreeBSD-based router which seems to work well.

    Any experiences would be appreciated.

    Thanks,

    RL
    RL, Feb 20, 2008
    #1
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  2. In article <fpgemp$5ig$>, RL did write:

    > I've absolutely had enough with ADSL. I have four routers (Allied
    > Telesyn, DSE, D-Link, and Dynalink), none of which work reliably,
    > particularly when it comes to lots of concurrent connections. The DSE
    > one is the most reliable if you're curious.


    I had a D-Link DSL-500 for a few years. Never actually gave any trouble, I
    only moved away from it because of its NAT limitations.

    I currently use a USB ADSL modem that I picked up from Dick Smith
    (discontinued model--I got the last one at the local Powerhouse). I
    switched to it because it's built around a Conexant chipset, which has
    Linux drivers (though I had to hunt around to find the right firmware), and
    I can rely on the full flexibility of netfilter/iptables on my main Linux
    box to do all the routing and NAT.
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Feb 20, 2008
    #2
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  3. RL

    EMB Guest

    RL wrote:
    > I just want to turn the thing on, and never have to touch it. Line
    > conditions are marginal, but good enough that ADSL should work, and
    > there really is no excuse for the routers to just freeze up when things
    > go bad, like they all seem to.
    >
    > I'd prefer something that supported half bridge mode, as I a
    > FreeBSD-based router which seems to work well.


    If the line is marginal you'll not be needing an ADSL2+ router. I'd
    suggest getting hold of an old Nokia M1122 - they are bulletproof and
    work well on marginal lines.

    I use a Linksys AG241 at home that performs pretty well and only gives
    problems when there are physical issues on the line (it's just taken
    Telecom 9 months to resolve the line issues). It supports half or full
    bridge mode, is ADSL2+ and is probably only avialable on Trademe now.
    EMB, Feb 20, 2008
    #3
  4. RL

    RL Guest

    EMB wrote:
    > RL wrote:
    >> I just want to turn the thing on, and never have to touch it. Line
    >> conditions are marginal, but good enough that ADSL should work, and
    >> there really is no excuse for the routers to just freeze up when
    >> things go bad, like they all seem to.
    >>
    >> I'd prefer something that supported half bridge mode, as I a
    >> FreeBSD-based router which seems to work well.

    >
    > If the line is marginal you'll not be needing an ADSL2+ router. I'd
    > suggest getting hold of an old Nokia M1122 - they are bulletproof and
    > work well on marginal lines.


    Does the M1122 support half bridge mode? I wasn't aware of it supporting
    this, otherwise I would probably have got one years ago. I used to use
    the M11 and later the M1122 at work, and they were solid performers.

    The other good router I used was a Cisco model, back in the early days
    of ADSL, but sadly that belonged to an employer at the time.

    Thanks,

    - RL
    RL, Feb 20, 2008
    #4
  5. RL

    Richard Guest

    EMB wrote:

    > If the line is marginal you'll not be needing an ADSL2+ router. I'd
    > suggest getting hold of an old Nokia M1122 - they are bulletproof and
    > work well on marginal lines.


    I 100% disagree with that recommendation. ADSL2 has the range extend
    profile which works better on long lines, and on the line here an m1122
    gets 2048 or 1920k - a junky dynalink rta1320 gets the low 3000's - and
    if the noise margin is dropped to minimum with the DMT tool it will get
    about 4 megs. All with an extra 120 on the upstream.

    The only issues with the dynalinks are overheating related which have
    being solved with ram heatsinks on all the chips in it and a case fan.
    Richard, Feb 20, 2008
    #5
  6. RL

    RL Guest

    Richard wrote:
    > I 100% disagree with that recommendation. ADSL2 has the range extend
    > profile which works better on long lines, and on the line here an m1122
    > gets 2048 or 1920k - a junky dynalink rta1320 gets the low 3000's - and
    > if the noise margin is dropped to minimum with the DMT tool it will get
    > about 4 megs. All with an extra 120 on the upstream.


    Thanks for the feedback. I'm more concerned with stablity than speed,
    but if ADSL2 may help address the problem, then I should plan for its
    forthcoming availability.

    > The only issues with the dynalinks are overheating related which have
    > being solved with ram heatsinks on all the chips in it and a case fan.


    I have an ancient Dynalink RTA210. This model was subject to a recall,
    and the Dynalink support staff didn't seem to believe me that I kept my
    connection up by using a ~40cm pedistal fan blowing across the room
    towards the router on a desk, several meters away.

    RL
    RL, Feb 20, 2008
    #6
  7. RL

    Squiggle Guest

    RL wrote:
    >
    > The other good router I used was a Cisco model, back in the early days
    > of ADSL, but sadly that belonged to an employer at the time.
    >
    > Thanks,
    >
    > - RL


    Cisco 827 & 837s go for $70-$100 on trademe at the moment. Just picked
    one up yesterday. It doesn't sync any faster than the el-cheapo pt-3812
    I was using, now waiting to see if there is any noticable change in
    connection stability.
    Squiggle, Feb 20, 2008
    #7
  8. RL

    EMB Guest

    Richard wrote:
    > EMB wrote:
    >
    >> If the line is marginal you'll not be needing an ADSL2+ router. I'd
    >> suggest getting hold of an old Nokia M1122 - they are bulletproof and
    >> work well on marginal lines.

    >
    > I 100% disagree with that recommendation. ADSL2 has the range extend
    > profile which works better on long lines


    Which AFAIK is not implemented in NZ.
    EMB, Feb 20, 2008
    #8
  9. RL wrote:
    > EMB wrote:
    >> RL wrote:
    >>> I just want to turn the thing on, and never have to touch it. Line
    >>> conditions are marginal, but good enough that ADSL should work, and
    >>> there really is no excuse for the routers to just freeze up when
    >>> things go bad, like they all seem to.
    >>>
    >>> I'd prefer something that supported half bridge mode, as I a
    >>> FreeBSD-based router which seems to work well.

    >>
    >> If the line is marginal you'll not be needing an ADSL2+ router. I'd
    >> suggest getting hold of an old Nokia M1122 - they are bulletproof and
    >> work well on marginal lines.

    >
    > Does the M1122 support half bridge mode? I wasn't aware of it supporting
    > this, otherwise I would probably have got one years ago. I used to use
    > the M11 and later the M1122 at work, and they were solid performers.
    >
    > The other good router I used was a Cisco model, back in the early days
    > of ADSL, but sadly that belonged to an employer at the time.
    >
    > Thanks,
    >
    > - RL

    I have several Cisco 837 ADSL VPN Routers, they just keep on going
    handle poor lines and never need a reset
    Collector€NZ, Feb 20, 2008
    #9
  10. RL

    Enkidu Guest

    RL wrote:
    > Hi,
    >
    > I've absolutely had enough with ADSL. I have four routers (Allied
    > Telesyn, DSE, D-Link, and Dynalink), none of which work reliably,
    > particularly when it comes to lots of concurrent connections. The DSE
    > one is the most reliable if you're curious.
    >

    If you have that many problems, the problems are likely not with the
    modems but with your ADSL connection to the exchange. I've used various
    modems and the only ones that WILL NOT WORK are USR ones.

    Cheers,

    Cliff

    --

    Have you ever noticed that if something is advertised as 'amusing' or
    'hilarious', it usually isn't?
    Enkidu, Feb 20, 2008
    #10
  11. RL

    Richard Guest

    EMB wrote:
    > Richard wrote:
    >> EMB wrote:
    >>
    >>> If the line is marginal you'll not be needing an ADSL2+ router. I'd
    >>> suggest getting hold of an old Nokia M1122 - they are bulletproof and
    >>> work well on marginal lines.

    >>
    >> I 100% disagree with that recommendation. ADSL2 has the range extend
    >> profile which works better on long lines

    >
    > Which AFAIK is not implemented in NZ.


    Considering that its 50/50 if I get adsl2+ or adsl2 RE on my line then I
    would say that yes it has being.

    I dont know if telecom have a profile to load against your port to force
    it onto it, but it sure is there when allowed to choose it. I have had
    to be dropped back to adsl1 at the moment to solve the occasional low
    upstream speeds (talking the likes of 120 - 132 kb sync which makes the
    connection useless) since they have no profile that can force it at this
    stage.
    Richard, Feb 20, 2008
    #11
  12. RL

    EMB Guest

    Richard wrote:
    > EMB wrote:
    >> Richard wrote:
    >>> EMB wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> If the line is marginal you'll not be needing an ADSL2+ router. I'd
    >>>> suggest getting hold of an old Nokia M1122 - they are bulletproof
    >>>> and work well on marginal lines.
    >>>
    >>> I 100% disagree with that recommendation. ADSL2 has the range extend
    >>> profile which works better on long lines

    >>
    >> Which AFAIK is not implemented in NZ.

    >
    > Considering that its 50/50 if I get adsl2+ or adsl2 RE on my line then I
    > would say that yes it has being.
    >
    > I dont know if telecom have a profile to load against your port to force
    > it onto it, but it sure is there when allowed to choose it. I have had
    > to be dropped back to adsl1 at the moment to solve the occasional low
    > upstream speeds (talking the likes of 120 - 132 kb sync which makes the
    > connection useless) since they have no profile that can force it at this
    > stage.


    Then in the real world of "right now in NZ" I rest my case about ADSL2+
    being useless on a marginal line. A case that incidentally is based on
    real world experience with *very* marginal ADSL connections in rural areas.
    EMB, Feb 20, 2008
    #12
  13. RL

    Richard Guest

    EMB wrote:
    > Richard wrote:
    >> I dont know if telecom have a profile to load against your port to
    >> force it onto it, but it sure is there when allowed to choose it. I
    >> have had to be dropped back to adsl1 at the moment to solve the
    >> occasional low upstream speeds (talking the likes of 120 - 132 kb sync
    >> which makes the connection useless) since they have no profile that
    >> can force it at this stage.

    >
    > Then in the real world of "right now in NZ" I rest my case about ADSL2+
    > being useless on a marginal line. A case that incidentally is based on
    > real world experience with *very* marginal ADSL connections in rural areas.


    Well, if you want to use the m1122 and its low speeds when adsl 2 will
    give better ones, then thats fine by me. I was correcting you saying
    that its not implemented in nz when it is, I would suggest getting your
    isp to check with provisioning if they can force it on your line to see
    of you can get better speeds then you are on the dinosaur modem in the
    m1122. Or keep using it and accept that your getting 60-70% of what your
    line can deliver.

    What speeds do you get on this rural line with its "real world" case
    with an adsl2+ modem and the m1122, have you had telecom change the
    profile off adsl 1 when trying the adsl2 modem since they seem to by
    default lock them to adsl1 if you are using that at the time it was
    provisioned.
    Richard, Feb 20, 2008
    #13
  14. RL

    Richard Guest

    Enkidu wrote:
    > RL wrote:
    >> Hi,
    >>
    >> I've absolutely had enough with ADSL. I have four routers (Allied
    >> Telesyn, DSE, D-Link, and Dynalink), none of which work reliably,
    >> particularly when it comes to lots of concurrent connections. The DSE
    >> one is the most reliable if you're curious.
    >>

    > If you have that many problems, the problems are likely not with the
    > modems but with your ADSL connection to the exchange. I've used various
    > modems and the only ones that WILL NOT WORK are USR ones.


    Its a nat issue, not a problem with the physical adsl connection.

    The only way I could go more then a day on my old m1122 was to turn off
    dht in azureus since it didnt age udp sockets properly.
    Richard, Feb 21, 2008
    #14
  15. RL

    RL Guest

    Richard wrote:
    > Its a nat issue, not a problem with the physical adsl connection.
    >
    > The only way I could go more then a day on my old m1122 was to turn off
    > dht in azureus since it didnt age udp sockets properly.


    I'm running in half bridge mode, so NAT is disabled.

    - RL
    RL, Feb 21, 2008
    #15
  16. RL

    Fantail Guest

    On Feb 20, 6:44 pm, RL <> wrote:

    > I've absolutely had enough with ADSL. I have four routers (Allied
    > Telesyn, DSE, D-Link, and Dynalink), none of which work reliably...
    > ... have to restart the router a few times in a day...


    FWIW:
    I have a Dynalink router which required lots of restarts, until I
    noticed that the frequency correlated with sunshine. It seemed a bit
    hot, and the vents inadequate, only about 0.5 mm wide. Out with the
    Leatherman, lots of plastic removed, making the vents about 2 mm, and
    restarts are required roughly weekly now.

    Regards
    Fantail, Feb 25, 2008
    #16
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