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Wireless laptop problems

 
 
Randy and Ann
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Posts: n/a
 
      02-15-2010
Hi, my dad bought me a HP laptop and my sister a ASUS laptop last month that
both run off windows 7. We've had internet connection problems ever since
we got them. You all helped us once before and thought you could again. We
have a Net Gear WPN 824 router that connects wirelessly to our laptops.
The internet comes in from the wall through the wired cable modem to the
wireless router to the desktop computer. We made sure the security
encryption is WPA TKIP, since the guy at Best Buy said Windows 7 doesn't
like WPA. We have a total of 3 computers, 2 wirelessly connected to the
internet and one that isn't wireless. Our dad's computer is the oldest one
so it does not have windows 7. We did have my dad's computer and my sisters
laptop work at the same time but not all 3 at once. I'm 12 so I don't know
that much about computers, so if anybody has had this problem before or
could think of some solutions that could help get all 3 to work at the same
time that would be great, thanks in advanced.



Sometimes only the desktop works and sometime the desktop and my sisters
computer work. In the beginning, mine would connect too???



Thanks, Sam


 
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JD
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Posts: n/a
 
      02-15-2010
On 15/02/2010 12:13 PM, Randy and Ann wrote:
> Hi, my dad bought me a HP laptop and my sister a ASUS laptop last month that
> both run off windows 7. We've had internet connection problems ever since
> we got them. You all helped us once before and thought you could again. We
> have a Net Gear WPN 824 router that connects wirelessly to our laptops.
> The internet comes in from the wall through the wired cable modem to the
> wireless router to the desktop computer. We made sure the security
> encryption is WPA TKIP, since the guy at Best Buy said Windows 7 doesn't
> like WPA. We have a total of 3 computers, 2 wirelessly connected to the
> internet and one that isn't wireless. Our dad's computer is the oldest one
> so it does not have windows 7. We did have my dad's computer and my sisters
> laptop work at the same time but not all 3 at once. I'm 12 so I don't know
> that much about computers, so if anybody has had this problem before or
> could think of some solutions that could help get all 3 to work at the same
> time that would be great, thanks in advanced.
>
>
>
> Sometimes only the desktop works and sometime the desktop and my sisters
> computer work. In the beginning, mine would connect too???
>
>
>
> Thanks, Sam
>
>


Hi Sam.

it could be the router settings or it could be the laptop settings, I'd
start with the router as both the laptops are new and of different brands.

Try changing your Wireless Settings to WPA-PSK I'm using that with win7
it works fine, you might also want to change the default channel the
router uses as there might be a lot of traffic on the default channel
(channel 6 I think) Also check that DHCP is turned on.

try that and let us know how you get on.

JD
 
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Paul
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      02-15-2010
Randy and Ann wrote:
> Hi, my dad bought me a HP laptop and my sister a ASUS laptop last month that
> both run off windows 7. We've had internet connection problems ever since
> we got them. You all helped us once before and thought you could again. We
> have a Net Gear WPN 824 router that connects wirelessly to our laptops.
> The internet comes in from the wall through the wired cable modem to the
> wireless router to the desktop computer. We made sure the security
> encryption is WPA TKIP, since the guy at Best Buy said Windows 7 doesn't
> like WPA. We have a total of 3 computers, 2 wirelessly connected to the
> internet and one that isn't wireless. Our dad's computer is the oldest one
> so it does not have windows 7. We did have my dad's computer and my sisters
> laptop work at the same time but not all 3 at once. I'm 12 so I don't know
> that much about computers, so if anybody has had this problem before or
> could think of some solutions that could help get all 3 to work at the same
> time that would be great, thanks in advanced.
>
> Sometimes only the desktop works and sometime the desktop and my sisters
> computer work. In the beginning, mine would connect too???
>
> Thanks, Sam


I take it, first of all, that the wired machine is fault free ? It could be
important, to note any differences between the behavior of the wired machine
versus the wireless ones, because it may hint at the problems being purely
with the wireless part. If the wired computer always works, it means your router
and wired cable modem are working. And that is an important first step.

When you say "connect", you can do some basic connection setting and
troubleshooting, with the utilities built into Windows. These utilities
run in the Command Prompt (MSDOS) window. I presume Win7 still has something
like that, because otherwise, it would be pretty hard to run command prompt
type utilities.

"Connect" implies the ability to have basic TCP/IP connectivity. The ability
to send and receive packets between two computers.

Higher level functions, such as file sharing, have their own protocols, which
run on top of TCP/IP, and the TCP/IP has to work first, before you can get
something like file sharing working.

So, in terms of setting up your network, you debug and repair the bottom
layers of the protocol stack first, before you can work on the next layers up.

For wireless, you know that wireless security features require setup and
sharing of settings between wireless devices. You've set up your wireless
router, given it an SSID, set it up to use some level of security (WPA PSK
or Pre Shared Key). Perhaps a "secret" is shared by all networking devices,
that allows them to communicate. For the wireless devices to connect,
you wouldn't even begin to do any debugging, until those basics are set up
first on all the wireless devices.

Once you think the wireless part has been set up correctly, or you're using
wired connections, you can use some simple utilities for testing. In the
MSDOS window, try

ipconfig

That one returns the local IP address of the computer. If you look in
Settings:Network Connections and select the item doing the networking
at the moment (mine is Local Area Network, because I'm wired), there
is a Properties button. When you click Properties, there is a list
under "This connection uses the following items". The
"Internet Protocol (TCP/IP)" is the one you want there. When
you do "Properties" on that one, there are two tick boxes, saying
to "Obtain an IP address automatically" and "Obtain DNS server address
automatically". Those functions rely on DHCP. DHCP is a protocol
that allows your computer to reach the router, and the router can
manage a pool of local IP addresses to be handed out to the computers.

On the router, you'd set the DHCP server for some small number of
addresses, say 192.168.23.78 to 192.168.23.88 and every time one of
the computers connects to the router, it is going to be assigned an
IP address within that range.

Now, back to the ipconfig command. When you run ipconfig on your computer,
it should show the successful acquisition of an IP address.

Windows IP Configuration
...
IP Address . . . . . . . : 192.168.23.78

Now, say you have both of the laptops in front of you. The second laptop
may be reporting

Windows IP Configuration
...
IP Address . . . . . . . : 192.168.23.79

Now that you know the two addresses, you can run the "ping" command.
From the "78" machine, you could type

ping 192.168.23.79

and that checks that you can "reach" the second computer.

You can see in that example, that in the case of wireless, the test
is kinda bogus, in the sense that a lot of packets had to be
exchanged with the router, in order to even get that far. The
fact that DHCP worked, is proof your computer got as far as the router.

If DHCP didn't work, the address reported would be

IP Address . . . . . . . : 169.254.x.x

That is the "I don't know who I am" Windows address.

http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/aa505918.aspx

"the operating system uses APIPA to automatically configure its
network settings, assigning an IP address that is unique to the LAN."

and if you saw a 169.254.x.x range address, you'd suspect you
weren't successfully getting to the router at all. Meaning,
the wireless stuff cannot see the SSID of the router, use
secure connections or whatever.

Now, if you have been assigned an IP address from the DHCP
pool you set up on your router, and the "ping" command works,
the next test is DNS. Domain Name Server handles the translation
of "www.google.com" into IP numbers like 123.234.56.78. Again,
in your command prompt window, try something like the following

nslookup www.altavista.com <---- enter this

Server: UnKnown <---- and get this back
Address: 192.168.1.1

Name: avatw.search.a00.yahoodns.net
Address: 72.30.186.25
Aliases: www.altavista.com

Now, if I ping that address

ping 72.30.186.25

and there is a response to my packets, I'm connected
to the Internet. Ping bounces packets off that
public Internet address.

The reason "Server" is "UnKnown", is because the nslookup command
is processed by the router. The router, in turn, uses the DNS
server assigned by the ISP, to do the actual translation. The
router, then forwards that address to your computer. But since
the router does not have a public address (the 192.168.1.1 value
in my example), its address cannot be reverse translated to a symbolic
name, so it remains "UnKnown". If the computer was connected directly
to the Internet, without a router in place, the word "UnKnown" would
be replaced by the name if the ISP's DNS server.

Once "ping" on the Internet works, you can try this command, to see
all the public routers on the Internet, that routed your packet to
Altavista. This shows the hop-by-hop path taken.

tracert 72.30.186.25

On my computer right now, there are thirteen hops to get to the
Altavista server. The "traceroute" command shows the path the
packet takes, and sometimes you can see the packet is caught in
a routing loop or is otherwise broken. I've had a few day-long outages
here, where part of North America will be inaccessible to me. Some
"tracert" commands work normally, and others end in a vacuum when
the trace hits a part of the Internet which is broken.

*******

So that covers the layer above your WPA and SSID type stuff.

If you suspect the wireless part is broken, you're going to need
some tool which can show the status of the wireless connection,
what wireless router(s) are visible in your neighborhood and so on.

Above TCP/IP, you'd have things like File Sharing. For File Sharing
to work, the computers have to be able to authenticate one another,
to decide whether the files can be shared or not. Maybe someone else
knows some tricks for debugging that. It might involved things
like WORKGROUP value, having userids and passwords being the
same on all the computers, and the like.

HTH,
Paul
 
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Jeff Strickland
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      02-16-2010

"Randy and Ann" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:NTaen.82710$(E-Mail Removed)...
> Hi, my dad bought me a HP laptop and my sister a ASUS laptop last month
> that both run off windows 7. We've had internet connection problems ever
> since we got them. You all helped us once before and thought you could
> again. We have a Net Gear WPN 824 router that connects wirelessly to our
> laptops. The internet comes in from the wall through the wired cable modem
> to the wireless router to the desktop computer. We made sure the security
> encryption is WPA TKIP, since the guy at Best Buy said Windows 7 doesn't
> like WPA. We have a total of 3 computers, 2 wirelessly connected to the
> internet and one that isn't wireless. Our dad's computer is the oldest
> one so it does not have windows 7. We did have my dad's computer and my
> sisters laptop work at the same time but not all 3 at once. I'm 12 so I
> don't know that much about computers, so if anybody has had this problem
> before or could think of some solutions that could help get all 3 to work
> at the same time that would be great, thanks in advanced.
>
>
>
> Sometimes only the desktop works and sometime the desktop and my sisters
> computer work. In the beginning, mine would connect too???
>
>
>
> Thanks, Sam
>




I don't know of any reason why you would have problems with WEP encryption.
You should be able to connect your wireless machines without any problem,
EXCEPT that the router might not be up to the latest spec. Of course, I
assume you know the WEP key. I use WEP on my wireless network, not WPA. I
don't remember why, but I think it was recommended by my provider. In any
case, you tell the router a 10-digit key code, and then any wireless devices
within range also tell the router the same code, and the router lets them
in. You must choose 10 digits in the range of 0 through 9, plus A through
F -- a phone number with area code makes a good WEP key, just don't use your
own home phone. Use Grandma's phone number for a code that's easy to
remember. Once your machine has it, you don't need to keep entering it, but
if your cousin comes over with his computer, he will need to know the code
to use your Internet.

Wireless specification is defined by 802.11 (this is an international
specification). The problem is, there are several 802.11 specs, each one
faster than the previous, and with greater range. If your router is 802.11a,
but your new computers are 802.11n, then the new devices may not connect
reliably. The problem would be that the router is old, and the range and
speed are low. You should have an 802.11g or newer router. (There should be
a sticker on the router that gives the spec.)

Having said that, I had poor connections with my wireless router that I
fixed by upgrading the wireless adaptors in my PC. I installed 802.11n
wireless adaptors, and this made the connections speeds far better. The
802.11n adaptor has far greater sensitivity than the earlier version that it
replaced. You can't change the adaptor in your laptop, but you can improve
the router to the new specification for about $150.

Sometimes my router throws a hissy fit and won't talk to the machines. I
have to shut the router down then restart it, the machines then connect
properly. My router is provided by my service provider, so I do not go out
and buy them. If you guys bought your router, maybe you need a new one with
more range and faster speeds. You may just need to reboot the router. Turn
it off for 30 seconds, or so, then turn it back on.







 
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Randy and Ann
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      02-17-2010
Thanks for all the help. I had Dad replace the cable modem because the desk
top computer locked up sometimes. Then I got an error that said IP conflict
and that kicked the desktop computer offline and would not let the laptops
connect. I think the IP conflict is causing my problems, but am not sure how
to fix it. Can anyone help? I'm using Window's 7 on my and my sisters
laptops and I changed the settings on my laptop to WPA-Personal and
encryption type to TKIP.



I was able to copy this from the desktop:



Physical Address:

IP Address:

Subnet Mask:

Default Gateway:

DHCP Server:



I erased the numbers in case this could be used to hack into our computer.





I can't figure out how to find the IP address on the laptop and don't know
how to change them if it is the problem.



I WOULD REALLY LIKE SOME MORE HELP IF ANYONE HAS THE TIME.



Thank you, Sam



Oh, I almost forgot. JD, Paul and Jeff, Thank you for the help. Paul, you're
talking a little bit over my head. Can you make the steps a little more
simple please. Thanks, Sam









"James D. Andrews" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:hlhi8a$nun$(E-Mail Removed)...
>
> "Randy and Ann" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:NTaen.82710$(E-Mail Removed)...
>> Hi, my dad bought me a HP laptop and my sister a ASUS laptop last month
>> that both run off windows 7. We've had internet connection problems ever
>> since we got them. You all helped us once before and thought you could
>> again. We have a Net Gear WPN 824 router that connects wirelessly to our
>> laptops. The internet comes in from the wall through the wired cable
>> modem to the wireless router to the desktop computer. We made sure the
>> security encryption is WPA TKIP, since the guy at Best Buy said Windows 7
>> doesn't like WPA. We have a total of 3 computers, 2 wirelessly connected
>> to the internet and one that isn't wireless. Our dad's computer is the
>> oldest one so it does not have windows 7. We did have my dad's computer
>> and my sisters laptop work at the same time but not all 3 at once. I'm
>> 12 so I don't know that much about computers, so if anybody has had this
>> problem before or could think of some solutions that could help get all 3
>> to work at the same time that would be great, thanks in advanced.
>>
>>
>>
>> Sometimes only the desktop works and sometime the desktop and my sisters
>> computer work. In the beginning, mine would connect too???
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks, Sam

>
>
> Did anyone else catch that he's 12? Quite a lot for a 12 year old to jump
> into.
>
>
> --- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: http://www.velocityreviews.com/forums/(E-Mail Removed) ---



 
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Paul
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      02-18-2010
Randy and Ann wrote:
> Thanks for all the help. I had Dad replace the cable modem because the desk
> top computer locked up sometimes. Then I got an error that said IP conflict
> and that kicked the desktop computer offline and would not let the laptops
> connect. I think the IP conflict is causing my problems, but am not sure how
> to fix it. Can anyone help? I'm using Window's 7 on my and my sisters
> laptops and I changed the settings on my laptop to WPA-Personal and
> encryption type to TKIP.
>
>
>
> I was able to copy this from the desktop:
>
> Physical Address:
> IP Address:
> Subnet Mask:
> Default Gateway:
> DHCP Server:
>
> I erased the numbers in case this could be used to hack into our computer.
>
> I can't figure out how to find the IP address on the laptop and don't know
> how to change them if it is the problem.
>
> I WOULD REALLY LIKE SOME MORE HELP IF ANYONE HAS THE TIME.
>
> Thank you, Sam
>
> Oh, I almost forgot. JD, Paul and Jeff, Thank you for the help. Paul, you're
> talking a little bit over my head. Can you make the steps a little more
> simple please. Thanks, Sam


http://computing.chem.wisc.edu/help/ip-address.php

If you use the defaults, which look like this, the computer
gets its IP address from the router. The protocol used is
called DHCP.

http://computing.chem.wisc.edu/help/images/ip5.gif

By using DHCP, there is less chance of an address conflict.

The router may have some controls for DHCP, such as
the starting address, like 192.168.23.78 and the range of
numbers. You want enough numbers, for the number of computers
on your LAN. All that really counts there, is that DHCP is
enabled on the router, and then everyone should get an
address, from the pool of available addresses.

Apparently, the Smart Wizard on the router CD, will set up your
network control panel for DHCP (page 7). I'm surprised it
isn't already working properly. There isn't enough details
in the manual, for me to confuse you further in this regard.

ftp://downloads.netgear.com/files/WP...SM_22Aug07.pdf

You shouldn't be assigning an IP address manually in this dialog box,
as if you assign an address that conflicts with what DHCP hands
out, you'll get the symptoms you've got right now (potential conflict
between two computers). There can be good reasons to assign a static
address, but for just general surfing of the net, DHCP
(automatic IP address) is fine. All I use is DHCP here, and my panel
looks just like this.

http://computing.chem.wisc.edu/help/images/ip5.gif

Paul
 
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Jeff Strickland
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      02-18-2010

"Randy and Ann" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:f3%en.24$(E-Mail Removed)...
> Thanks for all the help. I had Dad replace the cable modem because the
> desk top computer locked up sometimes. Then I got an error that said IP
> conflict and that kicked the desktop computer offline and would not let
> the laptops connect. I think the IP conflict is causing my problems, but
> am not sure how to fix it. Can anyone help? I'm using Window's 7 on my and
> my sisters laptops and I changed the settings on my laptop to WPA-Personal
> and encryption type to TKIP.
>
>
>
> I was able to copy this from the desktop:
>
>
>
> Physical Address:
>
> IP Address:
>
> Subnet Mask:
>
> Default Gateway:
>
> DHCP Server:
>
>
>
> I erased the numbers in case this could be used to hack into our computer.
>
>
>
>
>
> I can't figure out how to find the IP address on the laptop and don't know
> how to change them if it is the problem.
>
>
>
> I WOULD REALLY LIKE SOME MORE HELP IF ANYONE HAS THE TIME.
>
>
>
> Thank you, Sam
>
>
>
> Oh, I almost forgot. JD, Paul and Jeff, Thank you for the help. Paul,
> you're talking a little bit over my head. Can you make the steps a little
> more simple please. Thanks, Sam
>
>
>


Click START>RUN and input IPCONFIG, press Enter. The result will be the IP
address of the machine. Wait, that might not work. If not, then click
START>RUN and input CMD. That will open a Command Prompt box, input
IPCONFIG, the result will be the address of the machine.

Your router should be named 192.168.1.1, and the machines will be named
192.168.1.2, 192.168.1.3, 192.168.1.4, and so on. You can go into the router
with your browser. Just input the router's IP address in the Address Box.
You may need to know the user name and password, try ADMIN, ADMIN, or ADMIN,
PASSWORD or PASSWORD1. These are commonly used defaults. When inside the
router, you can set the WEP code and make lots of changes. You can reset the
router to the default values too, which typically makes the MAC address into
the WEP key.







 
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Randy and Ann
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      02-20-2010
Paul,

Everything you typed below was o.k. on our computers.

Jeff,

I couldn't find anything wrong from what you typed either.
My dad and I decided to replace the wireless modem too and we're now online
with both laptops. We think the wireless modem was the problem even
though we ended up replacing both modems. I learned alot during these
adventures.

JEFF, PAUL AND EVERYONE WHO HELPED ME: THANK YOU. YOU GUYS ROCK!!!!

I REALL APPRECIATE IT!!!


THANKS, SAM


"Paul" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:hli2ev$su7$(E-Mail Removed)-september.org...
> Randy and Ann wrote:
>> Thanks for all the help. I had Dad replace the cable modem because the
>> desk top computer locked up sometimes. Then I got an error that said IP
>> conflict and that kicked the desktop computer offline and would not let
>> the laptops connect. I think the IP conflict is causing my problems, but
>> am not sure how to fix it. Can anyone help? I'm using Window's 7 on my
>> and my sisters laptops and I changed the settings on my laptop to
>> WPA-Personal and encryption type to TKIP.
>>
>>
>>
>> I was able to copy this from the desktop:
>>
>> Physical Address:
>> IP Address:
>> Subnet Mask:
>> Default Gateway:
>> DHCP Server:
>>
>> I erased the numbers in case this could be used to hack into our
>> computer.
>>
>> I can't figure out how to find the IP address on the laptop and don't
>> know how to change them if it is the problem.
>>
>> I WOULD REALLY LIKE SOME MORE HELP IF ANYONE HAS THE TIME.
>>
>> Thank you, Sam
>>
>> Oh, I almost forgot. JD, Paul and Jeff, Thank you for the help. Paul,
>> you're talking a little bit over my head. Can you make the steps a little
>> more simple please. Thanks, Sam

>
> http://computing.chem.wisc.edu/help/ip-address.php
>
> If you use the defaults, which look like this, the computer
> gets its IP address from the router. The protocol used is
> called DHCP.
>
> http://computing.chem.wisc.edu/help/images/ip5.gif
>
> By using DHCP, there is less chance of an address conflict.
>
> The router may have some controls for DHCP, such as
> the starting address, like 192.168.23.78 and the range of
> numbers. You want enough numbers, for the number of computers
> on your LAN. All that really counts there, is that DHCP is
> enabled on the router, and then everyone should get an
> address, from the pool of available addresses.
>
> Apparently, the Smart Wizard on the router CD, will set up your
> network control panel for DHCP (page 7). I'm surprised it
> isn't already working properly. There isn't enough details
> in the manual, for me to confuse you further in this regard.
>
> ftp://downloads.netgear.com/files/WP...SM_22Aug07.pdf
>
> You shouldn't be assigning an IP address manually in this dialog box,
> as if you assign an address that conflicts with what DHCP hands
> out, you'll get the symptoms you've got right now (potential conflict
> between two computers). There can be good reasons to assign a static
> address, but for just general surfing of the net, DHCP
> (automatic IP address) is fine. All I use is DHCP here, and my panel
> looks just like this.
>
> http://computing.chem.wisc.edu/help/images/ip5.gif
>
> Paul



 
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