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Lew
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      04-29-2012
On 04/28/2012 03:06 PM, Daniel Pitts wrote:
> On 4/28/12 3:06 AM, Peter Cheung wrote:
>> I use Jigloo plugins to generate UI code, I am happy with that plugin and
>> its generated code, so I would like to stay with it. thanks

>
> I read that as "I have no idea what I'm really doing, and I'm happy with that."
>
> God help me if I ever become that willfully ignorant.


It seems unlikely in your case.

Peter, Daniel raises an important point that will help you if you take it. The
art of programming requires learning, and not superstition. If you don't know
what Jigloo does, and others have pointed out that it isn't working, then you
are helpless and powerless.

You also completely avoid the issue of the lack of documentation, the
plagiarism which turns out not even to be necessary in the first place, and
the general lack of utility of the project. These are serious issues, and
resolving them will go a long way to making you a good programmer.

Refusing to resolve them, and taking the sort of negative attitude towards the
universal advice you're receiving, are bad habits and will destroy your
capabilities.

Just sayin' ...

--
Lew
Honi soit qui mal y pense.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi.../c/cf/Friz.jpg
 
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Peter Cheung
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      04-29-2012
Lew於 2012年4月29日星期日UTC+8下午12時08分46 寫道:
> On 04/28/2012 03:06 PM, Daniel Pitts wrote:
> > On 4/28/12 3:06 AM, Peter Cheung wrote:
> >> I use Jigloo plugins to generate UI code, I am happy with that plugin and
> >> its generated code, so I would like to stay with it. thanks

> >
> > I read that as "I have no idea what I'm really doing, and I'm happy with that."
> >
> > God help me if I ever become that willfully ignorant.

>
> It seems unlikely in your case.
>
> Peter, Daniel raises an important point that will help you if you take it.. The
> art of programming requires learning, and not superstition. If you don't know
> what Jigloo does, and others have pointed out that it isn't working, thenyou
> are helpless and powerless.
>
> You also completely avoid the issue of the lack of documentation, the
> plagiarism which turns out not even to be necessary in the first place, and
> the general lack of utility of the project. These are serious issues, and
> resolving them will go a long way to making you a good programmer.
>
> Refusing to resolve them, and taking the sort of negative attitude towards the
> universal advice you're receiving, are bad habits and will destroy your
> capabilities.
>
> Just sayin' ...
>
> --
> Lew
> Honi soit qui mal y pense.
> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi.../c/cf/Friz.jpg


Thanks, let me finish my project first.
 
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Peter Cheung
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      04-29-2012
Peter Cheung於 2012年4月29日星期日UTC+8下午3時13分55秒 寫道:
> Lew於 2012年4月29日星期日UTC+8下午12時08分46 寫道:
> > On 04/28/2012 03:06 PM, Daniel Pitts wrote:
> > > On 4/28/12 3:06 AM, Peter Cheung wrote:
> > >> I use Jigloo plugins to generate UI code, I am happy with that plugin and
> > >> its generated code, so I would like to stay with it. thanks
> > >
> > > I read that as "I have no idea what I'm really doing, and I'm happy with that."
> > >
> > > God help me if I ever become that willfully ignorant.

> >
> > It seems unlikely in your case.
> >
> > Peter, Daniel raises an important point that will help you if you take it. The
> > art of programming requires learning, and not superstition. If you don't know
> > what Jigloo does, and others have pointed out that it isn't working, then you
> > are helpless and powerless.
> >
> > You also completely avoid the issue of the lack of documentation, the
> > plagiarism which turns out not even to be necessary in the first place,and
> > the general lack of utility of the project. These are serious issues, and
> > resolving them will go a long way to making you a good programmer.
> >
> > Refusing to resolve them, and taking the sort of negative attitude towards the
> > universal advice you're receiving, are bad habits and will destroy your
> > capabilities.
> >
> > Just sayin' ...
> >
> > --
> > Lew
> > Honi soit qui mal y pense.
> > http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi.../c/cf/Friz.jpg

>
> Thanks, let me finish my project first.


why people in the forum look like angering something on me?
 
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Lew
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      04-29-2012
Peter Cheung wrote:
> why people in the forum look like angering something on me?


There are several reasons, and it's a fair question.

In the first place, I doubt that anyone is actually angry with you. There is a
difference between harshness and anger, although few people pay attention to
the difference. You have triggered some harsh reactions, but people really are
trying to impart information to help you. The thing you do right is to engage
with the conversation, to keep responding to people and trying to understand.
As long as you do that no one should actually be angry with you.

What people have been telling you is important information. There are high
standards to professional programming, and they are rigorous. Early on you
showed some resistance to the information people gave you. This is especially
important in the area of ethics, which you violated. Besides that, you did not
respond to the comments regarding engineering flaws in your code. Your
responses to other comments, namely the lack of Javadocs and a build script,
were dismissive and constituted little more than, "I'm not doing that." We
know you're not doing that, we pointed out that you're not doing that. More
importantly we pointed out that you should be doing that, advice that you
ignore at your own cost.

Basically you have not shown interest in the wisdom and expertise that the
several very smart and knowledgeable people like Patricia Shanahan, Daniel
Pitts, markspace and Arne Vajhøj, to name a few, have shared. You don't give
reasons or logic for your decisions. You seem unaware and uninterested in
respect for copyrights. Instead of taking coding advice, you say, "Let me
finish my project," indicating that you are going to follow bad code with even
more bad code.

So people aren't so much angry with you as contemptuous of your behavior. Not
of you, necessarily - I cannot imagine Ms. Dr. Shanahan showing less than
exquisite courtesy and respect to any human being, for example - but certainly
of actions that will harm your ability to put together good software.

It's not good to be emotional or defensive about one's work in this business.
The results have to work, and work in accordance with expectations. That is
what it is beyond all wishing or superstition or resistance to brutally honest
advice. Take the advice - respect for your behavior is far less important than
success in software development. Following the advice of those wiser in this
arena will lead to both.

--
Lew
Honi soit qui mal y pense.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi.../c/cf/Friz.jpg
 
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Peter Cheung
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      04-29-2012
Lew於 2012年4月29日星期日UTC+8下午4時56分50秒 寫道:
> Peter Cheung wrote:
> > why people in the forum look like angering something on me?

>
> There are several reasons, and it's a fair question.
>
> In the first place, I doubt that anyone is actually angry with you. Thereis a
> difference between harshness and anger, although few people pay attentionto
> the difference. You have triggered some harsh reactions, but people really are
> trying to impart information to help you. The thing you do right is to engage
> with the conversation, to keep responding to people and trying to understand.
> As long as you do that no one should actually be angry with you.


I cannot really identify harshness/anger from english text, english is not my first language.

>
> What people have been telling you is important information. There are high
> standards to professional programming, and they are rigorous. Early on you
> showed some resistance to the information people gave you. This is especially
> important in the area of ethics, which you violated. Besides that, you did not
> respond to the comments regarding engineering flaws in your code. Your
> responses to other comments, namely the lack of Javadocs and a build script,
> were dismissive and constituted little more than, "I'm not doing that." We
> know you're not doing that, we pointed out that you're not doing that. More
> importantly we pointed out that you should be doing that, advice that you
> ignore at your own cost.


There is only one developer to develop peter-swing, yes, its me. The primary goal for peter-swing is to make a new theme for my other project http://code.google.com/p/peter-bochs/ . If it is working, i don't want to spend time on writing comment, i would like to spend time on peter-bochs rather.

I really don't need a build script, because eclipse can build. Eclipse can build a executable jar, it is enough for me. I don't know how hurt is my sentence "I'm not doing that", but in chinese, that sentence is not a offensive sentence.
But the words "Wow, shame on you, Peter", it is very offensive in my point of view.

>
> Basically you have not shown interest in the wisdom and expertise that the
> several very smart and knowledgeable people like Patricia Shanahan, Daniel
> Pitts, markspace and Arne Vajhøj, to name a few, have shared. You don't give
> reasons or logic for your decisions. You seem unaware and uninterested in
> respect for copyrights. Instead of taking coding advice, you say, "Let me
> finish my project," indicating that you are going to follow bad code witheven
> more bad code.


I create components and theme for people use, that is the only wisdom i have in peter-swing project. If you think peter-swing project is bad enough, just leave it.
I really didn't steal somebody code, The class metalbump in my project, actually I don't use it. I have removed it.

>
> So people aren't so much angry with you as contemptuous of your behavior.Not
> of you, necessarily - I cannot imagine Ms. Dr. Shanahan showing less than
> exquisite courtesy and respect to any human being, for example - but certainly
> of actions that will harm your ability to put together good software.
>
> It's not good to be emotional or defensive about one's work in this business.
> The results have to work, and work in accordance with expectations. That is
> what it is beyond all wishing or superstition or resistance to brutally honest
> advice. Take the advice - respect for your behavior is far less importantthan
> success in software development. Following the advice of those wiser in this
> arena will lead to both.
>
> --
> Lew
> Honi soit qui mal y pense.
> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi.../c/cf/Friz.jpg


 
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Lew
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      04-29-2012
Peter Cheung wrote:
> There is only one developer to develop peter-swing, yes, its me.
>The primary goal for peter-swing is to make a new theme for my other project

...
>If it is working, i don't want to spend time on writing comment,
> i would like to spend time on peter-bochs rather.


And yet you told the public about it.

Do you steal code for your other project, too?

Why did you feel the need to copy a class that was already present anyway?
I've asked this question several times and you've *never* answered.

> I really don't need a build script, because eclipse can build. Eclipse can build a executable jar, it is enough for me. I don't know how hurt is my sentence "I'm not doing that", but in chinese, that sentence is not a offensive sentence.
> But the words "Wow, shame on you, Peter", it is very offensive in my point of view.


If you think you are wiser than everyone who's answered you here to where you
can reject our advice out of hand, that's fine, but understand that the odds
are against that judgment.

As for being offended, get over yourself. We're here to make each other a
better programmer, and nobody has insulted you here, so leave your ego out of
it. Besides, if anyone in this discussion has offered offense it's been you
for dismissing our advice, failing to respond to our question, avoiding
responsibility, and resorting to acting aggrieved when the appropriate
response should have been dispassionate. If you earn the "Shame on you,
Peter", how is that offensive? You have done things that deserve the
criticism, objectively deserve it, and shown no sign whatsoever of remorse for
it. You should be ashamed of those behaviors. So rather than be offended, you
should be grateful for the honesty and respect that people have shown in
giving you the truth.

Take the advice offered here, and do not be a namby-pamby.

--
Lew
Honi soit qui mal y pense.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi.../c/cf/Friz.jpg
 
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Arne Vajhøj
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      05-05-2012
On 4/29/2012 3:31 AM, Peter Cheung wrote:
> Peter Cheung於 2012年4月29日星期日UTC+8下午3時13分55秒 寫道:
>> Lew於 2012年4月29日星期日UTC+8下午12時08分46 寫道:
>>> On 04/28/2012 03:06 PM, Daniel Pitts wrote:
>>>> On 4/28/12 3:06 AM, Peter Cheung wrote:
>>>>> I use Jigloo plugins to generate UI code, I am happy with that plugin and
>>>>> its generated code, so I would like to stay with it. thanks
>>>>
>>>> I read that as "I have no idea what I'm really doing, and I'm happy with that."
>>>>
>>>> God help me if I ever become that willfully ignorant.
>>>
>>> It seems unlikely in your case.
>>>
>>> Peter, Daniel raises an important point that will help you if you take it. The
>>> art of programming requires learning, and not superstition. If you don't know
>>> what Jigloo does, and others have pointed out that it isn't working, then you
>>> are helpless and powerless.
>>>
>>> You also completely avoid the issue of the lack of documentation, the
>>> plagiarism which turns out not even to be necessary in the first place, and
>>> the general lack of utility of the project. These are serious issues, and
>>> resolving them will go a long way to making you a good programmer.
>>>
>>> Refusing to resolve them, and taking the sort of negative attitude towards the
>>> universal advice you're receiving, are bad habits and will destroy your
>>> capabilities.
>>> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi.../c/cf/Friz.jpg

>>
>> Thanks, let me finish my project first.

>
> why people in the forum look like angering something on me?


Most developers do not like copyright violations.

Arne
 
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