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Something wrong with the Fuji X-Pro 1 test on Dpreview

 
 
RichA
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      06-29-2012
On Jun 29, 6:28*am, Bruce <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> RichA <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> >On Jun 29, 12:45*am, Me <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> >> On 29/06/2012 3:19 p.m., Savageduck wrote:
> >> > On 2012-06-28 20:09:33 -0700, RichA <(E-Mail Removed)> said:

>
> >> >> On Jun 28, 11:08 pm, Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
> >> >> wrote:
> >> >>> On 2012-06-28 19:52:21 -0700, RichA <(E-Mail Removed)> said:

>
> >> >>>> Move the little square over the image (the Queen's face near *the
> >> >>>> centre) and look at it. *Use whatever ISO you like raw or jpeg.*Wh
> >> >> at
> >> >>>> is with the big yellow diagonal streaks going across the face? *It's
> >> >>>> either near absent or absent in other camera images. *I know the Fuji
> >> >>>> doesn't have an AA filter and it has an unusual sensor, so could it be
> >> >>>> some kind of moire?

>
> >> >>> I don't see what yellow streaks you are referring too in the Fuji image.
> >> >>> I zoomed in on the upper face of the queen of hearts, Nothing.
> >> >>> Then I checked the lower face, again nothing.

>
> >> >>> --
> >> >>> Regards,

>
> >> >>> Savageduck

>
> >> >>http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/fujifilm-x-pro1/25

>
> >> > Yup! that was the page I checked. The only yellow I see is the yellow in
> >> > the card design, no streaks in either of the Queen faces.
> >> > I even checked my display calibration, and still have no yellow streak.

>
> >> I think he means the statue like image of the queen, not the card. *And
> >> yes, it looks like some kind of moire effect to me.
> >> But perhaps not due the weird sensor, as exactly the same kind of
> >> yellowish banding can be seen on the roman (?) chap to the left of the
> >> queen in the Sony NEX 7 Image.

>
> >> Rich must spend an awful lot of time going through these samples on
> >> DPReview to find this stuff.

>
> >No, I mean the Canadian money image. *I'll check it on another
> >computer to be sure. *It didn't take long to see. *In that scene, I
> >usually look at the money and the clock.

>
> I agree the yellow banding is clearly visible on the Queen's image
> from a banknote.
>
> However, if you read the text on the same page, the reviewer suggests
> that processing the image in Adobe Camera Raw may be sub-optimal:
>
> "Using our standard processing, with Adobe Camera Raw's noise
> reduction set to a minimum, the X-Pro1's images look distinctly
> different to those from Bayer sensor cameras, and specifically show
> much lower chroma noise. This means that direct comparisons have to be
> treated with caution; in effect the demosaicing required by the
> X-Trans CMOS sensor includes a degree of chroma NR. ACR also shows
> processing artefacts in various areas of the image, and can't match
> the camera's JPEGs in rendering some of the very finest detail, for
> example on the banknotes."


Kind of odd that it manifests as a geometric pattern instead of random
"noise" but I guess anything is possible?
 
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RichA
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Posts: n/a
 
      06-29-2012
On Jun 29, 2:38*am, Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:
> On 2012-06-28 23:05:45 -0700, Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>said:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > On 2012-06-28 22:21:42 -0700, RichA <(E-Mail Removed)> said:

>
> >> On Jun 28, 11:19*pm, Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>> On 2012-06-28 20:09:33 -0700, RichA <(E-Mail Removed)> said:

>
> >>>> On Jun 28, 11:08 pm, Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>> On 2012-06-28 19:52:21 -0700, RichA <(E-Mail Removed)> said:

>
> >>>>>> Move the little square over the image (the Queen's face near the
> >>>>>> centre) and look at it. Use whatever ISO you like raw or jpeg. Wh
> >>>> at
> >>>>>> is with the big yellow diagonal streaks going across the face? It's
> >>>>>> either near absent or absent in other camera images. I know the Fuji
> >>>>>> doesn't have an AA filter and it has an unusual sensor, so could it b
> >> e
> >>>>>> some kind of moire?

>
> >>>>> I don't see what yellow streaks you are referring too in the Fuji imag
> >> e.
> >>>>> I zoomed in on the upper face of the queen of hearts, Nothing.
> >>>>> Then I checked the lower face, again nothing.

>
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> Regards,

>
> >>>>> Savageduck

>
> >>>>http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/fujifilm-x-pro1/25

>
> >>> Yup! that was the page I checked. The only yellow I see is the yellow
> >>> in the card design, no streaks in either of the Queen faces.
> >>> I even checked my display calibration, and still have no yellow streak.

>
> >>> --
> >>> Regards,

>
> >>> Savageduck

>
> >> I cropped the image out. *This is a piece of the JPEG image, the RAW
> >> shows it too, at 200-1600 ISO anyway.

>
> >> Now, *the yellow bands run diagonally from left top to right bottom,
> >> across the hair and face. *They appear (depending on your monitor
> >> size) about 1cm wide.

>
> >>http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm/image/144390852

>
> > When you said Queen, the only Queen I could readily ID was the Queen ofHearts.

>
> > Looking at the image on the bank note I see the image of a woman, but I
> > can't ID her as any Queen of England I am familiar with. Are you sure
> > that is a Canadian bank note? It certainly isn't Vicky or Liz-2 at any
> > age. The choker type medallion is not the sort of thing the current
> > resident of the throne would typically decorate herself with. I would
> > suggest some other Victorian/Edwardian era female. I first thought
> > perhaps Marie Curie, but she is not a match.

>
> > That said there is certainly a yellow tint in what I believe is an
> > anti-counterfeiting feature of that particular note. I can see it in
> > all the images. I don't believe the yellow is going to disappear in any
> > test image.

>
> Damn! I am a researching fool!
>
> The bank note is not Canadian, and the image is not a Queen, but an
> educator. It is a 1000 Lira bank of Italy note honoring Maria
> Montessori.
>


Ha ha ha! That I did not realize!
 
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RichA
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Posts: n/a
 
      06-29-2012
On Jun 29, 8:26*am, Whisky-dave <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> On Friday, June 29, 2012 6:08:38 AM UTC+1, RichA wrote:
> > , I
> > usually look at the money and the clock.

>
> Makes you sound like a Prostitute *


For that, I'd have to be working for Dpreview.
 
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RichA
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Posts: n/a
 
      06-29-2012
On Jun 29, 6:28*am, Bruce <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> RichA <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> >On Jun 29, 12:45*am, Me <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> >> On 29/06/2012 3:19 p.m., Savageduck wrote:
> >> > On 2012-06-28 20:09:33 -0700, RichA <(E-Mail Removed)> said:

>
> >> >> On Jun 28, 11:08 pm, Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
> >> >> wrote:
> >> >>> On 2012-06-28 19:52:21 -0700, RichA <(E-Mail Removed)> said:

>
> >> >>>> Move the little square over the image (the Queen's face near *the
> >> >>>> centre) and look at it. *Use whatever ISO you like raw or jpeg.*Wh
> >> >> at
> >> >>>> is with the big yellow diagonal streaks going across the face? *It's
> >> >>>> either near absent or absent in other camera images. *I know the Fuji
> >> >>>> doesn't have an AA filter and it has an unusual sensor, so could it be
> >> >>>> some kind of moire?

>
> >> >>> I don't see what yellow streaks you are referring too in the Fuji image.
> >> >>> I zoomed in on the upper face of the queen of hearts, Nothing.
> >> >>> Then I checked the lower face, again nothing.

>
> >> >>> --
> >> >>> Regards,

>
> >> >>> Savageduck

>
> >> >>http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/fujifilm-x-pro1/25

>
> >> > Yup! that was the page I checked. The only yellow I see is the yellow in
> >> > the card design, no streaks in either of the Queen faces.
> >> > I even checked my display calibration, and still have no yellow streak.

>
> >> I think he means the statue like image of the queen, not the card. *And
> >> yes, it looks like some kind of moire effect to me.
> >> But perhaps not due the weird sensor, as exactly the same kind of
> >> yellowish banding can be seen on the roman (?) chap to the left of the
> >> queen in the Sony NEX 7 Image.

>
> >> Rich must spend an awful lot of time going through these samples on
> >> DPReview to find this stuff.

>
> >No, I mean the Canadian money image. *I'll check it on another
> >computer to be sure. *It didn't take long to see. *In that scene, I
> >usually look at the money and the clock.

>
> I agree the yellow banding is clearly visible on the Queen's image
> from a banknote.
>
> However, if you read the text on the same page, the reviewer suggests
> that processing the image in Adobe Camera Raw may be sub-optimal:
>
> "Using our standard processing, with Adobe Camera Raw's noise
> reduction set to a minimum, the X-Pro1's images look distinctly
> different to those from Bayer sensor cameras, and specifically show
> much lower chroma noise. This means that direct comparisons have to be
> treated with caution; in effect the demosaicing required by the
> X-Trans CMOS sensor includes a degree of chroma NR. ACR also shows
> processing artefacts in various areas of the image, and can't match
> the camera's JPEGs in rendering some of the very finest detail, for
> example on the banknotes."


Anyway, I tried a number of other cameras on that comparison tool,
didn't see the same effect. I guess the users of Fuji are going to
have to experiment a lot with other raw processors.
 
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tony cooper
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Posts: n/a
 
      06-29-2012
On Thu, 28 Jun 2012 23:38:26 -0700, Savageduck
<savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:

>On 2012-06-28 23:05:45 -0700, Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> said:
>
>> On 2012-06-28 22:21:42 -0700, RichA <(E-Mail Removed)> said:
>>
>>> On Jun 28, 11:19*pm, Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>> On 2012-06-28 20:09:33 -0700, RichA <(E-Mail Removed)> said:
>>>>
>>>>> On Jun 28, 11:08 pm, Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> On 2012-06-28 19:52:21 -0700, RichA <(E-Mail Removed)> said:
>>>>
>>>>>>> Move the little square over the image (the Queen's face near the
>>>>>>> centre) and look at it. Use whatever ISO you like raw or jpeg. Wh
>>>>> at
>>>>>>> is with the big yellow diagonal streaks going across the face? It's
>>>>>>> either near absent or absent in other camera images. I know the Fuji
>>>>>>> doesn't have an AA filter and it has an unusual sensor, so could it b
>>> e
>>>>>>> some kind of moire?
>>>>
>>>>>> I don't see what yellow streaks you are referring too in the Fuji imag
>>> e.
>>>>>> I zoomed in on the upper face of the queen of hearts, Nothing.
>>>>>> Then I checked the lower face, again nothing.
>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>>>> Savageduck
>>>>
>>>>> http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/fujifilm-x-pro1/25
>>>>
>>>> Yup! that was the page I checked. The only yellow I see is the yellow
>>>> in the card design, no streaks in either of the Queen faces.
>>>> I even checked my display calibration, and still have no yellow streak.
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Savageduck
>>>
>>> I cropped the image out. This is a piece of the JPEG image, the RAW
>>> shows it too, at 200-1600 ISO anyway.
>>>
>>> Now, the yellow bands run diagonally from left top to right bottom,
>>> across the hair and face. They appear (depending on your monitor
>>> size) about 1cm wide.
>>>
>>> http://www.pbase.com/andersonrm/image/144390852

>>
>> When you said Queen, the only Queen I could readily ID was the Queen of Hearts.
>>
>> Looking at the image on the bank note I see the image of a woman, but I
>> can't ID her as any Queen of England I am familiar with. Are you sure
>> that is a Canadian bank note? It certainly isn't Vicky or Liz-2 at any
>> age. The choker type medallion is not the sort of thing the current
>> resident of the throne would typically decorate herself with. I would
>> suggest some other Victorian/Edwardian era female. I first thought
>> perhaps Marie Curie, but she is not a match.
>>
>> That said there is certainly a yellow tint in what I believe is an
>> anti-counterfeiting feature of that particular note. I can see it in
>> all the images. I don't believe the yellow is going to disappear in any
>> test image.

>
>Damn! I am a researching fool!
>
>The bank note is not Canadian, and the image is not a Queen, but an
>educator. It is a 1000 Lira bank of Italy note honoring Maria
>Montessori.
>

I did some Google snooping before I read this (using Gio Pino as a
search term) and found the 1,000 note too. Maria was the first woman
in Italy to qualify as a physician. The back of the note honors
teachers with a more modern image.

http://www.banknotebank.com/note/932592

Maria seems to have contracted jaundice.

I would have said that saying Maria was an educator was wrong, but
Floyd would consider that a "profession flame", and we don't want to
stir Floyd up, do we?


--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
 
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David J Taylor
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      06-29-2012
"Me" wrote in message news:jsjfts$osu$(E-Mail Removed)...
[]
He looked roman to me - who the hell is that guy? Has there ever been a
famous Canadian?
===============================

The Villeneuve racing drivers, perhaps?
 
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Bruce
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      06-29-2012
RichA <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>On Jun 29, 6:28*am, Bruce <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>> However, if you read the text on the same page, the reviewer suggests
>> that processing the image in Adobe Camera Raw may be sub-optimal:
>>
>> "Using our standard processing, with Adobe Camera Raw's noise
>> reduction set to a minimum, the X-Pro1's images look distinctly
>> different to those from Bayer sensor cameras, and specifically show
>> much lower chroma noise. This means that direct comparisons have to be
>> treated with caution; in effect the demosaicing required by the
>> X-Trans CMOS sensor includes a degree of chroma NR. ACR also shows
>> processing artefacts in various areas of the image, and can't match
>> the camera's JPEGs in rendering some of the very finest detail, for
>> example on the banknotes."

>
>Kind of odd that it manifests as a geometric pattern instead of random
>"noise" but I guess anything is possible?



Read carefully the quoted text ...

 
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Joe Kotroczo
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Posts: n/a
 
      06-29-2012
On 29/06/2012 14:47, David J Taylor wrote:
> "Me" wrote in message news:jsjfts$osu$(E-Mail Removed)...
> []
> He looked roman to me - who the hell is that guy? Has there ever been a
> famous Canadian?
> ===============================
>
> The Villeneuve racing drivers, perhaps?


Dan Aykroyd
Keanu Reeves
Leonard Cohen
Celine Dion
Alannis Morisette
Neil Young
Jim Carrey
Sarah McLachlan
Bryan Adams
Paul Anka
James Cameron
John Candy
Douglas Coupland
David Cronenberg
William Gibson
Joni Mitchell
Oscar Peterson
William Shatner

and so on...

--
Illegitimi non carborundum


 
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David J Taylor
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Posts: n/a
 
      06-30-2012
"Joe Kotroczo" wrote in message news:(E-Mail Removed)...

On 29/06/2012 14:47, David J Taylor wrote:
> "Me" wrote in message news:jsjfts$osu$(E-Mail Removed)...
> []
> He looked roman to me - who the hell is that guy? Has there ever been a
> famous Canadian?
> ===============================
>
> The Villeneuve racing drivers, perhaps?


Dan Aykroyd
Keanu Reeves
Leonard Cohen
Celine Dion
Alannis Morisette
Neil Young
Jim Carrey
Sarah McLachlan
Bryan Adams
Paul Anka
James Cameron
John Candy
Douglas Coupland
David Cronenberg
William Gibson
Joni Mitchell
Oscar Peterson
William Shatner

and so on...
==========================

Yes, I've heard of five of those, so it's more than just Giles and Jacques!
(I no longer take an interest in "pop" and have little interest in films.)

Thanks,
David

 
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Robert Coe
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      06-30-2012
On Fri, 29 Jun 2012 20:20:56 +1200, Apteryx <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
: On 29/06/2012 5:54 p.m., Me wrote:
:
: > He looked roman to me - who the hell is that guy? Has there ever been a
: > famous Canadian?
:
: William Shatner

Wayne Gretzky

Bob
 
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