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Full speed USB 2.0

 
 
wassa
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      09-14-2006
Is it actually legal to brand a USB 1.1 product as USB 2.0?

I recently bought an mp3 player and the spec says "Full speed USB 2.0".
Only through later research that I found out it actually means USB 1.1.
Do I have a legal case at all if I want a refund?

 
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charlieg
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      09-14-2006

"wassa" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed) oups.com...
> Is it actually legal to brand a USB 1.1 product as USB 2.0?


No : see the Fair Trading Act 1986
http://www.legislation.govt.nz/brows...t=pal_statutes
>
> I recently bought an mp3 player and the spec says "Full speed USB 2.0".
> Only through later research that I found out it actually means USB 1.1.
> Do I have a legal case at all if I want a refund?


Yes, on the basis of what you have explained, you do. You will. of course,
need to convince the shop of that. If you don't feel confident, perhaps you
have alocal community law centre who may write on your behalf.

Failing that, thers is always the Disputes Tribunal - see your local court
for details

Charlie G


 
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thingy
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      09-14-2006
wassa wrote:
> Is it actually legal to brand a USB 1.1 product as USB 2.0?
>
> I recently bought an mp3 player and the spec says "Full speed USB 2.0".
> Only through later research that I found out it actually means USB 1.1.
> Do I have a legal case at all if I want a refund?
>


I would say so...

regards

Thing
 
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whome
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      09-14-2006

"thingy" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:4509020b$(E-Mail Removed)...
> wassa wrote:
>> Is it actually legal to brand a USB 1.1 product as USB 2.0?
>>
>> I recently bought an mp3 player and the spec says "Full speed USB 2.0".
>> Only through later research that I found out it actually means USB 1.1.
>> Do I have a legal case at all if I want a refund?
>>

>
> I would say so...
>
> regards
>
> Thing


Depends on the bottleneck maybe? It could be the memory/drive slowing it
down rather than the USB2.0 connection itself.

But really, you should be able to return this.




 
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wassa
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      09-14-2006

charlieg wrote:
> "wassa" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed) oups.com...
> > Is it actually legal to brand a USB 1.1 product as USB 2.0?

>
> No : see the Fair Trading Act 1986
> http://www.legislation.govt.nz/brows...t=pal_statutes
> >
> > I recently bought an mp3 player and the spec says "Full speed USB 2.0".
> > Only through later research that I found out it actually means USB 1.1.
> > Do I have a legal case at all if I want a refund?

>
> Yes, on the basis of what you have explained, you do. You will. of course,
> need to convince the shop of that. If you don't feel confident, perhaps you
> have alocal community law centre who may write on your behalf.
>
> Failing that, thers is always the Disputes Tribunal - see your local court
> for details
>



This scum is trying to explain this away and while I know he's full of
**** I need to be 100% sure that he hasn't got a point legally:

"Hi that item use a Action ATJ2085 control chipset, it is USB2.0 FULL
SPEED. What you should do is check the USB standard of USB association,
and find out what that means, and find out what is the difference
between USB2.0 HIGH SPEED and FULL SPEED"

 
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Earl Grey
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      09-14-2006
wassa wrote:
> charlieg wrote:
>> "wassa" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
>> news:(E-Mail Removed) oups.com...
>>> Is it actually legal to brand a USB 1.1 product as USB 2.0?

>> No : see the Fair Trading Act 1986
>> http://www.legislation.govt.nz/brows...t=pal_statutes
>>> I recently bought an mp3 player and the spec says "Full speed USB 2.0".
>>> Only through later research that I found out it actually means USB 1.1.
>>> Do I have a legal case at all if I want a refund?

>> Yes, on the basis of what you have explained, you do. You will. of course,
>> need to convince the shop of that. If you don't feel confident, perhaps you
>> have alocal community law centre who may write on your behalf.
>>
>> Failing that, thers is always the Disputes Tribunal - see your local court
>> for details
>>

>
>
> This scum is trying to explain this away and while I know he's full of
> **** I need to be 100% sure that he hasn't got a point legally:
>
> "Hi that item use a Action ATJ2085 control chipset, it is USB2.0 FULL
> SPEED. What you should do is check the USB standard of USB association,
> and find out what that means, and find out what is the difference
> between USB2.0 HIGH SPEED and FULL SPEED"
>


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USB_2#Transfer_speed

He is trying to con you.
 
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Colinco
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      09-14-2006

wassa wrote:
>
> This scum is trying to explain this away and while I know he's full of
> **** I need to be 100% sure that he hasn't got a point legally:
>

How much research have you done? Your trader didn't invent the USB
naming.
Low Speed = 1.5Mbs Full Speed = 12Mbs Hi Speed = 480Mbs
The USB Industry Assoc is trying to get manufacturers to use only USB
and Hi-speed USB to cut out some of the confusion
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_Serial_Bus

 
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Lawrence D'Oliveiro
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      09-14-2006
In message <(E-Mail Removed) .com>, wassa
wrote:

> Is it actually legal to brand a USB 1.1 product as USB 2.0?
>
> I recently bought an mp3 player and the spec says "Full speed USB 2.0".
> Only through later research that I found out it actually means USB 1.1.


Technically, no. USB 2.0 allows for 3 channel speeds: "low-speed" (1.5
Mbps), "full-speed" (12Mbps) and "high-speed" (480Mbps), but it doesn't
_require_ devices to use all of them. Pretty much by definition, devices
originally designed to the USB 1.1 spec are also USB-2.0-compliant.

Look at it this way: USB 1.1 only allowed for the first 2 speeds. Yet if you
bought a low-speed device like a USB keyboard or mouse, which only
communicated at 1.5Mbps instead of the full 12MBps that USB 1.1 allowed,
did that mean it wasn't USB-1.1-compliant and that you'd been diddled?

Yes, the "full-speed" versus "high-speed" terminology _is_ confusing, but it
_is_ the official terminology endorsed by the USB Implementors' Forum
<http://usb.org/>. (You can see it used here
<http://www.usb.org/developers/usbfaq/>, for instance.) If you think
someone is conning you, then it's them.
 
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wassa
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      09-15-2006

Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> In message <(E-Mail Removed) .com>, wassa
> wrote:
>
> > Is it actually legal to brand a USB 1.1 product as USB 2.0?
> >
> > I recently bought an mp3 player and the spec says "Full speed USB 2.0".
> > Only through later research that I found out it actually means USB 1.1.

>
> Technically, no. USB 2.0 allows for 3 channel speeds: "low-speed" (1.5
> Mbps), "full-speed" (12Mbps) and "high-speed" (480Mbps), but it doesn't
> _require_ devices to use all of them. Pretty much by definition, devices
> originally designed to the USB 1.1 spec are also USB-2.0-compliant.
>
> Look at it this way: USB 1.1 only allowed for the first 2 speeds. Yet if you
> bought a low-speed device like a USB keyboard or mouse, which only
> communicated at 1.5Mbps instead of the full 12MBps that USB 1.1 allowed,
> did that mean it wasn't USB-1.1-compliant and that you'd been diddled?
>
> Yes, the "full-speed" versus "high-speed" terminology _is_ confusing, but it
> _is_ the official terminology endorsed by the USB Implementors' Forum
> <http://usb.org/>. (You can see it used here
> <http://www.usb.org/developers/usbfaq/>, for instance.) If you think
> someone is conning you, then it's them.


According to USB-IF (http://www.usb.org/developers/packaging/):

-----------------------------------
Low or Full-speed Product Packaging Recommendations:
Products that operate at only low or full-speed can qualify to use only
the Basic Version of the logo (i.e. without the special Hi-Speed
identifier). The old USB logo is obsolete and should not be used. The
USB-IF recommends vendors simply use "USB" as has always been done, on
packaging and in marketing materials for low or full-speed USB
products. Avoid using terminology such as USB 2.0 Full Speed, Full
Speed USB or USB 2.0 which can be confusing for consumers whose
expectation is that a USB 2.0 product is by definition high-speed.
-----------------------------------

The bottom line is that specifying a device as USB 2.0 when it's USB
1.1 IS misleading (if not downright fraudulent) to average consumers -
gee I used to sell computer hardware for a living and even I didn't
know USB 2.0 could be USB 1.1!! There is no way you can convince me
that someone could be writing that spec out without anticipating the
confusion it might cause.

 
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jasen
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      09-15-2006
On 2006-09-14, wassa <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> Is it actually legal to brand a USB 1.1 product as USB 2.0?
>
> I recently bought an mp3 player and the spec says "Full speed USB 2.0".
> Only through later research that I found out it actually means USB 1.1.
> Do I have a legal case at all if I want a refund?


The Trades Description Act i think it's called - if they claimed it to be
2.0 (displaying a package with 2.0 written on it counts) and it's not you
have a case. if someone else claimed it was 2.0 AFAICT you don't.

Bye.
Jasen
 
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