20d newbie questions

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by pshaw@emmet.com, Dec 2, 2004.

  1. Guest

    in looking through the options on the 20 d i discovered that i have a
    few questions:

    1) as i work with my pix in photoshop should i set my space to srgb or
    rgb? i use rgb in photoshop
    2) which of the 'parameters is better? 1 or 2 and if 2 should any of
    the subdivision be changed? (contrast, sharpness etc)
    3) any suggestions to change any of the other functions?
    4) does anyone have a favorite 'raw' software to import the canon raw
    files?

    tia ...

    steve
     
    , Dec 2, 2004
    #1
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  2. Matt Ion Guest

    wrote:
    > in looking through the options on the 20 d i discovered that i have a
    > few questions:
    >
    > 1) as i work with my pix in photoshop should i set my space to srgb or
    > rgb? i use rgb in photoshop


    From what I've picked up here and in a couple magazines, your best
    choice is probably Adobe RGB in the camera.

    > 2) which of the 'parameters is better? 1 or 2 and if 2 should any of
    > the subdivision be changed? (contrast, sharpness etc)


    I use the stock parameters with my Digital Rebel. Note that these
    settings only take effect when the camera stores images as JPG; they
    don't affect RAW files.

    > 4) does anyone have a favorite 'raw' software to import the canon raw
    > files?


    There's a plugin for the latest Photoshop...
     
    Matt Ion, Dec 2, 2004
    #2
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  3. wrote:
    > in looking through the options on the 20 d i discovered that i have a
    > few questions:
    >
    > 1) as i work with my pix in photoshop should i set my space to srgb or
    > rgb? i use rgb in photoshop
    > 2) which of the 'parameters is better? 1 or 2 and if 2 should any of
    > the subdivision be changed? (contrast, sharpness etc)
    > 3) any suggestions to change any of the other functions?
    > 4) does anyone have a favorite 'raw' software to import the canon raw
    > files?


    Steve,

    There's a newsgroup dedicated to DSLRs like the 20D at:

    rec.photo.digital.slr-systems

    Cheers,
    David
     
    David J Taylor, Dec 2, 2004
    #3
  4. Skip M Guest

    --
    Skip Middleton
    http://www.shadowcatcherimagery.com
    <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > in looking through the options on the 20 d i discovered that i have a
    > few questions:
    >
    > 1) as i work with my pix in photoshop should i set my space to srgb or
    > rgb? i use rgb in photoshop
    > 2) which of the 'parameters is better? 1 or 2 and if 2 should any of
    > the subdivision be changed? (contrast, sharpness etc)
    > 3) any suggestions to change any of the other functions?
    > 4) does anyone have a favorite 'raw' software to import the canon raw
    > files?
    >
    > tia ...
    >
    > steve


    Actually, what I've picked up here, and from the owner's manual, is that
    sRGB is more workable.
    As far as the parameters, you really need to determine that yourself. I
    usually use parameter 1 and Set 1 that I've set with higher saturation. And
    the B&W set, too.
    The same goes for any of the other settings, but most have found that
    setting the flash metering for "average" rather than the default
    "evaluative" gives better results. And I have mine set to second curtain
    synch so that any flash trails look more natural.
    I took my camera out for a day in the park, with a notebook. I documented
    everything I shot, changed settings endlessly, compared everything when I
    got home, looked at all the variables, and decided what settings were the
    most useful, for me. And I'm still changing some of them, as I get into
    more and more situations.
    Of course, your mileage may vary...
     
    Skip M, Dec 2, 2004
    #4
  5. Also remember that only Parameter 2 settings are used in the "non
    creative zone".


    On Thu, 2 Dec 2004 05:28:32 -0800, "Skip M" <>
    wrote:

    > the variables, and decided what settings were the
    >most useful, for me. And I'm still changing some of them, as I get into
    >more and more situations.
    >Of course, your mileage may vary...
    >


    --------------------------------
     
    Leith Cassone, Dec 2, 2004
    #5
  6. Bill Hilton Guest

    >From: "Skip M"

    >Actually, what I've picked up here, and from the owner's manual, is that
    >sRGB is more workable.


    If you want to throw away a large % of the colors captured by the 20D then sRGB
    is for you. Anyone who knows how to use color management and has a profiled
    monitor and a good printer can make much better prints using AdobeRGB.

    "workable" in the sense that it's the lowest common denominator working space,
    meant for web images (that aren't viewed in a color managed environment) and
    people with uncalibrated monitors.
     
    Bill Hilton, Dec 2, 2004
    #6
  7. "Matt Ion" <> wrote in message
    news:ORzrd.410828$%k.260618@pd7tw2no...

    >> 2) which of the 'parameters is better? 1 or 2 and if 2 should any of
    >> the subdivision be changed? (contrast, sharpness etc)

    >
    > I use the stock parameters with my Digital Rebel. Note that these
    > settings only take effect when the camera stores images as JPG; they don't
    > affect RAW files.


    I disagree. Both the RAW file and the resulting EXIF TIFF show sharpness
    +1, saturation +1 in the EXIF data if I use Parameter 1. For scientific
    work I'm about to switch to Parameter 2.

    Basically, Parameter 1 if you think you're going to be making some prints
    direct from the camera; Parameter 2 if you're always going to post-process
    your pictures.

    >> 4) does anyone have a favorite 'raw' software to import the canon raw
    >> files?

    >
    > There's a plugin for the latest Photoshop...


    Where do I get that? Also, the one that comes with the camera (Canon File
    Viewer) works well. Photoshop without the Canon plugin can open .CRW files
    but doesn't seem to interpret them correctly; they don't look too good.
     
    Michael A. Covington, Dec 2, 2004
    #7
  8. "David J Taylor" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >
    > Steve,
    >
    > There's a newsgroup dedicated to DSLRs like the 20D at:
    >
    > rec.photo.digital.slr-systems
    >
    > Cheers,
    > David



    Quite a bit of the world still doesn't get that newsgroup. I don't know
    what happened to it, but neither of my 2 totally unrelated servers gets it
    yet, even though it has existed for a month.
     
    Michael A. Covington, Dec 2, 2004
    #8
  9. "Leith Cassone" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Also remember that only Parameter 2 settings are used in the "non
    > creative zone".


    Parameter 1, you mean? Or are they backwards on the 20D compared to the
    300D?
     
    Michael A. Covington, Dec 2, 2004
    #9
  10. Mitch Alsup Guest

    wrote in message news:<>...
    > in looking through the options on the 20 d i discovered that i have a
    > few questions:
    >
    > 1) as i work with my pix in photoshop should i set my space to srgb or
    > rgb? i use rgb in photoshop


    You choose the RGB space at the point of conversion from RAW to {TIFF/JPG}.
    With the bundled 20D software, this is best/easiest done in DPP.

    > 2) which of the 'parameters is better? 1 or 2 and if 2 should any of
    > the subdivision be changed? (contrast, sharpness etc)


    Shoot RAW and then look at each picture and balance individually. Once
    you have done 100-200 you get pretty good at getting the color right
    very fast so it ends up taking only a couple of seconds/image.

    I do all my color corrections at the RAW->{TFFF/JPG} conversion in DPP.
    I do all my image manipulation in Photoshop {sharpness, contrast, levels,
    punch} just before writing out the image as JPG.

    RAW is the digital negative, JPG is the digital positive (print)

    > 3) any suggestions to change any of the other functions?
    > 4) does anyone have a favorite 'raw' software to import the canon raw
    > files?


    I use EOS Viewer to import camera->PC (RAW)
    I use DPP as my color correction, saturation and white balance processing
    I use Photoshop as my image manipulation engine.

    Once I got about 500 images under my belt, the whole process takes about
    1 minute per descent image but I will still spend up to an hour saving a
    disaterous image into a very presentable image.

    Mitch
     
    Mitch Alsup, Dec 2, 2004
    #10
  11. Guest

    "David J Taylor" <> wrote:

    >> 1) as i work with my pix in photoshop should i set my space to srgb

    or
    >> rgb? i use rgb in photoshop
    >> 2) which of the 'parameters is better? 1 or 2 and if 2 should any

    of
    >> the subdivision be changed? (contrast, sharpness etc)
    >> 3) any suggestions to change any of the other functions?
    >> 4) does anyone have a favorite 'raw' software to import the canon

    raw
    >> files?

    >
    > There's a newsgroup dedicated to DSLRs like the 20D at:
    >
    > rec.photo.digital.slr-systems


    Post-processing talk is only allowed in that group if, and only if, it
    pertains directly to "dslr photography". Since sRGB (or colour
    managemnt in general) is not a direct dSLR issue, question (1) would
    be off-topic there.

    Questions (2) and (3) may be on-topic, but only if the question was
    phrased to be specific to a dSLR. Read your Charter!

    (4) would be off-topic, since it also lacks the sufficient dSLR
    references, and indeed, even if it had such, probably is not specific
    to dSLR cameras (because non-slr systems also have raw image formats).

    Have you considered changing The Sacred Charter? It is so narrow that
    one wonders just what can be posted there but for glorified "can you
    read me my user manual" questions and answers about dSLR camera X.
     
    , Dec 2, 2004
    #11
  12. Guest

    wrote:

    > 1) as i work with my pix in photoshop should i set my space to srgb or
    > rgb? i use rgb in photoshop


    sRGB for images to be viewed on monitors. The Adobe space for prints.
    The net difference isn't much to be worried about though:

    http://www.brucelindbloom.com

    Click on "Info" and then "Working RGB sets".

    > 2) which of the 'parameters is better? 1 or 2 and if 2 should any of
    > the subdivision be changed? (contrast, sharpness etc)


    Which do you like better? Peas or cucumbers?

    > 3) any suggestions to change any of the other functions?


    Potato or carrot?

    > 4) does anyone have a favorite 'raw' software to import the canon raw
    > files?


    I can't believe that trying stuff and coming to your own conclusion is
    out of the question.
     
    , Dec 2, 2004
    #12
  13. wrote:
    > "David J Taylor" <> wrote:

    []
    >> There's a newsgroup dedicated to DSLRs like the 20D at:
    >>
    >> rec.photo.digital.slr-systems

    []
    > Have you considered changing The Sacred Charter? It is so narrow that
    > one wonders just what can be posted there but for glorified "can you
    > read me my user manual" questions and answers about dSLR camera X.


    You had opportunity to have your input when the charter was discussed,
    just like everyone else. I am sure the users of that group would
    determine what was or was not in accordance with the charter.

    I am sorry you take exception to my pointing out to a newbie that there is
    a group where his 20D can be discussed.

    David
     
    David J Taylor, Dec 2, 2004
    #13
  14. Annika1980 Guest

    >From: "David J Taylor"

    >You had opportunity to have your input when the charter was discussed,
    >just like everyone else. I am sure the users of that group would
    >determine what was or was not in accordance with the charter.


    Yeah, both of them.

    I'll start posting there when AOL decides to pick it up.
     
    Annika1980, Dec 2, 2004
    #14
  15. Ryadia Guest

    "David J Taylor" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > wrote:
    > > "David J Taylor" <> wrote:

    > []
    > >> There's a newsgroup dedicated to DSLRs like the 20D at:
    > >>
    > >> rec.photo.digital.slr-systems

    > []
    > > Have you considered changing The Sacred Charter? It is so narrow that
    > > one wonders just what can be posted there but for glorified "can you
    > > read me my user manual" questions and answers about dSLR camera X.

    >
    > You had opportunity to have your input when the charter was discussed,
    > just like everyone else. I am sure the users of that group would
    > determine what was or was not in accordance with the charter.
    >
    > I am sorry you take exception to my pointing out to a newbie that there is
    > a group where his 20D can be discussed.
    >
    > David
    >

    Just take a look at Alan Browne's reaction to a Digicam question and pretty
    soon you'll realize that rec.photo.digital.slr-systems looks like it's
    going to be a group for a selected few people hell bent on ensuring no one
    posts anything remotely off topic. Probably the same group which dominate
    rec.photo.equipment.35mm and is most likely the people responsible for all
    the troll activity in that group from their off-topic activities.

    Sanctimonious is a word which probably fits. Sort of like a bottom end
    anti-elitist group, 180 degree opposite from The Photographic Society! The
    sacred charter is indeed a worthy description. Who will be the first to
    complain to someone's ISP for off-topic posts? From my reading of the
    charter, even posting about studio flash or speedlights is off-topic. Narrow
    minded is another description I'd consider for whoever though up that
    charter.

    Doug
     
    Ryadia, Dec 2, 2004
    #15
  16. Ryadia Guest

    <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > wrote:
    >
    >
    > I can't believe that trying stuff and coming to your own conclusion is
    > out of the question.

    -----------
    Doesn't that require a logical mind and a dedicated thought process?
     
    Ryadia, Dec 2, 2004
    #16
  17. Ryadia wrote:
    []
    > Just take a look at Alan Browne's reaction to a Digicam question and
    > pretty soon you'll realize that ..........


    Doug, let's concentrate on helping people instead!
     
    David J Taylor, Dec 2, 2004
    #17
  18. Guest

    "David J Taylor" <> wrote:

    >> Have you considered changing The Sacred Charter? It is so narrow

    that
    >> one wonders just what can be posted there but for glorified "can

    you
    >> read me my user manual" questions and answers about dSLR camera X.

    >
    > You had opportunity to have your input when the charter was discussed,
    > just like everyone else.


    I also "had opportunity" to supply input to the design of Microsoft
    Windows. Am I to be blamed for the resulting atrocity because I
    didn't send in the job application form 15 years ago? Or are you just
    not making sense here?

    > I am sure the users of that group would
    > determine what was or was not in accordance with the charter.


    Isn't the whole point of a charter to remove this sort of
    arbitrariness? If users of the group decide, then what is the point
    of a charter? Or at least why isn't this ensconced within the charter
    itself? The "we, the users, make it up as we go along" clause.

    > I am sorry you take exception to my pointing out to a newbie that there is
    > a group where his 20D can be discussed.


    You mis-understand: I have no objections to you making any point you
    like. I merely point out that it seems some of his questions would be
    _off topic_ to that group, and the reason is because
    rec.photo.digital.slr-systems has an overly restrictive charter. It
    really does read like "if it's not in the user manual for any digital
    SLR camera, it's off topic".
     
    , Dec 2, 2004
    #18
  19. Skip M Guest

    "Bill Hilton" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > >From: "Skip M"

    >
    >>Actually, what I've picked up here, and from the owner's manual, is that
    >>sRGB is more workable.

    >
    > If you want to throw away a large % of the colors captured by the 20D then
    > sRGB
    > is for you. Anyone who knows how to use color management and has a
    > profiled
    > monitor and a good printer can make much better prints using AdobeRGB.
    >
    > "workable" in the sense that it's the lowest common denominator working
    > space,
    > meant for web images (that aren't viewed in a color managed environment)
    > and
    > people with uncalibrated monitors.


    Yours and the previous post are the first times I've actually come in
    contact with someone who recommends AdobeRGB.
    The manual recommends sRGB, and my monitor matches my printers output to the
    nth degree. I've been reluctant to calibrate it because of that. I'm not
    really up on color management, and most of my stuff is printed elsewhere.
    My printer is for proofs, only.

    --
    Skip Middleton
    http://www.shadowcatcherimagery.com
     
    Skip M, Dec 3, 2004
    #19
  20. wrote:
    > "David J Taylor" <> wrote:

    []
    >> I am sure the users of that group would
    >> determine what was or was not in accordance with the charter.

    >
    > Isn't the whole point of a charter to remove this sort of
    > arbitrariness? If users of the group decide, then what is the point
    > of a charter? Or at least why isn't this ensconced within the charter
    > itself? The "we, the users, make it up as we go along" clause.


    Don't forget that charter contains recommendations and suggestions, as
    well as what is strictly prohibited. I would expect the group members to
    decide amongst themselves how strictly the non-mandatory parts of the
    charter were enforced, in an intelligent and common-sense fashion.

    Cheers,
    David
     
    David J Taylor, Dec 3, 2004
    #20
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