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system page file help..

 
 
Robert Baer
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Posts: n/a
 
      01-05-2013
This very rarely happens to me, but when it does, it is a total (to
date) non-recoverable bitch.

Background: my HD has the following structure:
Partition 1 = C: WIN9SE (primary)
Partition 2 = extended with D: WORK (logical) and E: DEVEL (logical)
Partition 3 = F: MASTER (primary)
Partition 4 = G: WIN2K (primary).
My backup drive is exactly the same.

Somehow i did something when both drives were plugged into the
computer (i use removable HD kits for all hard drives), and now when i
boot with only one HD, i get this incredibly stupid and insane message
box "your system has no paging file, or the paging file is too small..."
and it goes on, ASS-U-MEing one is fully booted, with the procedure of
setting the paging file.

It is insane and stupid in that it is COMPLETELY IMPOSSIBLE to do
anything other that unplug the computer to turn it off.
There is absolutely NO F*ING WAY to change the paging file(s) unless
one _then_ boots with both hard drives in the computer.

And wasting hours with various page file allocations makes no
difference in the above "operation".

Please, ANY clues as what else one can do to try and fix this?

PS:
Do not mention useless "safe mode"; one gets a black screen with
"safe mode" in all 4 corners and the cursor, and nothing else (oh yes,
one must unplug computer to reset).
This is an artifact when one has a Windoze dual-boot system; i
experimented one time without Win98SE (Win2K only OS, boots directly)
and sure enough, "safe mode" is actually useable; i damn near fainted
due to the shock (many years of useless "safe mode" with a dual-boot
system).
 
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Paul
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      01-05-2013
Robert Baer wrote:
> This very rarely happens to me, but when it does, it is a total (to
> date) non-recoverable bitch.
>
> Background: my HD has the following structure:
> Partition 1 = C: WIN9SE (primary)
> Partition 2 = extended with D: WORK (logical) and E: DEVEL (logical)
> Partition 3 = F: MASTER (primary)
> Partition 4 = G: WIN2K (primary).
> My backup drive is exactly the same.
>
> Somehow i did something when both drives were plugged into the
> computer (i use removable HD kits for all hard drives), and now when i
> boot with only one HD, i get this incredibly stupid and insane message
> box "your system has no paging file, or the paging file is too small..."
> and it goes on, ASS-U-MEing one is fully booted, with the procedure of
> setting the paging file.
>
> It is insane and stupid in that it is COMPLETELY IMPOSSIBLE to do
> anything other that unplug the computer to turn it off.
> There is absolutely NO F*ING WAY to change the paging file(s) unless
> one _then_ boots with both hard drives in the computer.
>
> And wasting hours with various page file allocations makes no
> difference in the above "operation".
>
> Please, ANY clues as what else one can do to try and fix this?
>
> PS:
> Do not mention useless "safe mode"; one gets a black screen with "safe
> mode" in all 4 corners and the cursor, and nothing else (oh yes, one
> must unplug computer to reset).
> This is an artifact when one has a Windoze dual-boot system; i
> experimented one time without Win98SE (Win2K only OS, boots directly)
> and sure enough, "safe mode" is actually useable; i damn near fainted
> due to the shock (many years of useless "safe mode" with a dual-boot
> system).


I had something like that happen with Win2K.

And the funny part was, even putting a pagefile file onto C:,
didn't fix it. I even copied a pagefile from another OS,
thinking that perhaps the pagefile had a header and some info
that needed to be present, to be recognized.

Which implies some registry info needs to be doctored as well.
Maybe something like that would have fixed it. (You may be
able to edit the registry, from another OS.)

I suppose a Repair Install could fix it. As I was in a hurry at the
time (and was working in a VM), I just started over again, rather
than waste the time slugging at it.

You could also look at what registry repair options you have
available. System Restore keeps copies of the registry,
but I don't think there is System Restore on the older OSes.

Post back if you find a solution.

Paul
 
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Robert Baer
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      01-06-2013
Paul wrote:
> Robert Baer wrote:
>> This very rarely happens to me, but when it does, it is a total (to
>> date) non-recoverable bitch.
>>
>> Background: my HD has the following structure:
>> Partition 1 = C: WIN9SE (primary)
>> Partition 2 = extended with D: WORK (logical) and E: DEVEL (logical)
>> Partition 3 = F: MASTER (primary)
>> Partition 4 = G: WIN2K (primary).
>> My backup drive is exactly the same.
>>
>> Somehow i did something when both drives were plugged into the
>> computer (i use removable HD kits for all hard drives), and now when i
>> boot with only one HD, i get this incredibly stupid and insane message
>> box "your system has no paging file, or the paging file is too
>> small..." and it goes on, ASS-U-MEing one is fully booted, with the
>> procedure of setting the paging file.
>>
>> It is insane and stupid in that it is COMPLETELY IMPOSSIBLE to do
>> anything other that unplug the computer to turn it off.
>> There is absolutely NO F*ING WAY to change the paging file(s) unless
>> one _then_ boots with both hard drives in the computer.
>>
>> And wasting hours with various page file allocations makes no
>> difference in the above "operation".
>>
>> Please, ANY clues as what else one can do to try and fix this?
>>
>> PS:
>> Do not mention useless "safe mode"; one gets a black screen with "safe
>> mode" in all 4 corners and the cursor, and nothing else (oh yes, one
>> must unplug computer to reset).
>> This is an artifact when one has a Windoze dual-boot system; i
>> experimented one time without Win98SE (Win2K only OS, boots directly)
>> and sure enough, "safe mode" is actually useable; i damn near fainted
>> due to the shock (many years of useless "safe mode" with a dual-boot
>> system).

>
> I had something like that happen with Win2K.
>
> And the funny part was, even putting a pagefile file onto C:,
> didn't fix it. I even copied a pagefile from another OS,
> thinking that perhaps the pagefile had a header and some info
> that needed to be present, to be recognized.
>
> Which implies some registry info needs to be doctored as well.
> Maybe something like that would have fixed it. (You may be
> able to edit the registry, from another OS.)
>
> I suppose a Repair Install could fix it. As I was in a hurry at the
> time (and was working in a VM), I just started over again, rather
> than waste the time slugging at it.
>
> You could also look at what registry repair options you have
> available. System Restore keeps copies of the registry,
> but I don't think there is System Restore on the older OSes.
>
> Post back if you find a solution.
>
> Paul

"Repair Install" sounds nice, but rarely helps any problem; in this
case it does nothing.
Naturally, there are NO registry repair options that i know of.
And not even Hisself Billy Boy knows where they hide the registry.
RegEdit only works on the registry for that particular OS on its volume.
The only way to fix it is to start from scratch like you mentioned.
And that takes daze to re-build all of the apps.

 
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Paul
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      01-06-2013
Robert Baer wrote:
> Paul wrote:
>> Robert Baer wrote:
>>> This very rarely happens to me, but when it does, it is a total (to
>>> date) non-recoverable bitch.
>>>
>>> Background: my HD has the following structure:
>>> Partition 1 = C: WIN9SE (primary)
>>> Partition 2 = extended with D: WORK (logical) and E: DEVEL (logical)
>>> Partition 3 = F: MASTER (primary)
>>> Partition 4 = G: WIN2K (primary).
>>> My backup drive is exactly the same.
>>>
>>> Somehow i did something when both drives were plugged into the
>>> computer (i use removable HD kits for all hard drives), and now when i
>>> boot with only one HD, i get this incredibly stupid and insane message
>>> box "your system has no paging file, or the paging file is too
>>> small..." and it goes on, ASS-U-MEing one is fully booted, with the
>>> procedure of setting the paging file.
>>>
>>> It is insane and stupid in that it is COMPLETELY IMPOSSIBLE to do
>>> anything other that unplug the computer to turn it off.
>>> There is absolutely NO F*ING WAY to change the paging file(s) unless
>>> one _then_ boots with both hard drives in the computer.
>>>
>>> And wasting hours with various page file allocations makes no
>>> difference in the above "operation".
>>>
>>> Please, ANY clues as what else one can do to try and fix this?
>>>
>>> PS:
>>> Do not mention useless "safe mode"; one gets a black screen with "safe
>>> mode" in all 4 corners and the cursor, and nothing else (oh yes, one
>>> must unplug computer to reset).
>>> This is an artifact when one has a Windoze dual-boot system; i
>>> experimented one time without Win98SE (Win2K only OS, boots directly)
>>> and sure enough, "safe mode" is actually useable; i damn near fainted
>>> due to the shock (many years of useless "safe mode" with a dual-boot
>>> system).

>>
>> I had something like that happen with Win2K.
>>
>> And the funny part was, even putting a pagefile file onto C:,
>> didn't fix it. I even copied a pagefile from another OS,
>> thinking that perhaps the pagefile had a header and some info
>> that needed to be present, to be recognized.
>>
>> Which implies some registry info needs to be doctored as well.
>> Maybe something like that would have fixed it. (You may be
>> able to edit the registry, from another OS.)
>>
>> I suppose a Repair Install could fix it. As I was in a hurry at the
>> time (and was working in a VM), I just started over again, rather
>> than waste the time slugging at it.
>>
>> You could also look at what registry repair options you have
>> available. System Restore keeps copies of the registry,
>> but I don't think there is System Restore on the older OSes.
>>
>> Post back if you find a solution.
>>
>> Paul

> "Repair Install" sounds nice, but rarely helps any problem; in this
> case it does nothing.
> Naturally, there are NO registry repair options that i know of.
> And not even Hisself Billy Boy knows where they hide the registry.
> RegEdit only works on the registry for that particular OS on its volume.
> The only way to fix it is to start from scratch like you mentioned.
> And that takes daze to re-build all of the apps.
>


This is one I can find in WinXP. It occurs several places.

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\ControlSet001\Control\Se ssion Manager\Memory Management
PagingFiles c:\pagefile.sys 2048 4092 <--- MultiStrings Type

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\ControlSet002\Control\Se ssion Manager\Memory Management
PagingFiles c:\pagefile.sys 2048 4092 <--- MultiStrings Type

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Contro l\Session Manager\Memory Management
PagingFiles c:\pagefile.sys 2048 4092 <--- MultiStrings Type

ControlSet002 = "Last Known Good"
ControlSet001 = last control set booted with
CurrentControlSet = pointer to one of the other two

Maybe when I'm more awake, I'll try some experiments in a Win2K VM.

Paul
 
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Paul
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Posts: n/a
 
      01-07-2013
Robert Baer wrote:
> Paul wrote:
>> Robert Baer wrote:
>>> This very rarely happens to me, but when it does, it is a total (to
>>> date) non-recoverable bitch.
>>>
>>> Background: my HD has the following structure:
>>> Partition 1 = C: WIN9SE (primary)
>>> Partition 2 = extended with D: WORK (logical) and E: DEVEL (logical)
>>> Partition 3 = F: MASTER (primary)
>>> Partition 4 = G: WIN2K (primary).
>>> My backup drive is exactly the same.
>>>
>>> Somehow i did something when both drives were plugged into the
>>> computer (i use removable HD kits for all hard drives), and now when i
>>> boot with only one HD, i get this incredibly stupid and insane message
>>> box "your system has no paging file, or the paging file is too
>>> small..." and it goes on, ASS-U-MEing one is fully booted, with the
>>> procedure of setting the paging file.
>>>
>>> It is insane and stupid in that it is COMPLETELY IMPOSSIBLE to do
>>> anything other that unplug the computer to turn it off.
>>> There is absolutely NO F*ING WAY to change the paging file(s) unless
>>> one _then_ boots with both hard drives in the computer.
>>>
>>> And wasting hours with various page file allocations makes no
>>> difference in the above "operation".
>>>
>>> Please, ANY clues as what else one can do to try and fix this?
>>>
>>> PS:
>>> Do not mention useless "safe mode"; one gets a black screen with "safe
>>> mode" in all 4 corners and the cursor, and nothing else (oh yes, one
>>> must unplug computer to reset).
>>> This is an artifact when one has a Windoze dual-boot system; i
>>> experimented one time without Win98SE (Win2K only OS, boots directly)
>>> and sure enough, "safe mode" is actually useable; i damn near fainted
>>> due to the shock (many years of useless "safe mode" with a dual-boot
>>> system).

>>
>> I had something like that happen with Win2K.
>>
>> And the funny part was, even putting a pagefile file onto C:,
>> didn't fix it. I even copied a pagefile from another OS,
>> thinking that perhaps the pagefile had a header and some info
>> that needed to be present, to be recognized.
>>
>> Which implies some registry info needs to be doctored as well.
>> Maybe something like that would have fixed it. (You may be
>> able to edit the registry, from another OS.)
>>
>> I suppose a Repair Install could fix it. As I was in a hurry at the
>> time (and was working in a VM), I just started over again, rather
>> than waste the time slugging at it.
>>
>> You could also look at what registry repair options you have
>> available. System Restore keeps copies of the registry,
>> but I don't think there is System Restore on the older OSes.
>>
>> Post back if you find a solution.
>>
>> Paul

> "Repair Install" sounds nice, but rarely helps any problem; in this
> case it does nothing.
> Naturally, there are NO registry repair options that i know of.
> And not even Hisself Billy Boy knows where they hide the registry.
> RegEdit only works on the registry for that particular OS on its volume.
> The only way to fix it is to start from scratch like you mentioned.
> And that takes daze to re-build all of the apps.
>


OK. I fired up my virtual machine and did some testing.

1) I tried a config with just one disk drive, with Win2K C: on it.
I deleted C:\pagefile.sys. I restarted. The system created a
new pagefile.sys and carried on as if nothing happened. OK,
so that's not the recipe on how to break it.

2) Next, I tried two disks with Win2K on them, a C: on each disk.
I assigned a label to each disk, so I could tell them apart.
I also used Sysinternals VolumeID and gave the second disk a
different volume ID. Just in case that was important. (It's possible
the OS will do that anyway, but I didn't want to ruin things by
ignoring it.)

Now, what happens at boot, is interesting. I expected this to
happen, with the two disks present.

Disk0 C:
Disk1 E:

And instead, they had switched roles.

Disk0 E: Healthy (System)
Disk1 C: Healthy (Pagefile)

So what's happened is, the system should have booted from Disk0.
And it did. But, when it did, two things happened. It decided the
other disk had C:\pagefile.sys (which it does). And then it changes the
system drive letter to E: ! At this point, no pagefile.sys was
deleted.

If I delete pagefile.sys from E:, nothing happens, because it's
still pointed at Disk1 C:. I can still boot, because both disks
are still present, and the pagefile.sys on the so-called C: is
still available.

OK, now, remove Disk1 and try to run with Disk0. BOom. Now,
we're in that pagefile error message loop.

And basically, nothing I did would fix it. I tried changing
the registry, by editing SYSTEM with a hex editor, and changing
that registry entry. (Hmmm. It occurs to me, there are three
similar keys, and maybe I edited the wrong one. Mumble...)

My conclusion at the moment is, if you were to put back the
disks that were present when the "ole switcheroo" was pulled,
then the Win2K system would boot. It would look like my mess,
with C: having become E: and E: changing to C:. You should put the
disks back on the same cables they used originally.

So there are actually two variables involved. There is the
registry entry that keeps track of system drive letter.
And also the registry entry that keeps the pagefile strings.
In fact, the pagefile registry entry isn't changing. It's the
fact the drive letters have changed, that screws things up.
And between the two of those, you have to get things aligned
so the system can find the pagefile.

Maybe this situation arises, when a person clones Win2K, and
both disks with their copy of Win2K remain present, for the very
first boot of the clone. Then the drive letter mess happens
and so on. And then, disconnecting the second disk, and trying
to boot with only one of the two disks present, makes it
painfully obvious that the pagefile is missing as far
as the system is concerned.

Paul
 
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Robert Baer
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      01-08-2013
Paul wrote:
> Robert Baer wrote:
>> This very rarely happens to me, but when it does, it is a total (to
>> date) non-recoverable bitch.
>>
>> Background: my HD has the following structure:
>> Partition 1 = C: WIN9SE (primary)
>> Partition 2 = extended with D: WORK (logical) and E: DEVEL (logical)
>> Partition 3 = F: MASTER (primary)
>> Partition 4 = G: WIN2K (primary).
>> My backup drive is exactly the same.
>>
>> Somehow i did something when both drives were plugged into the
>> computer (i use removable HD kits for all hard drives), and now when i
>> boot with only one HD, i get this incredibly stupid and insane message
>> box "your system has no paging file, or the paging file is too
>> small..." and it goes on, ASS-U-MEing one is fully booted, with the
>> procedure of setting the paging file.
>>
>> It is insane and stupid in that it is COMPLETELY IMPOSSIBLE to do
>> anything other that unplug the computer to turn it off.
>> There is absolutely NO F*ING WAY to change the paging file(s) unless
>> one _then_ boots with both hard drives in the computer.
>>
>> And wasting hours with various page file allocations makes no
>> difference in the above "operation".
>>
>> Please, ANY clues as what else one can do to try and fix this?
>>
>> PS:
>> Do not mention useless "safe mode"; one gets a black screen with "safe
>> mode" in all 4 corners and the cursor, and nothing else (oh yes, one
>> must unplug computer to reset).
>> This is an artifact when one has a Windoze dual-boot system; i
>> experimented one time without Win98SE (Win2K only OS, boots directly)
>> and sure enough, "safe mode" is actually useable; i damn near fainted
>> due to the shock (many years of useless "safe mode" with a dual-boot
>> system).

>
> I had something like that happen with Win2K.
>
> And the funny part was, even putting a pagefile file onto C:,
> didn't fix it. I even copied a pagefile from another OS,
> thinking that perhaps the pagefile had a header and some info
> that needed to be present, to be recognized.
>
> Which implies some registry info needs to be doctored as well.
> Maybe something like that would have fixed it. (You may be
> able to edit the registry, from another OS.)
>
> I suppose a Repair Install could fix it. As I was in a hurry at the
> time (and was working in a VM), I just started over again, rather
> than waste the time slugging at it.
>
> You could also look at what registry repair options you have
> available. System Restore keeps copies of the registry,
> but I don't think there is System Restore on the older OSes.
>
> Post back if you find a solution.
>
> Paul

At present, i cannot test this possible way to fix that problem
(would need a spare HD to make new exclusive install of Win2K): at boot,
F8 to "Safe Mode" and try the control panel / system / advanced /
performance options / virtual memory / change..

 
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Robert Baer
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      01-08-2013
Paul wrote:
> Robert Baer wrote:
>> Paul wrote:
>>> Robert Baer wrote:
>>>> This very rarely happens to me, but when it does, it is a total (to
>>>> date) non-recoverable bitch.
>>>>
>>>> Background: my HD has the following structure:
>>>> Partition 1 = C: WIN9SE (primary)
>>>> Partition 2 = extended with D: WORK (logical) and E: DEVEL (logical)
>>>> Partition 3 = F: MASTER (primary)
>>>> Partition 4 = G: WIN2K (primary).
>>>> My backup drive is exactly the same.
>>>>
>>>> Somehow i did something when both drives were plugged into the
>>>> computer (i use removable HD kits for all hard drives), and now when i
>>>> boot with only one HD, i get this incredibly stupid and insane message
>>>> box "your system has no paging file, or the paging file is too
>>>> small..." and it goes on, ASS-U-MEing one is fully booted, with the
>>>> procedure of setting the paging file.
>>>>
>>>> It is insane and stupid in that it is COMPLETELY IMPOSSIBLE to do
>>>> anything other that unplug the computer to turn it off.
>>>> There is absolutely NO F*ING WAY to change the paging file(s) unless
>>>> one _then_ boots with both hard drives in the computer.
>>>>
>>>> And wasting hours with various page file allocations makes no
>>>> difference in the above "operation".
>>>>
>>>> Please, ANY clues as what else one can do to try and fix this?
>>>>
>>>> PS:
>>>> Do not mention useless "safe mode"; one gets a black screen with "safe
>>>> mode" in all 4 corners and the cursor, and nothing else (oh yes, one
>>>> must unplug computer to reset).
>>>> This is an artifact when one has a Windoze dual-boot system; i
>>>> experimented one time without Win98SE (Win2K only OS, boots directly)
>>>> and sure enough, "safe mode" is actually useable; i damn near fainted
>>>> due to the shock (many years of useless "safe mode" with a dual-boot
>>>> system).
>>>
>>> I had something like that happen with Win2K.
>>>
>>> And the funny part was, even putting a pagefile file onto C:,
>>> didn't fix it. I even copied a pagefile from another OS,
>>> thinking that perhaps the pagefile had a header and some info
>>> that needed to be present, to be recognized.
>>>
>>> Which implies some registry info needs to be doctored as well.
>>> Maybe something like that would have fixed it. (You may be
>>> able to edit the registry, from another OS.)
>>>
>>> I suppose a Repair Install could fix it. As I was in a hurry at the
>>> time (and was working in a VM), I just started over again, rather
>>> than waste the time slugging at it.
>>>
>>> You could also look at what registry repair options you have
>>> available. System Restore keeps copies of the registry,
>>> but I don't think there is System Restore on the older OSes.
>>>
>>> Post back if you find a solution.
>>>
>>> Paul

>> "Repair Install" sounds nice, but rarely helps any problem; in this
>> case it does nothing.
>> Naturally, there are NO registry repair options that i know of.
>> And not even Hisself Billy Boy knows where they hide the registry.
>> RegEdit only works on the registry for that particular OS on its volume.
>> The only way to fix it is to start from scratch like you mentioned.
>> And that takes daze to re-build all of the apps.
>>

>
> OK. I fired up my virtual machine and did some testing.
>
> 1) I tried a config with just one disk drive, with Win2K C: on it.
> I deleted C:\pagefile.sys. I restarted. The system created a
> new pagefile.sys and carried on as if nothing happened. OK,
> so that's not the recipe on how to break it.
>
> 2) Next, I tried two disks with Win2K on them, a C: on each disk.
> I assigned a label to each disk, so I could tell them apart.
> I also used Sysinternals VolumeID and gave the second disk a
> different volume ID. Just in case that was important. (It's possible
> the OS will do that anyway, but I didn't want to ruin things by
> ignoring it.)
>
> Now, what happens at boot, is interesting. I expected this to
> happen, with the two disks present.
>
> Disk0 C:
> Disk1 E:
>
> And instead, they had switched roles.
>
> Disk0 E: Healthy (System)
> Disk1 C: Healthy (Pagefile)
>
> So what's happened is, the system should have booted from Disk0.
> And it did. But, when it did, two things happened. It decided the
> other disk had C:\pagefile.sys (which it does). And then it changes the
> system drive letter to E: ! At this point, no pagefile.sys was
> deleted.
>
> If I delete pagefile.sys from E:, nothing happens, because it's
> still pointed at Disk1 C:. I can still boot, because both disks
> are still present, and the pagefile.sys on the so-called C: is
> still available.
>
> OK, now, remove Disk1 and try to run with Disk0. BOom. Now,
> we're in that pagefile error message loop.
>
> And basically, nothing I did would fix it. I tried changing
> the registry, by editing SYSTEM with a hex editor, and changing
> that registry entry. (Hmmm. It occurs to me, there are three
> similar keys, and maybe I edited the wrong one. Mumble...)
>
> My conclusion at the moment is, if you were to put back the
> disks that were present when the "ole switcheroo" was pulled,
> then the Win2K system would boot. It would look like my mess,
> with C: having become E: and E: changing to C:. You should put the
> disks back on the same cables they used originally.
>
> So there are actually two variables involved. There is the
> registry entry that keeps track of system drive letter.
> And also the registry entry that keeps the pagefile strings.
> In fact, the pagefile registry entry isn't changing. It's the
> fact the drive letters have changed, that screws things up.
> And between the two of those, you have to get things aligned
> so the system can find the pagefile.
>
> Maybe this situation arises, when a person clones Win2K, and
> both disks with their copy of Win2K remain present, for the very
> first boot of the clone. Then the drive letter mess happens
> and so on. And then, disconnecting the second disk, and trying
> to boot with only one of the two disks present, makes it
> painfully obvious that the pagefile is missing as far
> as the system is concerned.
>
> Paul

WOW! You found the secret a switcheroo!
I did not know of that ages ago, what i did the next build was make
sure Win2K was "out there" (eg: partition 4, G, and for a number of
years that prevented the problem (gotta say "somehow" now that i have a
better idea about the funny business).

 
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Robert Baer
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Posts: n/a
 
      01-10-2013
Paul wrote:
> Robert Baer wrote:
>> Paul wrote:
>>> Robert Baer wrote:
>>>> This very rarely happens to me, but when it does, it is a total (to
>>>> date) non-recoverable bitch.
>>>>
>>>> Background: my HD has the following structure:
>>>> Partition 1 = C: WIN9SE (primary)
>>>> Partition 2 = extended with D: WORK (logical) and E: DEVEL (logical)
>>>> Partition 3 = F: MASTER (primary)
>>>> Partition 4 = G: WIN2K (primary).
>>>> My backup drive is exactly the same.
>>>>
>>>> Somehow i did something when both drives were plugged into the
>>>> computer (i use removable HD kits for all hard drives), and now when i
>>>> boot with only one HD, i get this incredibly stupid and insane message
>>>> box "your system has no paging file, or the paging file is too
>>>> small..." and it goes on, ASS-U-MEing one is fully booted, with the
>>>> procedure of setting the paging file.
>>>>
>>>> It is insane and stupid in that it is COMPLETELY IMPOSSIBLE to do
>>>> anything other that unplug the computer to turn it off.
>>>> There is absolutely NO F*ING WAY to change the paging file(s) unless
>>>> one _then_ boots with both hard drives in the computer.
>>>>
>>>> And wasting hours with various page file allocations makes no
>>>> difference in the above "operation".
>>>>
>>>> Please, ANY clues as what else one can do to try and fix this?
>>>>
>>>> PS:
>>>> Do not mention useless "safe mode"; one gets a black screen with "safe
>>>> mode" in all 4 corners and the cursor, and nothing else (oh yes, one
>>>> must unplug computer to reset).
>>>> This is an artifact when one has a Windoze dual-boot system; i
>>>> experimented one time without Win98SE (Win2K only OS, boots directly)
>>>> and sure enough, "safe mode" is actually useable; i damn near fainted
>>>> due to the shock (many years of useless "safe mode" with a dual-boot
>>>> system).
>>>
>>> I had something like that happen with Win2K.
>>>
>>> And the funny part was, even putting a pagefile file onto C:,
>>> didn't fix it. I even copied a pagefile from another OS,
>>> thinking that perhaps the pagefile had a header and some info
>>> that needed to be present, to be recognized.
>>>
>>> Which implies some registry info needs to be doctored as well.
>>> Maybe something like that would have fixed it. (You may be
>>> able to edit the registry, from another OS.)
>>>
>>> I suppose a Repair Install could fix it. As I was in a hurry at the
>>> time (and was working in a VM), I just started over again, rather
>>> than waste the time slugging at it.
>>>
>>> You could also look at what registry repair options you have
>>> available. System Restore keeps copies of the registry,
>>> but I don't think there is System Restore on the older OSes.
>>>
>>> Post back if you find a solution.
>>>
>>> Paul

>> "Repair Install" sounds nice, but rarely helps any problem; in this
>> case it does nothing.
>> Naturally, there are NO registry repair options that i know of.
>> And not even Hisself Billy Boy knows where they hide the registry.
>> RegEdit only works on the registry for that particular OS on its volume.
>> The only way to fix it is to start from scratch like you mentioned.
>> And that takes daze to re-build all of the apps.
>>

>
> OK. I fired up my virtual machine and did some testing.
>
> 1) I tried a config with just one disk drive, with Win2K C: on it.
> I deleted C:\pagefile.sys. I restarted. The system created a
> new pagefile.sys and carried on as if nothing happened. OK,
> so that's not the recipe on how to break it.
>
> 2) Next, I tried two disks with Win2K on them, a C: on each disk.
> I assigned a label to each disk, so I could tell them apart.
> I also used Sysinternals VolumeID and gave the second disk a
> different volume ID. Just in case that was important. (It's possible
> the OS will do that anyway, but I didn't want to ruin things by
> ignoring it.)
>
> Now, what happens at boot, is interesting. I expected this to
> happen, with the two disks present.
>
> Disk0 C:
> Disk1 E:
>
> And instead, they had switched roles.
>
> Disk0 E: Healthy (System)
> Disk1 C: Healthy (Pagefile)
>
> So what's happened is, the system should have booted from Disk0.
> And it did. But, when it did, two things happened. It decided the
> other disk had C:\pagefile.sys (which it does). And then it changes the
> system drive letter to E: ! At this point, no pagefile.sys was
> deleted.
>
> If I delete pagefile.sys from E:, nothing happens, because it's
> still pointed at Disk1 C:. I can still boot, because both disks
> are still present, and the pagefile.sys on the so-called C: is
> still available.
>
> OK, now, remove Disk1 and try to run with Disk0. BOom. Now,
> we're in that pagefile error message loop.
>
> And basically, nothing I did would fix it. I tried changing
> the registry, by editing SYSTEM with a hex editor, and changing
> that registry entry. (Hmmm. It occurs to me, there are three
> similar keys, and maybe I edited the wrong one. Mumble...)
>
> My conclusion at the moment is, if you were to put back the
> disks that were present when the "ole switcheroo" was pulled,
> then the Win2K system would boot. It would look like my mess,
> with C: having become E: and E: changing to C:. You should put the
> disks back on the same cables they used originally.
>
> So there are actually two variables involved. There is the
> registry entry that keeps track of system drive letter.
> And also the registry entry that keeps the pagefile strings.
> In fact, the pagefile registry entry isn't changing. It's the
> fact the drive letters have changed, that screws things up.
> And between the two of those, you have to get things aligned
> so the system can find the pagefile.
>
> Maybe this situation arises, when a person clones Win2K, and
> both disks with their copy of Win2K remain present, for the very
> first boot of the clone. Then the drive letter mess happens
> and so on. And then, disconnecting the second disk, and trying
> to boot with only one of the two disks present, makes it
> painfully obvious that the pagefile is missing as far
> as the system is concerned.
>
> Paul

I think i have found a way to reliably create the problem as well as
fix it.
Use Acronis to clone HD1 to HD2 and re-boot with both connected.

Original HD1 and what should be if all OK for HD2
Partition 1 = C: WIN9SE (primary) I:
Partition 2 = extended D: WORK & E: DEVEL J: & K: (logical)
Partition 3 = F: MASTER (primary) L:
Partition 4 = G: WIN2K (primary). M:

But, you get C: D:
E: & F: G: & H:
I: J:
?: ?: (did not look)
Ugly results were reported by DOS Fdisk.
*
Fix: Boot to Win2K and use disk manager to re-assign the drives (will
need to use (say) P: as temp placeholder; final result to look like the
initial sample (ie: BE IN ORDER on each drive).
 
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Daniel47@teranews.com
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      01-15-2013
Robert Baer wrote:

<Snip>
>> Paul

> I think i have found a way to reliably create the problem as well as
> fix it.
> Use Acronis to clone HD1 to HD2 and re-boot with both connected.
>
> Original HD1 and what should be if all OK for HD2
> Partition 1 = C: WIN9SE (primary) I:
> Partition 2 = extended D: WORK & E: DEVEL J: & K: (logical)
> Partition 3 = F: MASTER (primary) L:
> Partition 4 = G: WIN2K (primary). M:
>
> But, you get C: D:
> E: & F: G: & H:
> I: J:
> ?: ?: (did not look)
> Ugly results were reported by DOS Fdisk.
> *
> Fix: Boot to Win2K and use disk manager to re-assign the drives (will
> need to use (say) P: as temp placeholder; final result to look like the
> initial sample (ie: BE IN ORDER on each drive).


Hey, Robert, I seem to recall that any primary partition has to get
listed before any extended partitions, so the primary partition on your
second drive will always be listed before the extended partitions on the
Primary drive.

HTH

Daniel

 
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Robert Baer
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      01-17-2013
Paul wrote:
> Robert Baer wrote:
>> Paul wrote:
>>> Robert Baer wrote:
>>>> This very rarely happens to me, but when it does, it is a total (to
>>>> date) non-recoverable bitch.
>>>>
>>>> Background: my HD has the following structure:
>>>> Partition 1 = C: WIN9SE (primary)
>>>> Partition 2 = extended with D: WORK (logical) and E: DEVEL (logical)
>>>> Partition 3 = F: MASTER (primary)
>>>> Partition 4 = G: WIN2K (primary).
>>>> My backup drive is exactly the same.
>>>>
>>>> Somehow i did something when both drives were plugged into the
>>>> computer (i use removable HD kits for all hard drives), and now when i
>>>> boot with only one HD, i get this incredibly stupid and insane message
>>>> box "your system has no paging file, or the paging file is too
>>>> small..." and it goes on, ASS-U-MEing one is fully booted, with the
>>>> procedure of setting the paging file.
>>>>
>>>> It is insane and stupid in that it is COMPLETELY IMPOSSIBLE to do
>>>> anything other that unplug the computer to turn it off.
>>>> There is absolutely NO F*ING WAY to change the paging file(s) unless
>>>> one _then_ boots with both hard drives in the computer.
>>>>
>>>> And wasting hours with various page file allocations makes no
>>>> difference in the above "operation".
>>>>
>>>> Please, ANY clues as what else one can do to try and fix this?
>>>>
>>>> PS:
>>>> Do not mention useless "safe mode"; one gets a black screen with "safe
>>>> mode" in all 4 corners and the cursor, and nothing else (oh yes, one
>>>> must unplug computer to reset).
>>>> This is an artifact when one has a Windoze dual-boot system; i
>>>> experimented one time without Win98SE (Win2K only OS, boots directly)
>>>> and sure enough, "safe mode" is actually useable; i damn near fainted
>>>> due to the shock (many years of useless "safe mode" with a dual-boot
>>>> system).
>>>
>>> I had something like that happen with Win2K.
>>>
>>> And the funny part was, even putting a pagefile file onto C:,
>>> didn't fix it. I even copied a pagefile from another OS,
>>> thinking that perhaps the pagefile had a header and some info
>>> that needed to be present, to be recognized.
>>>
>>> Which implies some registry info needs to be doctored as well.
>>> Maybe something like that would have fixed it. (You may be
>>> able to edit the registry, from another OS.)
>>>
>>> I suppose a Repair Install could fix it. As I was in a hurry at the
>>> time (and was working in a VM), I just started over again, rather
>>> than waste the time slugging at it.
>>>
>>> You could also look at what registry repair options you have
>>> available. System Restore keeps copies of the registry,
>>> but I don't think there is System Restore on the older OSes.
>>>
>>> Post back if you find a solution.
>>>
>>> Paul

>> "Repair Install" sounds nice, but rarely helps any problem; in this
>> case it does nothing.
>> Naturally, there are NO registry repair options that i know of.
>> And not even Hisself Billy Boy knows where they hide the registry.
>> RegEdit only works on the registry for that particular OS on its volume.
>> The only way to fix it is to start from scratch like you mentioned.
>> And that takes daze to re-build all of the apps.
>>

>
> OK. I fired up my virtual machine and did some testing.
>
> 1) I tried a config with just one disk drive, with Win2K C: on it.
> I deleted C:\pagefile.sys. I restarted. The system created a
> new pagefile.sys and carried on as if nothing happened. OK,
> so that's not the recipe on how to break it.
>
> 2) Next, I tried two disks with Win2K on them, a C: on each disk.
> I assigned a label to each disk, so I could tell them apart.
> I also used Sysinternals VolumeID and gave the second disk a
> different volume ID. Just in case that was important. (It's possible
> the OS will do that anyway, but I didn't want to ruin things by
> ignoring it.)
>
> Now, what happens at boot, is interesting. I expected this to
> happen, with the two disks present.
>
> Disk0 C:
> Disk1 E:
>
> And instead, they had switched roles.
>
> Disk0 E: Healthy (System)
> Disk1 C: Healthy (Pagefile)
>
> So what's happened is, the system should have booted from Disk0.
> And it did. But, when it did, two things happened. It decided the
> other disk had C:\pagefile.sys (which it does). And then it changes the
> system drive letter to E: ! At this point, no pagefile.sys was
> deleted.
>
> If I delete pagefile.sys from E:, nothing happens, because it's
> still pointed at Disk1 C:. I can still boot, because both disks
> are still present, and the pagefile.sys on the so-called C: is
> still available.
>
> OK, now, remove Disk1 and try to run with Disk0. BOom. Now,
> we're in that pagefile error message loop.
>
> And basically, nothing I did would fix it. I tried changing
> the registry, by editing SYSTEM with a hex editor, and changing
> that registry entry. (Hmmm. It occurs to me, there are three
> similar keys, and maybe I edited the wrong one. Mumble...)
>
> My conclusion at the moment is, if you were to put back the
> disks that were present when the "ole switcheroo" was pulled,
> then the Win2K system would boot. It would look like my mess,
> with C: having become E: and E: changing to C:. You should put the
> disks back on the same cables they used originally.
>
> So there are actually two variables involved. There is the
> registry entry that keeps track of system drive letter.
> And also the registry entry that keeps the pagefile strings.
> In fact, the pagefile registry entry isn't changing. It's the
> fact the drive letters have changed, that screws things up.
> And between the two of those, you have to get things aligned
> so the system can find the pagefile.
>
> Maybe this situation arises, when a person clones Win2K, and
> both disks with their copy of Win2K remain present, for the very
> first boot of the clone. Then the drive letter mess happens
> and so on. And then, disconnecting the second disk, and trying
> to boot with only one of the two disks present, makes it
> painfully obvious that the pagefile is missing as far
> as the system is concerned.
>
> Paul

Because I could easily get Acronis to create that mess, i tried
changing drive letters, and found it impossible to change drive letters
on the boot drive, AND on the system drive (that would be C: and E: or
your sample).
Now Acronis without any by-your-leave scrambles dive letters which
virtually guarantees the _possiblity_ of a problem.
The problem is made real if one leaves both drives connected and
re-boots.
The problem is NOT created if one POWERS DOWN the computer at the end
of the clone process (and removes 2nd drive; i think this step not
necessary, as re-inserting for a 2-drive state seems to make no problem).


 
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