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Canon A570IS, 200 shots on eneloop, 10 shots on Alkaline

 
 
Chris Malcolm
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      07-08-2008
SMS <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> ransley wrote:


>> You miss understand what I said, I in no way put down AA
>> rechargeables, all I use is AA, Sanyo Eneloop, or Energiser NiMh.
>> Depending on location in Alaska it could be 45f for a high around now.
>> I recently bought new what were outdated Alkaline cells that after one
>> month wont run a tv remote, but we have no idea how this person used
>> the camera or how much time they reviewed their shots with the Lcd. I
>> suspect poor battery performance was from a lack of the persons
>> understanding many issues on cameras, settings and batteries.


> I'm sure the LCD was being used to frame the shot, not the viewfinder,
> and that no effort was made to turn off the flash. However the time
> spent reviewing the photos on the LCD was minimal. I guess that it's
> possible that the batteries sold on the ship were old, but alkalines
> have a very long shelf life.


> The A60 used four AA batteries, the A570IS uses two, despite having a
> larger LCD and other power-consuming features.


> When I get the camera back I'm going to try it with alkalines, something
> I never tried (I use lithium AAs as a backup, and they work fine).


> I wish some reviews would include battery life for NiMH, Lithium, and
> alkaline AAs. Now the typical review says something like "The alkalines
> that come in the box will quickly find their way into the trash."


> I don't mind AA rechargeables now that low-discharge NiMH batteries are
> so widely available and so cheap, but I didn't expect alkalines to be as
> bad as they are.


In my Canon Powershot AA-using A300 I only get about a dozen shots on
a cold day. But after putting the batteries in a warm pocket for five
minutes I'll get several more. And so on. If I'm shooting in the cold
I'll usually keep rotating three sets through the camera and a warm
pocket to keep the thing going.

--
Chris Malcolm http://www.velocityreviews.com/forums/(E-Mail Removed) DoD #205
IPAB, Informatics, JCMB, King's Buildings, Edinburgh, EH9 3JZ, UK
[http://www.dai.ed.ac.uk/homes/cam/]

 
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SMS
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      07-08-2008
Chris Malcolm wrote:

> In my Canon Powershot AA-using A300 I only get about a dozen shots on
> a cold day. But after putting the batteries in a warm pocket for five
> minutes I'll get several more. And so on. If I'm shooting in the cold
> I'll usually keep rotating three sets through the camera and a warm
> pocket to keep the thing going.


I don't think it was too cold on this cruise. It was San Francisco,
Ketchikan, Juneau, Skagway, Tracy Arm Fjord, Victoria, San Francisco in
late June/early July. I've been much further north in Alaska, earlier in
June, and the weather was pretty mild.

 
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Chris Malcolm
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      07-08-2008
SMS <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> Chris Malcolm wrote:


>> In my Canon Powershot AA-using A300 I only get about a dozen shots on
>> a cold day. But after putting the batteries in a warm pocket for five
>> minutes I'll get several more. And so on. If I'm shooting in the cold
>> I'll usually keep rotating three sets through the camera and a warm
>> pocket to keep the thing going.


> I don't think it was too cold on this cruise. It was San Francisco,
> Ketchikan, Juneau, Skagway, Tracy Arm Fjord, Victoria, San Francisco in
> late June/early July. I've been much further north in Alaska, earlier in
> June, and the weather was pretty mild.


What kind of AAs was she using? Some cameras have brief high peak
surge current demands which are uncomfortably close to the maximum the
cheaper alkaline AAs can deliver. That's why lower nominal capacity
reachargeables can last so much longer than nominally much higher
capacity alkalines in some cameras. I've bought some cheap alkaline
AAs on the run which only lasted a dozen or so shots even in summer
sun.

--
Chris Malcolm (E-Mail Removed) DoD #205
IPAB, Informatics, JCMB, King's Buildings, Edinburgh, EH9 3JZ, UK
[http://www.dai.ed.ac.uk/homes/cam/]

 
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SMS
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      07-08-2008
Chris Malcolm wrote:
> SMS <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>> Chris Malcolm wrote:

>
>>> In my Canon Powershot AA-using A300 I only get about a dozen shots on
>>> a cold day. But after putting the batteries in a warm pocket for five
>>> minutes I'll get several more. And so on. If I'm shooting in the cold
>>> I'll usually keep rotating three sets through the camera and a warm
>>> pocket to keep the thing going.

>
>> I don't think it was too cold on this cruise. It was San Francisco,
>> Ketchikan, Juneau, Skagway, Tracy Arm Fjord, Victoria, San Francisco in
>> late June/early July. I've been much further north in Alaska, earlier in
>> June, and the weather was pretty mild.

>
> What kind of AAs was she using? Some cameras have brief high peak
> surge current demands which are uncomfortably close to the maximum the
> cheaper alkaline AAs can deliver. That's why lower nominal capacity
> reachargeables can last so much longer than nominally much higher
> capacity alkalines in some cameras. I've bought some cheap alkaline
> AAs on the run which only lasted a dozen or so shots even in summer
> sun.


I'll find out when I get the camera back. I guess it's possible that the
cruise line was selling some no-name AA batteries, but I doubt it.
 
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ransley
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      07-09-2008
On Jul 7, 5:37*pm, Clair Johnston <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> ransley wrote:
> > On Jul 7, 5:15 am, SMS <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> >> I lent our A570IS to a relative for a cruise to Alaska. She didn't want
> >> to take the NiMH batteries and charger, so I told her to bring plenty of
> >> disposable AA Alkaline batteries, which she didn't, so she was buying AA
> >> batteries on the ship (I cringe to think of the price that Princess must
> >> charge for AA batteries). She came back today, complaining that the
> >> camera would only take "a few" pictures on a set of AA batteries and
> >> that she stopped using it rather than buying AA batteries on the ship.

>
> >> I've never used Alkaline AA batteries in this camera, but an older A60
> >> uses four AA alkaline batteries without any problems, giving about 150
> >> shots per set. In the A570IS I always use either NiMH or lithium AA
> >> cells as a back-up (though now that spare lithium AA batteries aren't
> >> allowed in checked luggage, I only keep one emergency set with the
> >> camera) and don't take along a couple of four packs). I wonder if this
> >> is normal with AA alkaline batteries and this camera. Alkaline batteries
> >> have very high internal resistance, and don't last as long in
> >> high-current applications as NiMH, but surely they should be good for
> >> more than 10 shots or so.

>
> > *Thats what happens when you lend a camera to someone who makes no
> > effort to understand the camera fully. With flash? what was the
> > temperature, with IS on, autofocus, Lcd, alot of reviewing, and
> > someone who doesnt know how to use a camera, who knows. Someone who
> > thinks can use settings that dont drain batteries as fast. What brand
> > and age were the batteries, I recently bought old ones that were not
> > very good. Alkaline to me dont work well.

>
> When I bought my first digital p&s camera (Olympus 3030) a few years
> back, I didn't have rechargeables with me and wanted to try it out.
> I put in 4 alkalines (fresh) and started taking pictures while my wife
> continued shopping. *Fifteen (15) shots and they were dead. *Different
> cameras seem to have different drain characteristics. A Nikon Coolpix
> that uses 2 AA batteries delivers about 1/2 the shots of rechargables
> when powered via alkaline.
>
> Clair- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -


My old sony is the same, with alkaline in winter I got a few shots,
with nimh I go forever it seems. Now i use eneloop since my NiMh are
very old, its great having a charged camera now!
 
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SMS
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      07-09-2008
ransley wrote:

> My old sony is the same, with alkaline in winter I got a few shots,
> with nimh I go forever it seems. Now i use eneloop since my NiMh are
> very old, its great having a charged camera now!


Okay, so it seems to be a consensus that getting very few shots on
alkalines is pretty normal on newer models. I should have insisted that
my sister-in-law take a charger and some NiMH cells. I've been spoiled
by not having to deal with AA batteries for a while. I bought the A570
IS because the spousal unit wanted a larger camera than the sub-compact
pocket cameras (which all use Li-Ion), and the AA batteries were a
compromise I was willing to make in light of the Sanyo eneloops and
other low-discharge NiMH batteries.

I've added some stuff to the web site about this. Unrelated, I've added
a longer evaluation of the Tenergy T6278 Universal (AAA, AA, C, D, 9V)
Smart Charger, I've expanded the section on solar charging, and fixed
some of the dead links.

Steve
"http://batterydata.com"
Earth's Independent Source for Digital Camera Battery Information
 
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ASAAR
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      07-09-2008
On Wed, 09 Jul 2008 07:47:07 -0700, SMS wrote:

>> My old sony is the same, with alkaline in winter I got a few shots,
>> with nimh I go forever it seems. Now i use eneloop since my NiMh are
>> very old, its great having a charged camera now!

>
> Okay, so it seems to be a consensus that getting very few shots on
> alkalines is pretty normal on newer models.


It's the same old story with you, isn't it? You'll blindly accept
whatever anecdotal report supports your bias. Why don't you test
your A570 IS when you get it back? Getting fewer shots on new
camera models using alkalines is *not* pretty normal. My Fuji is
good for 300 shots using the CIPA test where 1/2 of the shots use
the flash at full power, and with the LCD display turned on. The
previous version of this camera was only good for 250 shots.

Your own A570 IS is rated by Canon as being good for 120 shots
using alkalines with the same stringent CIPA test, and 400 shots per
set of alkaline batteries with the more lenient non-CIPA test where
the viewfinder is used instead of the LCD display. The previous
version lacking IS (A530/A540) was only good for 90 and 360 shots,
respectively. You and I both know that with a fresh pair of
alkaline AA cells and the mild weather your relative used your A570
IS in, it will be good for far more than 10 shots, even if you
forget to disable the flash. But that won't stop you from trying to
mislead gullible visitors to your "battery information" website.

BTW, Canon reports that with the latest version (the A590 IS) the
number of "CIPA" shots using the flash and LCD display increases
from the previous 90/120 to 200 shots. So much for your theory that
newer cameras get fewer shots from their batteries. You once again
have demonstrated your fanatical battery bias and lack of integrity.

 
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SMS
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      07-10-2008
ransley wrote:

> Thats what happens when you lend a camera to someone who makes no
> effort to understand the camera fully. With flash? what was the
> temperature, with IS on, autofocus, Lcd, alot of reviewing, and
> someone who doesnt know how to use a camera, who knows. Someone who
> thinks can use settings that dont drain batteries as fast. What brand
> and age were the batteries, I recently bought old ones that were not
> very good. Alkaline to me dont work well.


Well the whole point of a point at shoot is that you should be able to
use it _without_ having to understand it fully. I don't care what the
settings are, 10 photos on a set of batteries, even with flash, even
with reviewing the photos is unacceptable. Including a set of alkaline
AA batteries may be seen as a good idea by the manufacturer, but I think
it really gives the wrong impression of their product to the consumer
that isn't familiar with all the issues of different kinds of batteries.
I didn't realize just how bad the situation is with alkaline batteries
until I saw all the responses to the original post. I looked on the
Canon web site and they say 120 shots on a set of alkaline batteries,
but they don't say the conditions used.
 
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ASAAR
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      07-10-2008
On Wed, 09 Jul 2008 19:20:54 -0700, SMS wrote:

> Well the whole point of a point at shoot is that you should be able to
> use it _without_ having to understand it fully. I don't care what the
> settings are, 10 photos on a set of batteries, even with flash, even
> with reviewing the photos is unacceptable.


Yes, assuming that one (such as your relative) isn't a total
nitwit. If the AA batteries were unused when placed in the camera,
getting only 10 shots may be because they weren't alkaline
batteries. Using standard, or "heavy duty" batteries could result
in only 10 shots. That you automatically assume that your camera
might be good for only 10 shots per set of alkalines indicates that
either nitwit genes run in your family, or that you're still at it,
trying to dishonestly mislead gullible people into thinking that
cameras won't perform well if they use AA batteries.

> Including a set of alkaline
> AA batteries may be seen as a good idea by the manufacturer, but I think
> it really gives the wrong impression of their product to the consumer
> that isn't familiar with all the issues of different kinds of batteries.
> I didn't realize just how bad the situation is with alkaline batteries
> until I saw all the responses to the original post. I looked on the
> Canon web site and they say 120 shots on a set of alkaline batteries,
> but they don't say the conditions used.


Nitwit or spinmeister? The information is in your manual. Using
alkaline batteries the A570 IS is good for 120 shots using the CIPA
test procedure, and approximately 400 shots for flashless shots
using the viewfinder. Once again, the self proclaimed battery
expert has to resort to pretending to be dull witted and ignorant in
order to make it appear that AA batteries aren't up to the job.

BTW, once again you appear to be either a complete nitwit or are
blatantly lying when you claim that "they don't say the conditions
used". Have you any idea what "CIPA" means? Quoting from the
Specifications Tab on Canon's A570 IS web page :

> Shooting Capacity Still Image: approx. 120 shots (AA-size Alkaline Battery),
> approx. 400 shots (AA-size NiMH Battery)*
>
> Playback Time Approx. 540 min. (AA-size Alkaline Battery), approx.
> 660 min. (AA-size NiMH Battery)*
>
> * LCD screen on. The above figures comply with CIPA testing
> standards and apply when fully-charged batteries are used.



http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/co...elTechSpecsAct

 
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SMS
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      07-11-2008
Chris Malcolm wrote:

> What kind of AAs was she using? Some cameras have brief high peak
> surge current demands which are uncomfortably close to the maximum the
> cheaper alkaline AAs can deliver. That's why lower nominal capacity
> reachargeables can last so much longer than nominally much higher
> capacity alkalines in some cameras. I've bought some cheap alkaline
> AAs on the run which only lasted a dozen or so shots even in summer
> sun.


I saw on the Delkin web site at
"http://www.delkin.com/pdf/product_docs/rcr_v3.pdf" their comparisons
between AA alkaline, AA NiMH, and the RCRV3 that they sell. Of course
they're trying to sell the RCRV3 packs, so maybe they aren't credible
(and the self-discharge they show is pre-eneloop), but everyone that's
responded to my original post said the same thing about alkaline
batteries (in fact Delkin shows more shots on alkalines than anyone
seems to have gotten with alkalines). I don't think the RCRV3 will work
in the A570 though.
 
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