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ANNC: qooxlisp 0.1: Driving Miss qooxdoo (from Common Lisp)

 
 
Kenneth Tilton
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      05-30-2010
qooxdoo + Common Lisp (+ Cells, a common lisp dataflow hack):
http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/qooxlisp/

Just a proof of concept so far, but includes a substantial starter example:
http://github.com/downloads/kennytil...apropos-kt.jpg

Discussion of the Lisp advantage here:
http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/q...sp-in-qooxlisp

Discussion of the Cells advantage is being written next and will appear
here:
http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/q...idetm-qooxlisp


kt

--
http://www.stuckonalgebra.com
"The best Algebra tutorial program I have seen... in a class by itself."
Macworld
 
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David Mark
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      05-30-2010
On May 30, 1:49*pm, Kenneth Tilton <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> qooxdoo + Common Lisp (+ Cells, a common lisp dataflow hack):
> * *http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/qooxlisp/


Qooxdoo + anything < 0; // true
 
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Roby Sadeli
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      05-30-2010
On May 31, 12:49*am, Kenneth Tilton <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> qooxdoo + Common Lisp (+ Cells, a common lisp dataflow hack):
> * *http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/qooxlisp/
>
> Just a proof of concept so far, but includes a substantial starter example:
> * *http://github.com/downloads/kennytil...apropos-kt.jpg
>
> Discussion of the Lisp advantage here:
> *http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/q...sp-in-qooxlisp
>
> Discussion of the Cells advantage is being written next and will appear
> here:
> *http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/q...idetm-qooxlisp
>
> kt
>
> --http://www.stuckonalgebra.com
> "The best Algebra tutorial program I have seen... in a class by itself."
> Macworld


Really cool stuff Mr. Tilton!
I have been reading your blog and noticed your interest in qooxdoo +
lisp.
I really hope your interest in qooxlisp doesn't wane anytime soon
since I
really want to see a complete framework that people can use. (+ great
docs
)

Btw, my Lisp knowledge is minimal and I have just learned how to
use cl-weblocks.
 
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Kenneth Tilton
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      05-30-2010
David Mark wrote:
> On May 30, 1:49 pm, Kenneth Tilton <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>> qooxdoo + Common Lisp (+ Cells, a common lisp dataflow hack):
>> http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/qooxlisp/

>
> Qooxdoo + anything < 0; // true


Dave! Whassup?!

I considered building a framework atop your stuff to make for much
lighter initial loads but needed a quick win. (and qooxdoo rocks for RIAs).

Maybe for my next effort, if you 'll do an LGPL license for it.

kt



--
http://www.stuckonalgebra.com
"The best Algebra tutorial program I have seen... in a class by itself."
Macworld
 
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David Mark
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Posts: n/a
 
      05-30-2010
On May 30, 3:35*pm, Kenneth Tilton <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> David Mark wrote:
> > On May 30, 1:49 pm, Kenneth Tilton <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> >> qooxdoo + Common Lisp (+ Cells, a common lisp dataflow hack):
> >> * *http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/qooxlisp/

>
> > Qooxdoo + anything < 0; // true

>
> Dave! Whassup?!


Oh, that's right. It's "Kenny" from a ways back. I should have made
the connection as AFAIK you were/are the only person on earth using
Qooxdoo.

>
> I considered building a framework atop your stuff to make for much
> lighter initial loads but needed a quick win.


Or perhaps the fleeting illusion of such? We went over this ad
nauseam. Qooxdoo is a bloated, outdated, over-engineered pile of
browser sniffing crap-ola (see also Dojo).

> (and qooxdoo rocks for RIAs).


Sucks, Kenny. Sucks for RIA's. Perhaps there was a breakdown in
communication?

>
> Maybe for my next effort, if you 'll do an LGPL license for it.


Last I checked it had an MIT license. That was the consensus choice.
I have no idea how that differs from an LGPL license and don't care to
find out. Use it or don't.
 
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Kenny
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      05-31-2010
David Mark wrote:
> On May 30, 3:35 pm, Kenneth Tilton <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>> David Mark wrote:
>>> On May 30, 1:49 pm, Kenneth Tilton <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>>> qooxdoo + Common Lisp (+ Cells, a common lisp dataflow hack):
>>>> http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/qooxlisp/
>>> Qooxdoo + anything < 0; // true

>> Dave! Whassup?!

>
> Oh, that's right. It's "Kenny" from a ways back. I should have made
> the connection as AFAIK you were/are the only person on earth using
> Qooxdoo.
>
>> I considered building a framework atop your stuff to make for much
>> lighter initial loads but needed a quick win.

>
> Or perhaps the fleeting illusion of such? We went over this ad
> nauseam. Qooxdoo is a bloated, outdated, over-engineered pile of
> browser sniffing crap-ola (see also Dojo).
>
>> (and qooxdoo rocks for RIAs).

>
> Sucks, Kenny. Sucks for RIA's. Perhaps there was a breakdown in
> communication?


I think it was a breakdown in parallel universes. In mine qooxdoo works
brilliantly.

>
>> Maybe for my next effort, if you 'll do an LGPL license for it.

>
> Last I checked it had an MIT license. That was the consensus choice.
> I have no idea how that differs from an LGPL license and don't care to
> find out. Use it or don't.


Oh, great, I do MIT, too. Last /I/ checked your stuff was licensed "ask me".

Well, see if you like this:

http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/q...idetm-qooxlisp

We could do the same with raw HTML/js

kt


--

$$$$$: http://www.theoryyalgebra.com/
Cells: http://common-lisp.net/project/cells/
BSlog: http://smuglispweeny.blogspot.com/
 
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Kenny
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Posts: n/a
 
      05-31-2010
Roby Sadeli wrote:
> On May 31, 12:49 am, Kenneth Tilton <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>> qooxdoo + Common Lisp (+ Cells, a common lisp dataflow hack):
>> http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/qooxlisp/
>>
>> Just a proof of concept so far, but includes a substantial starter example:
>> http://github.com/downloads/kennytil...apropos-kt.jpg
>>
>> Discussion of the Lisp advantage here:
>> http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/q...sp-in-qooxlisp
>>
>> Discussion of the Cells advantage is being written next and will appear
>> here:
>> http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/q...idetm-qooxlisp
>>
>> kt
>>
>> --http://www.stuckonalgebra.com
>> "The best Algebra tutorial program I have seen... in a class by itself."
>> Macworld

>
> Really cool stuff Mr. Tilton!


Thanks!

> I have been reading your blog and noticed your interest in qooxdoo +
> lisp.
> I really hope your interest in qooxlisp doesn't wane anytime soon
> since I
> really want to see a complete framework that people can use. (+ great
> docs
> )


Well, I will be using it to move my Algebra software to the web and it
has a pretty intense interface so its gonna happen and happen fast. I
also think as an open-source project it will get enough support to move
even faster. The Cells component is especially awesome for GUI
development so I think we may even convert more than a few developers
using other stacks to qooxlisp.

>
> Btw, my Lisp knowledge is minimal and I have just learned how to
> use cl-weblocks.


That is definitely one of the neater libraries out there for web
programming in Lisp.

kt

--

$$$$$: http://www.theoryyalgebra.com/
Cells: http://common-lisp.net/project/cells/
BSlog: http://smuglispweeny.blogspot.com/
 
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David Mark
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Posts: n/a
 
      05-31-2010
On May 30, 11:06*pm, Kenny <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> David Mark wrote:
> > On May 30, 3:35 pm, Kenneth Tilton <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> >> David Mark wrote:
> >>> On May 30, 1:49 pm, Kenneth Tilton <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> >>>> qooxdoo + Common Lisp (+ Cells, a common lisp dataflow hack):
> >>>> * *http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/qooxlisp/
> >>> Qooxdoo + anything < 0; // true
> >> Dave! Whassup?!

>
> > Oh, that's right. *It's "Kenny" from a ways back. *I should have made
> > the connection as AFAIK you were/are the only person on earth using
> > Qooxdoo.

>
> >> I considered building a framework atop your stuff to make for much
> >> lighter initial loads but needed a quick win.

>
> > Or perhaps the fleeting illusion of such? *We went over this ad
> > nauseam. *Qooxdoo is a bloated, outdated, over-engineered pile of
> > browser sniffing crap-ola (see also Dojo).

>
> >> (and qooxdoo rocks for RIAs).

>
> > Sucks, Kenny. *Sucks for RIA's. *Perhaps there was a breakdown in
> > communication?

>
> I think it was a breakdown in parallel universes. In mine qooxdoo works
> brilliantly.


Based on what evidence? I'm guessing you tried it in a handful of
browsers you had handy and figured if it appeared to work in those, it
must be "brilliant". Did it ever occur to you that the authors of
qooxdoo tried the same browsers before you and inserted lots of hacks
and sniffs to make them appear to work? What do you think will happen
in anything older, newer or unknown to the authors?

>
>
>
> >> Maybe for my next effort, if you 'll do an LGPL license for it.

>
> > Last I checked it had an MIT license. *That was the consensus choice.
> > I have no idea how that differs from an LGPL license and don't care to
> > find out. *Use it or don't.

>
> Oh, great, I do MIT, too. Last /I/ checked your stuff was licensed "ask me".


Yeah, and lots did. Most of those got a free license. People who
didn't ask got nothing. Go figure.

>
> Well, see if you like this:
>
> http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/q...idetm-qooxlisp


What about it?

>
> We could do the same with raw HTML/js
>


Raw HTML?
 
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Kenneth Tilton
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Posts: n/a
 
      05-31-2010
David Mark wrote:
> On May 30, 11:06 pm, Kenny <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>> David Mark wrote:
>>> On May 30, 3:35 pm, Kenneth Tilton <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>>> David Mark wrote:
>>>>> On May 30, 1:49 pm, Kenneth Tilton <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>>>>> qooxdoo + Common Lisp (+ Cells, a common lisp dataflow hack):
>>>>>> http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/qooxlisp/
>>>>> Qooxdoo + anything < 0; // true
>>>> Dave! Whassup?!
>>> Oh, that's right. It's "Kenny" from a ways back. I should have made
>>> the connection as AFAIK you were/are the only person on earth using
>>> Qooxdoo.
>>>> I considered building a framework atop your stuff to make for much
>>>> lighter initial loads but needed a quick win.
>>> Or perhaps the fleeting illusion of such? We went over this ad
>>> nauseam. Qooxdoo is a bloated, outdated, over-engineered pile of
>>> browser sniffing crap-ola (see also Dojo).
>>>> (and qooxdoo rocks for RIAs).
>>> Sucks, Kenny. Sucks for RIA's. Perhaps there was a breakdown in
>>> communication?

>> I think it was a breakdown in parallel universes. In mine qooxdoo works
>> brilliantly.

>
> Based on what evidence? I'm guessing you tried it in a handful of
> browsers you had handy and figured if it appeared to work in those, it
> must be "brilliant". Did it ever occur to you that the authors of
> qooxdoo tried the same browsers before you and inserted lots of hacks
> and sniffs to make them appear to work? What do you think will happen
> in anything older, newer or unknown to the authors?


I'll lose 0.01% of my market for a week until the ten full-time
engineers paid to work on qooxdoo patch it?

>
>>
>>
>>>> Maybe for my next effort, if you 'll do an LGPL license for it.
>>> Last I checked it had an MIT license. That was the consensus choice.
>>> I have no idea how that differs from an LGPL license and don't care to
>>> find out. Use it or don't.

>> Oh, great, I do MIT, too. Last /I/ checked your stuff was licensed "ask me".

>
> Yeah, and lots did. Most of those got a free license. People who
> didn't ask got nothing. Go figure.


Oh, you just wanted to have us come grovelling to your door hat in hand?
Great!

>
>> Well, see if you like this:
>>
>> http://wiki.github.com/kennytilton/q...idetm-qooxlisp

>
> What about it?


Wow, you learned nothing, eh? That is the price of knowing everything, I
guess. But at least you know everything.

>
>> We could do the same with raw HTML/js
>>

>
> Raw HTML?


Keep up the good fight! Still programming in assembly language?



kt

--
http://www.stuckonalgebra.com
"The best Algebra tutorial program I have seen... in a class by itself."
Macworld
 
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Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn
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Posts: n/a
 
      05-31-2010
Kenneth Tilton wrote:

> David Mark wrote:
>> On May 30, 11:06 pm, Kenny <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>> I think it was a breakdown in parallel universes. In mine qooxdoo works
>>> brilliantly.

>>
>> Based on what evidence? I'm guessing you tried it in a handful of
>> browsers you had handy and figured if it appeared to work in those, it
>> must be "brilliant". Did it ever occur to you that the authors of
>> qooxdoo tried the same browsers before you and inserted lots of hacks
>> and sniffs to make them appear to work? What do you think will happen
>> in anything older, newer or unknown to the authors?

>
> I'll lose 0.01% of my market for a week until the ten full-time
> engineers paid to work on qooxdoo patch it?


,-[qooxdoo-1.1-sdk/framework/source/class/qx/Bootstrap.js:554]
|
| getClass : function(value)
| {
| var classString = Object.prototype.toString.call(value);
| return (
| qx.Bootstrap.__classToTypeMap[classString] ||
| classString.slice(8, -1)
| );
| },

,-[ibid.:554]
|
| isString : function(value)
| {
| // Added "value !== null" because IE throws an exception "Object
| // expected"
| // by executing "value instanceof Array" if value is a DOM element that
| // doesn't exist. It seems that there is a internal different between a
| // JavaScript null and a null returned from calling DOM.
| // e.q. by document.getElementById("ReturnedNull").
| return (
| value !== null && (
| typeof value === "string" ||
| qx.Bootstrap.getClass(value) == "String" ||
| value instanceof String ||
| (!!value && !!value.$$isString))
| );
| },

This alone proves that qooxdoo is junk as its authors are completely
clueless. Get over it.


PointedEars
--
Prototype.js was written by people who don't know javascript for people
who don't know javascript. People who don't know javascript are not
the best source of advice on designing systems that use javascript.
-- Richard Cornford, cljs, <f806at$ail$1$(E-Mail Removed)>
 
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