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On 19 Dec 2008, DLU <> wrote:

>>>> Get rid of the target="_blank" attribute. It's not valid with a
>>>> strict 4.01 doctype anyway.
>>> What can I use in its place to have the link open in a new page?
>>>
>>
>> You don't.
>>
>> Let your user decide, they may want to open the link in a new tab,
>> or new window by right-clicking, or not! Their choice. If the link
>> opens in the same window and if your page is "good" enough they can
>> ways hit the back button to return.
>>
>> http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...in+new+window+
>> bad+web+design&btnG=Google+Search
>>
>> why opening links in new window bad web design - Google Search
>>
> A survey of my users showed that they like the setup where they do
> not have to go back. They like being able to have the main page open
> and a second one with it. I think it is actually sell confusing to
> most of them. Again, these are not sophisticated users, just people
> looking for information, or meeting schedules and such. Very few of
> them even know what USENET is. Occasionally a a meeting I have shown
> someone a USENET group when they wanted some kind of information and
> they were astounded that such a medium even exists.
>
> Also, there may be other legitimate reasons for having a link open in
> a second window. I find it odd, that not provision has been made for
> that.

Well, if the majority of your users like it, so be it. However, believe
me when I say the majority of most people don't. Take me for instance.
I went to your site to check the image you mentioned. It was pleasing
to see that the image filesize was only around 11k. I clicked on the
link to view the full-size image, -a nice pic, indeed. But when I
attempted to go back, there was no back. Petulantly, I closed the
errant window, but in my aggrieved state I accidentally double-clicked
the mouse and also closed the first/main window as well. Now truly
perturbed, I made a voodoo doll of you in a leotard and spent several
hours sticking pins in the loci of what are traditionally the most
delicate regions available to an actual living host. See?

--
Neredbojias
http://www.neredbojias.org/
http://www.neredbojias.net/

DLU wrote:
> Jonathan N. Little wrote:
>> DLU wrote:
>>> Neredbojias wrote:
>>>> On 18 Dec 2008, DLU <> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Bergamot wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Get rid of the target="_blank" attribute. It's not valid with a strict
>>>> 4.01 doctype anyway.
>>> What can I use in its place to have the link open in a new page?
>>>
>>
>> You don't.
>>
>> Let your user decide, they may want to open the link in a new tab, or
>> new window by right-clicking, or not! Their choice. If the link opens
>> in the same window and if your page is "good" enough they can ways hit
>> the back button to return.
>>
>> http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...=Google+Search
>>
>> why opening links in new window bad web design - Google Search
>>
> A survey of my users showed that they like the setup where they do not
> have to go back. They like being able to have the main page open and a
> second one with it. I think it is actually sell confusing to most of
> them. Again, these are not sophisticated users, just people looking for
> information, or meeting schedules and such.

It doesn't take any sophistication to click a big button that says
"Back"--which is more of a cue than they get from the unlabeled Close
button in the upper right-hand corner of the window.

> Very few of them even know
> what USENET is. Occasionally a a meeting I have shown someone a USENET
> group when they wanted some kind of information and they were astounded
> that such a medium even exists.

I don't understand what their lack of awareness of Usenet has to do with
the question at hand.

> Also, there may be other legitimate reasons for having a link open in a
> second window. I find it odd, that not provision has been made for that.

Not every place where HTML is used even *has* such a thing as "a second
window". There are no second windows on my Windows Mobile phone, for
example. And then, in my Firefox, a target attribute opens up another
*tab*, not another window. A pop-up blocker may also prevent a new
window from opening.

Neredbojias wrote:
> On 19 Dec 2008, DLU <> wrote:
>

> Well, if the majority of your users like it, so be it. However, believe
> me when I say the majority of most people don't. Take me for instance.
> I went to your site to check the image you mentioned. It was pleasing
> to see that the image filesize was only around 11k. I clicked on the
> link to view the full-size image, -a nice pic, indeed. But when I
> attempted to go back, there was no back. Petulantly, I closed the
> errant window, but in my aggrieved state I accidentally double-clicked
> the mouse and also closed the first/main window as well. Now truly
> perturbed, I made a voodoo doll of you in a leotard and spent several
> hours sticking pins in the loci of what are traditionally the most
> delicate regions available to an actual living host. See?
>
Hmm, I may have to reconsider then. I thought I felt pins and needles
this morning but I attributed it to the niacin I took earlier.
And I don't wear leotards, I wear spandex bicycle clothing.

--
***************************************
* This is the Spammish Inquisition *
* Not Lumber Cartel Unit 75 [TINLC] *
* I am not SPEWS.ORG *
***************************************

On Fri, 19 Dec 2008 23:13:16 +0000 (UTC), Neredbojias
<> wrote:

>On 19 Dec 2008, DLU <> wrote:
>
>>>>> Get rid of the target="_blank" attribute. It's not valid with a
>>>>> strict 4.01 doctype anyway.
>>>> What can I use in its place to have the link open in a new page?
>>>>
>>>
>>> You don't.
>>>
>>> Let your user decide, they may want to open the link in a new tab,
>>> or new window by right-clicking, or not! Their choice. If the link
>>> opens in the same window and if your page is "good" enough they can
>>> ways hit the back button to return.
>>>
>>> http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...in+new+window+
>>> bad+web+design&btnG=Google+Search
>>>
>>> why opening links in new window bad web design - Google Search
>>>
>> A survey of my users showed that they like the setup where they do
>> not have to go back. They like being able to have the main page open
>> and a second one with it. I think it is actually sell confusing to
>> most of them. Again, these are not sophisticated users, just people
>> looking for information, or meeting schedules and such. Very few of
>> them even know what USENET is. Occasionally a a meeting I have shown
>> someone a USENET group when they wanted some kind of information and
>> they were astounded that such a medium even exists.
>>
>> Also, there may be other legitimate reasons for having a link open in
>> a second window. I find it odd, that not provision has been made for
>> that.
>
>Well, if the majority of your users like it, so be it. However, believe
>me when I say the majority of most people don't.

The best way of solving this issue, is that the browser must be able
with a right-clik on the link to propose:
Open in the same window if the "_blank" option is used
Open in a new window if the "_blank" option is not used

On 19 Dec 2008, DLU <> wrote:

>> Neredbojias wrote:
>> Well, if the majority of your users like it, so be it. However,
>> believe me when I say the majority of most people don't. Take me
>> for instance. I went to your site to check the image you mentioned.
>> It was pleasing to see that the image filesize was only around 11k.
>> I clicked on the link to view the full-size image, -a nice pic,
>> indeed. But when I attempted to go back, there was no back.
>> Petulantly, I closed the errant window, but in my aggrieved state I
>> accidentally double-clicked the mouse and also closed the first/main
>> window as well. Now truly perturbed, I made a voodoo doll of you in
>> a leotard and spent several hours sticking pins in the loci of what
>> are traditionally the most delicate regions available to an actual
>> living host. See?
>>
> Hmm, I may have to reconsider then. I thought I felt pins and
> needles this morning but I attributed it to the niacin I took
> earlier. And I don't wear leotards, I wear spandex bicycle clothing.

<grin />

Aw, I didn't really make a voodoo doll of you, but I do believe that
superfluous windows aren't a good idea. Anyway, happy holidays.

--
Neredbojias
http://www.neredbojias.org/
http://www.neredbojias.net/

On 19 Dec 2008, (Raymond Schmit) wrote:

>>> Also, there may be other legitimate reasons for having a link open
>>> in a second window. I find it odd, that not provision has been
>>> made for that.
>>
>>Well, if the majority of your users like it, so be it. However,
>>believe me when I say the majority of most people don't.
>
> The best way of solving this issue, is that the browser must be able
> with a right-clik on the link to propose:
> Open in the same window if the "_blank" option is used
> Open in a new window if the "_blank" option is not used

Why not make browsers ignore the target attribute altogether? I believe
most (maybe all) modern browsers already have the "open in a new window"
option available in the right-click context menu already. -Or at least
have a "preferences" setting which allows ignoring targets.

--
Neredbojias
http://www.neredbojias.org/
http://www.neredbojias.net/

On Dec 21, 8:24*pm, Neredbojias <neredboj...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 19 Dec 2008, Raymond.Sch...@pircarre.be (Raymond Schmit) wrote:
>
> >>> Also, there may be other legitimate reasons for having a link open
> >>> in a second window. *I find it odd, that not provision has been
> >>> made for that.
>
> >>Well, if the majority of your users like it, so be it. *However,
> >>believe me when I say the majority of most people don't. *
>
> > The best way of solving this issue, is that the browser must be able
> > with a right-clik on the link to propose:
> > Open in the same window if the "_blank" option is used
> > Open in a new window if the "_blank" option is not used
>
> Why not make browsers ignore the target attribute altogether? *I believe
> most (maybe all) modern browsers already have the "open in a new window"
> option available in the right-click context menu already. *-Or at least
> have a "preferences" setting which allows ignoring targets.
>
They all do. All modern browsers have pop-up blockers, which can be
set to block all pop-ups. Which I do in IE7 and Firefox3 as well as
Opera (when I actually use Opera that is).
--
Regards Chad. http://freewebdesignonline.org

On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 09:24:58 +0000 (UTC), Neredbojias
<> wrote:

>On 19 Dec 2008, (Raymond Schmit) wrote:
>
>>>> Also, there may be other legitimate reasons for having a link open
>>>> in a second window. I find it odd, that not provision has been
>>>> made for that.
>>>
>>>Well, if the majority of your users like it, so be it. However,
>>>believe me when I say the majority of most people don't.
>>
>> The best way of solving this issue, is that the browser must be able
>> with a right-clik on the link to propose:
>> Open in the same window if the "_blank" option is used
>> Open in a new window if the "_blank" option is not used
>
>Why not make browsers ignore the target attribute altogether? I believe
>most (maybe all) modern browsers already have the "open in a new window"
>option available in the right-click context menu already. -Or at least
>have a "preferences" setting which allows ignoring targets.

Yes .... but why not having also the "open in the same window"
option. ?

On 21 Dec 2008, Chaddy2222 <spamlovermailbox->
wrote:

> On Dec 21, 8:24*pm, Neredbojias <neredboj...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Why not make browsers ignore the target attribute altogether? *I
>> believ
> e
>> most (maybe all) modern browsers already have the "open in a new
>> window" option available in the right-click context menu already.
>> *-Or at least have a "preferences" setting which allows ignoring
>> targets.
>>
> They all do. All modern browsers have pop-up blockers, which can be
> set to block all pop-ups. Which I do in IE7 and Firefox3 as well as
> Opera (when I actually use Opera that is).

But can these pop-up blockers be set to ignore "pop-ups" created by the
"target=_blank" attribute? I know they work on j/s pop-ups and at
least some browsers can be persuaded to open new windows in tabs, but
how 'bout the first thing?

--
Neredbojias
http://www.neredbojias.org/
http://www.neredbojias.net/

On 21 Dec 2008, (Raymond Schmit) wrote:

> On Sun, 21 Dec 2008 09:24:58 +0000 (UTC), Neredbojias
> <> wrote:
>>Why not make browsers ignore the target attribute altogether? I
>>believe most (maybe all) modern browsers already have the "open in a
>>new window" option available in the right-click context menu already.
>> -Or at least have a "preferences" setting which allows ignoring
>>targets.
>
> Yes .... but why not having also the "open in the same window"
> option. ?

Shouldn't be needed; that is and should be the default, then if any
page target setting is ignored...

--
Neredbojias
http://www.neredbojias.org/
http://www.neredbojias.net/