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Boot times vs Shutdown times

 
 
Dave Warren
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      09-12-2011
In message <83cc8$4e6b5199$5419acc3$(E-Mail Removed)1.nb.ho me.nl>
someone claiming to be "Skybuck Flying" <(E-Mail Removed)>
typed:

>People who want to start working for many hours with the computer can surely
>wait a few seconds at boot time, those few seconds don't matter.


Then seconds shutting down shouldn't matter either, if you're about to
sleep for many hours you can surely wait a few more seconds on shutdown.

>People who want to get to bed don't want to wait many minutes or hours for
>windows shutdown to finish updating and what not.
>
>Also people in a hurry and which most go do not have the time to wait for
>shutdown.


So don't wait. When you boot your computer, you can't proceed until the
computer finishes booting. Conversely, when you're shutting down, you
can tell the computer to shut down and proceed with your life (go to
bed/whatever) immediately without waiting.

>Other examples includes students which have to log out from systems because
>the hour is gone... they must make room for other students.
>
>Here log out time matters more then login time.


There are a set of instances where one will be better than the other,
this is true. My point is that /overall/, startup time matters
virtually every time you boot a computer whereas shutdown time only
actually matters in a small number of cases (primarily where you intend
on changing hardware, disconnecting the power, etc. Reboots don't count
*if* you gain the time back on the subsequent bootup)

>Overal I think shutdown time is probably even more important than boot time.
>
>Give me one good example where a quick startup time is essential ?


Each and every time I'm sitting waiting for my computer to start -- I
can't proceed with the next thing I intend on doing since this next task
would require the computer to be turned on.
 
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Skybuck Flying
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      09-13-2011
The importance of the occurences is also much more important than the
frequency.

For example.

Every day your boring life starts and you bore up the computer, no problem
there.

But what if you have to go to an important party or an important meeting and
you want to go there with the train ?!

And now the system starts to screw up the shutdown ?!

That train won't wait an additional 10 seconds.

You come 1 second to late and the train is gone !

Bye,
Skybuck.

 
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Dave Warren
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      09-16-2011
In message <79337$4e6eb716$5419acc3$(E-Mail Removed)1.nb.ho me.nl>
someone claiming to be "Skybuck Flying" <(E-Mail Removed)>
typed:

>The importance of the occurences is also much more important than the
>frequency.
>
>For example.
>
>Every day your boring life starts and you bore up the computer, no problem
>there.
>
>But what if you have to go to an important party or an important meeting and
>you want to go there with the train ?!
>
>And now the system starts to screw up the shutdown ?!
>
>That train won't wait an additional 10 seconds.
>
>You come 1 second to late and the train is gone !


Exactly why you turn the computer off and walk away.

The whole trick here is that you don't have to wait for a computer to
finish shutting down (unless you're rebooting, in which case you're
waiting the startup time so you need to consider the total time for
both)

Conversely, you typically can't proceed to use the computer on startup
until the startup finishes.
 
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Skybuck Flying
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      09-24-2011
Apperently there could even be more risk, by applieing updates during
shutdowns.

You walk away....

The next day when you boot the system it tries and finishes the update, by
gives no indication that this is going on.

The update takes so long, you think the system hang and you reset it !

Consequence:

Possible system corruption !

Bye,
Skybuck.



 
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Dave Warren
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      09-25-2011
In message <c2bc1$4e7e679d$5419acc3$(E-Mail Removed)1.nb.hom e.nl>
someone claiming to be "Skybuck Flying" <(E-Mail Removed)>
typed:

>Apperently there could even be more risk, by applieing updates during
>shutdowns.
>
>You walk away....
>
>The next day when you boot the system it tries and finishes the update, by
>gives no indication that this is going on.


If by giving you no indication, you mean that it tells you that it's
installing "Update 1 of 3...", then you're correct, unless this is being
removed from Windows 8.

>The update takes so long, you think the system hang and you reset it !
>
>Consequence:
>
>Possible system corruption !


Updates generally shouldn't cause system corruption even if aborted
unexpectedly. This is one of the benefits of the WinSxS implementation
the updated files are written first, then linked into the appropriate
place in the filesystem all at once in a journaled transaction.

Should that transaction fail, the journal allows the system to
automatically revert to the previous configuration and the next update
installation will take care of the problem.

More importantly, what you've described can happen whether they focus on
faster startups or shutdowns, so the point is moot.
 
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Skybuck Flying
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      09-26-2011
It was an interesting hypothesis none the less...

With no indication I mean absolutely nothing, except a hanging harddisk
light.

The question is if updates happen at all if the system reboots...

The answer could be yes.

However what I experienced might be explained by falling harddisks.

Maybe old harddisk failed or maybe new harddisk failed.

It was also interesting to see how Knoppix/Linux detected harddisk failure
but windows could not.

Windows failed to boot at first... maybe it's because that drive
malfunctioned and Knoppix was started from DVD.

Also finally I kept trying and it did boot... maybe the successfull boot was
a fluke of luck.

Finally I disconnected old drives and it booted...

What the hell is going on I don't know... could also be weird electrical
behaviour.

For now best course of action for me is to:

1. Not shutdown the system until I have made enough backups of all critical
data.

And then figure out what the hell is happening.

It could still be update related or microsoft's virus scanner related... it
could be anything.

Microsoft tools should definetly give more information about what they are
doing, especially the repair tool.

So far Windows could be considered a miracle... here I am it's still
working... but it was very close...

My system could have been dead already...

Fortunately I didn't panic too much and didn't do too many stupid things...

But windows could definetly be made a bit better here and there... I think
windows could learn a little bit from linux when it comes to failing
harddisk...

Weeeiiirrd stuff going on this morning... very weird stuff...

Harddisk-protocol problems I think...

I don't know but I'll try and figure it out.

Could also be windows file system problem though... I read once.. that
windows 7 would lead to corruption... it was supposed to be fixed ?!? But
maybe a bug is still in there ??!

As I said... could be anything... but my safest bet is: trouble in harddisk
land...

Bye,
Skybuck.

 
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