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Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:

> In message <>, Allistar
> wrote:
>
>> Someone should produce a DVD player that ignores the "invalid operations"
>> specified on the DVD.
>
> They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing conditions.
>
> Similarly, the Freeview licensing conditions prohibit the ability to
> transfer the stream digitally to external drives.

No standard for DVD format, just proprietry lock-ins.

But I'm wondering if DMCA-Lite as part of ACTA with disallow
region-free players.

In message <gb->, Allistar wrote:

> Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>
>> In message <>, Allistar
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Someone should produce a DVD player that ignores the "invalid
>>> operations" specified on the DVD.
>>
>> They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing conditions.
>
> Licensing what? The DVD specification? Is this protected by some kind of
> patent?

Patents, NDAs, you name it.

On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 12:11:44 +1300, Allistar wrote:

>> They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing conditions.
>
> Licensing what? The DVD specification? Is this protected by some kind of
> patent?

Yes.

some kind.


--
"Filtering the Internet is like trying to boil the ocean"

In message <>, Sweetpea wrote:

> On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 12:11:44 +1300, Allistar wrote:
>
>>> They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing conditions.
>>
>> Licensing what? The DVD specification? Is this protected by some kind of
>> patent?
>
> Yes.
>
> some kind.

Actually I think it’s only the MPEG parts that are patented, the rest of the
DVD spec is under NDA.

On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 18:28:53 +1300, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:

> In message <>, Sweetpea wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 12:11:44 +1300, Allistar wrote:
>>
>>>> They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing conditions.
>>>
>>> Licensing what? The DVD specification? Is this protected by some kind
>>> of patent?
>>
>> Yes.
>>
>> some kind.
>
> Actually I think it’s only the MPEG parts that are patented, the rest of
> the DVD spec is under NDA.

Yes - that's what I said - "some kind".


--
"Filtering the Internet is like trying to boil the ocean"

On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 06:44:16 +0000 (UTC), Sweetpea
<> wrote:

>On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 18:28:53 +1300, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>
>> In message <>, Sweetpea wrote:
>>
>>> On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 12:11:44 +1300, Allistar wrote:
>>>
>>>>> They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing conditions.
>>>>
>>>> Licensing what? The DVD specification? Is this protected by some kind
>>>> of patent?
>>>
>>> Yes.
>>>
>>> some kind.
>>
>> Actually I think it’s only the MPEG parts that are patented, the rest of
>> the DVD spec is under NDA.
>
>Yes - that's what I said - "some kind".

My understanding was that "DVD" was a trademark of some kind, so to
use it you have to sign up for the license conditions they impose. So
if you want to sell an "optical disk player", you can do what you want
(except for the MPEG patents).

On Tue, 23 Feb 2010 01:58:16 +1300, Stephen Worthington wrote:

> On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 06:44:16 +0000 (UTC), Sweetpea
> <> wrote:
>
>>On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 18:28:53 +1300, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>>
>>> In message <>, Sweetpea wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 12:11:44 +1300, Allistar wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing
>>>>>> conditions.
>>>>>
>>>>> Licensing what? The DVD specification? Is this protected by some
>>>>> kind of patent?
>>>>
>>>> Yes.
>>>>
>>>> some kind.
>>>
>>> Actually I think itÂ’s only the MPEG parts that are patented, the rest
>>> of the DVD spec is under NDA.
>>
>>Yes - that's what I said - "some kind".
>
> My understanding was that "DVD" was a trademark of some kind, so to use
> it you have to sign up for the license conditions they impose. So if
> you want to sell an "optical disk player", you can do what you want
> (except for the MPEG patents).

But if you don't license the MPEG patents then you can't play DVDs.

If you don't license and implement the DVD specification then you can't use the "DVD" logo. Likewise
you won't be able to legally decrypt the encryption on the DVD discs.


--
"Filtering the Internet is like trying to boil the ocean"

In message <>, Sweetpea wrote:

> But if you don't license the MPEG patents then you can't play DVDs.

There is lots of free software around that doesn’t license the MPEG patents,
that can play DVDs.

On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 18:30:20 +0000 (UTC), Sweetpea
<> wrote:

>On Tue, 23 Feb 2010 01:58:16 +1300, Stephen Worthington wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 06:44:16 +0000 (UTC), Sweetpea
>> <> wrote:
>>
>>>On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 18:28:53 +1300, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>>>
>>>> In message <>, Sweetpea wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 12:11:44 +1300, Allistar wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing
>>>>>>> conditions.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Licensing what? The DVD specification? Is this protected by some
>>>>>> kind of patent?
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes.
>>>>>
>>>>> some kind.
>>>>
>>>> Actually I think it?s only the MPEG parts that are patented, the rest
>>>> of the DVD spec is under NDA.
>>>
>>>Yes - that's what I said - "some kind".
>>
>> My understanding was that "DVD" was a trademark of some kind, so to use
>> it you have to sign up for the license conditions they impose. So if
>> you want to sell an "optical disk player", you can do what you want
>> (except for the MPEG patents).
>
>But if you don't license the MPEG patents then you can't play DVDs.
>
>If you don't license and implement the DVD specification then you can't use the "DVD" logo. Likewise
>you won't be able to legally decrypt the encryption on the DVD discs.

No, my understanding is that there are licenses you can get for the
MPEG patents that are not DVD specific. The rules requiring you to
obey a DVD's scripts and turn off things only come with the use of the
DVD trademark. As for the encryption, I am not sure. You can get
decryption to install into Linux systems, but whether you can sell
something that includes it, I do not know.

On Tue, 23 Feb 2010 21:45:14 +1300, Stephen Worthington wrote:

> As for the encryption, I am not sure. You can get decryption to install
> into Linux systems, but whether you can sell something that includes it,
> I do not know.

That CODEC is not legally usable in the USA.


--
"Filtering the Internet is like trying to boil the ocean"