«

I've decided I need a new inkjet printer.

My current Ep$on Photo Stylus 820 ink eater still works and,
except for one point, makes nice prints. But that one point
is driving me crazy.

The problem is that using Epson's top grade glossy paper,
it does not print real black. No where near the density of
a genuine ordinary chromogenic old-fashioned wet process color print.

What's the current state in printers for low-volume use? I'm interested in
the 8-inch wide ones or the next width step up (11 inches? 14?).

Doug McDonald

On Jun 16, 4:18*pm, Doug McDonald <mcdon...@scs.uiuc.edu> wrote:
> I've decided I need a new inkjet printer.
>
> My current Ep$on Photo Stylus 820 ink eater still works and,
> except for one point, makes nice prints. But that one point
> is driving me crazy.
>
> The problem is that using Epson's top grade glossy paper,
> it does not print real black. No where near the density of
> a genuine ordinary chromogenic old-fashioned wet process color print.
>
> What's the current state in printers for low-volume use? I'm interested in
> the 8-inch wide ones or the next width step up (11 inches? 14?).
>
> Doug McDonald

If its for B&W you need to find reviews and test one before buying, my
opinion is not of recent products, but even Best Buy had Canon and HPs
I could test, about 5 years ago it was Epson and HP for B&W, and Canon
and Epson for color, Canon years ago had the finest, 1 Picoliter
printing on some models, HP was the worst. Each printer had its
strengths and weaknesses.

? "Doug McDonald" <> ?????? ??? ??????
news:hvbeui$ddv$...
> I've decided I need a new inkjet printer.
>
> My current Ep$on Photo Stylus 820 ink eater still works and,
> except for one point, makes nice prints. But that one point
> is driving me crazy.
>
> The problem is that using Epson's top grade glossy paper,
> it does not print real black. No where near the density of
> a genuine ordinary chromogenic old-fashioned wet process color print.
>
> What's the current state in printers for low-volume use? I'm interested in
> the 8-inch wide ones or the next width step up (11 inches? 14?).
Canon Pixma iP 4500 (IIRC the current model, I have the 4300).
5 separate inks (Cyan,Magenta, Yellow, Photo Black, Document Black).
Optimum ink cost, because the tanks are, well, tanks and head is available
separately (running smoothly after 3+ years and hundreds of printouts)
Prints on printable cds and vds.
Has a paper tray (better model has 2 trays IIRC) so you don't have to
manually feed paper.
A4 (letter) size.
Prints on both sides of paper automatically (flips it).
Price ~120 euros, ink tank ~14 euros (I use generic paper and have the tanks
refilled with generic ink, excellent results-prints only smudge a bit).

HTH,


--
Tzortzakakis Dimitrios
major in electrical engineering
mechanized infantry reservist
hordad AT otenet DOT gr

On Fri, 18 Jun 2010 19:23:32 +0300, "Tzortzakakis Dimitris" <>
wrote:
:
: ? "Doug McDonald" <> ?????? ??? ??????
: news:hvbeui$ddv$...
: > I've decided I need a new inkjet printer.
: >
: > My current Ep$on Photo Stylus 820 ink eater still works and,
: > except for one point, makes nice prints. But that one point
: > is driving me crazy.
: >
: > The problem is that using Epson's top grade glossy paper,
: > it does not print real black. No where near the density of
: > a genuine ordinary chromogenic old-fashioned wet process color print.
: >
: > What's the current state in printers for low-volume use? I'm interested in
: > the 8-inch wide ones or the next width step up (11 inches? 14?).
: Canon Pixma iP 4500 (IIRC the current model, I have the 4300).
: 5 separate inks (Cyan,Magenta, Yellow, Photo Black, Document Black).
: Optimum ink cost, because the tanks are, well, tanks and head is available
: separately (running smoothly after 3+ years and hundreds of printouts)
: Prints on printable cds and vds.
: Has a paper tray (better model has 2 trays IIRC) so you don't have to
: manually feed paper.
: A4 (letter) size.
: Prints on both sides of paper automatically (flips it).
: Price ~120 euros, ink tank ~14 euros (I use generic paper and have the tanks
: refilled with generic ink, excellent results-prints only smudge a bit).

I was with you until that last line. How could it possibly be acceptable for
the prints to smudge at all?

Bob

On Wed, 16 Jun 2010 16:18:27 -0500, Doug McDonald
<> wrote:

>I've decided I need a new inkjet printer.
>
>My current Ep$on Photo Stylus 820 ink eater still works and,
>except for one point, makes nice prints. But that one point
>is driving me crazy.
>
>The problem is that using Epson's top grade glossy paper,
>it does not print real black. No where near the density of
>a genuine ordinary chromogenic old-fashioned wet process color print.
>
>What's the current state in printers for low-volume use? I'm interested in
>the 8-inch wide ones or the next width step up (11 inches? 14?).
>

If you are worried about colour gamut you should have a look at
anything from the Epson Stylus range with a number of the general form
of XX80.



Eric Stevens

On Jun 18, 11:23*am, "Tzortzakakis Dimitris" <no...@nospam.com> wrote:
> ? "Doug McDonald" <mcdon...@scs.uiuc.edu> ?????? ??? ??????news:hvbeui$ddv$...> I've decided I need a new inkjet printer..
>
> > My current Ep$on Photo Stylus 820 ink eater still works and,
> > except for one point, makes nice prints. But that one point
> > is driving me crazy.
>
> > The problem is that using Epson's top grade glossy paper,
> > it does not print real black. No where near the density of
> > a genuine ordinary chromogenic old-fashioned wet process color print.
>
> > What's the current state in printers for low-volume use? I'm interested in
> > the 8-inch wide ones or the next width step up (11 inches? 14?).
>
> Canon Pixma iP 4500 (IIRC the current model, I have the 4300).
> 5 separate inks (Cyan,Magenta, Yellow, Photo Black, Document Black).
> Optimum ink cost, because the tanks are, well, tanks and head is available
> separately (running smoothly after 3+ years and hundreds of printouts)
> Prints on printable cds and vds.
> Has a paper tray (better model has 2 trays IIRC) so you don't have to
> manually feed paper.
> A4 (letter) size.
> Prints on both sides of paper automatically (flips it).
> Price ~120 euros, ink tank ~14 euros (I use generic paper and have the tanks
> refilled with generic ink, excellent results-prints only smudge a bit).
>
> HTH,
>
> --
> Tzortzakakis Dimitrios
> major in electrical engineering
> mechanized infantry reservist
> hordad AT otenet DOT gr

Have you done B&W photos and compared them to other printers and B&W
film, my 5 ink canon mp 950s B&W have a cyan tint to the black, maybe
new models are better but this isnt a new issue for canon. For color
canon is great.

? "Robert Coe" <> ?????? ??? ??????
news:...
> On Fri, 18 Jun 2010 19:23:32 +0300, "Tzortzakakis Dimitris"
> <>
> wrote:
> :
> : ? "Doug McDonald" <> ?????? ??? ??????
> : news:hvbeui$ddv$...
> : > I've decided I need a new inkjet printer.
> : >
> : > My current Ep$on Photo Stylus 820 ink eater still works and,
> : > except for one point, makes nice prints. But that one point
> : > is driving me crazy.
> : >
> : > The problem is that using Epson's top grade glossy paper,
> : > it does not print real black. No where near the density of
> : > a genuine ordinary chromogenic old-fashioned wet process color print.
> : >
> : > What's the current state in printers for low-volume use? I'm
> interested in
> : > the 8-inch wide ones or the next width step up (11 inches? 14?).
> : Canon Pixma iP 4500 (IIRC the current model, I have the 4300).
> : 5 separate inks (Cyan,Magenta, Yellow, Photo Black, Document Black).
> : Optimum ink cost, because the tanks are, well, tanks and head is
> available
> : separately (running smoothly after 3+ years and hundreds of printouts)
> : Prints on printable cds and vds.
> : Has a paper tray (better model has 2 trays IIRC) so you don't have to
> : manually feed paper.
> : A4 (letter) size.
> : Prints on both sides of paper automatically (flips it).
> : Price ~120 euros, ink tank ~14 euros (I use generic paper and have the
> tanks
> : refilled with generic ink, excellent results-prints only smudge a bit).
>
> I was with you until that last line. How could it possibly be acceptable
> for
> the prints to smudge at all?
If you count the economic benefit of having the tanks refilled for 4 euros,
when an original tank costs 16 euros... That's four for the price of one! We
accept smudged photos, FWIW, and BTW, it's greener to use the same
cartridge again, instead of throwing it away, and buying a new one, and
throwing away again all packaging material.


--
Tzortzakakis Dimitrios
major in electrical engineering
mechanized infantry reservist
hordad AT otenet DOT gr

On Sat, 19 Jun 2010 22:59:10 +0300, "Tzortzakakis Dimitris"
<> wrote:

>
>? "Robert Coe" <> ?????? ??? ??????
>news:.. .
>> On Fri, 18 Jun 2010 19:23:32 +0300, "Tzortzakakis Dimitris"
>> <>
>> wrote:
>> :
>> : ? "Doug McDonald" <> ?????? ??? ??????
>> : news:hvbeui$ddv$...
>> : > I've decided I need a new inkjet printer.
>> : >
>> : > My current Ep$on Photo Stylus 820 ink eater still works and,
>> : > except for one point, makes nice prints. But that one point
>> : > is driving me crazy.
>> : >
>> : > The problem is that using Epson's top grade glossy paper,
>> : > it does not print real black. No where near the density of
>> : > a genuine ordinary chromogenic old-fashioned wet process color print.
>> : >
>> : > What's the current state in printers for low-volume use? I'm
>> interested in
>> : > the 8-inch wide ones or the next width step up (11 inches? 14?).
>> : Canon Pixma iP 4500 (IIRC the current model, I have the 4300).
>> : 5 separate inks (Cyan,Magenta, Yellow, Photo Black, Document Black).
>> : Optimum ink cost, because the tanks are, well, tanks and head is
>> available
>> : separately (running smoothly after 3+ years and hundreds of printouts)
>> : Prints on printable cds and vds.
>> : Has a paper tray (better model has 2 trays IIRC) so you don't have to
>> : manually feed paper.
>> : A4 (letter) size.
>> : Prints on both sides of paper automatically (flips it).
>> : Price ~120 euros, ink tank ~14 euros (I use generic paper and have the
>> tanks
>> : refilled with generic ink, excellent results-prints only smudge a bit).
>>
>> I was with you until that last line. How could it possibly be acceptable
>> for
>> the prints to smudge at all?
>If you count the economic benefit of having the tanks refilled for 4 euros,
>when an original tank costs 16 euros... That's four for the price of one! We
>accept smudged photos, FWIW, and BTW, it's greener to use the same
>cartridge again, instead of throwing it away, and buying a new one, and
>throwing away again all packaging material.

Smudging depends more on the paper used than the inks used. If the surface
cannot adequately trap the ink then you'll get smudging. Any half-decent
paper today will absorb, trap, and stabilize both pigment and dye inks.
Perhaps you are using pigment inks on a dye-inks-only paper, or vice-versa.

On 2010-06-19 20:59:10 +0100, Tzortzakakis Dimitris said:

> ? "Robert Coe" <> ?????? ??? ??????
> news:...
>> On Fri, 18 Jun 2010 19:23:32 +0300, "Tzortzakakis Dimitris" <>
>> wrote:
>> :
>> : ? "Doug McDonald" <> ?????? ??? ??????
>> : news:hvbeui$ddv$...
>> : > I've decided I need a new inkjet printer.
>> : >
>> : > My current Ep$on Photo Stylus 820 ink eater still works and,
>> : > except for one point, makes nice prints. But that one point
>> : > is driving me crazy.
>> : >
>> : > The problem is that using Epson's top grade glossy paper,
>> : > it does not print real black. No where near the density of
>> : > a genuine ordinary chromogenic old-fashioned wet process color print.
>> : >
>> : > What's the current state in printers for low-volume use? I'm interested in
>> : > the 8-inch wide ones or the next width step up (11 inches? 14?).
>> : Canon Pixma iP 4500 (IIRC the current model, I have the 4300).
>> : 5 separate inks (Cyan,Magenta, Yellow, Photo Black, Document Black).
>> : Optimum ink cost, because the tanks are, well, tanks and head is available
>> : separately (running smoothly after 3+ years and hundreds of printouts)
>> : Prints on printable cds and vds.
>> : Has a paper tray (better model has 2 trays IIRC) so you don't have to
>> : manually feed paper.
>> : A4 (letter) size.
>> : Prints on both sides of paper automatically (flips it).
>> : Price ~120 euros, ink tank ~14 euros (I use generic paper and have the tanks
>> : refilled with generic ink, excellent results-prints only smudge a bit).
>>
>> I was with you until that last line. How could it possibly be acceptable for
>> the prints to smudge at all?
> If you count the economic benefit of having the tanks refilled for 4
> euros, when an original tank costs 16 euros... That's four for the
> price of one! We accept smudged photos, FWIW, and BTW, it's greener to
> use the same cartridge again, instead of throwing it away, and buying a
> new one, and throwing away again all packaging material.

Just something to consider: find a really good printing company. The
major expense will be mailing, but less expensive than buying a printer
and feeding it with ink, better quality, and overall much more friendly
to the environment. Turnaround is two days max.

--
Pete

? "scott nalter" <> ?????? ??? ??????
news:...
> On Sat, 19 Jun 2010 22:59:10 +0300, "Tzortzakakis Dimitris"
> <> wrote:
>
>>
>>? "Robert Coe" <> ?????? ??? ??????
>>news:. ..
>>> On Fri, 18 Jun 2010 19:23:32 +0300, "Tzortzakakis Dimitris"
>>> <>
>>> wrote:
>>> :
>>> : ? "Doug McDonald" <> ?????? ??? ??????
>>> : news:hvbeui$ddv$...
>>> : > I've decided I need a new inkjet printer.
>>> : >
>>> : > My current Ep$on Photo Stylus 820 ink eater still works and,
>>> : > except for one point, makes nice prints. But that one point
>>> : > is driving me crazy.
>>> : >
>>> : > The problem is that using Epson's top grade glossy paper,
>>> : > it does not print real black. No where near the density of
>>> : > a genuine ordinary chromogenic old-fashioned wet process color
>>> print.
>>> : >
>>> : > What's the current state in printers for low-volume use? I'm
>>> interested in
>>> : > the 8-inch wide ones or the next width step up (11 inches? 14?).
>>> : Canon Pixma iP 4500 (IIRC the current model, I have the 4300).
>>> : 5 separate inks (Cyan,Magenta, Yellow, Photo Black, Document Black).
>>> : Optimum ink cost, because the tanks are, well, tanks and head is
>>> available
>>> : separately (running smoothly after 3+ years and hundreds of printouts)
>>> : Prints on printable cds and vds.
>>> : Has a paper tray (better model has 2 trays IIRC) so you don't have to
>>> : manually feed paper.
>>> : A4 (letter) size.
>>> : Prints on both sides of paper automatically (flips it).
>>> : Price ~120 euros, ink tank ~14 euros (I use generic paper and have the
>>> tanks
>>> : refilled with generic ink, excellent results-prints only smudge a
>>> bit).
>>>
>>> I was with you until that last line. How could it possibly be acceptable
>>> for
>>> the prints to smudge at all?
>>If you count the economic benefit of having the tanks refilled for 4
>>euros,
>>when an original tank costs 16 euros... That's four for the price of one!
>>We
>>accept smudged photos, FWIW, and BTW, it's greener to use the same
>>cartridge again, instead of throwing it away, and buying a new one, and
>>throwing away again all packaging material.
>
> Smudging depends more on the paper used than the inks used. If the surface
> cannot adequately trap the ink then you'll get smudging. Any half-decent
> paper today will absorb, trap, and stabilize both pigment and dye inks.
> Perhaps you are using pigment inks on a dye-inks-only paper, or
> vice-versa.
I got best results with Canon paper, and Canon inks, obviously, but Canon
"everyday" papers go for 10 euros per 100@4X5", and Canon inks go for 16
euros a tank (these inks are supposed to be guaranteed for 100 years). On
the contrary, generic paper from lidl www.lidl.co.uk goes for 4 euros per
100, and my tanks refilled with generic ink and the chip resetted with a
chip resetter, 4 euros per tank. So, if we take the worst scenario, that all
3 tanks need refilling for 100 prints (C-M-Y), it's 4 euros for paper plus
12 euros for refilling all 3 tanks, 16 euros so 16 cents per print. This is
cheaper than most local photofinishig labs. ( I obviously go to the greek
lidl, www.lidl.gr , but I don't think that anybody else speaks greek here).



--
Tzortzakakis Dimitrios
major in electrical engineering
mechanized infantry reservist
hordad AT otenet DOT gr