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linux fc4 a quick look....

 
 
Waylon Kenning
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      01-28-2006
T'was the Sat, 28 Jan 2006 18:42:30 +1300 when I remembered shannon
<(E-Mail Removed)> saying something like this:

>>> I do think the docs with most Linux software and distros could be
>>> better, but I also agree with Cliff - some people are just not cut
>>> out for the freedom of choice and range of options in Linux. Those
>>> people are best left inside the dumbed-down Windows GUI...

>>
>> That's a pretty elitist way of thinking.

>
>How so ?


Instead of thinking "Lets make linux easier to use", it's "some people
aren't suited to it". Computers aren't magical machines, they're just
pretty common technology. They really should be easy to use.
--
Cheers,

Waylon Kenning.
 
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Shane
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      01-28-2006
On Sat, 28 Jan 2006 18:51:36 +1300, Waylon Kenning wrote:

> T'was the Sat, 28 Jan 2006 18:42:30 +1300 when I remembered shannon
> <(E-Mail Removed)> saying something like this:
>
>>>> I do think the docs with most Linux software and distros could be
>>>> better, but I also agree with Cliff - some people are just not cut out
>>>> for the freedom of choice and range of options in Linux. Those people
>>>> are best left inside the dumbed-down Windows GUI...
>>>
>>> That's a pretty elitist way of thinking.

>>
>>How so ?

>
> Instead of thinking "Lets make linux easier to use", it's "some people
> aren't suited to it". Computers aren't magical machines, they're just
> pretty common technology. They really should be easy to use. --
> Cheers,
>
> Waylon Kenning.


You ever tried linux?

--
Perfume counter saleswoman: Do you know what the fastest way to a man's heart is?
Roseanne: Yeah... through his chest.

 
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Waylon Kenning
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      01-28-2006
T'was the Sat, 28 Jan 2006 18:57:38 +1300 when I remembered Shane
<(E-Mail Removed)-a-geek.net> saying something like this:

>You ever tried linux?


No, is it a religion or something?

Peanut Linux in 2000;
Caldera;
TurboLinux;
SuSe;
Other linuxes when Copyleft had their get 10 distros for $100+ or so
back in 2002;
Red Hat 7 or so;
RH 9;
Fedora Core 1;
FC2;
Knoppix;
Xandros;
Mitel SME server (or whatever it was called for a bit);
K12LTSP;
Mandrake;
etc etc...

I've scraped the surface of linux. At the moment I'm looking at Puppy
Linux in low memory (64-128mb) environments. Quite impressive really
in terms of response time, start Mozilla in abot 2 seconds, Abiword
starts in around the same time.
--
Cheers,

Waylon Kenning.
 
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MarkH
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      01-28-2006
Waylon Kenning <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
news:(E-Mail Removed):

> T'was the Sat, 28 Jan 2006 18:57:38 +1300 when I remembered Shane
><(E-Mail Removed)-a-geek.net> saying something like this:
>
>>You ever tried linux?

>
> No, is it a religion or something?
>
> Peanut Linux in 2000;
> Caldera;
> TurboLinux;
> SuSe;
> Other linuxes when Copyleft had their get 10 distros for $100+ or so
> back in 2002;
> Red Hat 7 or so;
> RH 9;
> Fedora Core 1;
> FC2;
> Knoppix;
> Xandros;
> Mitel SME server (or whatever it was called for a bit);
> K12LTSP;
> Mandrake;
> etc etc...
>
> I've scraped the surface of linux. At the moment I'm looking at Puppy
> Linux in low memory (64-128mb) environments. Quite impressive really
> in terms of response time, start Mozilla in abot 2 seconds, Abiword
> starts in around the same time.


You should take a look at Beatrix, which is basically a slimmed down (200MB
CD) version of Knoppix (but with Gnome). I tried an install to HDD, then
used apt to install synaptic, then used synaptic to install some other
stuff - basically you can use any Debian/Ubuntu sources to install apps
from. Personally I liked it much more than Puppy.

My main OS is SUSE 10 which runs very well on decent H/ware (P3-866 with
512MB runs well).


--
Mark Heyes (New Zealand)
See my pics at www.gigatech.co.nz (last updated 5-September-05)
"The person on the other side was a young woman. Very obviously a
young woman. There was no possible way she could have been mistaken
for a young man in any language, especially Braille."
Maskerade
 
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Enkidu
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      01-28-2006
Waylon Kenning wrote:
> T'was the Sat, 28 Jan 2006 18:42:30 +1300 when I remembered shannon
> <(E-Mail Removed)> saying something like this:
>
>>>> I do think the docs with most Linux software and distros could
>>>> be better, but I also agree with Cliff - some people are just
>>>> not cut out for the freedom of choice and range of options in
>>>> Linux. Those people are best left inside the dumbed-down
>>>> Windows GUI...
>>>
>>> That's a pretty elitist way of thinking.

>>
>> How so ?

>
> Instead of thinking "Lets make linux easier to use", it's "some
> people aren't suited to it". Computers aren't magical machines,
> they're just pretty common technology. They really should be easy to
> use.
>

There's distressing trend in Linux mailing lists for newbies to assume
that there is always a GUI, and to 'solve' problems by removing and
re-installing stuff. Not to mention things like rebooting to change
network settings! You don't even have to reboot to change network
settings in Windows these days!

Cheers,

Cliff
 
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shannon
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      01-28-2006
Waylon Kenning wrote:
> T'was the Sat, 28 Jan 2006 18:42:30 +1300 when I remembered shannon
> <(E-Mail Removed)> saying something like this:
>
>>>> I do think the docs with most Linux software and distros could be
>>>> better, but I also agree with Cliff - some people are just not cut
>>>> out for the freedom of choice and range of options in Linux. Those
>>>> people are best left inside the dumbed-down Windows GUI...
>>> That's a pretty elitist way of thinking.

>> How so ?

>
> Instead of thinking "Lets make linux easier to use", it's "some people
> aren't suited to it". Computers aren't magical machines, they're just
> pretty common technology. They really should be easy to use.
> --
> Cheers,
>
> Waylon Kenning.


Why do you think no one is making Linux easier to use ?
You would have to be straight out ignorant or trolling to make such a claim.
Learning to use Windows means acquiring skills and learning to use Linux
means acquiring skills. Transitioning from Windows to Linux means
acquiring skills, if that effort is not acceptable then you will have to
stick with Windows
Some people aren't suited to it, thats a fact.
Some people aren't suited to using computers at all, thats not an
elitist statement, its just the way it is..
 
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Mr Undeniably Sluttish
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      01-28-2006
On Sun, 29 Jan 2006 00:09:49 +1300, shannon wrote:

>> Instead of thinking "Lets make linux easier to use", it's "some people
>> aren't suited to it". Computers aren't magical machines, they're just
>> pretty common technology. They really should be easy to use.
>> --
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Waylon Kenning.

>
> Why do you think no one is making Linux easier to use ?
> You would have to be straight out ignorant or trolling to make such a claim.
> Learning to use Windows means acquiring skills and learning to use Linux
> means acquiring skills. Transitioning from Windows to Linux means
> acquiring skills, if that effort is not acceptable then you will have to
> stick with Windows
> Some people aren't suited to it, thats a fact.
> Some people aren't suited to using computers at all, thats not an
> elitist statement, its just the way it is..


I think that some people find it very difficult to change from the
Micro$oft Way to the Unix way. After all, many things are different, and a
*nix box does not hold the Admin's hand - the Administrator controls the
OS, not the other way round.


Undeniably Sluttish

--
Buffer overflow attacks. By flooding a program with too much data, a hacker
can track and manipulate the overflow and trick the system into following his
instructions as if he were the sysadmin. The technique has been known for
decades, yet Microsoft still hasn't come up with a way to defend against it.

 
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Fred Dagg
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      01-28-2006
On Sat, 28 Jan 2006 22:46:50 +1300, Enkidu <(E-Mail Removed)>
exclaimed:

>Waylon Kenning wrote:
>> T'was the Sat, 28 Jan 2006 18:42:30 +1300 when I remembered shannon
>> <(E-Mail Removed)> saying something like this:
>>
>>>>> I do think the docs with most Linux software and distros could
>>>>> be better, but I also agree with Cliff - some people are just
>>>>> not cut out for the freedom of choice and range of options in
>>>>> Linux. Those people are best left inside the dumbed-down
>>>>> Windows GUI...
>>>>
>>>> That's a pretty elitist way of thinking.
>>>
>>> How so ?

>>
>> Instead of thinking "Lets make linux easier to use", it's "some
>> people aren't suited to it". Computers aren't magical machines,
>> they're just pretty common technology. They really should be easy to
>> use.
>>

>There's distressing trend in Linux mailing lists for newbies to assume
>that there is always a GUI, and to 'solve' problems by removing and
>re-installing stuff. Not to mention things like rebooting to change
>network settings! You don't even have to reboot to change network
>settings in Windows these days!
>

Come on, Cliff. It's the 21st century.

If people are trying to say that Linux (or any OS) is suitable for
consumers, these days there SHOULD be a GUI for everything, removing
and reinstalling stuff SHOULD work (and is often a hell of a lot
easier than trying to troubleshoot something with limited knowledge),
and the network settings, well, maybe the tools should be more
obvious.
 
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Enkidu
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Posts: n/a
 
      01-28-2006
Fred Dagg wrote:
>
>
> ....removing and reinstalling stuff SHOULD work (and is often a hell
> of a lot easier than trying to troubleshoot something with limited
> knowledge)...
>

No! Neither in Windows nor in Linux should removing and reinstalling fix
problems. It shows that there is something in the application that is
screwing things so badly that the application can't work, which should
never happen.

Cheers,

Cliff
 
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Fred Dagg
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Posts: n/a
 
      01-29-2006
On Sun, 29 Jan 2006 12:39:19 +1300, Enkidu <(E-Mail Removed)>
exclaimed:

>Fred Dagg wrote:
>>
>>
>> ....removing and reinstalling stuff SHOULD work (and is often a hell
>> of a lot easier than trying to troubleshoot something with limited
>> knowledge)...
> >

>No! Neither in Windows nor in Linux should removing and reinstalling fix
>problems. It shows that there is something in the application that is
>screwing things so badly that the application can't work, which should
>never happen.
>

Yes, but we're living in the real world, and in this one, that's just
the way it is.
 
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