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LED light bulbs to cut energy bills by 75%

 
 
Peter M
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Rich80105@hotmail.com
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      01-30-2009
On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 11:26:18 +1300, "geoff" <(E-Mail Removed)>
wrote:

>Peter M wrote:
>> http://www.neowin.net/news/main/09/0...gy-bills-by-75

>
>A pretty lame, generalised, and inconcise article.
>
>geoff
>

It does demonstrate the value of research and development - which our
sub-prime minister decided was less important than boosting his net
earnings through a big tax cut.
 
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oneofus
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      01-30-2009
whoisthis wrote:
> In article <(E-Mail Removed)>,
> "I Love It!" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>> whoisthis wrote:
>>
>>>> Research and development should be funded by the companies
>>>> that make
>>>> a profit from such research. NOT by the long suffering
>>>> taxpayer.
>>> and yet patents held by government departments brings in tens
>>> of
>>> millions of dollars each year. Those held by companies can
>>> shift their
>>> profits to another country.

>> Spoken like a true commie.
>>
>> Those profits are NOT yours!

>
> spoken like a true fool.
> Samsung has about 100,000 employees world wide but has larger GDP than
> New Zealand. If we had ONE company like that New Zealanders would be
> among the wealthiest in the world. And no, its not the taxes which is
> doing this, Finland for example has higher taxes, yet they make their
> own fighter aircraft, warships, have higher education and living
> standards, and they have the same population as NZ.


Definitely even more stupid to suggest that Samsung has a Gross Domestic
Product
If we had Samsung we would have the worlds largest conglomerate by revenue.
Which by the way has 263000 employees
It would be nice to have the option but its like saying "If we were
South Korea" or "If I had a bigger dick"
 
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Brian Dooley
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      01-30-2009
On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 20:40:45 +1300, whoisthis <(E-Mail Removed)>
wrote:

snip---

>Finland for example has higher taxes, yet they make their
>own fighter aircraft,


No they don't

>warships,


4 Patrol boats about the size of the RNZN IPVs

>have higher education and living
>standards,


Debatable

>and they have the same population as NZ.


5.25 million
--

Brian Dooley

Wellington New Zealand
 
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oneofus
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      01-30-2009
whoisthis wrote:
> In article <glufg3$5u5$(E-Mail Removed)>,
> oneofus <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>> whoisthis wrote:
>>> In article <(E-Mail Removed)>,
>>> "I Love It!" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>>
>>>> whoisthis wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> Research and development should be funded by the companies
>>>>>> that make
>>>>>> a profit from such research. NOT by the long suffering
>>>>>> taxpayer.
>>>>> and yet patents held by government departments brings in tens
>>>>> of
>>>>> millions of dollars each year. Those held by companies can
>>>>> shift their
>>>>> profits to another country.
>>>> Spoken like a true commie.
>>>>
>>>> Those profits are NOT yours!
>>> spoken like a true fool.
>>> Samsung has about 100,000 employees world wide but has larger GDP than
>>> New Zealand. If we had ONE company like that New Zealanders would be
>>> among the wealthiest in the world. And no, its not the taxes which is
>>> doing this, Finland for example has higher taxes, yet they make their
>>> own fighter aircraft, warships, have higher education and living
>>> standards, and they have the same population as NZ.

>> Definitely even more stupid to suggest that Samsung has a Gross Domestic
>> Product
>> If we had Samsung we would have the worlds largest conglomerate by revenue.
>> Which by the way has 263000 employees
>> It would be nice to have the option but its like saying "If we were
>> South Korea" or "If I had a bigger dick"

>
> Well south Korea can help you with your dick... well at least all the
> spam I get indicates they can


You can buy Samsung too
http://eng.krx.co.kr/mki/stc/stc_d_0...su_cd=A005935v
 
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Squiggle
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      01-31-2009
whoisthis threw some characters down the intarwebs:
>
>
> Libertarians are OK with monopolies who can charge what they like, after
> all its their money. It is also OK with libertarians for monopolies to
> charge one group more because there is no competition so they can
> subsidize other business interests.
> Equally, libertarians are happy with a few shareholders having the power
> to dictate to smaller shareholders what the direction of the company
> will be, how much the directors will be paid (Huge bonuses even when
> they **** it up). It is perfectly OK for 4-5 people to have more voting
> rights than the other 1000 share holders.
>

And why should they not, if they have invested hundreds of thousands of
dollars in buying a large interest in that company should they not have
more control over what is done with their money than Joe Bloggs that has
$100 of shares in that company? If Joe Bloggs isn't happy he can sell
his shares and invest in a company that is doing what he wants. And if
he sells his shares at a low price just to be rid of them it drops the
value of those shares still held by the larger investors. So its in
everybodys interest that all moves are made in the best interest of
company/shareholdrs. And don't forget that if the guy with 45% of the
company votes to pay Director X $300,000 in bonuses he is paying 45% of
that $300,000 ($135000) while Joe Bloggs with 1% of the company is only
paying $3000 from his share of the company.
Thats the way shareholding works, If you don't like the game, don't
play. Unlike govt taxation that is an option you have available to you.

> So long as you call it a business, it can be as nasty as it likes when
> it has a monopoly and thats OK, and it has more than enough money to
> kill off any competition. Its also OK for small groups to dictate to
> large groups.
>


Name one monopoly in NZ that is not Govt owned/controlled.

> On this basis it would be perfectly OK for businesses to charge people
> differing amounts for the same job... based on their ability to pay, and
>
> this indeed does happen. For example a commercial building costs more
>
> per square meter to build than a residential building, even though there
> are generally fewer services and internal walls.

And those that are paying more for the same work have noone to blame but
themselves, noone forced them to use XYZ ripoffs Ltd. , they can shop
around, or they can hire their own staff to do the work and maybe even
diversify into a new field.

> So,
> Monopolies are good, in fact thats proof of being good in business.
> A few dictating to the majority is also good
> Charging on the perceived ability to pay is good
>
> yet
> Government is a monopoly
> A few can not dictate, we all get the same vote
> They charge based on the perceived ability to pay.
>


The Govt is a monopoly, you cannot chose not to do business with them,
and nor can you go into competition with them. That is a fairly major
difference.


> The only difference between what we have now and what the libertarians
> want is power, they see themselves at the top being able to dictate to
> those below them, only they call it freedom, they use financial
> compulsion to get what they want.

It is freedom, if you have the choice of who you wish to do business with.

> By making education unaffordable to
> the poor the guarantee a cheap labour force, by making health care
> unaffordable they can use that as a carrot "work for me for $1 an hour
> and you will get basic health care". All this time you are free to say
> no and starve.
>

Except you of course ignore the fact that employers don't want
uneducated employees, they make too many ****ups, can't think for
themselves and are unreliable. So in the end the businesses would end up
paying those costs in having to educate themselves not to **** things
up. Personally I prefer that the state provides basic education and
health care and am quite happy to pay taxes for those. Sure there are a
few jobs that require no skill, but most of those jobs are the sort of
jobs that can be replaced by modern automation.


> Libertarians cant get over the fact that we are all shareholders in our
> country, and every 3 years or so we get to vote in broad terms what we
> expect our government (board of directors) to do with our money, this in
> effect, just like a company means not everyone gets what they want.
>

Except we don't have the option of selling shares in this company, or to
be more precise, not buying more shares in it at whatever price it
dictates we will pay.

> For example, telecommunications is now an essential service, no business
> can survive without it, as a shareholder in Telstra I voted on certain
> things, the majority won, I have to live with the consequences of this.
>

Or you can sell your shares and invest in another telco, or another
industry.

> Equally well, we can look at the finance company collapses, the
> shareholders of the company were the only ones with voting rights, the
> investors whose money the company was using had no voting rights at all
> and in the end they were the losers by hundreds of millions of dollars.
>


Amazing what happens when you combine greed and ignorance with the sheer
stupidity of believing that what goes up doesn't come down. Housing (and
most other) markets are cyclic, always has been, probably always will
be. The only thing that changes is the length of the cycles and how high
the peaks are.

> Lets look at the apartment scandal in Auckland. Turns out that some
> companies had the proviso that if they did not finish on time the
> investors got their money back. And they did. The company recognized
> that during the build (where the investors had paid all the costs) the
> apartments had actually become MORE valuable than what they were
> originally sold for, so they delayed finishing by a week, gave the money
> back to people who thought it was their home that was being built and
> then on sold the apartments at a greater profit, leaving the investors
> with no home and no profit on their money.
>

I would've thought you'd read the ****ing contract when you are dealing
with serious amounts of cash. And then think about what it means. Or
paid somebody to do the thinking for you.

> In the libertarian world, there are no restraints and this behavior will
> be common place.
>
> There is also no guarantee that you will get any return on your shares,
> goldcorp being a good example.
>

The sharemarket is nothing more than institutionalised gambling. And
the gambler doesn't have the cards in his hand unless he has paid to buy
them . Like all gambles sometimes you lose. If you want a guaranteed
return there are term deposits and govt bonds.

> Yet, we invest in our country through taxes, we get education, health,
> welfare, transport, law and order, armed forces.... we ALL get a return.
>


But we don't get a choice in how much we are willing to invest. Some get
told that 39% of your next hours work will be invested whether you like
it or not. Meanwhile, J Bloggs next door is being told, "oh, you have
chosen to have kids, and you choose to work only 40hrs a week.. don't
worry, we'll only make you invest 19%, and then we'll give most of that
back as a WFF handout". And that WFF handout (dividend) is only paid out
to some investors. You'd be right ****ed off if a company you choose to
invest in said this year we are only paying dividends to people who live
in brick and tile houses with red letterboxes. Why should the Govt get
any special leeway in that regard?
>
> Look at all the rip offs and scams that happen now, imagine what it will
> be like with no restraint.

There would also be no ability of established businesses to lobby (buy)
govt to create regulations that are so expensive to comply with that
nobody can afford to try to break into the market. Using endless RMA
appeals to block the competition eg. the North Shore (Sunnybrae?)
Pak'n'Save.

There is an ideal point that balances the govt having enough power to
protect the public from their own greed and stupidity while staying far
enough out of the way to enable innovation and competition.

> In the libertarian world the individual at
> the bottom has no control, recourse or choice, in our world our
> government can compete with big business financially and ensuring laws
> keep the playing field as even as it can be.
>

No, the government does not compete with big business financially, it
dictates to it. Apart from that you are right, in NZ the playing field
is reasonably level, but slopes one way for a while, then the other way
for a while when we change govts.

 
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Gordon
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      02-01-2009
On 2009-01-31, whoisthis <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> In article <(E-Mail Removed)>,
> "I Love It!" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>> whoisthis wrote:
>> > In article <(E-Mail Removed)>,
>> > "I Love It!" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>> >
>> >> whoisthis wrote:
>> >>> In article <(E-Mail Removed)>,
>> >>> "I Love It!" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>>> blah blah blah, abuse, blah blah blah...
>> >>>>> Please go to a country, island, platform,boat that allows
>> >>>>> you
>> >>>>> to live
>> >>>>> your life as you wish.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Get ****ed you dictating communist pig! It's YOU thet needs
>> >>>> to
>> >>>> **** off. Cuba would be ideal for you.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>> This country, its people and its life style do
>> >>>>> not suit you.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Wrong. It is communist arseholes like YOU that don't suit me
>> >>>> or
>> >>>> the welfare of this country.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> It's YOU that needs to **** off!
>> >>>
>> >>> Its interesting isnt it.
>> >>
>> >> No it's NOT!
>> >>
>> >> Get out of our country you filthy communist pig. Go live in
>> >> Cuba.
>> >> Suits your demented evil ideology better.
>> >
>> > wow, what a winning personality... yeah right.

>>
>> Personality has nothing to do with it. You are indeed a dictating
>> communist pig.
>>
>> Govt interference in the market is always a disaster. It creates
>> imbalances and distortions which result in negative results. That
>> you cannot fathom that out is no surprise at all.
>>
>> ALL your assertions are no justification for you dictating to
>> people. ALL your assertions are generalisations and are NOT the
>> general rule.
>>
>> Just because you have govt dictating, or, libertarian freedom,
>> does NOT mean everyone will behave ethically.
>>
>> But your beloved communism/socialism is a proven failure.
>> Otherwise why don't we have the nirvana you are calling for?
>>
>> People are not perfect. You cannot regulate for them to be so. No
>> matter how many hundreds of thousands of laws, rules,
>> regulations, Police and Jackboots you put in place.
>>
>> But don't let the facts of 'reality' get in the way of your
>> demented hate-filled anti-business anti-life anti-freedom
>> power-tripping agenda.
>>
>> You have a real nasty chip on your shoulder and seek to destroy
>> anything you see others have that is good.
>>
>> By the way, how many slum people have you invited to live in your
>> home?
>>
>> You claim you help them but refuse to name them or explain
>> *exactly* what you personally did to help them.
>>
>> You are a fake. A liar and a cheat. Definitely not to be trusted.

>
> You have claimed I am a liar and a cheat. Please prove it, after all you
> have made a very specific accusations. I know you can't, and you know
> you cant either.


Bait taken then eh?

>
> I currently have a solo mum in one house, and my intellectually
> handicapped son in the other, and we are working with Support Links to
> get a flatmate for him ( they were also very helpful in finding him his
> current job). I take time out to take my son to golf and golf lessons
> each week. My partner has a professional ambulance officer renting hers
> as it is in a very quiet area and she often sleeps days, and we are
> considering buying another 1 or 2 for the rest of our kids to be able to
> move into as they leave school and into work.
>
> lots of my friends who I met in these various organizations are in their
> own businesses, yet they still contribute their time to the community. I
> got into St John because my father was the chairman of its trust and the
> person who was my best man at my wedding had been an officer for some
> years, he did some 20 years with St John and now is a volunteer
> firebrigade officer for about 12 years. These are the people I respect,
> the people who build stronger communities and families.


Gosh, yes life is not fair. Even the late CEO of MS knew that.

Pity, one can take things like this to e-mail these days. Spam rules, okay.
Uh
 
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Carnations
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      02-01-2009
>> "I Love It!" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>
>>> Govt interference in the market is always a disaster. It creates
>>> imbalances and distortions which result in negative results.


Can you explain, therefore, why the "Govt" of the most capitalist nation
on the planet recently chose to deliberately interfere in their economy
to the tune of 700 BILLIONS of USian dollars?

Isn't that just a little wee bit excessive? Surely those fine capitalist
enterprises should have been left alone to their devices without
interference from a "Communist pig" like Dubbya Bush?


--
"Filtering the Internet is like trying to boil the ocean"
 
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Stephen Worthington
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      02-01-2009
On Sun, 1 Feb 2009 06:40:09 +0000 (UTC), Carnations
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>>> "I Love It!" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Govt interference in the market is always a disaster. It creates
>>>> imbalances and distortions which result in negative results.

>
>Can you explain, therefore, why the "Govt" of the most capitalist nation
>on the planet recently chose to deliberately interfere in their economy
>to the tune of 700 BILLIONS of USian dollars?
>
>Isn't that just a little wee bit excessive? Surely those fine capitalist
>enterprises should have been left alone to their devices without
>interference from a "Communist pig" like Dubbya Bush?


Calling the USA capitalist is a misnomer of the highest order. They
have a protected, regulated and subsidised economy, not a classic
capitalist one. The latest massive bailouts are nothing more than
continuing a long tradition on non-capitalist economic processes. The
NZ economy is much closer to capitalism than the US one, as we are far
more open to market forces.
 
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Mike Dee
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      02-01-2009
On Sun, 01 Feb 2009 06:40:09 +0000, Carnations wrote:

[...]
> Can you explain...


I rather know how this drivel got leaked into nz.comp

--
dee

 
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