ADSL in NZ..

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Hmmm, Oct 16, 2004.

  1. Hmmm

    Hmmm Guest

    I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday and I
    was saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever switch me over),
    he was surprised the speed was so low, and he nearly died of laughter
    when he heard that many isp's offer 128/128 adsl connections over here..

    I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month,
    totally unlimited and unthrottled...

    That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even less
    for him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.

    But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how much
    the plans here suck so much....

    I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as that...


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    Hmmm, Oct 16, 2004
    #1
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  2. Hmmm

    Starkey Guest

    On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 11:10:07 +1300, Hmmm <> wrote:

    >I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday and I
    >was saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever switch me over),
    >he was surprised the speed was so low, and he nearly died of laughter
    >when he heard that many isp's offer 128/128 adsl connections over here..
    >
    >I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month,
    >totally unlimited and unthrottled...
    >
    >That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even less
    >for him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.
    >
    >But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how much
    >the plans here suck so much....
    >
    >I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    >wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as that...
    >
    >
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    you gotta remember though thats europe, we are flat stick in the
    middle of nowhere, i highly doubt we will see anything like that here
    and even if we do it be to expensive to own.



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    Starkey, Oct 17, 2004
    #2
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  3. Hmmm

    Geronimo! Guest

    On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 14:37:18 +1300, Starkey <> wrote:

    >On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 11:10:07 +1300, Hmmm <> wrote:
    >
    >>I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday and I
    >>was saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever switch me over),
    >>he was surprised the speed was so low, and he nearly died of laughter
    >>when he heard that many isp's offer 128/128 adsl connections over here..
    >>
    >>I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month,
    >>totally unlimited and unthrottled...
    >>
    >>That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even less
    >>for him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.
    >>
    >>But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how much
    >>the plans here suck so much....
    >>
    >>I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    >>wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as that...
    >>
    >>
    >>----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
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    >>---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---

    >
    >you gotta remember though thats europe, we are flat stick in the
    >middle of nowhere, i highly doubt we will see anything like that here
    >and even if we do it be to expensive to own.
    >




    But every thing here is way way overpriced..

    The Land of Milk & Honey, but nothing else.

    Even the Wages here are lower than most Eastern Countries, and the Tax is far
    to high..

    But then we have Crap governments, and MP's that are just in it for them
    selves..


    So the Complacent Kiwi just sits on his hand as dose nothing about it.


    >
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    Geronimo!, Oct 17, 2004
    #3
  4. Hmmm

    E. Scrooge Guest

    "Geronimo!" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 14:37:18 +1300, Starkey <> wrote:
    >
    >>On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 11:10:07 +1300, Hmmm <> wrote:
    >>
    >>>I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday and I
    >>>was saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever switch me over),
    >>>he was surprised the speed was so low, and he nearly died of laughter
    >>>when he heard that many isp's offer 128/128 adsl connections over here..
    >>>
    >>>I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month,
    >>>totally unlimited and unthrottled...
    >>>
    >>>That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even less
    >>>for him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.
    >>>
    >>>But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how much
    >>>the plans here suck so much....
    >>>
    >>>I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    >>>wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as
    >>>that...
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
    >>>News==----
    >>>http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000
    >>>Newsgroups
    >>>---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---

    >>
    >>you gotta remember though thats europe, we are flat stick in the
    >>middle of nowhere, i highly doubt we will see anything like that here
    >>and even if we do it be to expensive to own.
    >>

    >
    >
    >
    > But every thing here is way way overpriced..
    >
    > The Land of Milk & Honey, but nothing else.
    >
    > Even the Wages here are lower than most Eastern Countries, and the Tax is
    > far
    > to high..
    >
    > But then we have Crap governments, and MP's that are just in it for them
    > selves..
    >
    >
    > So the Complacent Kiwi just sits on his hand as dose nothing about it.


    You can't have next to nothing low prices and have the highest possible
    wages.
    Prices for a lot of things aren't that bad at all these days.

    It was the same high taxes that were partly used to keep you alive. Who
    else do you think paid for your weeks of Hospital care?

    After helping to pay for your fucking Hospital care, lets see some decent
    returns for what was wasted on you, grizzle guts.

    E. Scrooge
     
    E. Scrooge, Oct 17, 2004
    #4
  5. Hmmm

    steve Guest

    Hmmm wrote:

    > But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how much
    > the plans here suck so much....
    >
    > I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    > wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as
    > that...


    It will come in a few years.....but Telecom will drag it out for as long as
    they possibly can.....as they always do.

    That is becasue their primary consideration is profit.

    Compare with Korea, where the primary consideration was broadband for
    everyone as soon as possible -> as a government priority.....

    and it was so....

    ....and the telco remains hugely profitable (govt owned...)

    --
    Distributed Computing Projects:
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    http://boinc.mundayweb.com/seti2/stats.php?userID=1248
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    steve, Oct 17, 2004
    #5
  6. Hmmm

    T-Boy Guest

    In article <1097981612.498852@ftpsrv1>, scrooge@*shot.co.nz says...
    >
    > "Geronimo!" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 14:37:18 +1300, Starkey <> wrote:
    > >
    > >>On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 11:10:07 +1300, Hmmm <> wrote:
    > >>
    > >>>I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday and I
    > >>>was saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever switch me over),
    > >>>he was surprised the speed was so low, and he nearly died of laughter
    > >>>when he heard that many isp's offer 128/128 adsl connections over here..
    > >>>
    > >>>I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month,
    > >>>totally unlimited and unthrottled...
    > >>>
    > >>>That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even less
    > >>>for him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.
    > >>>
    > >>>But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how much
    > >>>the plans here suck so much....
    > >>>
    > >>>I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    > >>>wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as
    > >>>that...
    > >>>
    > >>>
    > >>>----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
    > >>>News==----
    > >>>http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000
    > >>>Newsgroups
    > >>>---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---
    > >>
    > >>you gotta remember though thats europe, we are flat stick in the
    > >>middle of nowhere, i highly doubt we will see anything like that here
    > >>and even if we do it be to expensive to own.
    > >>

    > >
    > >
    > >
    > > But every thing here is way way overpriced..
    > >
    > > The Land of Milk & Honey, but nothing else.
    > >
    > > Even the Wages here are lower than most Eastern Countries, and the Tax is
    > > far
    > > to high..
    > >
    > > But then we have Crap governments, and MP's that are just in it for them
    > > selves..
    > >
    > >
    > > So the Complacent Kiwi just sits on his hand as dose nothing about it.

    >
    > You can't have next to nothing low prices and have the highest possible
    > wages.
    > Prices for a lot of things aren't that bad at all these days.
    >
    > It was the same high taxes that were partly used to keep you alive. Who
    > else do you think paid for your weeks of Hospital care?
    >
    > After helping to pay for your fucking Hospital care, lets see some decent
    > returns for what was wasted on you, grizzle guts.


    Is there a point to your rant? If so, could you state it please.

    --
    Duncan
     
    T-Boy, Oct 17, 2004
    #6
  7. Hmmm

    ChrisOD Guest

    Hmmm wrote:
    > I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday and I
    > was saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever switch me over),
    > he was surprised the speed was so low, and he nearly died of laughter
    > when he heard that many isp's offer 128/128 adsl connections over here..
    >
    > I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month,
    > totally unlimited and unthrottled...
    >
    > That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even less
    > for him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.
    >
    > But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how much
    > the plans here suck so much....
    >
    > I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    > wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as that...
    >
    >
    > ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
    > News==----
    > http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000
    > Newsgroups
    > ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---


    Yeah, not one to defend Telecon but...

    The netherlands is very densly populated, flat and easy to trench (apart
    from the water). When I was there last summer I asked an ISP about the
    penetration of broadband, and he said it was close to 100%. His reasons
    were: almost everyone has cable (existing BB infrastructure), you can
    moleplow fibre almost anywhere through the mud. And for those few places
    that can be considered rural, you can put a telephone pole up at one end
    of the country and another at the other and they could get 100% wireless
    coverage (I think by the tone this last point was delivered that this
    was some dutch joke).


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    ChrisOD, Oct 17, 2004
    #7
  8. Hmmm

    Steve Guest

    steve wrote:
    > Hmmm wrote:
    >
    >
    >>But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how much
    >>the plans here suck so much....
    >>
    >>I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    >>wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as
    >>that...

    >
    >
    > It will come in a few years.....but Telecom will drag it out for as long as
    > they possibly can.....as they always do.
    >
    > That is becasue their primary consideration is profit.
    >
    > Compare with Korea, where the primary consideration was broadband for
    > everyone as soon as possible -> as a government priority.....
    >
    > and it was so....
    >
    > ...and the telco remains hugely profitable (govt owned...)
    >

    Look at the difference in population density between the Netherlands and
    New Zealand. There's 15million+ people in a country the size of a small
    handkerchief on one hand, and then there's us.

    What difference in ROI do you think that may make? There's so much fibre
    in the ground in the Netherlands that most people have it to their door.
    It's been put in because the population density makes it worthwhile.

    Get real.

    Steve
     
    Steve, Oct 17, 2004
    #8
  9. Hmmm

    Collector_NZ Guest

    Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 11:10:
    > I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday and I
    > was saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever switch me over),
    > he was surprised the speed was so low, and he nearly died of laughter
    > when he heard that many isp's offer 128/128 adsl connections over here..
    >
    > I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month,
    > totally unlimited and unthrottled...
    >
    > That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even less
    > for him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.
    >
    > But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how much
    > the plans here suck so much....
    >
    > I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    > wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as that...


    Would a better comparision be something like Iceland, similar geographic
    isolation and population density to area ratio. Similar Govt etc.
     
    Collector_NZ, Oct 17, 2004
    #9
  10. Hmmm

    Hmmm Guest

    Collector_NZ wrote:
    > Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 11:10:
    >
    >> I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday and
    >> I was saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever switch me
    >> over), he was surprised the speed was so low, and he nearly died of
    >> laughter when he heard that many isp's offer 128/128 adsl connections
    >> over here..
    >>
    >> I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month,
    >> totally unlimited and unthrottled...
    >>
    >> That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even less
    >> for him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.
    >>
    >> But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how
    >> much the plans here suck so much....
    >>
    >> I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    >> wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as
    >> that...

    >
    >
    > Would a better comparision be something like Iceland, similar geographic
    > isolation and population density to area ratio. Similar Govt etc.
    >


    What does population density have to do with telecom not offering faster
    speeds on dsl? They can do, they choose not to. The person in the
    above example is on a adsl connection in the netherlands although yes
    cable is prolific there as well, but in the cities of NZ I assume most
    people are on exchanges that be reached by adsl, so i dont believe the
    population density has much to do with the fact that telecom are giving
    the extreme low end of adsl capabilities to us.


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    Hmmm, Oct 17, 2004
    #10
  11. Hmmm

    Collector_NZ Guest

    Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 21:16:
    > Collector_NZ wrote:
    >
    >> Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 11:10:
    >>
    >>> I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday and
    >>> I was saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever switch me
    >>> over), he was surprised the speed was so low, and he nearly died of
    >>> laughter when he heard that many isp's offer 128/128 adsl connections
    >>> over here..
    >>>
    >>> I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month,
    >>> totally unlimited and unthrottled...
    >>>
    >>> That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even
    >>> less for him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.
    >>>
    >>> But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how
    >>> much the plans here suck so much....
    >>>
    >>> I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    >>> wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as
    >>> that...

    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> Would a better comparision be something like Iceland, similar
    >> geographic isolation and population density to area ratio. Similar
    >> Govt etc.
    >>

    >
    > What does population density have to do with telecom not offering faster
    > speeds on dsl? They can do, they choose not to. The person in the
    > above example is on a adsl connection in the netherlands although yes
    > cable is prolific there as well, but in the cities of NZ I assume most
    > people are on exchanges that be reached by adsl, so i dont believe the
    > population density has much to do with the fact that telecom are giving
    > the extreme low end of adsl capabilities to us.
    >

    Population density has a lot to do with it in relation to the
    comparision to Holland, the population density has made it economical to
    have the fibre cabling system, and the density creates a compact
    reachable customer base in Holland.

    In NZ a large number of urban customers are outside the distance to get
    ADSL let alone anything like 2Mbs. The density of population does not
    make it a good economic proposition to lay better cable and so an
    economic customer base does not exist.

    All that said, Telecom are dragging the situation out to the max because
    it is good busines for them to do so, get as much profit out of the
    current infrastructure before having to put in better infrastructure,
    not to mention the possibility of blackmailing the Govt into tax
    incentives to do so. Now while it would be possible for them to offer
    more speed to some customers it would create a disparity situation in
    service driving down the price of the main service they can supply
    128/256 to the majority.
     
    Collector_NZ, Oct 17, 2004
    #11
  12. Hmmm

    Hmmm Guest

    Collector_NZ wrote:
    > Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 21:16:
    >
    >> Collector_NZ wrote:
    >>
    >>> Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 11:10:
    >>>
    >>>> I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday
    >>>> and I was saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever switch
    >>>> me over), he was surprised the speed was so low, and he nearly died
    >>>> of laughter when he heard that many isp's offer 128/128 adsl
    >>>> connections over here..
    >>>>
    >>>> I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month,
    >>>> totally unlimited and unthrottled...
    >>>>
    >>>> That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even
    >>>> less for him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.
    >>>>
    >>>> But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how
    >>>> much the plans here suck so much....
    >>>>
    >>>> I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    >>>> wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as
    >>>> that...
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> Would a better comparision be something like Iceland, similar
    >>> geographic isolation and population density to area ratio. Similar
    >>> Govt etc.
    >>>

    >>
    >> What does population density have to do with telecom not offering
    >> faster speeds on dsl? They can do, they choose not to. The person in
    >> the above example is on a adsl connection in the netherlands although
    >> yes cable is prolific there as well, but in the cities of NZ I assume
    >> most people are on exchanges that be reached by adsl, so i dont
    >> believe the population density has much to do with the fact that
    >> telecom are giving the extreme low end of adsl capabilities to us.
    >>

    > Population density has a lot to do with it in relation to the
    > comparision to Holland, the population density has made it economical to
    > have the fibre cabling system, and the density creates a compact
    > reachable customer base in Holland.
    >
    > In NZ a large number of urban customers are outside the distance to get
    > ADSL let alone anything like 2Mbs. The density of population does not
    > make it a good economic proposition to lay better cable and so an
    > economic customer base does not exist.
    >
    > All that said, Telecom are dragging the situation out to the max because
    > it is good busines for them to do so, get as much profit out of the
    > current infrastructure before having to put in better infrastructure,
    > not to mention the possibility of blackmailing the Govt into tax
    > incentives to do so. Now while it would be possible for them to offer
    > more speed to some customers it would create a disparity situation in
    > service driving down the price of the main service they can supply
    > 128/256 to the majority.
    >


    Well yes that was what I was getting at, that they can in fact offer
    faster services at decent prices to people already getting adsl but they
    are not. I never expeced telecom to run cable out to some farmer in the
    middle of nowhere, but those in cities on adsl capable exchanges should
    be able to get decent plans.

    Oh well maybe one day... dreams are free afterall.


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    Hmmm, Oct 17, 2004
    #12
  13. Hmmm

    Collector_NZ Guest

    Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 22:00:
    > Collector_NZ wrote:
    >
    >> Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 21:16:
    >>
    >>> Collector_NZ wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 11:10:
    >>>>
    >>>>> I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday
    >>>>> and I was saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever switch
    >>>>> me over), he was surprised the speed was so low, and he nearly died
    >>>>> of laughter when he heard that many isp's offer 128/128 adsl
    >>>>> connections over here..
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month,
    >>>>> totally unlimited and unthrottled...
    >>>>>
    >>>>> That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even
    >>>>> less for him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how
    >>>>> much the plans here suck so much....
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    >>>>> wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as
    >>>>> that...
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> Would a better comparision be something like Iceland, similar
    >>>> geographic isolation and population density to area ratio. Similar
    >>>> Govt etc.
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> What does population density have to do with telecom not offering
    >>> faster speeds on dsl? They can do, they choose not to. The person
    >>> in the above example is on a adsl connection in the netherlands
    >>> although yes cable is prolific there as well, but in the cities of NZ
    >>> I assume most people are on exchanges that be reached by adsl, so i
    >>> dont believe the population density has much to do with the fact that
    >>> telecom are giving the extreme low end of adsl capabilities to us.
    >>>

    >> Population density has a lot to do with it in relation to the
    >> comparision to Holland, the population density has made it economical
    >> to have the fibre cabling system, and the density creates a compact
    >> reachable customer base in Holland.
    >>
    >> In NZ a large number of urban customers are outside the distance to
    >> get ADSL let alone anything like 2Mbs. The density of population does
    >> not make it a good economic proposition to lay better cable and so an
    >> economic customer base does not exist.
    >>
    >> All that said, Telecom are dragging the situation out to the max
    >> because it is good busines for them to do so, get as much profit out
    >> of the current infrastructure before having to put in better
    >> infrastructure, not to mention the possibility of blackmailing the
    >> Govt into tax incentives to do so. Now while it would be possible for
    >> them to offer more speed to some customers it would create a disparity
    >> situation in service driving down the price of the main service they
    >> can supply 128/256 to the majority.
    >>

    >
    > Well yes that was what I was getting at, that they can in fact offer
    > faster services at decent prices to people already getting adsl but they
    > are not. I never expeced telecom to run cable out to some farmer in the
    > middle of nowhere, but those in cities on adsl capable exchanges should
    > be able to get decent plans.
    >
    > Oh well maybe one day... dreams are free afterall.
    >

    Actually in NZ the age and nature of the copper in the ground limits the
    options for ADSL quite a bit even in built up areas.
    I for example am about 3k from the exchange in a straight line, my line
    is about 7km to the exchange ergo forget DSL, not just because of the
    distance but because the cables in my area are crap been in too long too
    many joins etc. So even in the city ADSL is really only available to a
    limited number with big areas of no coverage.
     
    Collector_NZ, Oct 17, 2004
    #13
  14. Hmmm

    Hmmm Guest

    Collector_NZ wrote:
    > Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 22:00:
    >
    >> Collector_NZ wrote:
    >>
    >>> Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 21:16:
    >>>
    >>>> Collector_NZ wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 11:10:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday
    >>>>>> and I was saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever
    >>>>>> switch me over), he was surprised the speed was so low, and he
    >>>>>> nearly died of laughter when he heard that many isp's offer
    >>>>>> 128/128 adsl connections over here..
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month,
    >>>>>> totally unlimited and unthrottled...
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even
    >>>>>> less for him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how
    >>>>>> much the plans here suck so much....
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    >>>>>> wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice
    >>>>>> as that...
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Would a better comparision be something like Iceland, similar
    >>>>> geographic isolation and population density to area ratio. Similar
    >>>>> Govt etc.
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> What does population density have to do with telecom not offering
    >>>> faster speeds on dsl? They can do, they choose not to. The person
    >>>> in the above example is on a adsl connection in the netherlands
    >>>> although yes cable is prolific there as well, but in the cities of
    >>>> NZ I assume most people are on exchanges that be reached by adsl, so
    >>>> i dont believe the population density has much to do with the fact
    >>>> that telecom are giving the extreme low end of adsl capabilities to us.
    >>>>
    >>> Population density has a lot to do with it in relation to the
    >>> comparision to Holland, the population density has made it economical
    >>> to have the fibre cabling system, and the density creates a compact
    >>> reachable customer base in Holland.
    >>>
    >>> In NZ a large number of urban customers are outside the distance to
    >>> get ADSL let alone anything like 2Mbs. The density of population does
    >>> not make it a good economic proposition to lay better cable and so an
    >>> economic customer base does not exist.
    >>>
    >>> All that said, Telecom are dragging the situation out to the max
    >>> because it is good busines for them to do so, get as much profit out
    >>> of the current infrastructure before having to put in better
    >>> infrastructure, not to mention the possibility of blackmailing the
    >>> Govt into tax incentives to do so. Now while it would be possible
    >>> for them to offer more speed to some customers it would create a
    >>> disparity situation in service driving down the price of the main
    >>> service they can supply 128/256 to the majority.
    >>>

    >>
    >> Well yes that was what I was getting at, that they can in fact offer
    >> faster services at decent prices to people already getting adsl but
    >> they are not. I never expeced telecom to run cable out to some farmer
    >> in the middle of nowhere, but those in cities on adsl capable
    >> exchanges should be able to get decent plans.
    >>
    >> Oh well maybe one day... dreams are free afterall.
    >>

    > Actually in NZ the age and nature of the copper in the ground limits the
    > options for ADSL quite a bit even in built up areas.
    > I for example am about 3k from the exchange in a straight line, my line
    > is about 7km to the exchange ergo forget DSL, not just because of the
    > distance but because the cables in my area are crap been in too long too
    > many joins etc. So even in the city ADSL is really only available to a
    > limited number with big areas of no coverage.


    Interesting, so telecom have been making nice huge profits and letting
    the infrastructure rot in the ground. The more you hear about telecom
    the more you realise that they definately arent a service in nz.. just
    out to make profits and definately dont care about providing, but yep
    you cant blame them, they are a profit organisation and it should be the
    government getting tough with them which they always seem afraid to do..

    It does suck talking to people overseas all the time and hearing how
    fast they downloaded something though hehe, its almost embarassing to
    tell them what speeds we get here and what we pay.


    ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==----
    http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! >100,000 Newsgroups
    ---= East/West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =---
     
    Hmmm, Oct 17, 2004
    #14
  15. Hmmm

    ofn01 Guest

    "Hmmm" <> wrote in message news:41719a3f$1_4@127.0.0.1...
    >I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday and I was
    >saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever switch me over), he was
    >surprised the speed was so low, and he nearly died of laughter when he
    >heard that many isp's offer 128/128 adsl connections over here..
    >
    > I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month, totally
    > unlimited and unthrottled...
    >
    > That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even less for
    > him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.
    >
    > But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how much
    > the plans here suck so much....
    >
    > I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    > wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as
    > that...
    >



    Did he mention anything about a contention ratio?
    I used to live in NZ and I am now in the UK. I had jetstart in NZ (128/128)
    but now I have 512/256 here in the UK for £24 a month (BT phoneline is
    £11.50 a month on top).

    However, all ADSL lines are contention based - and for residential users
    that means a ratio of 50:1. This is like cable in NZ really, 50 other people
    on your exchange with your speed all share that speed.

    I haven't noticed any significant slowdown thus far but then I have had it
    for less than a week!

    On this site (which I used in NZ) i constantly only get around 350kbits
    http://nzdsl.co.nz/speedtest

    On this side for UK I get 463.5kbits
    http://www.bandwidthplace.com/speedtest
     
    ofn01, Oct 17, 2004
    #15
  16. Hmmm

    Geronimo! Guest

    On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 21:29:20 +1300, Collector_NZ <>
    wrote:

    >Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 21:16:
    >> Collector_NZ wrote:
    >>
    >>> Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 11:10:
    >>>
    >>>> I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday and
    >>>> I was saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever switch me
    >>>> over), he was surprised the speed was so low, and he nearly died of
    >>>> laughter when he heard that many isp's offer 128/128 adsl connections
    >>>> over here..
    >>>>
    >>>> I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month,
    >>>> totally unlimited and unthrottled...
    >>>>
    >>>> That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even
    >>>> less for him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.
    >>>>
    >>>> But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how
    >>>> much the plans here suck so much....
    >>>>
    >>>> I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    >>>> wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as
    >>>> that...
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> Would a better comparision be something like Iceland, similar
    >>> geographic isolation and population density to area ratio. Similar
    >>> Govt etc.
    >>>

    >>
    >> What does population density have to do with telecom not offering faster
    >> speeds on dsl? They can do, they choose not to. The person in the
    >> above example is on a adsl connection in the netherlands although yes
    >> cable is prolific there as well, but in the cities of NZ I assume most
    >> people are on exchanges that be reached by adsl, so i dont believe the
    >> population density has much to do with the fact that telecom are giving
    >> the extreme low end of adsl capabilities to us.
    >>

    >Population density has a lot to do with it in relation to the
    >comparision to Holland, the population density has made it economical to
    >have the fibre cabling system, and the density creates a compact
    >reachable customer base in Holland.
    >
    >In NZ a large number of urban customers are outside the distance to get
    >ADSL let alone anything like 2Mbs. The density of population does not
    >make it a good economic proposition to lay better cable and so an
    >economic customer base does not exist.
    >
    >All that said, Telecom are dragging the situation out to the max because
    >it is good busines for them to do so, get as much profit out of the
    >current infrastructure before having to put in better infrastructure,
    >not to mention the possibility of blackmailing the Govt into tax
    >incentives to do so. Now while it would be possible for them to offer
    >more speed to some customers it would create a disparity situation in
    >service driving down the price of the main service they can supply
    >128/256 to the majority.




    No NZ is a very backwards country, and generally does not have a clue.
     
    Geronimo!, Oct 17, 2004
    #16
  17. In article <> in nz.comp on
    Sun, 17 Oct 2004 22:43:13 +1300, Geronimo! <> says...
    > On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 21:29:20 +1300, Collector_NZ <>
    > wrote:
    >
    > >Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 21:16:
    > >> Collector_NZ wrote:
    > >>
    > >>> Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 11:10:
    > >>>
    > >>>> I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday and
    > >>>> I was saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever switch me
    > >>>> over), he was surprised the speed was so low, and he nearly died of
    > >>>> laughter when he heard that many isp's offer 128/128 adsl connections
    > >>>> over here..
    > >>>>
    > >>>> I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month,
    > >>>> totally unlimited and unthrottled...
    > >>>>
    > >>>> That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even
    > >>>> less for him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.
    > >>>>
    > >>>> But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how
    > >>>> much the plans here suck so much....
    > >>>>
    > >>>> I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    > >>>> wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as
    > >>>> that...
    > >>>
    > >>>
    > >>>
    > >>> Would a better comparision be something like Iceland, similar
    > >>> geographic isolation and population density to area ratio. Similar
    > >>> Govt etc.
    > >>>
    > >>
    > >> What does population density have to do with telecom not offering faster
    > >> speeds on dsl? They can do, they choose not to. The person in the
    > >> above example is on a adsl connection in the netherlands although yes
    > >> cable is prolific there as well, but in the cities of NZ I assume most
    > >> people are on exchanges that be reached by adsl, so i dont believe the
    > >> population density has much to do with the fact that telecom are giving
    > >> the extreme low end of adsl capabilities to us.
    > >>

    > >Population density has a lot to do with it in relation to the
    > >comparision to Holland, the population density has made it economical to
    > >have the fibre cabling system, and the density creates a compact
    > >reachable customer base in Holland.
    > >
    > >In NZ a large number of urban customers are outside the distance to get
    > >ADSL let alone anything like 2Mbs. The density of population does not
    > >make it a good economic proposition to lay better cable and so an
    > >economic customer base does not exist.
    > >
    > >All that said, Telecom are dragging the situation out to the max because
    > >it is good busines for them to do so, get as much profit out of the
    > >current infrastructure before having to put in better infrastructure,
    > >not to mention the possibility of blackmailing the Govt into tax
    > >incentives to do so. Now while it would be possible for them to offer
    > >more speed to some customers it would create a disparity situation in
    > >service driving down the price of the main service they can supply
    > >128/256 to the majority.

    >
    >
    >
    > No NZ is a very backwards country, and generally does not have a clue.


    Why are you still living here then
     
    Patrick Dunford, Oct 17, 2004
    #17
  18. Hmmm

    steve Guest

    Steve wrote:

    > Look at the difference in population density between the Netherlands and
    > New Zealand. There's 15million+ people in a country the size of a small
    > handkerchief on one hand, and then there's us.
    >
    > What difference in ROI do you think that may make? There's so much fibre
    > in the ground in the Netherlands that most people have it to their door.
    > It's been put in because the population density makes it worthwhile.


    What you are forgetting is that when the government mandates it as a social
    and infrastructural priority, "ROI" takes on a whole new meaning.

    > Get real.


    I was. Perhaps you should shed your narrow view of the world. It's obscuring
    your vision.

    --
    Distributed Computing Projects:
    SETI at Home
    http://boinc.mundayweb.com/seti2/stats.php?userID=1248
    ClimatePrediction.net
    http://boinc.mundayweb.com/cpdn/stats.php?userID=334
     
    steve, Oct 17, 2004
    #18
  19. Hmmm

    Col: Guest

    On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 22:43:13 +1300, Geronimo! <>
    wrote:

    >On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 21:29:20 +1300, Collector_NZ <>
    >wrote:
    >
    >>Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 21:16:
    >>> Collector_NZ wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> Hmmm said the following on 17/10/2004 11:10:
    >>>>
    >>>>> I was talking to a friend that lives in the Netherlands yesterday and
    >>>>> I was saying I was getting 256/128 (well if telecom ever switch me
    >>>>> over), he was surprised the speed was so low, and he nearly died of
    >>>>> laughter when he heard that many isp's offer 128/128 adsl connections
    >>>>> over here..
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I asked him what his connection was, 4096/256 for $US50 per month,
    >>>>> totally unlimited and unthrottled...
    >>>>>
    >>>>> That is about 78 nz dollars at the moment but probably seems even
    >>>>> less for him due to salaries/cost of living there etc.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> But hell 80 nz dollars for 4096/256.... , just made me realise how
    >>>>> much the plans here suck so much....
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I wonder what prices we will have to pay for 2mbits when it gets
    >>>>> wholesaled... but i would be surpised if we get anything as nice as
    >>>>> that...
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> Would a better comparision be something like Iceland, similar
    >>>> geographic isolation and population density to area ratio. Similar
    >>>> Govt etc.
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>> What does population density have to do with telecom not offering faster
    >>> speeds on dsl? They can do, they choose not to. The person in the
    >>> above example is on a adsl connection in the netherlands although yes
    >>> cable is prolific there as well, but in the cities of NZ I assume most
    >>> people are on exchanges that be reached by adsl, so i dont believe the
    >>> population density has much to do with the fact that telecom are giving
    >>> the extreme low end of adsl capabilities to us.
    >>>

    >>Population density has a lot to do with it in relation to the
    >>comparision to Holland, the population density has made it economical to
    >>have the fibre cabling system, and the density creates a compact
    >>reachable customer base in Holland.
    >>
    >>In NZ a large number of urban customers are outside the distance to get
    >>ADSL let alone anything like 2Mbs. The density of population does not
    >>make it a good economic proposition to lay better cable and so an
    >>economic customer base does not exist.
    >>
    >>All that said, Telecom are dragging the situation out to the max because
    >>it is good busines for them to do so, get as much profit out of the
    >>current infrastructure before having to put in better infrastructure,
    >>not to mention the possibility of blackmailing the Govt into tax
    >>incentives to do so. Now while it would be possible for them to offer
    >>more speed to some customers it would create a disparity situation in
    >>service driving down the price of the main service they can supply
    >>128/256 to the majority.

    >
    >
    >
    >No NZ is a very backwards country, and generally does not have a clue.
    >
    >

    Don't let the door hit you on the arse on your way out !


    --

    Col

    Col's law.
    Thinly sliced cabbage..
     
    Col:, Oct 17, 2004
    #19
  20. Collector_NZ <> wrote in message news:<>...


    > Would a better comparision be something like Iceland, similar geographic
    > isolation and population density to area ratio. Similar Govt etc.


    Iceland is nowhere near as isolated as NZ is.
     
    Sigvaldi Eggertsson, Oct 17, 2004
    #20
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