«

Good day;
I have visited the NDA and it appears that the wording in the NDA is seeking
to prohibit the circulation of the exam questions, and/or the content of the
exam questions. The NDA language is as follows: " All Microsoft certification
exams, including the content and wording of exam questions, constitute
confidential Microsoft information protected by trade secret law. Anyone
obtaining access to MCP exams is obligated to maintain the confidentiality of
this information."

Microsoft could attempt, and then proceed to fail in its attempt, to
prohibit one from speaking about the exam in general. That is to say, not
reveal the content of the questions but to speak about the exam overall. This
is exactly what is done on the discussion site, the posts discussion the exam
in general without revealing the content of any specific questions.

For one to state that acknowledging the time allotted to sit for the exam,
or the type of grading system that is used to grade the exam is the same as
revealing the content of the questions is certainly a stretch of the
imagination.

Microsoft may have a lot of people scared, but the last I knew the U.S.
Constitution continues to allow free speech, whether or not a corporation
attempts to infringe upon this right with a NDA or some other agreement. The
Microsoft attorneys are fully aware that an NDA cannot restrict free speech
"about a subject," as long as the speech does not disclose the content of the
questions.

Please be aware that throughout history there have been Totalitarian Regimes
that have attempted to silence the proletariat. Thought, Speech and the human
Will must remain free, otherwise it is death. Bill

Let me put it this way then... The exam can be given in 2 formats:
Format 1, set number of questions. Format 2, adaptive. You do not know
what exam will be given until you sit the exam. The grading system for
the exams has never been publicized by Microsoft. There has been tons of
speculation, but nothing concrete. If you have spent any time in this
newsgroup, you are aware that published objectives are covered here, not
specific details of the exams content. Published objectives for any exam
can be found on http://www.microsoft.com/learning or by visiting by
website below. The published objectives, or preparation guides, have a
list of "Skills Being Measured" for each and every exam. This is a
guideline of what the test can entail. That is what we discuss here.

Again, discussions of specific details of the exam or its content
compromises the integrity of the certification and those who hold it.

--
Michael D. Alligood
MCSA, MCDST, MCP, A+,
Network+, i-Net+, CIW Assoc.,
CIW Certified Instructor

http://yetanotherblog.typepad.com/theclassroom



"Need help on MCP certification test"
< oft.com> wrote in
message news:47047C99-D45C-43A3-81AA-:

> Good day;
> I have visited the NDA and it appears that the wording in the NDA is seeking
> to prohibit the circulation of the exam questions, and/or the content of the
> exam questions. The NDA language is as follows: " All Microsoft certification
> exams, including the content and wording of exam questions, constitute
> confidential Microsoft information protected by trade secret law. Anyone
> obtaining access to MCP exams is obligated to maintain the confidentiality of
> this information."
>
> Microsoft could attempt, and then proceed to fail in its attempt, to
> prohibit one from speaking about the exam in general. That is to say, not
> reveal the content of the questions but to speak about the exam overall. This
> is exactly what is done on the discussion site, the posts discussion the exam
> in general without revealing the content of any specific questions.
>
> For one to state that acknowledging the time allotted to sit for the exam,
> or the type of grading system that is used to grade the exam is the same as
> revealing the content of the questions is certainly a stretch of the
> imagination.
>
> Microsoft may have a lot of people scared, but the last I knew the U.S.
> Constitution continues to allow free speech, whether or not a corporation
> attempts to infringe upon this right with a NDA or some other agreement. The
> Microsoft attorneys are fully aware that an NDA cannot restrict free speech
> "about a subject," as long as the speech does not disclose the content of the
> questions.
>
> Please be aware that throughout history there have been Totalitarian Regimes
> that have attempted to silence the proletariat. Thought, Speech and the human
> Will must remain free, otherwise it is death. Bill

Michael
You certainly have a gift for, and patience for, explaining the minutia of
the NDA.
My hat is off to you.

A student

Richard

"Michael D. Alligood" <> wrote in message
news:...
> Let me put it this way then... The exam can be given in 2 formats: Format
> 1, set number of questions. Format 2, adaptive. You do not know what exam
> will be given until you sit the exam. The grading system for the exams has
> never been publicized by Microsoft. There has been tons of speculation,
> but nothing concrete. If you have spent any time in this newsgroup, you
> are aware that published objectives are covered here, not specific details
> of the exams content. Published objectives for any exam can be found on
> http://www.microsoft.com/learning or by visiting by website below. The
> published objectives, or preparation guides, have a list of "Skills Being
> Measured" for each and every exam. This is a guideline of what the test
> can entail. That is what we discuss here.
>
> Again, discussions of specific details of the exam or its content
> compromises the integrity of the certification and those who hold it.
>
> --
> Michael D. Alligood
> MCSA, MCDST, MCP, A+,
> Network+, i-Net+, CIW Assoc.,
> CIW Certified Instructor
>
> http://yetanotherblog.typepad.com/theclassroom
>
>
>
> "Need help on MCP certification test"
> < oft.com> wrote in
> message news:47047C99-D45C-43A3-81AA-:
>
>> Good day;
>> I have visited the NDA and it appears that the wording in the NDA is
>> seeking
>> to prohibit the circulation of the exam questions, and/or the content of
>> the
>> exam questions. The NDA language is as follows: " All Microsoft
>> certification
>> exams, including the content and wording of exam questions, constitute
>> confidential Microsoft information protected by trade secret law. Anyone
>> obtaining access to MCP exams is obligated to maintain the
>> confidentiality of
>> this information."
>>
>> Microsoft could attempt, and then proceed to fail in its attempt, to
>> prohibit one from speaking about the exam in general. That is to say, not
>> reveal the content of the questions but to speak about the exam overall.
>> This
>> is exactly what is done on the discussion site, the posts discussion the
>> exam
>> in general without revealing the content of any specific questions.
>>
>> For one to state that acknowledging the time allotted to sit for the
>> exam,
>> or the type of grading system that is used to grade the exam is the same
>> as
>> revealing the content of the questions is certainly a stretch of the
>> imagination.
>>
>> Microsoft may have a lot of people scared, but the last I knew the U.S.
>> Constitution continues to allow free speech, whether or not a corporation
>> attempts to infringe upon this right with a NDA or some other agreement.
>> The
>> Microsoft attorneys are fully aware that an NDA cannot restrict free
>> speech
>> "about a subject," as long as the speech does not disclose the content of
>> the
>> questions.
>>
>> Please be aware that throughout history there have been Totalitarian
>> Regimes
>> that have attempted to silence the proletariat. Thought, Speech and the
>> human
>> Will must remain free, otherwise it is death. Bill
>

"Need help on MCP certification test"
< oft.com> wrote in message
news:47047C99-D45C-43A3-81AA-...
> Good day;
> I have visited the NDA and it appears that the wording in the NDA is
> seeking
> to prohibit the circulation of the exam questions, and/or the content of
> the
> exam questions. The NDA language is as follows: " All Microsoft
> certification
> exams, including the content and wording of exam questions, constitute
> confidential Microsoft information protected by trade secret law. Anyone
> obtaining access to MCP exams is obligated to maintain the confidentiality
> of
> this information."
>
> Microsoft could attempt, and then proceed to fail in its attempt, to
> prohibit one from speaking about the exam in general. That is to say, not
> reveal the content of the questions but to speak about the exam overall.
> This
> is exactly what is done on the discussion site, the posts discussion the
> exam
> in general without revealing the content of any specific questions.
>
> For one to state that acknowledging the time allotted to sit for the exam,
> or the type of grading system that is used to grade the exam is the same
> as
> revealing the content of the questions is certainly a stretch of the
> imagination.
>
> Microsoft may have a lot of people scared, but the last I knew the U.S.
> Constitution continues to allow free speech, whether or not a corporation
> attempts to infringe upon this right with a NDA or some other agreement.
> The
> Microsoft attorneys are fully aware that an NDA cannot restrict free
> speech
> "about a subject," as long as the speech does not disclose the content of
> the
> questions.
>
> Please be aware that throughout history there have been Totalitarian
> Regimes
> that have attempted to silence the proletariat. Thought, Speech and the
> human
> Will must remain free, otherwise it is death. Bill
>

Free speech, or any other right delegated to you by the constitution, does
not cover private contractual obligations. By taking the exam, you agree to
the terms of that exam. That, in essence, is a private agreement between
you and Microsoft. Microsoft certification is not a right granted to you.
Microsoft is not forcing you to take the exam, nor is it forcing you to seek
certification. Your employer might require it of you, but again, nobody is
forcing you to work for your employer either. You are certainly free to go
work at McDonalds and not be required to obtain MCSE.

The classic discussion to free speech is going into a crowded theater and
yelling "Fire!". You may call it free speech, others call it willfull
endangerment. And while the Microsoft police may not arrest you, they are
certainly free to withhold their certifications from anyone they choose to.
If it is certification at any level that you seek, it is up to you to abide
by it, if for no other reason than personal integrity. I choose to abide by
it because I worked hard at earning it, and I respect others that have done
the same.

As far as exam times go, it is no secret that you can call a testing center
and see how much time is alloted for an exam. If the exam center closes at
6pm, they will not allow you to schedule a test appointment for 5:45pm.
Once you have taken an exam or two, you can get a pretty good idea of the
time any particular exam will take. This does not violate anything in the
NDA.

Discussing technical aspects in general does not violate anything either.
Simply looking at the published objectives should give anyone a pretty good
idea of what to look for in the exam. After all, you are supposed to be
smart enough to understand the objectives if you are looking to take an
exam.

I don't think Microsoft is trying to "scare" anyone. They simply set the
rules for their certifications, just as motor vehicle departments set the
rules for licensing drivers, and the FAA sets the rules for licensing
pilots, or the FCC sets the rules for licensing broadcasting. If you choose
to not follow the rules, the corresponding agency is free to pull your
license (or certification if you will).

That's just my take on it.

John

>>>Microsoft certification is not a right granted to you.
Microsoft is not forcing you to take the exam, nor is it forcing you to seek
certification.

John

If I read your post correctly, I have to resolve within myself that I am
responsible
for my actions. This is a major revelation, imagine that I would have to be
responsible for myself!!!
If this is true I cannot wine like a child, and expect someone else to wipe
my ass for me.

Thank you for clearly stating the obvious, at least to reasonably minds,
that I have to follow some sort
of ethical code.

Richard


"John R" <> wrote in message
news:%23U$...
>
> "Need help on MCP certification test"
> < oft.com> wrote in
> message news:47047C99-D45C-43A3-81AA-...
>> Good day;
>> I have visited the NDA and it appears that the wording in the NDA is
>> seeking
>> to prohibit the circulation of the exam questions, and/or the content of
>> the
>> exam questions. The NDA language is as follows: " All Microsoft
>> certification
>> exams, including the content and wording of exam questions, constitute
>> confidential Microsoft information protected by trade secret law. Anyone
>> obtaining access to MCP exams is obligated to maintain the
>> confidentiality of
>> this information."
>>
>> Microsoft could attempt, and then proceed to fail in its attempt, to
>> prohibit one from speaking about the exam in general. That is to say, not
>> reveal the content of the questions but to speak about the exam overall.
>> This
>> is exactly what is done on the discussion site, the posts discussion the
>> exam
>> in general without revealing the content of any specific questions.
>>
>> For one to state that acknowledging the time allotted to sit for the
>> exam,
>> or the type of grading system that is used to grade the exam is the same
>> as
>> revealing the content of the questions is certainly a stretch of the
>> imagination.
>>
>> Microsoft may have a lot of people scared, but the last I knew the U.S.
>> Constitution continues to allow free speech, whether or not a corporation
>> attempts to infringe upon this right with a NDA or some other agreement.
>> The
>> Microsoft attorneys are fully aware that an NDA cannot restrict free
>> speech
>> "about a subject," as long as the speech does not disclose the content of
>> the
>> questions.
>>
>> Please be aware that throughout history there have been Totalitarian
>> Regimes
>> that have attempted to silence the proletariat. Thought, Speech and the
>> human
>> Will must remain free, otherwise it is death. Bill
>>
>
> Free speech, or any other right delegated to you by the constitution, does
> not cover private contractual obligations. By taking the exam, you agree
> to the terms of that exam. That, in essence, is a private agreement
> between you and Microsoft. Microsoft certification is not a right granted
> to you. Microsoft is not forcing you to take the exam, nor is it forcing
> you to seek certification. Your employer might require it of you, but
> again, nobody is forcing you to work for your employer either. You are
> certainly free to go work at McDonalds and not be required to obtain MCSE.
>
> The classic discussion to free speech is going into a crowded theater and
> yelling "Fire!". You may call it free speech, others call it willfull
> endangerment. And while the Microsoft police may not arrest you, they are
> certainly free to withhold their certifications from anyone they choose
> to. If it is certification at any level that you seek, it is up to you to
> abide by it, if for no other reason than personal integrity. I choose to
> abide by it because I worked hard at earning it, and I respect others that
> have done the same.
>
> As far as exam times go, it is no secret that you can call a testing
> center and see how much time is alloted for an exam. If the exam center
> closes at 6pm, they will not allow you to schedule a test appointment for
> 5:45pm. Once you have taken an exam or two, you can get a pretty good idea
> of the time any particular exam will take. This does not violate anything
> in the NDA.
>
> Discussing technical aspects in general does not violate anything either.
> Simply looking at the published objectives should give anyone a pretty
> good idea of what to look for in the exam. After all, you are supposed to
> be smart enough to understand the objectives if you are looking to take an
> exam.
>
> I don't think Microsoft is trying to "scare" anyone. They simply set the
> rules for their certifications, just as motor vehicle departments set the
> rules for licensing drivers, and the FAA sets the rules for licensing
> pilots, or the FCC sets the rules for licensing broadcasting. If you
> choose to not follow the rules, the corresponding agency is free to pull
> your license (or certification if you will).
>
> That's just my take on it.
>
> John
>

Well done.

--
Michael D. Alligood
MCSA, MCDST, MCP, A+,
Network+, i-Net+, CIW Assoc.,
CIW Certified Instructor

http://yetanotherblog.typepad.com/theclassroom



"John R" <> wrote in message
news:#U$:

> "Need help on MCP certification test"
> < oft.com> wrote in message
> news:47047C99-D45C-43A3-81AA-...
> > Good day;
> > I have visited the NDA and it appears that the wording in the NDA is
> > seeking
> > to prohibit the circulation of the exam questions, and/or the content of
> > the
> > exam questions. The NDA language is as follows: " All Microsoft
> > certification
> > exams, including the content and wording of exam questions, constitute
> > confidential Microsoft information protected by trade secret law. Anyone
> > obtaining access to MCP exams is obligated to maintain the confidentiality
> > of
> > this information."
> >
> > Microsoft could attempt, and then proceed to fail in its attempt, to
> > prohibit one from speaking about the exam in general. That is to say, not
> > reveal the content of the questions but to speak about the exam overall.
> > This
> > is exactly what is done on the discussion site, the posts discussion the
> > exam
> > in general without revealing the content of any specific questions.
> >
> > For one to state that acknowledging the time allotted to sit for the exam,
> > or the type of grading system that is used to grade the exam is the same
> > as
> > revealing the content of the questions is certainly a stretch of the
> > imagination.
> >
> > Microsoft may have a lot of people scared, but the last I knew the U.S.
> > Constitution continues to allow free speech, whether or not a corporation
> > attempts to infringe upon this right with a NDA or some other agreement.
> > The
> > Microsoft attorneys are fully aware that an NDA cannot restrict free
> > speech
> > "about a subject," as long as the speech does not disclose the content of
> > the
> > questions.
> >
> > Please be aware that throughout history there have been Totalitarian
> > Regimes
> > that have attempted to silence the proletariat. Thought, Speech and the
> > human
> > Will must remain free, otherwise it is death. Bill
> >
>
> Free speech, or any other right delegated to you by the constitution, does
> not cover private contractual obligations. By taking the exam, you agree to
> the terms of that exam. That, in essence, is a private agreement between
> you and Microsoft. Microsoft certification is not a right granted to you.
> Microsoft is not forcing you to take the exam, nor is it forcing you to seek
> certification. Your employer might require it of you, but again, nobody is
> forcing you to work for your employer either. You are certainly free to go
> work at McDonalds and not be required to obtain MCSE.
>
> The classic discussion to free speech is going into a crowded theater and
> yelling "Fire!". You may call it free speech, others call it willfull
> endangerment. And while the Microsoft police may not arrest you, they are
> certainly free to withhold their certifications from anyone they choose to.
> If it is certification at any level that you seek, it is up to you to abide
> by it, if for no other reason than personal integrity. I choose to abide by
> it because I worked hard at earning it, and I respect others that have done
> the same.
>
> As far as exam times go, it is no secret that you can call a testing center
> and see how much time is alloted for an exam. If the exam center closes at
> 6pm, they will not allow you to schedule a test appointment for 5:45pm.
> Once you have taken an exam or two, you can get a pretty good idea of the
> time any particular exam will take. This does not violate anything in the
> NDA.
>
> Discussing technical aspects in general does not violate anything either.
> Simply looking at the published objectives should give anyone a pretty good
> idea of what to look for in the exam. After all, you are supposed to be
> smart enough to understand the objectives if you are looking to take an
> exam.
>
> I don't think Microsoft is trying to "scare" anyone. They simply set the
> rules for their certifications, just as motor vehicle departments set the
> rules for licensing drivers, and the FAA sets the rules for licensing
> pilots, or the FCC sets the rules for licensing broadcasting. If you choose
> to not follow the rules, the corresponding agency is free to pull your
> license (or certification if you will).
>
> That's just my take on it.
>
> John

A couple of points on this subject: 1. as I previously mentioned the NDA is
subject to interpretation, and the NDA is written to address the issue of
revealing the content of questions, 2. the NDA is not written to prohibit
general discussions regarding the exam and, 3. if one were to take the
position that the NDA was written to prohibit the general discussion of the
exam, such a position would not stand in a court of law, regradless if a
party was to enter into the so-called contract.

Corporations and private individuals write things into contacts everty day,
deciding on the legal interpretation and attempting to enforce the
intepretation is an entirely different matter.

It is not a true statement that an illegal clause in a contract can be
inforced in a court of law simply because a party happened to agree to it.
Because the clause is illegal it follows that the clause cannot be inforced.
Furthermore, the NDA is subject to interpretation, and by no means does the
NDA specify general discussions of the exam, implicitly or otherwise. Bill


"Michael D. Alligood" wrote:

> Well done.
>
> --
> Michael D. Alligood
> MCSA, MCDST, MCP, A+,
> Network+, i-Net+, CIW Assoc.,
> CIW Certified Instructor
>
> http://yetanotherblog.typepad.com/theclassroom
>
>
>
> "John R" <> wrote in message
> news:#U$:
>
> > "Need help on MCP certification test"
> > < oft.com> wrote in message
> > news:47047C99-D45C-43A3-81AA-...
> > > Good day;
> > > I have visited the NDA and it appears that the wording in the NDA is
> > > seeking
> > > to prohibit the circulation of the exam questions, and/or the content of
> > > the
> > > exam questions. The NDA language is as follows: " All Microsoft
> > > certification
> > > exams, including the content and wording of exam questions, constitute
> > > confidential Microsoft information protected by trade secret law. Anyone
> > > obtaining access to MCP exams is obligated to maintain the confidentiality
> > > of
> > > this information."
> > >
> > > Microsoft could attempt, and then proceed to fail in its attempt, to
> > > prohibit one from speaking about the exam in general. That is to say, not
> > > reveal the content of the questions but to speak about the exam overall.
> > > This
> > > is exactly what is done on the discussion site, the posts discussion the
> > > exam
> > > in general without revealing the content of any specific questions.
> > >
> > > For one to state that acknowledging the time allotted to sit for the exam,
> > > or the type of grading system that is used to grade the exam is the same
> > > as
> > > revealing the content of the questions is certainly a stretch of the
> > > imagination.
> > >
> > > Microsoft may have a lot of people scared, but the last I knew the U.S.
> > > Constitution continues to allow free speech, whether or not a corporation
> > > attempts to infringe upon this right with a NDA or some other agreement.
> > > The
> > > Microsoft attorneys are fully aware that an NDA cannot restrict free
> > > speech
> > > "about a subject," as long as the speech does not disclose the content of
> > > the
> > > questions.
> > >
> > > Please be aware that throughout history there have been Totalitarian
> > > Regimes
> > > that have attempted to silence the proletariat. Thought, Speech and the
> > > human
> > > Will must remain free, otherwise it is death. Bill
> > >
> >
> > Free speech, or any other right delegated to you by the constitution, does
> > not cover private contractual obligations. By taking the exam, you agree to
> > the terms of that exam. That, in essence, is a private agreement between
> > you and Microsoft. Microsoft certification is not a right granted to you.
> > Microsoft is not forcing you to take the exam, nor is it forcing you to seek
> > certification. Your employer might require it of you, but again, nobody is
> > forcing you to work for your employer either. You are certainly free to go
> > work at McDonalds and not be required to obtain MCSE.
> >
> > The classic discussion to free speech is going into a crowded theater and
> > yelling "Fire!". You may call it free speech, others call it willfull
> > endangerment. And while the Microsoft police may not arrest you, they are
> > certainly free to withhold their certifications from anyone they choose to.
> > If it is certification at any level that you seek, it is up to you to abide
> > by it, if for no other reason than personal integrity. I choose to abide by
> > it because I worked hard at earning it, and I respect others that have done
> > the same.
> >
> > As far as exam times go, it is no secret that you can call a testing center
> > and see how much time is alloted for an exam. If the exam center closes at
> > 6pm, they will not allow you to schedule a test appointment for 5:45pm.
> > Once you have taken an exam or two, you can get a pretty good idea of the
> > time any particular exam will take. This does not violate anything in the
> > NDA.
> >
> > Discussing technical aspects in general does not violate anything either.
> > Simply looking at the published objectives should give anyone a pretty good
> > idea of what to look for in the exam. After all, you are supposed to be
> > smart enough to understand the objectives if you are looking to take an
> > exam.
> >
> > I don't think Microsoft is trying to "scare" anyone. They simply set the
> > rules for their certifications, just as motor vehicle departments set the
> > rules for licensing drivers, and the FAA sets the rules for licensing
> > pilots, or the FCC sets the rules for licensing broadcasting. If you choose
> > to not follow the rules, the corresponding agency is free to pull your
> > license (or certification if you will).
> >
> > That's just my take on it.
> >
> > John
>
>

On Feb 8, 8:40 am, "John R" <jsr...@zoominternet.net> wrote:
>
> Free speech, or any other right delegated to you by the constitution, does
> not cover private contractual obligations. By taking the exam, you agree to
> the terms of that exam. That, in essence, is a private agreement between
> you and Microsoft. Microsoft certification is not a right granted to you.
> Microsoft is not forcing you to take the exam, nor is it forcing you to seek
> certification. Your employer might require it of you, but again, nobody is
> forcing you to work for your employer either. You are certainly free to go
> work at McDonalds and not be required to obtain MCSE.
>
> The classic discussion to free speech is going into a crowded theater and
> yelling "Fire!". You may call it free speech, others call it willfull
> endangerment. And while the Microsoft police may not arrest you, they are
> certainly free to withhold their certifications from anyone they choose to.
> If it is certification at any level that you seek, it is up to you to abide
> by it, if for no other reason than personal integrity. I choose to abide by
> it because I worked hard at earning it, and I respect others that have done
> the same.
>
> As far as exam times go, it is no secret that you can call a testing center
> and see how much time is alloted for an exam. If the exam center closes at
> 6pm, they will not allow you to schedule a test appointment for 5:45pm.
> Once you have taken an exam or two, you can get a pretty good idea of the
> time any particular exam will take. This does not violate anything in the
> NDA.
>
> Discussing technical aspects in general does not violate anything either.
> Simply looking at the published objectives should give anyone a pretty good
> idea of what to look for in the exam. After all, you are supposed to be
> smart enough to understand the objectives if you are looking to take an
> exam.
>
> I don't think Microsoft is trying to "scare" anyone. They simply set the
> rules for their certifications, just as motor vehicle departments set the
> rules for licensing drivers, and the FAA sets the rules for licensing
> pilots, or the FCC sets the rules for licensing broadcasting. If you choose
> to not follow the rules, the corresponding agency is free to pull your
> license (or certification if you will).
>
> That's just my take on it.
>
> John-

That was *very* well said, John. A real pleasure to read.

----------
Cerebrus.
MCNGP #LIV (LIVewire ! Please hug !)

Join the fight against Br@indumps
http://www.certguard.com/forums/

On Feb 8, 11:03 am, Need help on MCP certification test
<NeedhelponMCPcertificationt...@discussions.micros oft.com> wrote:
> A couple of points on this subject: 1. as I previously mentioned the NDA is
> subject to interpretation, and the NDA is written to address the issue of
> revealing the content of questions, 2. the NDA is not written to prohibit
> general discussions regarding the exam and, 3. if one were to take the
> position that the NDA was written to prohibit the general discussion of the
> exam, such a position would not stand in a court of law, regradless if a
> party was to enter into the so-called contract.
>
> Corporations and private individuals write things into contacts everty day,
> deciding on the legal interpretation and attempting to enforce the
> intepretation is an entirely different matter.
>
> It is not a true statement that an illegal clause in a contract can be
> inforced in a court of law simply because a party happened to agree to it.
> Because the clause is illegal it follows that the clause cannot be inforced.
> Furthermore, the NDA is subject to interpretation, and by no means does the
> NDA specify general discussions of the exam, implicitly or otherwise. Bill

So, you're saying that if an employee signs an agreement with his
employer on Non-disclosure of company secrets, then leaves the company
and blabbers the secrets to the whole world, he cannot be challenged
in court ?

Good day:
That which I have written is addressed to 1. the interpretation of the NDA
and, 2. the legal principle of not being able to inforce an illegal clause
contained in a contract.


"Cerebrus" wrote:

> On Feb 8, 8:40 am, "John R" <jsr...@zoominternet.net> wrote:
> >
> > Free speech, or any other right delegated to you by the constitution, does
> > not cover private contractual obligations. By taking the exam, you agree to
> > the terms of that exam. That, in essence, is a private agreement between
> > you and Microsoft. Microsoft certification is not a right granted to you.
> > Microsoft is not forcing you to take the exam, nor is it forcing you to seek
> > certification. Your employer might require it of you, but again, nobody is
> > forcing you to work for your employer either. You are certainly free to go
> > work at McDonalds and not be required to obtain MCSE.
> >
> > The classic discussion to free speech is going into a crowded theater and
> > yelling "Fire!". You may call it free speech, others call it willfull
> > endangerment. And while the Microsoft police may not arrest you, they are
> > certainly free to withhold their certifications from anyone they choose to.
> > If it is certification at any level that you seek, it is up to you to abide
> > by it, if for no other reason than personal integrity. I choose to abide by
> > it because I worked hard at earning it, and I respect others that have done
> > the same.
> >
> > As far as exam times go, it is no secret that you can call a testing center
> > and see how much time is alloted for an exam. If the exam center closes at
> > 6pm, they will not allow you to schedule a test appointment for 5:45pm.
> > Once you have taken an exam or two, you can get a pretty good idea of the
> > time any particular exam will take. This does not violate anything in the
> > NDA.
> >
> > Discussing technical aspects in general does not violate anything either.
> > Simply looking at the published objectives should give anyone a pretty good
> > idea of what to look for in the exam. After all, you are supposed to be
> > smart enough to understand the objectives if you are looking to take an
> > exam.
> >
> > I don't think Microsoft is trying to "scare" anyone. They simply set the
> > rules for their certifications, just as motor vehicle departments set the
> > rules for licensing drivers, and the FAA sets the rules for licensing
> > pilots, or the FCC sets the rules for licensing broadcasting. If you choose
> > to not follow the rules, the corresponding agency is free to pull your
> > license (or certification if you will).
> >
> > That's just my take on it.
> >
> > John-
>
> That was *very* well said, John. A real pleasure to read.
>
> ----------
> Cerebrus.
> MCNGP #LIV (LIVewire ! Please hug !)
>
> Join the fight against Br@indumps
> http://www.certguard.com/forums/
>
>