Velocity Reviews - Computer Hardware Reviews

Velocity Reviews > Newsgroups > Programming > Python > Re: Managing Google Groups headaches

Reply
Thread Tools

Re: Managing Google Groups headaches

 
 
Roy Smith
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      12-07-2013
In article <(E-Mail Removed)>,
http://www.velocityreviews.com/forums/(E-Mail Removed) wrote:

> It is on this level the FSR fails.


What is "FSR"? I apologize if this was explained earlier in the thread
and I can't find the reference.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FSR#Sc...and_technology was no help.
 
Reply With Quote
 
 
 
 
Rotwang
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      12-07-2013
On 07/12/2013 16:08, Roy Smith wrote:
> In article <(E-Mail Removed)>,
> (E-Mail Removed) wrote:
>
>> It is on this level the FSR fails.

>
> What is "FSR"? I apologize if this was explained earlier in the thread
> and I can't find the reference.


It's the Flexible String Representation, introduced in Python 3.3:

http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0393/
 
Reply With Quote
 
 
 
 
Tim Chase
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      12-07-2013
On 2013-12-07 11:08, Roy Smith wrote:
> In article <(E-Mail Removed)>,
> (E-Mail Removed) wrote:
>
> > It is on this level the FSR fails.

>
> What is "FSR"? I apologize if this was explained earlier in the
> thread and I can't find the reference.


Flexible String Representation = PEP393

http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0393/

-tkc



 
Reply With Quote
 
rusi
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      12-07-2013
On Saturday, December 7, 2013 3:46:02 PM UTC+5:30, (E-Mail Removed) wrote:
> Rusi:


> "unicode as a medium is universal in the same way that
> ASCII used to be"


> Probably, you do not realize deeply how this sentence
> is correct. Unicode and ascii are constructed in the
> same way. It has not even to do with "characters", but
> with mathematics.


On the contrary, I'd say we have some rather interesting
'characters' out here.

> It is on this level the FSR fails. It is mathematically
> wrong by design!


Now thats an even more interesting statement. Only not sure what it means
Here are some attempts

It is wrong therefore unmathematical
It is designed so its wrong
It is mathematical so its undesigned

Any Ive missed??
 
Reply With Quote
 
Ned Batchelder
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      12-07-2013
On 12/7/13 11:27 AM, rusi wrote:
> On Saturday, December 7, 2013 3:46:02 PM UTC+5:30, (E-Mail Removed) wrote:
>> Rusi:

>
>> "unicode as a medium is universal in the same way that
>> ASCII used to be"

>
>> Probably, you do not realize deeply how this sentence
>> is correct. Unicode and ascii are constructed in the
>> same way. It has not even to do with "characters", but
>> with mathematics.

>
> On the contrary, I'd say we have some rather interesting
> 'characters' out here.
>
>> It is on this level the FSR fails. It is mathematically
>> wrong by design!

>
> Now thats an even more interesting statement. Only not sure what it means
> Here are some attempts
>
> It is wrong therefore unmathematical
> It is designed so its wrong
> It is mathematical so its undesigned
>
> Any Ive missed??
>


JMF: Please stop making this claim. The last 20 times you claimed it
you didn't convince anyone on this list, and I doubt you have any new
information.

Rusi: if you are interested in the details, search the archives.

--
Ned Batchelder, http://nedbatchelder.com

 
Reply With Quote
 
rusi
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      12-08-2013
On Saturday, December 7, 2013 9:35:34 PM UTC+5:30, giacomo boffi wrote:
> Steven D'Aprano writes:


> > Ironically, your post was not Unicode. [...] Your post was sent
> > using a legacy encoding, Windows-1252, also known as CP-1252


> i access rusi's post using a NNTP server,
> and in his post i see


> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8


> is it possible that what you see is an artifact
> of the gateway?


Thanks for checking that!
 
Reply With Quote
 
Steven D'Aprano
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      12-08-2013
On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 17:05:34 +0100, giacomo boffi wrote:

> Steven D'Aprano <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:
>
>> Ironically, your post was not Unicode. [...] Your post was sent using
>> a legacy encoding, Windows-1252, also known as CP-1252

>
> i access rusi's post using a NNTP server, and in his post i see
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8


But *which post* are you looking at?


I have just looked at three posts from him:

Rusi's original post, where he used the ellipsis characters:

Subject: Re: Managing Google Groups headaches
Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2013 23:13:54 -0800 (PST)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252

Then his reply to me:

Subject: Re: ASCII and Unicode [was Re: Managing Google Groups headaches]
Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2013 18:33:39 -0800 (PST)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

And finally, his reply to you:

Subject: Re: ASCII and Unicode
Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2013 08:41:10 -0800 (PST)
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

It seems to me that whatever client he is using to post (I believe it is
Google Groups web interface?) varies the encoding depending on what
characters are included in his post.


> is it possible that what you see is an artifact of the gateway?


I doubt it. Unfortunately the email mailing list archive doesn't display
all the email headers, but for the record here is his original post as
seen by the email mailing list:

https://mail.python.org/pipermail/py...er/661782.html

If you view source, you'll see that Mailman (the mailing list software)
sets the webpage encoding to US-ASCII and encodes the ellipses to &#8230,
which is a perfectly reasonable thing for a web page to do. So we can be
confident that when Mailman saw Rusi's post, it was able to correctly
decode the message and see ellipses.

Although I think that (probably) Google Groups is being stupid by varying
the charset (why not just use UTF-8 always?), at least it is setting the
charset correctly.



--
Steven
 
Reply With Quote
 
rusi
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      12-08-2013
On Sunday, December 8, 2013 10:52:34 PM UTC+5:30, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 17:05:34 +0100, giacomo boffi wrote:


> > Steven D'Aprano writes:
> >> Ironically, your post was not Unicode. [...] Your post was sent using
> >> a legacy encoding, Windows-1252, also known as CP-1252

> > i access rusi's post using a NNTP server, and in his post i see
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8


> But *which post* are you looking at?


> I have just looked at three posts from him:


> Rusi's original post, where he used the ellipsis characters:


> Subject: Re: Managing Google Groups headaches
> Date: Thu, 5 Dec 2013 23:13:54 -0800 (PST)
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252


> Then his reply to me:


> Subject: Re: ASCII and Unicode [was Re: Managing Google Groups headaches]
> Date: Fri, 6 Dec 2013 18:33:39 -0800 (PST)
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8


> And finally, his reply to you:


> Subject: Re: ASCII and Unicode
> Date: Sun, 8 Dec 2013 08:41:10 -0800 (PST)
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1


> It seems to me that whatever client he is using to post (I believe it is
> Google Groups web interface?) varies the encoding depending on what
> characters are included in his post.


> > is it possible that what you see is an artifact of the gateway?


> I doubt it. Unfortunately the email mailing list archive doesn't display
> all the email headers, but for the record here is his original post as
> seen by the email mailing list:


> https://mail.python.org/pipermail/py...er/661782.html


> If you view source, you'll see that Mailman (the mailing list software)
> sets the webpage encoding to US-ASCII and encodes the ellipses to &#8230,
> which is a perfectly reasonable thing for a web page to do. So we can be
> confident that when Mailman saw Rusi's post, it was able to correctly
> decode the message and see ellipses.


> Although I think that (probably) Google Groups is being stupid by varying
> the charset (why not just use UTF-8 always?), at least it is setting the
> charset correctly.


I think GG is being being sweet and affectionate and delectable enough thata
💩 in the footer will keep it stuck at UTF-8 you think ??


 
Reply With Quote
 
giacomo boffi
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      12-08-2013
Steven D'Aprano <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:

> On Sat, 07 Dec 2013 17:05:34 +0100, giacomo boffi wrote:
>
>> Steven D'Aprano <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:
>>
>>> Ironically, your post was not Unicode. [...] Your post was sent using
>>> a legacy encoding, Windows-1252, also known as CP-1252

>>
>> i access rusi's post using a NNTP server, and in his post i see
>>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

>
> But *which post* are you looking at?


<blush> the wrong one...</> i.e, the one JUST BEFORE your change of
subject --- if i look at the "ellipsis" post, i see the same encoding
that you have mentioned

sorry for the confusion
 
Reply With Quote
 
rusi
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      12-09-2013
On Monday, December 9, 2013 1:41:41 AM UTC+5:30, giacomo boffi wrote:
> <blush> the wrong one...</> i.e, the one JUST BEFORE your change of
> subject --- if i look at the "ellipsis" post, i see the same encoding
> that you have mentioned


> sorry for the confusion


And thank you for pointing the way to the culprit, viz. GG trying to be
too clever.

[Since you neglected to close your <blush> I am included in it ]
 
Reply With Quote
 
 
 
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Re: Managing Google Groups headaches Chris Angelico Python 49 12-04-2013 04:33 PM
Does Google Groups contain Google Docs? me@privacy.net Computer Support 2 09-20-2009 08:08 AM
Re: Try Doing A Google Search For Greg Carr On Google Groups Kevin C Baer Computer Support 4 09-16-2008 10:09 PM
FAQ - references to Google/Google Groups Andrew Thompson Java 0 06-20-2005 12:26 PM
getting values from URL such as http://groups.google.co.uk/groups?q=parameters+url+asp.net&start=10&hl=en&lr=& anonymous ASP .Net 1 05-08-2005 03:58 PM



Advertisments