«

JC wrote:
[ SNIP ]

> Off the top of my head, I am thinking of a Unix based version of Oracle for
> the DBMS. For the user interface I am thinking of something that is
> integrated with a web browser. And of course some sort of interface between
> the two. All this with my limited knowledge of what's out there today. I
> might be a dinosaur but certainly not stupid; I am quite capable of
> learning. I haven't been to school since 1996 when I graduated with a BS in
> Comp/Sci & Math.
>
> Many Thanks to any/all that respond ...
>
> -JC

I realize that you posted to Java newsgroups, and others have already
provided good advice for Java-based work. However, in line with where
you say you're currently at, I would recommend investigating a .NET
approach in parallel with following up the Java/J2EE leads. For a web
application you might then be looking at ASP.NET MVC 2, using C# as your
primary programming language, with SQL Server as your database. The J2EE
parallel to this could be JSF/Facelets in Java EE 6, with Java 1.6,
using Oracle or PostgreSQL. There are lots of permutations, obviously,
but these are broad brush suggestions.

Would I recommend one over the other, J2EE over .NET, or vice versa? No,
I simply recommend being aware of both technology sets. Especially since
you are essentially coming in at ground zero, which is not necessarily a
disadvantage here.

HTH, AHS

--
It should be noted that no ethically-trained software engineer would
ever consent to write a DestroyBaghdad procedure. Basic professional
ethics would instead require him to write a DestroyCity procedure, to
which Baghdad could be given as a parameter.
-- Nathaniel Borenstein

On 09-06-2010 20:19, Arved Sandstrom wrote:
> JC wrote:
> [ SNIP ]
>
>> Off the top of my head, I am thinking of a Unix based version of
>> Oracle for
>> the DBMS. For the user interface I am thinking of something that is
>> integrated with a web browser. And of course some sort of interface
>> between
>> the two. All this with my limited knowledge of what's out there today. I
>> might be a dinosaur but certainly not stupid; I am quite capable of
>> learning. I haven't been to school since 1996 when I graduated with a
>> BS in
>> Comp/Sci & Math.
>>
>> Many Thanks to any/all that respond ...
>
> I realize that you posted to Java newsgroups, and others have already
> provided good advice for Java-based work. However, in line with where
> you say you're currently at, I would recommend investigating a .NET
> approach in parallel with following up the Java/J2EE leads. For a web
> application you might then be looking at ASP.NET MVC 2, using C# as your
> primary programming language, with SQL Server as your database. The J2EE
> parallel to this could be JSF/Facelets in Java EE 6, with Java 1.6,
> using Oracle or PostgreSQL. There are lots of permutations, obviously,
> but these are broad brush suggestions.
>
> Would I recommend one over the other, J2EE over .NET, or vice versa? No,
> I simply recommend being aware of both technology sets. Especially since
> you are essentially coming in at ground zero, which is not necessarily a
> disadvantage here.

Given that he has Java, JDBC and Oracle experience then he should
have at least some advantages going Java instead of .NET.

Arne

Arne Vajhøj wrote:
> On 09-06-2010 20:19, Arved Sandstrom wrote:
>> JC wrote:
>> [ SNIP ]
>>
>>> Off the top of my head, I am thinking of a Unix based version of
>>> Oracle for
>>> the DBMS. For the user interface I am thinking of something that is
>>> integrated with a web browser. And of course some sort of interface
>>> between
>>> the two. All this with my limited knowledge of what's out there today. I
>>> might be a dinosaur but certainly not stupid; I am quite capable of
>>> learning. I haven't been to school since 1996 when I graduated with a
>>> BS in
>>> Comp/Sci & Math.
>>>
>>> Many Thanks to any/all that respond ...
>>
>> I realize that you posted to Java newsgroups, and others have already
>> provided good advice for Java-based work. However, in line with where
>> you say you're currently at, I would recommend investigating a .NET
>> approach in parallel with following up the Java/J2EE leads. For a web
>> application you might then be looking at ASP.NET MVC 2, using C# as your
>> primary programming language, with SQL Server as your database. The J2EE
>> parallel to this could be JSF/Facelets in Java EE 6, with Java 1.6,
>> using Oracle or PostgreSQL. There are lots of permutations, obviously,
>> but these are broad brush suggestions.
>>
>> Would I recommend one over the other, J2EE over .NET, or vice versa? No,
>> I simply recommend being aware of both technology sets. Especially since
>> you are essentially coming in at ground zero, which is not necessarily a
>> disadvantage here.
>
> Given that he has Java, JDBC and Oracle experience then he should
> have at least some advantages going Java instead of .NET.
>
> Arne
>
Based on what he said I wouldn't consider that to be a significant
advantage however. An ancient version of Java, for starters. And by his
own admission he's no DBA, so even discounting the old version of Oracle
he doesn't have admin chops on the database side either.

Again, I'm not recommending one over the other. I wouldn't even do that
for myself; personally I'd like to be in a position where I could work
with the latest Java EE for 6 months, then switch to the latest .NET for
6 months, then back to Java EE, and so on. I simply believe that the
OP is approaching this situation with practically a clean slate, so why
not keep his eyes open while making choices?

AHS
--
It should be noted that no ethically-trained software engineer would
ever consent to write a DestroyBaghdad procedure. Basic professional
ethics would instead require him to write a DestroyCity procedure, to
which Baghdad could be given as a parameter.
-- Nathaniel Borenstein

In article <4c1033b3$0$278$>,
says...

....

> Given that he has Java, JDBC and Oracle experience then he should
> have at least some advantages going Java instead of .NET.

Not to mention that those are all cross-platform options. while .NET
locks you into a windows-based network.

In article <-did-not-set--mail-host-address--
so-tickle-me>, says...
>
> David Kerber <> writes:
>
> > In article <4c1033b3$0$278$>,
> > says...
> >
> > ...
> >
> >> Given that he has Java, JDBC and Oracle experience then he should
> >> have at least some advantages going Java instead of .NET.
> >
> > Not to mention that those are all cross-platform options. while .NET
> > locks you into a windows-based network.
>
> And doesn't .NET also tend to drag you into to license fees and other
> expenses; whilst Java has an open source eco-system?

I don't know a whole lot about the .NET ecosystem, but Java absolutely
has a very strong open-source community.

Since he's the one writing the lab software, he can probably get the
entire office redone with zero software expenses, if he were to use
Linux for the OS, Postgres or mySQL (or the free version of Oracle) as
the db, and his own software for the front end.

The other nice thing about java is that his very old app will probably
still run on the newest jvms, allowing him to upgrade the machines and
rewrite the app later on in the process.

D

David Kerber wrote:
> In article <4c1033b3$0$278$>,
> says...
>
> ...
>
>> Given that he has Java, JDBC and Oracle experience then he should
>> have at least some advantages going Java instead of .NET.
>
> Not to mention that those are all cross-platform options. while .NET
> locks you into a windows-based network.

The way Mono is moving along that's not strictly speaking true. In any
case, being "locked into" a Windows-based network is not exactly a
liability, not now and not for a few more decades. As it is, the
majority of fellow developers and clients that I deal with do J2SE/J2EE
on Windows. Every job I've had there's always been a fair bit - often a
majority - of other applications that have been on Windows. So it may be
a point of pride that your app in theory could run on many OS's, but
since almost everyone will have Windows who really cares?

AHS

--
It should be noted that no ethically-trained software engineer would
ever consent to write a DestroyBaghdad procedure. Basic professional
ethics would instead require him to write a DestroyCity procedure, to
which Baghdad could be given as a parameter.
-- Nathaniel Borenstein

David Kerber wrote:
> In article <-did-not-set--mail-host-address--
> so-tickle-me>, says...
>> David Kerber <> writes:
>>
>>> In article <4c1033b3$0$278$>,
>>> says...
>>>
>>> ...
>>>
>>>> Given that he has Java, JDBC and Oracle experience then he should
>>>> have at least some advantages going Java instead of .NET.
>>> Not to mention that those are all cross-platform options. while .NET
>>> locks you into a windows-based network.
>> And doesn't .NET also tend to drag you into to license fees and other
>> expenses; whilst Java has an open source eco-system?
>
> I don't know a whole lot about the .NET ecosystem, but Java absolutely
> has a very strong open-source community.
>
> Since he's the one writing the lab software, he can probably get the
> entire office redone with zero software expenses, if he were to use
> Linux for the OS, Postgres or mySQL (or the free version of Oracle) as
> the db, and his own software for the front end.
[ SNIP ]

And apart from the price of a legal copy of Windows you could do
everything else in the .NET ecosystem for free also.

In any case the cost of labour is going to dwarf the cost of software in
this scenario.

AHS

--
It should be noted that no ethically-trained software engineer would
ever consent to write a DestroyBaghdad procedure. Basic professional
ethics would instead require him to write a DestroyCity procedure, to
which Baghdad could be given as a parameter.
-- Nathaniel Borenstein

On 10-06-2010 10:34, wrote:
> David Kerber<> writes:
>> In article<4c1033b3$0$278$>,
>> says...
>>
>> ...
>>
>>> Given that he has Java, JDBC and Oracle experience then he should
>>> have at least some advantages going Java instead of .NET.
>>
>> Not to mention that those are all cross-platform options. while .NET
>> locks you into a windows-based network.
>
> And doesn't .NET also tend to drag you into to license fees and other
> expenses; whilst Java has an open source eco-system?

..NET runtime, C# compiler, Visual Studio Express, SQLServer Express
etc. are all free.

It does require Windows which is not free.

There are not as much open source for .NET as for Java, but there
are plenty.

Some of it is very familiar for Java people: NHibernate, NUnit,
NAnt, Log4net etc..

Arne

On 10-06-2010 17:45, Arved Sandstrom wrote:
> David Kerber wrote:
>> In article <4c1033b3$0$278$>,
>> says...
>>
>> ...
>>
>>> Given that he has Java, JDBC and Oracle experience then he should
>>> have at least some advantages going Java instead of .NET.
>>
>> Not to mention that those are all cross-platform options. while .NET
>> locks you into a windows-based network.
>
> The way Mono is moving along that's not strictly speaking true.

True. But Mono is only 98% MS .NET compatible or so, which
either is not compatible or requires extra work to ensure
compatibility.

> In any
> case, being "locked into" a Windows-based network is not exactly a
> liability, not now and not for a few more decades. As it is, the
> majority of fellow developers and clients that I deal with do J2SE/J2EE
> on Windows. Every job I've had there's always been a fair bit - often a
> majority - of other applications that have been on Windows. So it may be
> a point of pride that your app in theory could run on many OS's, but
> since almost everyone will have Windows who really cares?

The database is running on non-Windows platform today and he indicated
interest in Unix as database platform.

Windows is big but it is not everything.

Arne

On 10-06-2010 06:45, Arved Sandstrom wrote:
> Arne Vajhøj wrote:
>> On 09-06-2010 20:19, Arved Sandstrom wrote:
>>> JC wrote:
>>> [ SNIP ]
>>>
>>>> Off the top of my head, I am thinking of a Unix based version of
>>>> Oracle for
>>>> the DBMS. For the user interface I am thinking of something that is
>>>> integrated with a web browser. And of course some sort of interface
>>>> between
>>>> the two. All this with my limited knowledge of what's out there
>>>> today. I
>>>> might be a dinosaur but certainly not stupid; I am quite capable of
>>>> learning. I haven't been to school since 1996 when I graduated with a
>>>> BS in
>>>> Comp/Sci & Math.
>>>>
>>>> Many Thanks to any/all that respond ...
>>>
>>> I realize that you posted to Java newsgroups, and others have already
>>> provided good advice for Java-based work. However, in line with where
>>> you say you're currently at, I would recommend investigating a .NET
>>> approach in parallel with following up the Java/J2EE leads. For a web
>>> application you might then be looking at ASP.NET MVC 2, using C# as your
>>> primary programming language, with SQL Server as your database. The J2EE
>>> parallel to this could be JSF/Facelets in Java EE 6, with Java 1.6,
>>> using Oracle or PostgreSQL. There are lots of permutations, obviously,
>>> but these are broad brush suggestions.
>>>
>>> Would I recommend one over the other, J2EE over .NET, or vice versa? No,
>>> I simply recommend being aware of both technology sets. Especially since
>>> you are essentially coming in at ground zero, which is not necessarily a
>>> disadvantage here.
>>
>> Given that he has Java, JDBC and Oracle experience then he should
>> have at least some advantages going Java instead of .NET.
>>
> Based on what he said I wouldn't consider that to be a significant
> advantage however. An ancient version of Java, for starters. And by his
> own admission he's no DBA, so even discounting the old version of Oracle
> he doesn't have admin chops on the database side either.

Even though Java 1.1 is old, then the code should still work on
a newer Java (there are few potential issues, but generally).

He may not be a DBA, but if has been writing SQL statements for the
app then he would know some of Oracles ways of doing things.

Arne