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Nobody Uses 64-Bit Dimdows Browsers

 
 
Lawrence D'Oliveiro
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      01-21-2010
In message <(E-Mail Removed)>, Allistar wrote:

>> So far as I recall, I have never been asked in any 64 bit install
>> whether or not the 32 bit libraries should be installed. They just were.

>
> You've never installed Gentoo before then.


Or Debian.
 
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Enkidu
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      01-21-2010
Allistar wrote:
> Enkidu wrote:
>
>> Allistar wrote:
>>> Enkidu wrote:
>>>
>>>> Sweetpea wrote:
>>>>> On Tue, 19 Jan 2010 19:54:29 +1300, Enkidu wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Sweetpea wrote:
>>>>>>> On Mon, 18 Jan 2010 18:12:24 -0800, Nathan Mercer wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Jan 19, 12:20 pm, Lawrence D'Oliveiro <l...@geek-
>>>>>>>> central.gen.new_zealand> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> So much for Microsoft trumpeting the joys of 64-bit
>>>>>>>>> operating systems.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>

> <http://arstechnica.com/microsoft/news/2010/01/why-microsoft-isnt-work...>
>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> who cares? (apart from you?)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 64 bit Windows operating systems run 32 bit
>>>>>>>> applications like IE just fine
>>>>>>> Users can only run 32bit programs on 64 bit operating
>>>>>>> systems if those 64bit operating systems provide 32bit
>>>>>>> runtime libraries in addition tot he 64bit libraries -
>>>>>>> effectively needing 2 versions of the same OS installed.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So, in actual fact, NO a 32bit program CANNOT run on a
>>>>>>> 64bit OS without a 32bit runtime environment being
>>>>>>> installed.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Micro$oft clearly thinks that kludge is superior to
>>>>>>> biting the bullet and properly migrating to a clean 64bit
>>>>>>> environment.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> LOL - this is little more than a rerun of the 16bit/32bit
>>>>>>> Windows bullshit that micro$oft claimed was a 32bit
>>>>>>> operating system!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> This is exactly the same on Linux.
>>>>> Really?
>>>>>
>>>> Really. You cannot run 32 bit Linux apps on 64 bit Linux
>>>> without the 32 bit libraries being installed, and they get
>>>> installed by default when the OS is installed.
>>> Only if you want to to be.
>>>

>> So far as I recall, I have never been asked in any 64 bit install
>> whether or not the 32 bit libraries should be installed. They just
>> were.

>
> You've never installed Gentoo before then.
>

Not a 64 bit one, no. But I was talking about mainstream distros.

Cheers,

Cliff

--

The Internet is interesting in that although the nicknames may change,
the same old personalities show through.
 
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Enkidu
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      01-21-2010
Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> In message <(E-Mail Removed)>, Allistar wrote:
>
>>> So far as I recall, I have never been asked in any 64 bit install
>>> whether or not the 32 bit libraries should be installed. They just were.

>> You've never installed Gentoo before then.

>
> Or Debian.
>

I suppose, if you start from a minimal or network install of 64bit and
you carefully choose only 64 bit packages, then you *might* with a bit
of luck end up with a Debian 64 bit only system. But a normal install
will pull in 32 packages and the 32 bit libraries.

Cheers,

Cliff

--

The Internet is interesting in that although the nicknames may change,
the same old personalities show through.
 
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eyes
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      01-21-2010
On 21/01/2010 9:52 a.m., Nik Coughlin wrote:
> On 20/01/2010 8:00 pm, eyes wrote:
>> On 19/01/2010 8:15 p.m., Enkidu wrote:
>>> Sigh! 32 bit OS with 8GB of RAM, memory available for apps, approx
>>> 2.7GB. 64 bit OS with 8GB of RAM, almost 8GB available for apps.
>>>

>>
>> Now that depends on the OS. Its only XP/Vista/7 that artificially limits
>> 32 bit to 4GB max.

>
> A 32 bit processor can only directly access 4GB of RAM. I'd hardly call
> that artificial.
>
>


Except all current 32bit processors can access 36bits of RAM.

The problem is that some OSes cannot support more RAM in 32bit mode,
when others can. These leads to the myth that you MUST have a 64bit OS
to break the 4GB barrier.
 
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Enkidu
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      01-21-2010
eyes wrote:
> On 21/01/2010 9:52 a.m., Nik Coughlin wrote:
>> On 20/01/2010 8:00 pm, eyes wrote:
>>> On 19/01/2010 8:15 p.m., Enkidu wrote:
>>>> Sigh! 32 bit OS with 8GB of RAM, memory available for apps, approx
>>>> 2.7GB. 64 bit OS with 8GB of RAM, almost 8GB available for apps.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Now that depends on the OS. Its only XP/Vista/7 that artificially limits
>>> 32 bit to 4GB max.

>>
>> A 32 bit processor can only directly access 4GB of RAM. I'd hardly call
>> that artificial.

>
> Except all current 32bit processors can access 36bits of RAM.
>
> The problem is that some OSes cannot support more RAM in 32bit mode,
> when others can. These leads to the myth that you MUST have a 64bit OS
> to break the 4GB barrier.
>

Are you talking about PAE? Yes, that had slipped my mind.

Cheers,

Cliff

--

The Internet is interesting in that although the nicknames may change,
the same old personalities show through.
 
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Sweetpea
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      01-21-2010
On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 20:31:13 +1300, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:

> In message <(E-Mail Removed)>, Allistar
> wrote:
>
>>> So far as I recall, I have never been asked in any 64 bit install
>>> whether or not the 32 bit libraries should be installed. They just
>>> were.

>>
>> You've never installed Gentoo before then.

>
> Or Debian.


Or SuSE!


--
"Filtering the Internet is like trying to boil the ocean"
 
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Enkidu
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      01-21-2010
Sweetpea wrote:
> On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 20:31:13 +1300, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>
>> In message <(E-Mail Removed)>, Allistar
>> wrote:
>>
>>>> So far as I recall, I have never been asked in any 64 bit install
>>>> whether or not the 32 bit libraries should be installed. They just
>>>> were.
>>> You've never installed Gentoo before then.

>> Or Debian.

>
> Or SuSE!
>

Did you actually check to see if you have the 32 bit libraries?

Cheers,

Cliff

--

The Internet is interesting in that although the nicknames may change,
the same old personalities show through.
 
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Lawrence D'Oliveiro
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      01-21-2010
In message <4b585d10$(E-Mail Removed)>, Collector_NZ wrote:

> ... mind you maybe when I installed Firefox I got a 64 version ...


I think 64-bit Firefox is only available on open-source platforms.
 
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Lawrence D'Oliveiro
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      01-21-2010
In message <(E-Mail Removed)>, Sweetpea wrote:

> On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 20:31:13 +1300, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>
>> In message <(E-Mail Removed)>, Allistar
>> wrote:
>>
>>>> So far as I recall, I have never been asked in any 64 bit install
>>>> whether or not the 32 bit libraries should be installed. They just
>>>> were.
>>>
>>> You've never installed Gentoo before then.

>>
>> Or Debian.

>
> Or SuSE!


Default SuSE installs seem to pull in a lot of stuff. Here’s one of the only
two 64-bit SuSE installs I have done (from back when version 10.0 was
reasonably current):

digi2:~ # du -ks /mnt/lib*
167936 /mnt/lib
8888 /mnt/lib64
digi2:~ # du -ks /mnt/usr/lib*
715722 /mnt/usr/lib
591740 /mnt/usr/lib64

As you can see, there’s a whole lot of 32-bit stuff there. (Feel free to
correct me if you’ve done a newer 64-bit SuSE install.)

By comparison, here’s a fresh 64-bit Debian 5.0 install I did just
yesterday:

ldo@bardeen:~> du -ks /lib{32,64}/
2464 /lib32/
169016 /lib64/
ldo@bardeen:~> du -ks /usr/lib{32,64}/
6456 /usr/lib32/
252796 /usr/lib64/

As you can see, there’s hardly any 32-bit stuff there.
 
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Enkidu
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      01-22-2010
Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> In message <(E-Mail Removed)>, Sweetpea wrote:
>
>> On Thu, 21 Jan 2010 20:31:13 +1300, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>>
>>> In message <(E-Mail Removed)>, Allistar
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> So far as I recall, I have never been asked in any 64 bit install
>>>>> whether or not the 32 bit libraries should be installed. They just
>>>>> were.
>>>> You've never installed Gentoo before then.
>>> Or Debian.

>> Or SuSE!

>
> Default SuSE installs seem to pull in a lot of stuff. Here’s one of the only
> two 64-bit SuSE installs I have done (from back when version 10.0 was
> reasonably current):
>
> digi2:~ # du -ks /mnt/lib*
> 167936 /mnt/lib
> 8888 /mnt/lib64
> digi2:~ # du -ks /mnt/usr/lib*
> 715722 /mnt/usr/lib
> 591740 /mnt/usr/lib64
>
> As you can see, there’s a whole lot of 32-bit stuff there. (Feel free to
> correct me if you’ve done a newer 64-bit SuSE install.)
>
> By comparison, here’s a fresh 64-bit Debian 5.0 install I did just
> yesterday:
>
> ldo@bardeen:~> du -ks /lib{32,64}/
> 2464 /lib32/
> 169016 /lib64/
> ldo@bardeen:~> du -ks /usr/lib{32,64}/
> 6456 /usr/lib32/
> 252796 /usr/lib64/
>
> As you can see, there’s hardly any 32-bit stuff there.
>

"Hardly any"? Lennier was claiming that you only get the 32 bit
libraries if you select or request them!!

Cheers,

Cliff

--

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the same old personalities show through.
 
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