degree or certification?

I want to know if it is better to take a college/university degree or get
certified for A+ N+ and MCSA.
Or is it best to get both.
What do employers look for?

Does Mike Meyers still hang out here.

Ben

"Michael" <> wrote in message
news:839Uc.1618$ ink.net...
> Ben wrote:
>
> > I want to know if it is better to take a college/university degree
or get
> > certified for A+ N+ and MCSA.
> > Or is it best to get both.
> > What do employers look for?
> >
> > Does Mike Meyers still hang out here.
>
> Do whichever you like. I will say the certs are absolutely
worthless
> outside of IT. The college degree carries more weight in other
fields.
>
> michael

indeed. there are many jobs out there where they say "bachelor's
degree required", and what that means is you could have a BS/A in
diddlysquat, but just because you have a piece of paper, you get the
job. probably has something to do with companies realizing that HS
grads are morons (especially public school grads) and that one is
actually forced to use his head in college. doesnt matter what you
have a degree *in* as long as you *have* a degree.

not to mention, you wont be banging sorority sisters at keggers at the
sylvan learning center
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Solomon Kozanski

On Sat, 28 Aug 2004 10:45:35 -0400, "Solomon Kozanski"
<> wrote:

>
>"Michael" <> wrote in message
>news:839Uc.1618$ link.net...
>> Ben wrote:
>>
>> > I want to know if it is better to take a college/university degree
>or get
>> > certified for A+ N+ and MCSA.
>> > Or is it best to get both.
>> > What do employers look for?
>> >
>> > Does Mike Meyers still hang out here.
>>
>> Do whichever you like. I will say the certs are absolutely
>worthless
>> outside of IT. The college degree carries more weight in other
>fields.
>>
>> michael
>
>indeed. there are many jobs out there where they say "bachelor's
>degree required", and what that means is you could have a BS/A in
>diddlysquat

A degree is recognized for what it is...a long-term effort to achieve
a goal.

Tom

>, but just because you have a piece of paper, you get the
>job. probably has something to do with companies realizing that HS
>grads are morons (especially public school grads) and that one is
>actually forced to use his head in college. doesnt matter what you
>have a degree *in* as long as you *have* a degree.
>
>not to mention, you wont be banging sorority sisters at keggers at the
>sylvan learning center

Tom MacIntyre

"Bobster123" <> wrote in message
news:...
> >>"Michael" <> wrote in message
> >>news:839Uc.1618$ hlink.net...
> >>> Ben wrote:
> >>>
> >>> > I want to know if it is better to take a college/university
degree
> >>or get
> >>> > certified for A+ N+ and MCSA.
> >>> > Or is it best to get both.
> >>> > What do employers look for?
>
>
> I would say do both. Find a college program where you can take the
> certification exams as you complete the courses in the degree.
>
> If I had to choose- I'd say get the college degree. Certifications
don't carry
> anywhere near the weight they did five years ago.

indeed. anybody can memorize a table of processor FSB speeds, but
knowing exactly *why* and what ramifications this has... some things
you only learn in college, like, for example, peecees suck and macs
and amigas rule.

if i were an employer who needed comp techs, i would most likely hire
people off the street for $8/hr who know something about computers,
give them training to bring them up to the level of A+, and simply not
acknowledge the existance or credibility of comptia certs. allow me
to elaborate:

you create your own "tech+" certification system for your company (no
flames from ham ops please) based on comptia's A+

you hire people for $6/hr as computer technician trainees/apprentices
with the understanding that when they complete your BS in-house tech
training, they get a buck or so raise (or 25 cents, whatever you can
get away with - haha, imagine getting $15/hr pc techs for $7!)

give them the opportunity to take the tests at any time to get that
raise and cert. this saves you money by not having to acknowledge or
pay inflated prevailing tech wages to those who already have the A+
and also saves them money by graciously giving them a tech job with a
moderate wage and not having to pay for the high priced tests.

the only thing you need to do is orally screen your applicants to make
sure they're minimally competent and can actually *learn* (those of
you who dont know how to screen applicants have no business in
business)

its quite ironic that the computer industry would create a
certification so they can ensure their staff conform to some minimum
standard only to have it blow up in their faces creating a class of
technicians who demand more money because of a letter - not that they
don't deserve the higher wage, but that depends solely on which side
of the employee/employer equation you sit.

oh and the other side effect to this is that your employees cannot
expect competitors to recognize their fly-by-night certification from
timbuktu inc., thus reducing your turnover and your price to earnings
ratio. remember, comptia has neither authority nor regulatory power!

i would have made a much better satan.
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Solomon Kozanski

"Barry Watzman" <> wrote in message
news:...
> The same? No. But BETTER, if the job opening was for an executive
chef.
>
> The best doctor in the world can't write a legal brief, and the best
> attorney can't do surgery. And neither could configure a LAN from
> scratch with 4 servers and 150 clients.

the best doctor and the best attorney in the world can certainly LEARN
to write legal briefs, practice surgery AND configure a LAN from
scratch with 4 servers and 150 clients (btw, surgery and law require
WAY MORE skill/intellect than tinkering with transistors)
--
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Solomon Kozanski

"Developwebsites" <> wrote in message
news:...
> > probably has something to do with companies realizing that HS
> >grads are morons (especially public school grads)
>
>
> so how do public colleges such as those in CUNY compare to private
ones such as
> NYU, Harvard, MIT, Pace, Columbia, Yale, etc.?

they compare poorly

> could I have a BS/BA in cooking from Hunter college with a 3.99gpa
and claim
> its the same as a BA in law from Harvard?

hahaha... keep dreaming. just remember, the world is run on three
things: bullsh*t, oil, and ivy league intellect. remove any one and
the whole thing will come tumbling down
--
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Solomon Kozanski

On Tue, 7 Sep 2004 09:14:21 -0400, "Solomon Kozanski"
<> wrote:

>
>"Barry Watzman" <> wrote in message
>news:...
>> The same? No. But BETTER, if the job opening was for an executive
>chef.
>>
>> The best doctor in the world can't write a legal brief, and the best
>> attorney can't do surgery. And neither could configure a LAN from
>> scratch with 4 servers and 150 clients.
>
>the best doctor and the best attorney in the world can certainly LEARN
>to write legal briefs, practice surgery AND configure a LAN from
>scratch with 4 servers and 150 clients (btw, surgery and law require
>WAY MORE skill/intellect than tinkering with transistors)

I don't know if he's a surgeon, but a few years back a doctor in my
area called the electronics repair shop where I worked every time he
came back home from vacation. The reason...he needed his VCR's, TV's,
converters, etc. reprogrammed. Instead of way more, maybe different
skill and intellect?

Tom

Tom MacIntyre

I think your way of saying it is better Tom. No skill requires more talent
or "intellect" than another. Just a different type. I know people who are
whizzes when it comes to cars but would not know how to do something as
simple as install more RAM inside a computer.
I am sure some medical professionals would be the same way.

CLV3

"Tom MacIntyre" <> wrote in message
news:...
> I don't know if he's a surgeon, but a few years back a doctor in my
> area called the electronics repair shop where I worked every time he
> came back home from vacation. The reason...he needed his VCR's,
TV's,
> converters, etc. reprogrammed. Instead of way more, maybe different
> skill and intellect?
>
> Tom

more like sloth, indifference, and/or ego (i'm a doctor, i'm too good
to program my VCR! muhahaha!)
--
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Solomon Kozanski

On Wed, 8 Sep 2004 08:53:47 -0400, "Solomon Kozanski"
<> wrote:

>
>"Tom MacIntyre" <> wrote in message
>news:.. .
>> I don't know if he's a surgeon, but a few years back a doctor in my
>> area called the electronics repair shop where I worked every time he
>> came back home from vacation. The reason...he needed his VCR's,
>TV's,
>> converters, etc. reprogrammed. Instead of way more, maybe different
>> skill and intellect?
>>
>> Tom
>
>more like sloth, indifference, and/or ego (i'm a doctor, i'm too good
>to program my VCR! muhahaha!)

Not the case here.

Tom

Tom MacIntyre