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Comprehensive comparison of Micro 4/3 "families"

 
 
David Dyer-Bennet
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      06-01-2012
Wolfgang Weisselberg <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:

> C. Neil Ellwood <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>> On Wed, 30 May 2012 15:16:49 -0500, David Dyer-Bennet wrote:

>
>>> Many of the telephotos I most value do not come in IS versions. It's
>>> fine if I'm buying super-telephotos for wildlife (at 4- and 5-figure
>>> prices), but 85, 105, and 135 lenses tend not to have it. Even prime
>>> 200mm lenses tend not to.

>
>> Canon have a 200mm IS lens it has a max aperture of f2.0 and your wallet
>> will wince if you show it - 73499.99 rrp.

>
> Does it work with EOS FF cameras?


Yes, of course. (Well, it says it does.)
--
David Dyer-Bennet, http://www.velocityreviews.com/forums/(E-Mail Removed); http://dd-b.net/
Snapshots: http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/
Photos: http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/
Dragaera: http://dragaera.info
 
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David Dyer-Bennet
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      06-01-2012
Wolfgang Weisselberg <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:

> Paul Ciszek <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>> I have been assuming that a 300mm (600mm equivalent) would be used only
>> with a tripod; is IS really good enough to use a telephoto like that
>> handheld?

>
> The usual rule of 1/f (35mm) seconds yields 1/600s. As far as
> I know this rule of thumb (which is accurate only to 1 stop)
> tends to fail at long lenses, which need faster times. So let's
> say 1/1500s.
>
> With an IS of 3-4 stops gain (and for once the gain seems to be
> an understatement) you'd get 1/200s or 1/100s, which at ISO 100
> and f/8 (you probably want to stop down a bit) means LV 13-14.
> That's enough for anything in a cloudy-bright daylight to
> noon-to-afternoon sun (not overcast, not in the shade), or if
> you shoot the moon, a 3/4 to full moon.
>
> Raise the ISO to 400 and you can probably work even when the
> subject is in open shade (and the sun shines) or when it's
> bright-overcast. (If ISO 400's noise free enough for you is
> the other question.)


If you're buying the super-teles, there's no excuse not having a body
that lets you use ISO 400 .

> So yes, there are conditions when handheld shooting --- given
> proper technique for framing and the like --- is possible.


I shot a lot handheld at the zoo today, as I said. ISOs up to 3200, but
on the D700 that's easily tolerable.
--
David Dyer-Bennet, (E-Mail Removed); http://dd-b.net/
Snapshots: http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/
Photos: http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/
Dragaera: http://dragaera.info
 
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David J Taylor
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      06-01-2012
> Not that I get anywhere NEAR 4 stops gain consistently. 1/40s at
> 200mm-e works for me nearly as often without IS as with.
>
> I did spend a few hours at the zoo today, shooting exclusively with the
> 120-400, sometimes on a tripod and sometimes handheld (depending mostly
> on the subject movement). I sometimes got over a stop of benefit from
> the IS, it looks like.
> --
> David Dyer-Bennet, (E-Mail Removed); http://dd-b.net/


A few sites have measured gain through VR/IS, but I don't know whether
there is an industry standard measurement. I rather suspect not. If you
are a stable lens holder, as it seems, then you may well get less gain.
It seems that you technique alone provides a couple of stops. I also
found this when shooting 35mm film, that I could go well under "1 / focal
length" without problems. Mind you, I wasn't doing large prints then, but
slide projection onto a large screen.

As I mentioned before, having the image be more stable in the viewfinder
(under windy or other adverse conditions) is a major improvement through
VR/IS for me, and having the image more stable on the focus and exposure
sensors can't be a bad thing either.

Cheers,
David

 
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Wolfgang Weisselberg
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      06-04-2012
Alfred Molon <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> In article <(E-Mail Removed)>, David Dyer-Bennet says...
>> I shot a lot handheld at the zoo today, as I said. ISOs up to 3200, but
>> on the D700 that's easily tolerable.


> I've noticed that high ISO shooting in bright daylight is less noisy
> than in low light conditions. Another reason why the noise is more
> tolerable.


Try high ISO once high-key and once low-key with the identical
bright daylight and again with the low light conditions.

You'll probably find that shadows are noisy and that the blue
channel is more noisy if you use incancescent light. Neither has
direct impact with daylight versus low light.

-Wolfgang
 
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Wolfgang Weisselberg
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      06-04-2012
David Dyer-Bennet <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> Wolfgang Weisselberg <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:
>> C. Neil Ellwood <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>> On Wed, 30 May 2012 15:16:49 -0500, David Dyer-Bennet wrote:


>>>> Many of the telephotos I most value do not come in IS versions. It's
>>>> fine if I'm buying super-telephotos for wildlife (at 4- and 5-figure
>>>> prices), but 85, 105, and 135 lenses tend not to have it. Even prime
>>>> 200mm lenses tend not to.


>>> Canon have a 200mm IS lens it has a max aperture of f2.0 and your wallet
>>> will wince if you show it - £73499.99 rrp.


>> Does it work with EOS FF cameras?


> Yes, of course. (Well, it says it does.)


And that costs £73k? 3k or 5k, OK, but it's not the 1200mm ...
The price sounds like a TV or at least video lens ...

-Wolfgang
 
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David Dyer-Bennet
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      06-04-2012
Wolfgang Weisselberg <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:

> Alfred Molon <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>> In article <(E-Mail Removed)>, David Dyer-Bennet says...
>>> I shot a lot handheld at the zoo today, as I said. ISOs up to 3200, but
>>> on the D700 that's easily tolerable.

>
>> I've noticed that high ISO shooting in bright daylight is less noisy
>> than in low light conditions. Another reason why the noise is more
>> tolerable.

>
> Try high ISO once high-key and once low-key with the identical
> bright daylight and again with the low light conditions.
>
> You'll probably find that shadows are noisy and that the blue
> channel is more noisy if you use incancescent light. Neither has
> direct impact with daylight versus low light.


Yep, that's certainly my experience.
--
David Dyer-Bennet, (E-Mail Removed); http://dd-b.net/
Snapshots: http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/
Photos: http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/
Dragaera: http://dragaera.info
 
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David Dyer-Bennet
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      06-04-2012
Wolfgang Weisselberg <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:

> David Dyer-Bennet <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>> Wolfgang Weisselberg <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:
>>> C. Neil Ellwood <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 30 May 2012 15:16:49 -0500, David Dyer-Bennet wrote:

>
>>>>> Many of the telephotos I most value do not come in IS versions. It's
>>>>> fine if I'm buying super-telephotos for wildlife (at 4- and 5-figure
>>>>> prices), but 85, 105, and 135 lenses tend not to have it. Even prime
>>>>> 200mm lenses tend not to.

>
>>>> Canon have a 200mm IS lens it has a max aperture of f2.0 and your wallet
>>>> will wince if you show it - 73499.99 rrp.

>
>>> Does it work with EOS FF cameras?

>
>> Yes, of course. (Well, it says it does.)

>
> And that costs 73k? 3k or 5k, OK, but it's not the 1200mm ...
> The price sounds like a TV or at least video lens ...


I think it's the units -- RRP. I'ts USD 6000 at B&H.
--
David Dyer-Bennet, (E-Mail Removed); http://dd-b.net/
Snapshots: http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/
Photos: http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/
Dragaera: http://dragaera.info
 
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Wolfgang Weisselberg
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      06-07-2012
David Dyer-Bennet <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> Wolfgang Weisselberg <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:
>> David Dyer-Bennet <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>> Wolfgang Weisselberg <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:
>>>> C. Neil Ellwood <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>>>> On Wed, 30 May 2012 15:16:49 -0500, David Dyer-Bennet wrote:


>>>>> Canon have a 200mm IS lens it has a max aperture of f2.0 and your wallet
>>>>> will wince if you show it - £73499.99 rrp.


>>>> Does it work with EOS FF cameras?


>>> Yes, of course. (Well, it says it does.)


>> And that costs £73k? 3k or 5k, OK, but it's not the 1200mm ...
>> The price sounds like a TV or at least video lens ...


> I think it's the units -- RRP. I'ts USD 6000 at B&H.


Recommended Retail Price well over ten times higher than the
street price? Really??

-Wolfgang
 
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David Dyer-Bennet
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      06-08-2012
Wolfgang Weisselberg <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:

> David Dyer-Bennet <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>> Wolfgang Weisselberg <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:
>>> David Dyer-Bennet <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>>> Wolfgang Weisselberg <(E-Mail Removed)> writes:
>>>>> C. Neil Ellwood <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>>>>> On Wed, 30 May 2012 15:16:49 -0500, David Dyer-Bennet wrote:

>
>>>>>> Canon have a 200mm IS lens it has a max aperture of f2.0 and your wallet
>>>>>> will wince if you show it - 73499.99 rrp.

>
>>>>> Does it work with EOS FF cameras?

>
>>>> Yes, of course. (Well, it says it does.)

>
>>> And that costs 73k? 3k or 5k, OK, but it's not the 1200mm ...
>>> The price sounds like a TV or at least video lens ...

>
>> I think it's the units -- RRP. I'ts USD 6000 at B&H.

>
> Recommended Retail Price well over ten times higher than the
> street price? Really??


Okay, never occurred to me that's what RRP might mean (the usual term is
MSRP, Manufacturer Suggested Retail Price). I thought it was a foreign
currency identifier; though now that I look, I can't find one by that
name.
--
David Dyer-Bennet, (E-Mail Removed); http://dd-b.net/
Snapshots: http://dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/data/
Photos: http://dd-b.net/photography/gallery/
Dragaera: http://dragaera.info
 
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