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Water Damage Info!

 
 
Yummy
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Posts: n/a
 
      09-12-2003
One of my clients roofs colapsed tonight from heavy rains. About 10-15
PC's plus possibly network equipment may have damage. I can't get into
the building till its been cleared by engineers.

While I'm waiting, what is the success rate of restoring the PC's, and
what is the best way of going about it?

Yummy
 
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RussS
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Posts: n/a
 
      09-12-2003
I strongly suggest insurance replacing them completely. I have seen water
damage many times where the ,achine is brought back to life successfully
only to fail 3 months or more down the line. Water has many minerals and
chemicals in it that can eat away at the MoBo or etching on the CPU in a way
that is virtually invisible to the eye.
Your client may thank you initially, but will abuse the heck out of you if
6-9 mths later many of their machines have died and there is no insurance on
them. As Clint Eastwood says - Do ya feel lucky?


 
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Tom MacIntyre
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Posts: n/a
 
      09-12-2003
On Fri, 12 Sep 2003 03:17:24 GMT, Yummy
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>One of my clients roofs colapsed tonight from heavy rains. About 10-15
>PC's plus possibly network equipment may have damage. I can't get into
>the building till its been cleared by engineers.
>
>While I'm waiting, what is the success rate of restoring the PC's, and
>what is the best way of going about it?
>
>Yummy


It's very difficult to say from a distance, but I will say that, in my
experience, water damage, especially with whatever minerals may have
been present in the water from the contact with the roof, etc, is
potentially catastrophic, short, medium and long-term, to any
electronics. We would not guarantee any water damage repair we did,
and that was told to customers up-front. Any residue at all left on a
circuit board has the capability of etching/eroding component leads
and circuit traces that aren't protected, and when the power is there
the problems are worse.

The approach we took to cleaning up any repair like this was a
toothbrush or similar and alcohol. There are other commercial cleaning
products as well.

This is going to depend on how much water got at the equipment, how
long the exposure was, whether the equipment was on or off, etc.
Monitors should be taken to a TV/monitor repair shop without an
attempt being made to turn them on, to be "hosed down" with alcohol,
or whatever that shop uses (the vent holes make them certain victims
of water damage). PC's should be examined very closely, and dealt with
accordingly. It is possible that the PC's themselves, if on desks
rather than the floor, have sustained minimal damage. Any in-line
power supply that is not sealed (for example, with a detachable AC
cord), should probably be thrown away, or at least tested rigourously.

You may want to float this by the good folks at

sci.electronics.repair

after you have assessed the situation. Good luck.

Tom
 
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Ghost
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      09-13-2003
In article <(E-Mail Removed)>, Navin R. Johnson
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> On Fri, 12 Sep 2003 03:17:24 GMT, Yummy
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
> >One of my clients roofs colapsed tonight from heavy rains. About 10-15
> >PC's plus possibly network equipment may have damage. I can't get into
> >the building till its been cleared by engineers.
> >
> >While I'm waiting, what is the success rate of restoring the PC's, and
> >what is the best way of going about it?
> >
> >Yummy

>
> You'll definitely want to recommend total replacement, especially if the
> equipment stayed wet for an extended period. Make a list of all the
> damaged items, with replacement costs, so the client can submit it to
> their insurance company. As for data recovery, all the hard drives
> should be removed ASAP then thoroughly rinsed with distilled water.
> Afterwards, hang them up and let a fan blow on them overnight. You
> should be able to get them all running again to retrieve their data.


err... do *NOT* rinse the HDD in any water whatsoever!!!

If the roof collapse and the PCs got wet- big deal- replace them. The HDD
likely did not get wet- or if they did, probably not too bad considering
their location inside a PC. By rinsing them off (thereby concentrating
water on them), you WILL contaminate them- remember they have breathing
holes which will allow water- distilled or otherwise- to get inside. That
will destroy the platters and data recovery will likely not be possible
after that. If there is even microsocopic surface corrosion, the data
will be irretrievable.

Navin, even if you were successful in the past with rinsing HDDs, I would
call that blind luck! It is not something I would try. In fact, I might
try an experiment though- I might take a few of the dead drives we have
laying around and try a few things with those- just to see how fast the
platters visibly corrode.




>
> I had exactly the same scenario with one of my customers about a year
> ago. Their insurance company accepted my damage list and repair
> estimates and paid the entire cost - I even added extra charges for
> overtime emergency service and all the time spent checking out the
> damaged equipment. That was the single largest check I deposited in all
> my 13 years of PC service - over 27K$ - and about half of it was for my
> labor.


Wouldnt it be nice if ALL our checks for 27k!!! lol

My largest was for a re-networking job and that bill was for about 58k I think.

I need to get a few more of those.. lol
 
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Ghost
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      09-13-2003
In article <(E-Mail Removed)>,
http://www.velocityreviews.com/forums/(E-Mail Removed) wrote:

> On Fri, 12 Sep 2003 03:17:24 GMT, Yummy
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
> >One of my clients roofs colapsed tonight from heavy rains. About 10-15
> >PC's plus possibly network equipment may have damage. I can't get into
> >the building till its been cleared by engineers.
> >
> >While I'm waiting, what is the success rate of restoring the PC's, and
> >what is the best way of going about it?
> >
> >Yummy

>
> It's very difficult to say from a distance, but I will say that, in my
> experience, water damage, especially with whatever minerals may have
> been present in the water from the contact with the roof, etc, is
> potentially catastrophic, short, medium and long-term, to any
> electronics. We would not guarantee any water damage repair we did,
> and that was told to customers up-front. Any residue at all left on a
> circuit board has the capability of etching/eroding component leads
> and circuit traces that aren't protected, and when the power is there
> the problems are worse.
>
> The approach we took to cleaning up any repair like this was a
> toothbrush or similar and alcohol. There are other commercial cleaning
> products as well.
>
> This is going to depend on how much water got at the equipment, how
> long the exposure was, whether the equipment was on or off, etc.
> Monitors should be taken to a TV/monitor repair shop without an
> attempt being made to turn them on, to be "hosed down" with alcohol,
> or whatever that shop uses (the vent holes make them certain victims
> of water damage). PC's should be examined very closely, and dealt with
> accordingly. It is possible that the PC's themselves, if on desks
> rather than the floor, have sustained minimal damage. Any in-line
> power supply that is not sealed (for example, with a detachable AC
> cord), should probably be thrown away, or at least tested rigourously.
>
> You may want to float this by the good folks at
>
> sci.electronics.repair
>
> after you have assessed the situation. Good luck.
>
> Tom


"float"????
 
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Ghost
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      09-13-2003
In article <(E-Mail Removed)>, Navin R. Johnson
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 02:50:21 GMT, (E-Mail Removed) (Ghost) wrote:
>
> >snip

>
> >err... do *NOT* rinse the HDD in any water whatsoever!!!
> >
> >If the roof collapse and the PCs got wet- big deal- replace them. The HDD
> >likely did not get wet- or if they did, probably not too bad considering
> >their location inside a PC. By rinsing them off (thereby concentrating
> >water on them), you WILL contaminate them- remember they have breathing
> >holes which will allow water- distilled or otherwise- to get inside. That
> >will destroy the platters and data recovery will likely not be possible
> >after that. If there is even microsocopic surface corrosion, the data
> >will be irretrievable.
> >
> >Navin, even if you were successful in the past with rinsing HDDs, I would
> >call that blind luck! It is not something I would try. In fact, I might
> >try an experiment though- I might take a few of the dead drives we have
> >laying around and try a few things with those- just to see how fast the
> >platters visibly corrode.
> >

>
> Very successful - in fact 100% data recovery from 16 wet hard drives.
> The water that flooded the place was very muddy and the drives were
> totally submerged in it for at least a few hours. The breather holes
> were all clogged with mud and anyway, there's a filter that should have
> kept any water or mud out - and apparently it did. My thinking was that
> the mud and silt could have shorted something on the controller board
> and since the drives were already soaked it couldn't hurt them anymore
> to rinse them off. I guess it didn't. One more thing, I did sneak one of
> the 'wet' drives out before the insurance company came to inventory and
> collect the damaged equipment. It was a 60GB Maxtor DiamondMax and it's
> still running right now in one of my test systems.... Go figure.
>
> NRJ
>
>
>
>
>
> "Very funny Scotty..... Now beam down my clothes!"


Navin,

I will have to bow to that experience... It seems incredible that was
even possible.

All I can say is.. "WOW"...
 
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Tom MacIntyre
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      09-13-2003
On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 02:51:26 GMT, (E-Mail Removed) (Ghost) wrote:

>In article <(E-Mail Removed)>,
>(E-Mail Removed) wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 12 Sep 2003 03:17:24 GMT, Yummy
>> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>
>> >One of my clients roofs colapsed tonight from heavy rains. About 10-15
>> >PC's plus possibly network equipment may have damage. I can't get into
>> >the building till its been cleared by engineers.
>> >
>> >While I'm waiting, what is the success rate of restoring the PC's, and
>> >what is the best way of going about it?
>> >
>> >Yummy

>>
>> It's very difficult to say from a distance, but I will say that, in my
>> experience, water damage, especially with whatever minerals may have
>> been present in the water from the contact with the roof, etc, is
>> potentially catastrophic, short, medium and long-term, to any
>> electronics. We would not guarantee any water damage repair we did,
>> and that was told to customers up-front. Any residue at all left on a
>> circuit board has the capability of etching/eroding component leads
>> and circuit traces that aren't protected, and when the power is there
>> the problems are worse.
>>
>> The approach we took to cleaning up any repair like this was a
>> toothbrush or similar and alcohol. There are other commercial cleaning
>> products as well.
>>
>> This is going to depend on how much water got at the equipment, how
>> long the exposure was, whether the equipment was on or off, etc.
>> Monitors should be taken to a TV/monitor repair shop without an
>> attempt being made to turn them on, to be "hosed down" with alcohol,
>> or whatever that shop uses (the vent holes make them certain victims
>> of water damage). PC's should be examined very closely, and dealt with
>> accordingly. It is possible that the PC's themselves, if on desks
>> rather than the floor, have sustained minimal damage. Any in-line
>> power supply that is not sealed (for example, with a detachable AC
>> cord), should probably be thrown away, or at least tested rigourously.
>>
>> You may want to float this by the good folks at
>>
>> sci.electronics.repair
>>
>> after you have assessed the situation. Good luck.
>>
>> Tom

>
>"float"????


Jeez...as a recognized PITA punster by friends, family, and
co-workers, you'd think I'd have noticed what I had typed. Good catch!


Tom
 
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Yummy
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      09-14-2003
Mmmm puns.

I already know the monitors are shot because they were left on. Some
have nice little black streaks coming from the vent holes and the
smell of burnt band-aids. Some of the PC's were left on, I'll check
them but I'm pretty sure their "toast". As far as retrieving data, It
doesn't matter. All apps and data were stored on the server, which
wasn't damaged. Most of the users are good about using their mapped
user folders. If they had important data on their HD's, tough sh*t.
They were warned several times before about potential disasters. All
of the PC's were on the floor, so all got wet. I will be throwing away
all power cords, keyboards, mice, speakers, and surge protectors.

I am going to try to restore at least one PC. If I have success, I'll
try others. Someone told me to wash all parts in distilled water and
then bake them in an oven, but I'm afraid I would melt or warp the
boards. Has anyone tried that instead of letting the parts sit in the
sun?

As far as network backbone stuff, the central patch panel is shot, the
keystones are already starting to corrode. The hubs and switches are
also shot as they were on and water seeped into the vents. Also, the
drops at each PC seem OK, for now. It looks like none of the Cat5 runs
are damaged, however a fiber bridge between buidings was damaged. Not
my area, though.

Also, a laser printer got wet. It's a brand new Samsung, one of those
$800 ones. Of course it was on (sleep mode), but I haven't checked it
yet. If it was an HP, I would take it apart to try to restore it.

I would like to thank Mother Nature and stupid roofers for forcing a
much needed upgrade, and padding my pocket book also!

Yummy

"Wow, what a nice set!"


On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 21:47:32 GMT, Tom MacIntyre
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 02:51:26 GMT, (E-Mail Removed) (Ghost) wrote:
>
>>In article <(E-Mail Removed)>,
>>(E-Mail Removed) wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, 12 Sep 2003 03:17:24 GMT, Yummy
>>> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>>
>>> >One of my clients roofs colapsed tonight from heavy rains. About 10-15
>>> >PC's plus possibly network equipment may have damage. I can't get into
>>> >the building till its been cleared by engineers.
>>> >
>>> >While I'm waiting, what is the success rate of restoring the PC's, and
>>> >what is the best way of going about it?
>>> >
>>> >Yummy
>>>
>>> It's very difficult to say from a distance, but I will say that, in my
>>> experience, water damage, especially with whatever minerals may have
>>> been present in the water from the contact with the roof, etc, is
>>> potentially catastrophic, short, medium and long-term, to any
>>> electronics. We would not guarantee any water damage repair we did,
>>> and that was told to customers up-front. Any residue at all left on a
>>> circuit board has the capability of etching/eroding component leads
>>> and circuit traces that aren't protected, and when the power is there
>>> the problems are worse.
>>>
>>> The approach we took to cleaning up any repair like this was a
>>> toothbrush or similar and alcohol. There are other commercial cleaning
>>> products as well.
>>>
>>> This is going to depend on how much water got at the equipment, how
>>> long the exposure was, whether the equipment was on or off, etc.
>>> Monitors should be taken to a TV/monitor repair shop without an
>>> attempt being made to turn them on, to be "hosed down" with alcohol,
>>> or whatever that shop uses (the vent holes make them certain victims
>>> of water damage). PC's should be examined very closely, and dealt with
>>> accordingly. It is possible that the PC's themselves, if on desks
>>> rather than the floor, have sustained minimal damage. Any in-line
>>> power supply that is not sealed (for example, with a detachable AC
>>> cord), should probably be thrown away, or at least tested rigourously.
>>>
>>> You may want to float this by the good folks at
>>>
>>> sci.electronics.repair
>>>
>>> after you have assessed the situation. Good luck.
>>>
>>> Tom

>>
>>"float"????

>
>Jeez...as a recognized PITA punster by friends, family, and
>co-workers, you'd think I'd have noticed what I had typed. Good catch!
>
>
>Tom


 
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natural_4u
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      09-14-2003
I was also thinking the same thing about the HDD not getting wet considering
the location of the HDD.

I guess it would be a different story if there was a flood and the PCs were
on the floor.


"Ghost" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:user-1209032250210001@1.0.0.101...
> In article <(E-Mail Removed)>, Navin R. Johnson
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
> > On Fri, 12 Sep 2003 03:17:24 GMT, Yummy
> > <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> >
> > >One of my clients roofs colapsed tonight from heavy rains. About 10-15
> > >PC's plus possibly network equipment may have damage. I can't get into
> > >the building till its been cleared by engineers.
> > >
> > >While I'm waiting, what is the success rate of restoring the PC's, and
> > >what is the best way of going about it?
> > >
> > >Yummy

> >
> > You'll definitely want to recommend total replacement, especially if the
> > equipment stayed wet for an extended period. Make a list of all the
> > damaged items, with replacement costs, so the client can submit it to
> > their insurance company. As for data recovery, all the hard drives
> > should be removed ASAP then thoroughly rinsed with distilled water.
> > Afterwards, hang them up and let a fan blow on them overnight. You
> > should be able to get them all running again to retrieve their data.

>
> err... do *NOT* rinse the HDD in any water whatsoever!!!
>
> If the roof collapse and the PCs got wet- big deal- replace them. The HDD
> likely did not get wet- or if they did, probably not too bad considering
> their location inside a PC. By rinsing them off (thereby concentrating
> water on them), you WILL contaminate them- remember they have breathing
> holes which will allow water- distilled or otherwise- to get inside. That
> will destroy the platters and data recovery will likely not be possible
> after that. If there is even microsocopic surface corrosion, the data
> will be irretrievable.
>
> Navin, even if you were successful in the past with rinsing HDDs, I would
> call that blind luck! It is not something I would try. In fact, I might
> try an experiment though- I might take a few of the dead drives we have
> laying around and try a few things with those- just to see how fast the
> platters visibly corrode.
>
>
>
>
> >
> > I had exactly the same scenario with one of my customers about a year
> > ago. Their insurance company accepted my damage list and repair
> > estimates and paid the entire cost - I even added extra charges for
> > overtime emergency service and all the time spent checking out the
> > damaged equipment. That was the single largest check I deposited in all
> > my 13 years of PC service - over 27K$ - and about half of it was for my
> > labor.

>
> Wouldnt it be nice if ALL our checks for 27k!!! lol
>
> My largest was for a re-networking job and that bill was for about 58k I

think.
>
> I need to get a few more of those.. lol



 
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Tom MacIntyre
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      09-14-2003
On Sun, 14 Sep 2003 07:25:58 GMT, Yummy
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>Mmmm puns.
>
>I already know the monitors are shot because they were left on. Some
>have nice little black streaks coming from the vent holes and the
>smell of burnt band-aids. Some of the PC's were left on, I'll check
>them but I'm pretty sure their "toast". As far as retrieving data, It
>doesn't matter. All apps and data were stored on the server, which
>wasn't damaged. Most of the users are good about using their mapped
>user folders. If they had important data on their HD's, tough sh*t.
>They were warned several times before about potential disasters. All
>of the PC's were on the floor, so all got wet. I will be throwing away
>all power cords, keyboards, mice, speakers, and surge protectors.
>
>I am going to try to restore at least one PC. If I have success, I'll
>try others. Someone told me to wash all parts in distilled water and
>then bake them in an oven, but I'm afraid I would melt or warp the
>boards. Has anyone tried that instead of letting the parts sit in the
>sun?


I have also heard of this as a viable option. Water is a
non-conductor; it is the various trace elements in water that causes
the problems. Time is not on your side now, though, as the original
water+ damage is several days old.

Tom

>
>As far as network backbone stuff, the central patch panel is shot, the
>keystones are already starting to corrode. The hubs and switches are
>also shot as they were on and water seeped into the vents. Also, the
>drops at each PC seem OK, for now. It looks like none of the Cat5 runs
>are damaged, however a fiber bridge between buidings was damaged. Not
>my area, though.
>
>Also, a laser printer got wet. It's a brand new Samsung, one of those
>$800 ones. Of course it was on (sleep mode), but I haven't checked it
>yet. If it was an HP, I would take it apart to try to restore it.
>
>I would like to thank Mother Nature and stupid roofers for forcing a
>much needed upgrade, and padding my pocket book also!
>
>Yummy
>
>"Wow, what a nice set!"
>
>
>On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 21:47:32 GMT, Tom MacIntyre
><(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 13 Sep 2003 02:51:26 GMT, (E-Mail Removed) (Ghost) wrote:
>>
>>>In article <(E-Mail Removed)>,
>>>(E-Mail Removed) wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Fri, 12 Sep 2003 03:17:24 GMT, Yummy
>>>> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> >One of my clients roofs colapsed tonight from heavy rains. About 10-15
>>>> >PC's plus possibly network equipment may have damage. I can't get into
>>>> >the building till its been cleared by engineers.
>>>> >
>>>> >While I'm waiting, what is the success rate of restoring the PC's, and
>>>> >what is the best way of going about it?
>>>> >
>>>> >Yummy
>>>>
>>>> It's very difficult to say from a distance, but I will say that, in my
>>>> experience, water damage, especially with whatever minerals may have
>>>> been present in the water from the contact with the roof, etc, is
>>>> potentially catastrophic, short, medium and long-term, to any
>>>> electronics. We would not guarantee any water damage repair we did,
>>>> and that was told to customers up-front. Any residue at all left on a
>>>> circuit board has the capability of etching/eroding component leads
>>>> and circuit traces that aren't protected, and when the power is there
>>>> the problems are worse.
>>>>
>>>> The approach we took to cleaning up any repair like this was a
>>>> toothbrush or similar and alcohol. There are other commercial cleaning
>>>> products as well.
>>>>
>>>> This is going to depend on how much water got at the equipment, how
>>>> long the exposure was, whether the equipment was on or off, etc.
>>>> Monitors should be taken to a TV/monitor repair shop without an
>>>> attempt being made to turn them on, to be "hosed down" with alcohol,
>>>> or whatever that shop uses (the vent holes make them certain victims
>>>> of water damage). PC's should be examined very closely, and dealt with
>>>> accordingly. It is possible that the PC's themselves, if on desks
>>>> rather than the floor, have sustained minimal damage. Any in-line
>>>> power supply that is not sealed (for example, with a detachable AC
>>>> cord), should probably be thrown away, or at least tested rigourously.
>>>>
>>>> You may want to float this by the good folks at
>>>>
>>>> sci.electronics.repair
>>>>
>>>> after you have assessed the situation. Good luck.
>>>>
>>>> Tom
>>>
>>>"float"????

>>
>>Jeez...as a recognized PITA punster by friends, family, and
>>co-workers, you'd think I'd have noticed what I had typed. Good catch!
>>
>>
>>Tom


 
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