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Microsoft does not care a hoot about small biz and home users

 
 
peterwn
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Posts: n/a
 
      11-05-2007
See:
http://www.stuff.co.nz/4261312a13.html

"The XP downgrade option was available only to buyers of the business
version of Vista, said Rayner, because users of the home editions,
even if they were small businesses, would not be badly affected."

Translated:
1. We are scared stiff that larrge corporates will go the Linux /
Open Office / ODF way if we continue to try and ram Vista down their
throats.
2. We do not care a hoot about small business / home users - they are
almost a captive market for our over priced under performing software
as long as we can keep the government / education / corporate market
tied up.

"But he said any small business with difficulties over Vista should
contact the company. "

Translated:
1. If you come to us on bended knees, we might just slip you an XP CD
under the counter. We would not want you guys to form associations
and start ganging up on us.

 
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E. Scrooge
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      11-05-2007

"peterwn" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed) oups.com...
> See:
> http://www.stuff.co.nz/4261312a13.html
>
> "The XP downgrade option was available only to buyers of the business
> version of Vista, said Rayner, because users of the home editions,
> even if they were small businesses, would not be badly affected."
>
> Translated:
> 1. We are scared stiff that larrge corporates will go the Linux /
> Open Office / ODF way if we continue to try and ram Vista down their
> throats.
> 2. We do not care a hoot about small business / home users - they are
> almost a captive market for our over priced under performing software
> as long as we can keep the government / education / corporate market
> tied up.
>
> "But he said any small business with difficulties over Vista should
> contact the company. "
>
> Translated:
> 1. If you come to us on bended knees, we might just slip you an XP CD
> under the counter. We would not want you guys to form associations
> and start ganging up on us.


XP is available from Dell and other brands... in America and till January
31st 2008.

E. Scrooge


 
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Roy Schestowitz
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Posts: n/a
 
      11-05-2007
____/ *sling on Monday 05 November 2007 11:13 : \____

>
> "peterwn" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed) oups.com...
>> See:
>> http://www.stuff.co.nz/4261312a13.html
>>
>> "The XP downgrade option was available only to buyers of the business
>> version of Vista, said Rayner, because users of the home editions,
>> even if they were small businesses, would not be badly affected."
>>
>> Translated:
>> 1. We are scared stiff that larrge corporates will go the Linux /
>> Open Office / ODF way if we continue to try and ram Vista down their
>> throats.
>> 2. We do not care a hoot about small business / home users - they are
>> almost a captive market for our over priced under performing software
>> as long as we can keep the government / education / corporate market
>> tied up.
>>
>> "But he said any small business with difficulties over Vista should
>> contact the company. "
>>
>> Translated:
>> 1. If you come to us on bended knees, we might just slip you an XP CD
>> under the counter. We would not want you guys to form associations
>> and start ganging up on us.

>
> XP is available from Dell and other brands... in America and till January
> 31st 2008.
>
> E. Scrooge


I suspect Microsoft had the extended (by 5 months?) due to backlash. That
happened about a month ago.

--
~~ Best of wishes

Maths applied to numbers is like logic applied to statistics. Statistics are
lies.
http://Schestowitz.com | GNU/Linux | PGP-Key: 0x74572E8E
Mem: 515500k total, 235220k used, 280280k free, 3972k buffers
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Jeremy Wembley
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      11-05-2007

"peterwn" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed) oups.com...
> See:
> http://www.stuff.co.nz/4261312a13.html
>
> "The XP downgrade option was available only to buyers of the business
> version of Vista, said Rayner, because users of the home editions,
> even if they were small businesses, would not be badly affected."
>
> Translated:
> 1. We are scared stiff that larrge corporates will go the Linux /
> Open Office / ODF way if we continue to try and ram Vista down their
> throats.
> 2. We do not care a hoot about small business / home users - they are
> almost a captive market for our over priced under performing software
> as long as we can keep the government / education / corporate market
> tied up.
>
> "But he said any small business with difficulties over Vista should
> contact the company. "
>
> Translated:
> 1. If you come to us on bended knees, we might just slip you an XP CD
> under the counter. We would not want you guys to form associations
> and start ganging up on us.
>




Gee - Windows XP is available for this laptop.
http://global.acer.com/products/notebook/fr4000.htm

And Windows XP is also available for this laptop.
http://global.acer.com/products/notebook/tm2410.htm

Wow - Amazing that an "unavailable OS" can be bought here too.
http://www.dell.com/content/products...en&s=bsd&cs=04

My, my. And yet another computer where XP is available as an option.
http://www.dell.com/content/products...en&s=bsd&cs=04



Translated - Peterwn is a idiot ^h^h LIAR ^h^h typical "COLA advocate" who
like most other linux idiots ^h^h^h LIARS ^h^h^h "advocates" has
absolutely zero idea what he's talking about.




--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

 
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Nighthawk
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      11-05-2007
On Tue, 6 Nov 2007 00:13:07 +1300, "E. Scrooge" <scrooge@*shot.co.nz
(*sling)> wrote:

>
>"peterwn" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
>news:(E-Mail Removed) roups.com...
>> See:
>> http://www.stuff.co.nz/4261312a13.html
>>
>> "The XP downgrade option was available only to buyers of the business
>> version of Vista, said Rayner, because users of the home editions,
>> even if they were small businesses, would not be badly affected."
>>
>> Translated:
>> 1. We are scared stiff that larrge corporates will go the Linux /
>> Open Office / ODF way if we continue to try and ram Vista down their
>> throats.
>> 2. We do not care a hoot about small business / home users - they are
>> almost a captive market for our over priced under performing software
>> as long as we can keep the government / education / corporate market
>> tied up.
>>
>> "But he said any small business with difficulties over Vista should
>> contact the company. "
>>
>> Translated:
>> 1. If you come to us on bended knees, we might just slip you an XP CD
>> under the counter. We would not want you guys to form associations
>> and start ganging up on us.

>
>XP is available from Dell and other brands... in America and till January
>31st 2008.
>

http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/f...alescycle.mspx

June 30, 2008.

In an effort to respond to feedback the company is hearing from its
customers and partners, Microsoft is extending availability of Windows
XP editions among original equipment manufacturers (OEM) and retail
channels for an additional five months to June 30, 2008.

 
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chrisv
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      11-05-2007
Nighthawk wrote:

>http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/f...alescycle.mspx
>
>June 30, 2008.
>
>In an effort to respond to feedback the company is hearing from its
>customers and partners, Microsoft is extending availability of Windows
>XP editions among original equipment manufacturers (OEM) and retail
>channels for an additional five months to June 30, 2008.


You gotta like the M$ spin:

Nash: "While we’ve been pleased with the positive response we’ve seen
and heard from customers using Windows Vista, there are some customers
who need a little more time to make the switch to Windows Vista."

Translation:

"We tried to bully our customers into buying what is, for many of
them, a completely inappropriate product, requiring far greater
hardware resources, with little or no benefit. Additionally,
customers complained that they had no desire to change to a new and
unproven version of our bloatware, at least until the first major
"service pack" has been released. So, even though a few misguided
souls actually like Vista and gave positive feedback, the outpouring
of dissatisfaction over it's drawbacks, and over our customer-hostile
policies, forced us to backpedal and continue to offer the older
product."

 
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Rex Ballard
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      11-05-2007
On Nov 5, 4:16 am, peterwn <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> See:http://www.stuff.co.nz/4261312a13.html


The person being quoted in the first paragraph was:
Microsoft Windows client marketing manager David Rayner told the Star-
Times the company was aware of concerns.

> "The XP downgrade option was available only to buyers of the business
> version of Vista, said Rayner, because users of the home editions,
> even if they were small businesses, would not be badly affected."


This is an official confirmation of what we have suspected in this
group all along. OEMs who are selling PCs with XP are actually
purchasing a Vista Business license which then allows them to
downgrade to XP. So Microsoft IS counting XP machines as Vista
Business Edition licenses.

> Translated:
> 1. We are scared stiff that large corporates will go the Linux /
> Open Office / ODF way if we continue to try and ram Vista down their
> throats.


Which appears to have backfired. Microsoft is able to make lots of
statements in the press about the "Success" of Vista, and even cites
the surprisingly high proportion of Vista Business Edition sales.

It's noteworthy that OEMs have dropped the price of the upgrade to
Vista Business/XP to $20, which is quite likely their cost. It's
possible that Microsoft is counting two licenses, the Vista Home Basic
or Home Premium sold bulk at minimum commitment to the OEMS, and then
counting the machines sold with Vista Business as a SECOND VISTA
license, even though the machine was SHIPPED as Windows XP. This
could mean that OEMS are actually selling FEWER actual machines this
year than they did the first year of XP, and given that most of
Microsoft's XP license counts were the result of "Force-feed" licenses
to Volume License customers, OEMs, and retailers, even that didn't
generate as many actual PC sales as the OEMS had hoped.

It may even be that any "surge" in PC sales was a scramble to get
machines with XP while they were still available. Normally, Microsoft
allows OEMs a few MONTHS of grace period during which they can sell
the previous version as an option. Demand for XP machines may have
been so strong that Microsoft came up with the "Buy Vista Business and
you can downgrade to XP" option to prevent XP numbers from becoming
public knowledge.


IF THIS IS TRUE, then Microsoft may be guilty of fraud on a massive
scale (again).

There may be Sarbanes-Oxley violations.

Top executives who left Microsoft prior to the release of the latest
10Q may have
known this and were attempting to avoid the risk of being sent to
jail.

They may have also decide to get off the sinking ship before they got
pulled in.


> 2. We do not care a hoot about small business / home users - they are
> almost a captive market for our over priced under performing software
> as long as we can keep the government / education / corporate market
> tied up.


More accurately, "we don't care a hoot about retailers". Anyone who
wants Windows XP on their laptop can order it from Dell, HP, Lenovo,
Gateway, Acer, Toshiba, Sony or the rest of the "top 10" vendors via
the web and simply request XP. Behind the scenes, what they are
actually doing is purchasing a Vista Business license and the OEM is
providing the downgrade to XP at no additional cost. The OEM simply
ships a hard drive that has been preconfigured with XP instead of one
that is pre-configured with Vista Business.

At this point, the price, when ordered via phone or web, is only about
$20 more. This is about 1/2 the cost of the full license at OEM
quantity prices.

The problem is that the machines sent to RETAILERS is only configured
with Vista Home Basic or Vista Home Premium. Most stores won't even
take the machines with Vista Home Basic anymore because those buying
it have been having their computers disabled by WGA. It seems that if
you install iTunes, Rhapsody, or other media players on Home BASIC,
it's a violation of the license. If you attempt to run Home BASIC as
a VM client, your License to ANY use of Home BASIC is revoked.
Retailers had so many returns of Home Basic, that they have just gone
with Home Premium.

The problem is that if you want to upgrade to Vista Business so you
can downgrade to XP again, you have to purchase both upgrades in
cardboard boxes and do it yourself. Again, most people just end up
returning the machine and ordering one via the Web.

I wonder, is Microsoft is counting these returns in their license
counts?

> "But he said any small business with difficulties over Vista should
> contact the company. "


If you have a PC with an extended warranty, return it and have it
upgraded. If you can't return it, call Microsoft and they will charge
you for BOTH the upgrade AND the downgrade. Remember, if you
purchased your Vista license as part of an OEM PC, then you can't call
Microsoft directly, you have to call the manufacturer. In most cases,
Manufacturers will offer to "swap out" your hard drive for one that's
pre-loaded with XP. You have to purchase the upgrade to Vista
Business and you have to pay shipping and handling, and you won't be
getting installation media (though some OEMs offer installation media
for a nominal charge), but you can usually get the upgrade to XP for
less than $100, compared to almost $159 in the stores.

Appearantly there were a number of people who tried to upgrade to
Vista and then hated it so much they wanted to switch back to XP.
Several Magazines included XP Recovery CDs because there was such
demand. I wonder if Microsoft counted those licenses as Vista?

> Translated:
> 1. If you come to us on bended knees, we might just slip you an XP CD
> under the counter. We would not want you guys to form associations
> and start ganging up on us.


I think Microsoft is acutely aware of the problem. Steve and Bill are
putting up a good front, but a number of executives have left the
company after years of service. At least one gave up a substantial
bonus because he was in such a hurry to get out.

I think the story was in InfoWorld or ComputerWorld. Unfortunately,
both publications purge their web content after only a few days.


 
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Rex Ballard
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      11-05-2007
On Nov 5, 9:56 am, chrisv <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> Nighthawk wrote:
> >http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/f...09-27xpsalescy...

>
> >June 30, 2008.

>
> >In an effort to respond to feedback the company is hearing from its
> >customers and partners, Microsoft is extending availability of Windows
> >XP editions among original equipment manufacturers (OEM) and retail
> >channels for an additional five months to June 30, 2008.

>
> You gotta like the M$ spin:
>
> Nash: "While we've been pleased with the positive response we've seen
> and heard from customers using Windows Vista, there are some customers
> who need a little more time to make the switch to Windows Vista."
>
> Translation:
>
> "We tried to bully our customers into buying what is, for many of
> them, a completely inappropriate product, requiring far greater
> hardware resources, with little or no benefit. Additionally,
> customers complained that they had no desire to change to a new and
> unproven version of our bloatware, at least until the first major
> "service pack" has been released. So, even though a few misguided
> souls actually like Vista and gave positive feedback, the outpouring
> of dissatisfaction over it's drawbacks, and over our customer-hostile
> policies, forced us to backpedal and continue to offer the older
> product."


I also like the way they invite small businesses who are having
problems to contact the company directly. Perhaps Microsoft wants
these companies to sign nondisclosure agreements prior to the
discussion, and then promise not to tell anyone about the problems
they have been having with the transition to Vista?

I'm beginning to wonder how long before the whole mess explodes in
their faces. Microsoft can lie to the press. Microsoft can lie to
the public. They can even make misleading statements on their SEC
filings, but Microsoft's REAL customers - the OEMS and large
corporations, aren't so easily fooled. You can put all the sugar on
the doggie droppings you want, even pile it high with sweet frosting,
but if you are the one who has to actually EAT that doggie poo, you
KNOW it's not chocolate cake you are eating.

Microsoft has tried to make their REAL customers eat Vista, which has
turned out to be sugar coated doggie poo. And the OEMs are the ones
watching Microsoft report 40% inclease in revenue and profits, while
they are looking at rapidly diminishing revenue, minimal profits or
even deep losses and subsidies of the PC business, and beginning to
look at Microsoft in a completely different way.

Remember, Microsoft was "indespensible" only when they could assure
the creation of a huge market that produced huge profits. At this
point, Microsoft has delivered a huge market that is generating huge
LOSSES. Fortunately, companies like HP and Dell have other sources of
revenue, and they can offset the losses in the PC business with
profits from printers, HDTVs, servers, consulting, and software
profits. Gateway isn't so lucky. They have been bleeding red ink for
years. Their stock price dropped so low that they were on the verge
of being delisted. Acer snapped up the company at a fraction of it's
price when XP was released, and will have to make radical changes to
the product and marketing (here's where Linux and Microsoft collide),
in order to make that brand profitable again.

It should be noted that ACER has been focusing it's efforts on making
"Linux Ready" PCs, and has done very well in that market. Machines
were sold with XP, but could be converted to SUSE or Ubuntu Linux in
less than an hour and EVERYTHING worked. To Acer, Microsoft Windows
licenses are more of a nuicance than an indespensible feature, and
Vista has become a liablity.

IBM just scuttled their PC business, selling off nearly all of it's
desktop and laptop lines to Lenovo. IBM still sells the
Intellistation, which are offered with the choice of Linux or Windows
XP (NOT Vista). The Intellistation Power series offers the choice of
Linux and/or AIX.

They aren't cheap, but they are powerful and quite competitive with
the Apple high end systems.

 
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DFS
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      11-05-2007
Rex Ballard wrote:

> It should be noted that ACER has been focusing it's efforts on making
> "Linux Ready" PCs, and has done very well in that market. Machines
> were sold with XP, but could be converted to SUSE or Ubuntu Linux in
> less than an hour and EVERYTHING worked. To Acer, Microsoft Windows
> licenses are more of a nuicance than an indespensible feature, and
> Vista has become a liablity.



Acer "recommends Windows Vista" all over the world


http://global.acer.com/



including Turkey

http://www.acer.com.tr/public/page3....crc=2743844784

Acer, Is Amaçli Bilgi Islem için Windows Vista® Business ürününü önerir
Acer, Kisisel Bilgi Islem için Windows Vista® Home Premium ürününü önerir





> IBM just scuttled their PC business, selling off nearly all of it's
> desktop and laptop lines to Lenovo.


Lenovo? Oh, they also recommend Windows Vista (Business and Home Premium).

http://shop.lenovo.com/SEUILibrary/c...rtals/Products


 
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peter
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      11-05-2007
peterwn wrote:
> See:
> http://www.stuff.co.nz/4261312a13.html
> "The XP downgrade option was available only to buyers of the business
> version of Vista, said Rayner, because users of the home editions,
> even if they were small businesses, would not be badly affected."
>
> Translated:
> 1. We are scared stiff that larrge corporates will go the Linux /
> Open Office / ODF way if we continue to try and ram Vista down their
> throats.


Maybe this (at least partly) explains recent sales trend with Macs?
http://www.itpro.co.uk/wireless/news...e-profits.html

"Apple has once again surprised analysts and the markets by turning in
another massive jump in quarterly earnings and sales, again fuelled by
growth in its computer business rather than just sales of its iPod digital
media device. The company shipped 2.164 million Macintosh computers, 34
per cent up on the same quarter last year. The biggest seller was again its
MacBook and MacBook Pro laptop lines, selling a total of 1.347 million
units compared with 817,000 desktop computers."



Peter

 
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