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Ping Craig Whitmore - Does Orcon's email server do SMTP auth from a remote IP?

 
 
Mark C
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      08-19-2008
Hi,

My brother has a free Orcon email account (was dialup) and is now
overseas.

Trying to get him to send emails from his Orcon account (OE).

Tried setting the Outgoing Mail Server/"My server requires
authentication" ON, but no go (could be because he can't follow
instructions, could be because I can't explain properly, could be
because its not supported by Orcon).

Does Orcon have SMTP auth for outgoing emails?

If not I'll get him to forward via gmail.

Thanks,
Mark
 
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Jasen Betts
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      08-21-2008
On 2008-08-20, Mark C <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> dilberts_left_nut <not@home> wrote in news:48abb94c$(E-Mail Removed):
>
>> Mark C wrote:
>>> Trying to get him to send emails from his Orcon account (OE).

>>
>> Maybe the network he is connected to blocks outgoing port 25
>> connections, this is becoming more common.

>
> I'll try that, assuming I can get him to understand telnet (and
> assuming his Windows XP home has a telnet client...)


xp has a partial telnet client, it's good enough to test for open
ports but as it doesn't support line buffering it sometimes won't
work for interacting with text based services.

AFAIK the home version is as bad as the pro version.

Bye.
Jasen
 
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Jasen Betts
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      08-21-2008
On 2008-08-20, Mark C <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> Puddle <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> news:48aa9f8d$(E-Mail Removed):
>
>> 250-STARTTLS

>
> Does that mean it requires Secure Password Authentication or a
> secure (SSL) connection?


it means it offers TLS on port 25. (nothing more)

after starting TLS the server is allowed to offer another set of
authentication methods which may be the same or may be partially or
completely different. AFAICT the orcon server offers the same mwthods.

> Edit: 250-AUTH PLAIN LOGIN
> I guess that means it doesn't *require* Secure Password
> Authentication but does support optional SSL/TLS?


"Secure Password Authentication" in microsoft speak is
NT Lan Manager authentication in english,
in SMTP thats "NTLM"

PLAIN and LOGIN authentication are not secure over an insecure channel.
(but after starting TLS or on a "SSL" connection they are secure )
as with both schemes the login and password are sent with only
base64 encoding to disguise their content. (it's probably not intended as
disguise)

some versions of outlook don't understand SMTP and want
"AUTH=" instead of "AUTH " (I'm not sure which versions)

> Edit+Edit: OK, I doubt Orcon support Secure Password Authentication
> anyway...


It says there that they don't ... they seem to be running an out-of-the
box install of exim ver4.67, NTLM and CRAM-MD5 authentication (both of
which are secure over insecure channels) are available with that
version of exim but orcon haven't turned them on.

One possible reason for this is that the secure password schemes
require the mail server have access to cleartext passwords, while the
insecure methods allow the server to use hashed passwords.

There's also an 'option' to use announce 'AUTH=' in addition to 'AUTH ' to
support broken versions of outlook but they haven't turned that on either.

Bye.
Jasen
 
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Jasen Betts
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      08-21-2008
On 2008-08-20, dilberts_left_nut <not@home> wrote:

> Maybe the network he is connected to blocks outgoing port 25
> connections, this is becoming more common.


indeed!

in fact Xnet started doing that today.



port 465/ssl is still available,

Bye.
Jasen
 
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Mark C
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      08-26-2008
Mark C <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
news:48aa9323$0$18552$(E-Mail Removed):

> Does Orcon have SMTP auth for outgoing emails?


For reference, when using SMTP auth and SSL/port 465 from a non-Orcon
(overseas) IP, Orcon's email server requires that the EHLO command
contain a FQDN.

Since XP won't let me set a computer name containing full-stops, my
brother can't send emails directly using Orcon.

I've set him up forwarding via gmail.

Mark
 
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Jasen Betts
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      08-26-2008
On 2008-08-26, Mark C <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> Mark C <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> news:48aa9323$0$18552$(E-Mail Removed):
>
>> Does Orcon have SMTP auth for outgoing emails?

>
> For reference, when using SMTP auth and SSL/port 465 from a non-Orcon
> (overseas) IP, Orcon's email server requires that the EHLO command
> contain a FQDN.
>
> Since XP won't let me set a computer name containing full-stops, my
> brother can't send emails directly using Orcon.


Microsoft's SMTP support is shocking, it's asif they are allergic to
documented standards.
anyway It's not an operating system problem it's a mail client problem.

I can't blame orcon for following the standards.

The server seems to accept anything with a domain part eg localhost.localnet
or a.b or an IP address (v4 or V6) inside brackets eg: [127.0.0.1]

seamonkey uses it's IP address after EHLO (well it does here)

Bye.
Jasen
 
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Mark C
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      11-13-2008
"Craig Whitmore" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
news:490d4ade$(E-Mail Removed):

> Sorry for the delay in answering. (I've not been on here for
> quite a while)
>
> You can use port 587 (Submission Port) and turn on SMTP AUTH
> and make sure "This Server requires a secure connection(SSL)" on
> outlook express for example.


Thanks for answering anyway!

We eventually got him forwarding through gmail while spoofing the
Orcon addy (send as).

From memory, SMTP AUTH thru Orcon required a FQDN HELO greeting,
otherwise we got an error message from the Orcon server.

Ta,
Mark
 
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