«

On Tue, 23 Jan 2007 10:08:53 +1300, Allistar wrote:

>>> The 6800 is still only dual core. I've seen examples of overclocking the
>>> quad core qx6700, but I'm not sure I'm game enough to risk frying a $1900
>>> processor!
>>
>> But what about dual sockets running two cores per socket?
>
> I couldn't find any motherboards that would do dual processors with the
> Pentium Core Duo chips. There are plenty for Xeon. I reckon a quad core in
> one package would outperform two dual cores.

Do you mean that you think two dual-cored Opterons don't outperform 4
intel cores packaged onto one chip?


--
Dianthus Mimulus

Microsoft's business practises exposed in court:
http://www.maxframe.com/DR/Info/full...#_Toc447960918

Dianthus Mimulus wrote:

> On Tue, 23 Jan 2007 10:08:53 +1300, Allistar wrote:
>
>>>> The 6800 is still only dual core. I've seen examples of overclocking
>>>> the quad core qx6700, but I'm not sure I'm game enough to risk frying a
>>>> $1900 processor!
>>>
>>> But what about dual sockets running two cores per socket?
>>
>> I couldn't find any motherboards that would do dual processors with the
>> Pentium Core Duo chips. There are plenty for Xeon. I reckon a quad core
>> in one package would outperform two dual cores.
>
> Do you mean that you think two dual-cored Opterons don't outperform 4
> intel cores packaged onto one chip?

That's my dilemma. Which setup will perform better.

Will the faster memory and faster FSB but larger pipeline of the Intel
outperform the slower FSB, smaller pipeline but better integration of each
core of the Opteron?

(I was actually referring to 2 dual core intels vs 1 quad core intel in my
message though).

Allistar.

Allistar wrote:
> Dianthus Mimulus wrote:
>
> > On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 22:48:46 +1300, Allistar wrote:
> >
> > > Another question: The m/b has a 1066MHz FSB. Do I need to match
> > > the DDR2 memory speed to that to get optimal performance? I can
> > > get 2x2Gb 1066MHz DDR2 SDRAM chips, but could fit more in for the
> > > same dollars if the speed was less.
> >
> > I thought that DDR2 clocked at half the clock speed of the FSB. Is
> > that not correct?
>
> Not sure - that's beyond my knowledge. I've asked the technical dudes
> at Ascent. If that's true, what's the point of selling 1066MHz SDRAM?
> I know of no CPU that is double that speed.

It's not 1066 _MHz_ SDRAM, it's 1066MHz *DDR2* SDRAM. Also, aren't Intel
(and maybe AMD now) FSB's "Quad-pumped"? (Which begs the question; Why do
they still call the RAM DDR, Dual Data Rate? Shouldn't it be QDR?) That
means that the RAM actually runs at 266MHz.

I could be wrong.
--
Shaun.

~misfit~ wrote:

> Allistar wrote:
>> Dianthus Mimulus wrote:
>>
>> > On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 22:48:46 +1300, Allistar wrote:
>> >
>> > > Another question: The m/b has a 1066MHz FSB. Do I need to match
>> > > the DDR2 memory speed to that to get optimal performance? I can
>> > > get 2x2Gb 1066MHz DDR2 SDRAM chips, but could fit more in for the
>> > > same dollars if the speed was less.
>> >
>> > I thought that DDR2 clocked at half the clock speed of the FSB. Is
>> > that not correct?
>>
>> Not sure - that's beyond my knowledge. I've asked the technical dudes
>> at Ascent. If that's true, what's the point of selling 1066MHz SDRAM?
>> I know of no CPU that is double that speed.
>
> It's not 1066 _MHz_ SDRAM, it's 1066MHz *DDR2* SDRAM. Also, aren't Intel
> (and maybe AMD now) FSB's "Quad-pumped"? (Which begs the question; Why do
> they still call the RAM DDR, Dual Data Rate? Shouldn't it be QDR?) That
> means that the RAM actually runs at 266MHz.
>
> I could be wrong.

What does that mean when it comes to picking RAM for an Intel QX6700? Is
1066MHz DDR2 SDRAM compatible? Will it perform better than lower speed RAM,
and if so by how much? Will I notice?

Allistar.

On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 11:10:41 +1300, Allistar wrote:

> Assume for a minute that cost isn't an issue, which setup would you prefer,
> and why?

Intel, more cores, thus more raw power, and other people seem to rave this
way.

Allistar wrote:
> Dianthus Mimulus wrote:
>
> > On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 21:06:03 +1300, Allistar wrote:
> >
> >> The 6800 is still only dual core. I've seen examples of overclocking the
> >> quad core qx6700, but I'm not sure I'm game enough to risk frying a $1900
> >> processor!
> >
> > But what about dual sockets running two cores per socket?
>
> I couldn't find any motherboards that would do dual processors with the
> Pentium Core Duo chips.

Xeons E51XX or E53XX are Core Duo 2 architecture with 1333-FSB
E51XX dual core
E53XX quad core

The compilation below specifies the 8 core WS for ~$2.8K;

The configuration below runs 2.77 times faster my code then dual
Opteron 285. Code is integer 64 threaded.

$ 1636 = $818.0 X 2 CPUs Xeon 5345
http://store.pagecomputers.com/catal...28ifj8n5sq0l94

$335 Tyan Tempest i5000XL (S2692ANR) Dual Xeon/LGA771/5000X
http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?p=MB-...86ba971a6bfaf6

$588 = $147 X 4 = 4GB fb-dimm/667Mhz
http://store.pagecomputers.com/catal...0#tab_overview

$80 PWS JUST PC JPC-FP600S ATX12V / EPS12V 600W Power Supply:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817181109

$35 Case http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811103003

$23 SAMSUNG SH-M522C/BEBN 52x32x52/16x CDRW/DVD
http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?p=CMB...1c5d1656d67e36

$94 320GB HD Seagate ST3320620AS 320GB SATA2 7200rpm 16MB Hard Drive
http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?p=HD-...86ba971a6bfaf6

$41.50 EVGA nVidia GeForce 7100GS 128MB DVI/HDTV PCI-Express Video Card
http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?p=EV-...86ba971a6bfaf6

---------------
Total: $2834

wrote:

>
> Allistar wrote:
>> Dianthus Mimulus wrote:
>>
>> > On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 21:06:03 +1300, Allistar wrote:
>> >
>> >> The 6800 is still only dual core. I've seen examples of overclocking
>> >> the quad core qx6700, but I'm not sure I'm game enough to risk frying
>> >> a $1900 processor!
>> >
>> > But what about dual sockets running two cores per socket?
>>
>> I couldn't find any motherboards that would do dual processors with the
>> Pentium Core Duo chips.
>
> Xeons E51XX or E53XX are Core Duo 2 architecture with 1333-FSB
> E51XX dual core
> E53XX quad core
>
> The compilation below specifies the 8 core WS for ~$2.8K;
>
> The configuration below runs 2.77 times faster my code then dual
> Opteron 285. Code is integer 64 threaded.
>
> $ 1636 = $818.0 X 2 CPUs Xeon 5345
>
http://store.pagecomputers.com/catal...28ifj8n5sq0l94
>
> $335 Tyan Tempest i5000XL (S2692ANR) Dual Xeon/LGA771/5000X
>
http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?p=MB-...86ba971a6bfaf6
>
> $588 = $147 X 4 = 4GB fb-dimm/667Mhz
>
http://store.pagecomputers.com/catal...0#tab_overview
>
> $80 PWS JUST PC JPC-FP600S ATX12V / EPS12V 600W Power Supply:
> http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16817181109
>
> $35 Case http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811103003
>
> $23 SAMSUNG SH-M522C/BEBN 52x32x52/16x CDRW/DVD
>
http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?p=CMB...1c5d1656d67e36
>
> $94 320GB HD Seagate ST3320620AS 320GB SATA2 7200rpm 16MB Hard Drive
>
http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?p=HD-...86ba971a6bfaf6
>
> $41.50 EVGA nVidia GeForce 7100GS 128MB DVI/HDTV PCI-Express Video Card
>
http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?p=EV-...86ba971a6bfaf6
>
> ---------------
> Total: $2834

Thanks for the information - good food for thought, but from what I can tell
those prices are in US dollars, which makes it a lot more expensive
considering this is a NZ group, paying in NZ dollars.

I've priced that system up in our local currency and it comes to $5519
(excl.). Thanks for the help but that's a tad over budget.

Allistar.

On Tue, 23 Jan 2007 10:44:54 +1300, Allistar wrote:

>> Do you mean that you think two dual-cored Opterons don't outperform 4
>> intel cores packaged onto one chip?
>
> That's my dilemma. Which setup will perform better.
>
> Will the faster memory and faster FSB but larger pipeline of the Intel
> outperform the slower FSB, smaller pipeline but better integration of each
> core of the Opteron?

Surely the faster frontside bus is essential on the Intel platform due to
the fact that the RAM controller is not onchip with the CPU.

I would have thought that a more important factor would be the amount of
(shareable) cache per core.


--
Dianthus Mimulus

Microsoft's business practises exposed in court:
http://www.maxframe.com/DR/Info/full...#_Toc447960918

Allistar wrote:
> ~misfit~ wrote:
>
> > Allistar wrote:
> > > Dianthus Mimulus wrote:
> > >
> > > > On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 22:48:46 +1300, Allistar wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Another question: The m/b has a 1066MHz FSB. Do I need to
> > > > > match the DDR2 memory speed to that to get optimal
> > > > > performance? I can get 2x2Gb 1066MHz DDR2 SDRAM chips, but
> > > > > could fit more in for the same dollars if the speed was less.
> > > >
> > > > I thought that DDR2 clocked at half the clock speed of the FSB.
> > > > Is that not correct?
> > >
> > > Not sure - that's beyond my knowledge. I've asked the technical
> > > dudes at Ascent. If that's true, what's the point of selling
> > > 1066MHz SDRAM? I know of no CPU that is double that speed.
> >
> > It's not 1066 _MHz_ SDRAM, it's 1066MHz *DDR2* SDRAM. Also, aren't
> > Intel (and maybe AMD now) FSB's "Quad-pumped"? (Which begs the
> > question; Why do they still call the RAM DDR, Dual Data Rate?
> > Shouldn't it be QDR?) That means that the RAM actually runs at
> > 266MHz.
> >
> > I could be wrong.
>
> What does that mean when it comes to picking RAM for an Intel QX6700?
> Is 1066MHz DDR2 SDRAM compatible? Will it perform better than lower
> speed RAM, and if so by how much? Will I notice?

Sorry Allistar, I can't really answer that. I haven't built a new machine
for a couple years and am a bit out-of-touch with current technology.

All I can say is that the faster the RAM the better. However, there comes a
point where there are diminishing returns for your dollar. Only you can pick
where on that curve you choose to buy.
--
Shaun.

~misfit~ wrote:

> Allistar wrote:
>> ~misfit~ wrote:
>>
>> > Allistar wrote:
>> > > Dianthus Mimulus wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 22:48:46 +1300, Allistar wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > > Another question: The m/b has a 1066MHz FSB. Do I need to
>> > > > > match the DDR2 memory speed to that to get optimal
>> > > > > performance? I can get 2x2Gb 1066MHz DDR2 SDRAM chips, but
>> > > > > could fit more in for the same dollars if the speed was less.
>> > > >
>> > > > I thought that DDR2 clocked at half the clock speed of the FSB.
>> > > > Is that not correct?
>> > >
>> > > Not sure - that's beyond my knowledge. I've asked the technical
>> > > dudes at Ascent. If that's true, what's the point of selling
>> > > 1066MHz SDRAM? I know of no CPU that is double that speed.
>> >
>> > It's not 1066 _MHz_ SDRAM, it's 1066MHz *DDR2* SDRAM. Also, aren't
>> > Intel (and maybe AMD now) FSB's "Quad-pumped"? (Which begs the
>> > question; Why do they still call the RAM DDR, Dual Data Rate?
>> > Shouldn't it be QDR?) That means that the RAM actually runs at
>> > 266MHz.
>> >
>> > I could be wrong.
>>
>> What does that mean when it comes to picking RAM for an Intel QX6700?
>> Is 1066MHz DDR2 SDRAM compatible? Will it perform better than lower
>> speed RAM, and if so by how much? Will I notice?
>
> Sorry Allistar, I can't really answer that. I haven't built a new machine
> for a couple years and am a bit out-of-touch with current technology.

I'm finding the same thing. The last time I hand picked hardware for a box
was a PIII-400 - things are a bit different these days.

> All I can say is that the faster the RAM the better. However, there comes
> a point where there are diminishing returns for your dollar. Only you can
> pick where on that curve you choose to buy.

Thanks for the advice, I appreciate it. I've reached the ceiling price on
what my marital unit will allow, and although I've like 4Gb I think I'll
stick with 2 for now.

Allistar.