16GBit/s link

Discussion in 'Cisco' started by Gary, May 1, 2004.

  1. Gary

    Gary Guest

    I need to understand the technologies to link 2 UK offices with a 16Gbit/s
    capable link.

    Is the only way or at least the most common way to use STM-whatever

    What hardware would I be looking at for each end of this link assuming some
    Telco install the relevant link in the middle.

    Just a start to understandf the options please.

    Gary
    Gary, May 1, 2004
    #1
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  2. In article <ECEkc.942$nN6.575@lakeread06>, Gary <> wrote:
    :I need to understand the technologies to link 2 UK offices with a 16Gbit/s
    :capable link.

    :Is the only way or at least the most common way to use STM-whatever

    Is that really a sixteen gigabit per second link you are asking about?

    You might be able to approach that with some of the higher-end routers
    and sixteen 1 Gb/s links FastEtherChannel'd together, but I
    don't believe I've heard of anyone using a link that fast commercially.

    Cisco has some 10 Gb/s interfaces; FastEtherChannel'ing together
    two of those might get you a closer approximation to 16 Gb/s.

    If you were using FastEtherChannel or equivilent, you would have to
    select a paticular load-balancing algorithm, and no matter what you
    choose, it isn't going to be the same as running a single 16 gigabit link.
    --
    Ceci, ce n'est pas une idée.
    Walter Roberson, May 1, 2004
    #2
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  3. Gary

    Ben Guest

    16Gbs??? That is well into major telco land.

    "Walter Roberson" <-cnrc.gc.ca> wrote in message
    news:c6v71s$jn6$...
    > In article <ECEkc.942$nN6.575@lakeread06>, Gary <>

    wrote:
    > :I need to understand the technologies to link 2 UK offices with a

    16Gbit/s
    > :capable link.
    >
    > :Is the only way or at least the most common way to use STM-whatever
    >
    > Is that really a sixteen gigabit per second link you are asking about?
    >
    > You might be able to approach that with some of the higher-end routers
    > and sixteen 1 Gb/s links FastEtherChannel'd together, but I
    > don't believe I've heard of anyone using a link that fast commercially.
    >
    > Cisco has some 10 Gb/s interfaces; FastEtherChannel'ing together
    > two of those might get you a closer approximation to 16 Gb/s.
    >
    > If you were using FastEtherChannel or equivilent, you would have to
    > select a paticular load-balancing algorithm, and no matter what you
    > choose, it isn't going to be the same as running a single 16 gigabit link.
    > --
    > Ceci, ce n'est pas une idée.
    Ben, May 1, 2004
    #3
  4. Gary

    Kurt Jaeger Guest

    Hi!

    In article <ECEkc.942$nN6.575@lakeread06>, Gary <> wrote:
    >I need to understand the technologies to link 2 UK offices with a 16Gbit/s
    >capable link.
    >
    >Is the only way or at least the most common way to use STM-whatever


    No, you need a dark fiber between the two sites. Depending on the
    distance, you'll need some signal regeneration site somewhere in between.

    Then you start looking at your application: why does it need this
    bandwidth and how does it wants to use it ? Which protocol
    is being used ? IP ? TCP ? Something else ?

    Then you look for some transmission gear that allows you
    to transfer at those bit-rates.

    Some telco manufacturers already build devices to transmit 40 Gbit/sec
    over fiber. It's probably lab quality, so you need to discuss
    some sort of beta. Search for 40 GBit/sec with google.

    I know at least from Alcatel who did this.

    --
    MfG/Best regards, Kurt Jaeger 16 years to go !
    LF.net GmbH fon +49 711 90074-23
    Ruppmannstr. 27 fax +49 711 90074-33
    D-70565 Stuttgart mob +49 171 3101372
    Kurt Jaeger, May 1, 2004
    #4
  5. Gary

    Kurt Jaeger Guest

    >In article <ECEkc.942$nN6.575@lakeread06>, Gary <> wrote:
    >>I need to understand the technologies to link 2 UK offices with a 16Gbit/s
    >>capable link.


    www.mintera.com

    Looks interesting...

    --
    MfG/Best regards, Kurt Jaeger 16 years to go !
    LF.net GmbH fon +49 711 90074-23
    Ruppmannstr. 27 fax +49 711 90074-33
    D-70565 Stuttgart mob +49 171 3101372
    Kurt Jaeger, May 1, 2004
    #5
  6. Gary

    shope Guest

    "Gary" <> wrote in message
    news:ECEkc.942$nN6.575@lakeread06...
    > I need to understand the technologies to link 2 UK offices with a 16Gbit/s
    > capable link.
    >
    > Is the only way or at least the most common way to use STM-whatever


    common is the wrong word - 2.5 G per wavelength (for PoS) is the usual
    limit, although some telcos may sell you a 10G capable link.

    Anything you need will require fibre end to end, so in turn that may limit
    who you can go to - the telco will need to be able to provide fibre to both
    sites.

    you may be able to get dark fibre, but that is not common in the UK unless
    you are working at MAN distances - say up to 20 to 50 miles.
    >
    > What hardware would I be looking at for each end of this link assuming

    some
    > Telco install the relevant link in the middle.


    10G comes in 2 flavours - STM-64 and Gig Ethernet LAN style encoding. what
    you use will be dictated by what wAN link you manage to find.

    in cisco land for hardware you are looking at either GSR12k or higher, or
    Cat 6509s with sup 720s. Expect the hardware to cost at 6 or 7 digits when
    you add all the complications in (after all your LANs or local connections
    need to handle this bandwidth as well). The telco services may cost even
    more - a lot will depend on where the sites.
    >
    > Just a start to understandf the options please.
    >
    > Gary

    --
    Regards

    Stephen Hope - return address needs fewer xxs
    shope, May 1, 2004
    #6
  7. Gary

    Simon Leinen Guest

    Gary writes:
    > I need to understand the technologies to link 2 UK offices with a 16Gbit/s
    > capable link.


    Get fibre! It can carry more than 3 Tb/s with current technology.

    Then you probably want to carry 16 Gb/s of packets over this:

    A cost-effective IP-capable solution with Cisco gear would be two
    Catalyst 6505/7606 OSR, each with Supervisor 720 and a four-port 10
    GbE card (there are two-port 10 GbE cards, which are faster, but they
    are also more expensive, and you didn't say you need 20 Gb/s :).

    If you interconnect two pairs of 10 GbE interfaces, I'm very confident
    that you can get 16 Gb/s over it, if you have some amount of
    distribution of traffic sources and sinks on both sides. This is an
    interesting problem, but can normally be addressed by the design of
    the things that use the link (some kind of storage replication system?).

    Depending on the availability of multiple fibre pairs, and on
    distance, you have different options of transporting those two 10 Gb/s
    channels. If and when Cisco supports DWDM XENPAK modules (which
    exist), you can multiplex the two channels over a single pair (even a
    single fibre if you want) with no external active equipment, provided
    the distance doesn't make you require amplifiers. With some expert
    help, such links can be cost-effectively home-built from off-the-shelf
    parts (ordinary single-mode fibres, passive optical splitters, and for
    longer distance, dispersion compensators and amplifiers).

    If you want to transport other stuff than IP packets and MPLS or
    Ethernet frames (let's say Fibre Channel, ESCON or whatever), look at
    "Metro WDM" or combined WDM/TDM gear (Sorrento, Cisco's ex-ADVA and
    ex-Cerent stuff (now 15200 and 15400 I think), Nortel Optera Metro
    etc.) Again, you mileage will vary according to fibre availability and
    distance.

    Of course the design will need to take availability requirements into
    account (including the larger question of who should be blamed when
    things break).
    --
    Simon.
    Simon Leinen, May 1, 2004
    #7
  8. Gary

    Simon Leinen Guest

    Kurt Jaeger writes:
    > [...] Some telco manufacturers already build devices to transmit 40
    > Gbit/sec over fiber. It's probably lab quality, so you need to
    > discuss some sort of beta. Search for 40 GBit/sec with google.


    This may be misleading... 40 Gb/s as a single channel is telco-land
    ($$$) today, but 10 Gb/s can be done with cost-effective gear, and
    transmission of two 10 Gb/s channels over four (or two (or one!))
    fiber(s) can be done with off-the-shelf components... as I said, DWDM
    XENPAKs exist - although Cisco won't support them yet - and can be
    combined with passive optical filters/couplers, and
    amplifiers/dispersion compensators if necessary.

    If you have enough fibre pairs, you can simply use 10GB-ER XENPAKs
    today. You can simply not multiplex them optically, and optical
    amplification may not work either because of dispersion issues - the
    optical signal generated by a non-WDM XENPAK may be too wide-band.

    My colleagues have built some of these things with CWDM/DWDM GBICs,
    and I trust them when they tell me this will work with 10 GbE too.
    --
    Simon.
    Simon Leinen, May 1, 2004
    #8
  9. Gary

    AnyBody43 Guest

    Simon Leinen <> wrote
    > I'm very confident that you can get 16 Gb/s over it,


    Hi,
    I don't mean this to be harsh but I guess that it may still turn
    out that way, sorry.

    What exactly is going to drive it at that rate?

    Clearly if there are MANY conversations over it then
    it might well be possible but my persent (quite possibly flawed)
    understanding is that for example the PCI bus is limited to
    800Mbps.

    Dear OP, Have you heard of "bandwidth delay product"?


    Also Kurt Jaeger writes:
    > Then you start looking at your application: why does it need this
    > bandwidth and how does it wants to use it ? Which protocol
    > is being used ? IP ? TCP ? Something else ?


    You for sure need to start here.

    If you post further details then we may be able to assist.
    AnyBody43, May 1, 2004
    #9
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