«

Nicolaas Hawkins wrote:
> On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 11:45:23 +1200, Matthew Poole <> wrote
> in <news> :
>
>
>>On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 07:52:21 +1200, someone purporting to be Nicolaas
>>Hawkins didst scrawl:
>>
>>
>>>On Sat, 20 Aug 2005 21:57:41 +1200, "H.O.G" <> wrote in
>>><news: m>:
>>>
>>
>>*SNIP*
>>
>>>This defies logic - I must query how what I use between the CPU and its
>>>heatsink (given that, not being an idiot, I will use the best thermal
>>>transfer compound I can get) is going to affect the warranty on the
>>>motherboard - of which the CPU assembly is not part.
>>
>>I think it would be incredibly difficult even for AMD to reject a warranty
>>claim on the basis that an alternative thermal compound was used, unless
>>they could demonstrate that heat damage was the cause of the failure.
>>NZ consumer protection law does actually work quite well.
>
>
> I couldn't agree more.
>

I have a copy the AMD processor warranty in front of me, and it doesn't
even mention heatsinks, let alone thermal compound or sticker pads.
All it says is that "This limited warranty does not cover damage due to
external causes including improper use, problems with electrical power,
accident, neglect, alteration, repair, improper installation, or
improper testing."
H.O.G. is bullshitting.

H.O.G wrote:
> On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 12:32:39 +1200, "~misfit~"
> <> spoke these fine words:
>
>
>>Nicolaas Hawkins wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 20 Aug 2005 21:57:41 +1200, "H.O.G" <> wrote in
>>><news: m>:
>>>
>>>
>>>>On Sat, 20 Aug 2005 21:31:11 +1200, Nicolaas Hawkins
>>>><> spoke these fine words:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Installing a new motherboard on a system - need to re-mount
>>>>>heatsink on CPU. What are opinions, please, on the best heatsink
>>>>>compound to use?
>>>>
>>>>Be very aware of the fact that using a compound will void the
>>>>warranty on your motherboard.
>>>>
>>>>You must use a thermal pad thingee. And half decent AMD reseller will
>>>>have them. (ie about 1 in 20 these days, but that's a different
>>>>story).
>>>
>>>This defies logic
>>
>>And you're surprised? You've been here for ages, you should know who knows
>>what.
>
>
> Dickwad. I'll bet you a bottle of gold label Jim Beam that using a
> non-approved thermal compound voids the warranty on your processor.
>

The pad is part of the cooler package, not the CPU.
Its not mentioned at all in the warranty.
I expect you will weasel out of delivering the JB on a technicality

On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 11:45:23 +1200, Matthew Poole <>
spoke these fine words:

>On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 07:52:21 +1200, someone purporting to be Nicolaas
>Hawkins didst scrawl:
>
>> On Sat, 20 Aug 2005 21:57:41 +1200, "H.O.G" <> wrote in
>> <news: >:
>>
>*SNIP*
>> This defies logic - I must query how what I use between the CPU and its
>> heatsink (given that, not being an idiot, I will use the best thermal
>> transfer compound I can get) is going to affect the warranty on the
>> motherboard - of which the CPU assembly is not part.
>
>I think it would be incredibly difficult even for AMD to reject a warranty
>claim on the basis that an alternative thermal compound was used, unless
>they could demonstrate that heat damage was the cause of the failure.
>NZ consumer protection law does actually work quite well.

Of course they could, in the same way an appliance manufacturer could
void the warranty if you did not use approved parts in it, or an
engine manufacturer could void the warranty on a new head if an
appropriate head gasket wasn't used.

The fact is, many thermal compounds conduct electricity, shorting
connectors and things on the top of the processor. Additionally, many
people empty a whole tube of thermal grease on the top of the
processor, with obvious overflow problems.

Also, many thermal compounds dry to be hard and crusty over time which
causes heat spots (ie results in unequal dissipation of heat), which
obviously causes major problems, and significantly reduces the life of
a processor.

Note that AMD boxed products come with a 3 year warranty, which is
voided if you use a cooling solution (compound or heatsink/fan) other
than that supplied with the product. Tray (OEM) products, which are
only available grey market in NZ, come with a 12 month warranty, but
you can use any AMD-approved cooling solution. Note that most thermal
compounds are NOT AMD approved, and you are much better off using an
AMD thermal pad (htey are very affected, wont reduce the life of the
product, wont affect the warranty, and are cheap).

In reality, AMD are pretty reasonable about this. It is usually pretty
easy to tell whether an inappropriate compound has been used which
could have contributed to the failure.

Unlike idiots like misfit, I don't make this sort of thing up. I hold
a Gold Certification from AMD, and knowledge of this is one of the
things tested during the Certification Exam, as others here can no
doubt attest.

On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 14:06:30 +1200, shannon <> spoke
these fine words:

>>>>>>Installing a new motherboard on a system - need to re-mount
>>>>>>heatsink on CPU. What are opinions, please, on the best heatsink
>>>>>>compound to use?
>>>>>
>>>>>Be very aware of the fact that using a compound will void the
>>>>>warranty on your motherboard.
>>>>>
>>>>>You must use a thermal pad thingee. And half decent AMD reseller will
>>>>>have them. (ie about 1 in 20 these days, but that's a different
>>>>>story).
>>>>
>>>>This defies logic
>>>
>>>And you're surprised? You've been here for ages, you should know who knows
>>>what.
>>
>>
>> Dickwad. I'll bet you a bottle of gold label Jim Beam that using a
>> non-approved thermal compound voids the warranty on your processor.
>>
>
>The pad is part of the cooler package, not the CPU.
>Its not mentioned at all in the warranty.
>I expect you will weasel out of delivering the JB on a technicality

Maybe you should have checked it out before replying:
http://tinyurl.com/8mn8d

H.O.G wrote:
> On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 11:45:23 +1200, Matthew Poole <>
> spoke these fine words:
>
>
>>On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 07:52:21 +1200, someone purporting to be Nicolaas
>>Hawkins didst scrawl:
>>
>>
>>>On Sat, 20 Aug 2005 21:57:41 +1200, "H.O.G" <> wrote in
>>><news: m>:
>>>
>>
>>*SNIP*
>>
>>>This defies logic - I must query how what I use between the CPU and its
>>>heatsink (given that, not being an idiot, I will use the best thermal
>>>transfer compound I can get) is going to affect the warranty on the
>>>motherboard - of which the CPU assembly is not part.
>>
>>I think it would be incredibly difficult even for AMD to reject a warranty
>>claim on the basis that an alternative thermal compound was used, unless
>>they could demonstrate that heat damage was the cause of the failure.
>>NZ consumer protection law does actually work quite well.
>
>
> Of course they could, in the same way an appliance manufacturer could
> void the warranty if you did not use approved parts in it, or an
> engine manufacturer could void the warranty on a new head if an
> appropriate head gasket wasn't used.
>
> The fact is, many thermal compounds conduct electricity, shorting
> connectors and things on the top of the processor. Additionally, many
> people empty a whole tube of thermal grease on the top of the
> processor, with obvious overflow problems.
>
> Also, many thermal compounds dry to be hard and crusty over time which
> causes heat spots (ie results in unequal dissipation of heat), which
> obviously causes major problems, and significantly reduces the life of
> a processor.
>
> Note that AMD boxed products come with a 3 year warranty, which is
> voided if you use a cooling solution (compound or heatsink/fan) other
> than that supplied with the product. Tray (OEM) products, which are
> only available grey market in NZ, come with a 12 month warranty, but
> you can use any AMD-approved cooling solution. Note that most thermal
> compounds are NOT AMD approved, and you are much better off using an
> AMD thermal pad (htey are very affected, wont reduce the life of the
> product, wont affect the warranty, and are cheap).
>
> In reality, AMD are pretty reasonable about this. It is usually pretty
> easy to tell whether an inappropriate compound has been used which
> could have contributed to the failure.
>
> Unlike idiots like misfit, I don't make this sort of thing up. I hold
> a Gold Certification from AMD, and knowledge of this is one of the
> things tested during the Certification Exam, as others here can no
> doubt attest.

I think you embellished the actual situation with a dire warning of the
consequences, and now you are back pedalling.
There is no mention of voiding the warranty in the documentation
supplied with the processor, and suitable thermal compounds and
aftermarket coolers not made by AMD are sold by computer part vendors
with the recommendation that they are suitable for AMD processors. The
warranty could only be void if overheating due to an incorrect cooling
system was the cause of the failure, not an automatic consequence of
using a different but correct type of heat transfer compound as clearly
stated by the OP.

H.O.G wrote:
> On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 14:06:30 +1200, shannon <> spoke
> these fine words:
>
>
>>>>>>>Installing a new motherboard on a system - need to re-mount
>>>>>>>heatsink on CPU. What are opinions, please, on the best heatsink
>>>>>>>compound to use?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Be very aware of the fact that using a compound will void the
>>>>>>warranty on your motherboard.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>You must use a thermal pad thingee. And half decent AMD reseller will
>>>>>>have them. (ie about 1 in 20 these days, but that's a different
>>>>>>story).
>>>>>
>>>>>This defies logic
>>>>
>>>>And you're surprised? You've been here for ages, you should know who knows
>>>>what.
>>>
>>>
>>>Dickwad. I'll bet you a bottle of gold label Jim Beam that using a
>>>non-approved thermal compound voids the warranty on your processor.
>>>
>>
>>The pad is part of the cooler package, not the CPU.
>>Its not mentioned at all in the warranty.
>>I expect you will weasel out of delivering the JB on a technicality
>
>
> Maybe you should have checked it out before replying:
> http://tinyurl.com/8mn8d

Maybe you should just go **** yourself.
I have the warranty, not some he said she said web forum gossip.
It only becomes an issue if the processor fails due to heat.
It will not be any issue for any other warranty claim, it does not void
the warranty.

On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 14:33:02 +1200, shannon <> spoke
these fine words:

>> In reality, AMD are pretty reasonable about this. It is usually pretty
>> easy to tell whether an inappropriate compound has been used which
>> could have contributed to the failure.
>>
>> Unlike idiots like misfit, I don't make this sort of thing up. I hold
>> a Gold Certification from AMD, and knowledge of this is one of the
>> things tested during the Certification Exam, as others here can no
>> doubt attest.
>
>I think you embellished the actual situation with a dire warning of the
>consequences, and now you are back pedalling.
>There is no mention of voiding the warranty in the documentation
>supplied with the processor, and suitable thermal compounds and
>aftermarket coolers not made by AMD are sold by computer part vendors
>with the recommendation that they are suitable for AMD processors. The
>warranty could only be void if overheating due to an incorrect cooling
>system was the cause of the failure, not an automatic consequence of
>using a different but correct type of heat transfer compound as clearly
> stated by the OP.

No, I am not back pedalling, and no I am not "bullshitting" as you so
aloquently put it in another post.

Fact is, using a non-AMD Approved cooling solution voids the warranty
on an AMD processor. It doesn't matter what "computer part vendors"
say. It doesn't matter what is and isn't available. What matters is
that AMD say using an alternative cooling solution other than the one
that is supplied with the processor is regarded as inappropriate use,
and voids the warranty. Period. You must use the cooling solution
provided by AMD in the box the processor comes in. It really isn't
very hard to understand, and if you do a little research you will find
that I am completely correct.

As I said, this is not just an opinion, but something that is taught
as part of the Gold Certification Programme from AMD. You must know
this to achieve Gold Certification.

I would think an apology from people like you and ~misfit~ for calling
me names for stating a fact would be appropriate, but history tells me
not to hold my breath.

On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 14:39:51 +1200, shannon <> spoke
these fine words:

>>>>Dickwad. I'll bet you a bottle of gold label Jim Beam that using a
>>>>non-approved thermal compound voids the warranty on your processor.
>>>>
>>>
>>>The pad is part of the cooler package, not the CPU.
>>>Its not mentioned at all in the warranty.
>>>I expect you will weasel out of delivering the JB on a technicality
>>
>>
>> Maybe you should have checked it out before replying:
>> http://tinyurl.com/8mn8d
>
>Maybe you should just go **** yourself.

Settle, petal. Can't admit when you are wrong?

>I have the warranty, not some he said she said web forum gossip.
>It only becomes an issue if the processor fails due to heat.
>It will not be any issue for any other warranty claim, it does not void
>the warranty.

Why do you think processors fail? Other than DOA, 95% of failures are
caused directly or indirectly by overheating (often in conjunction
with weaknesses caused by not using correct antistatic protection).
THAT is why AMD state that the heatsink/fan supplied by the processor
must be used with said processor, or the warranty is void.

I don't understand why you can't understand such a simple concept.
They supply a processor and a heatsink/fan. You must use the supplied
heatsink/fan with that processor, as they form one product. Simple
stuff, really.

On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 14:01:57 +1200, shannon <> wrote:

>Nicolaas Hawkins wrote:
>> On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 11:45:23 +1200, Matthew Poole <> wrote
>> in <news> :
>>
>>
>>>On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 07:52:21 +1200, someone purporting to be Nicolaas
>>>Hawkins didst scrawl:
>>>
>>>
>>>>On Sat, 20 Aug 2005 21:57:41 +1200, "H.O.G" <> wrote in
>>>><news: om>:
>>>>
>>>
>>>*SNIP*
>>>
>>>>This defies logic - I must query how what I use between the CPU and its
>>>>heatsink (given that, not being an idiot, I will use the best thermal
>>>>transfer compound I can get) is going to affect the warranty on the
>>>>motherboard - of which the CPU assembly is not part.
>>>
>>>I think it would be incredibly difficult even for AMD to reject a warranty
>>>claim on the basis that an alternative thermal compound was used, unless
>>>they could demonstrate that heat damage was the cause of the failure.
>>>NZ consumer protection law does actually work quite well.
>>
>>
>> I couldn't agree more.
>>
>
>I have a copy the AMD processor warranty in front of me, and it doesn't
>even mention heatsinks, let alone thermal compound or sticker pads.
>All it says is that "This limited warranty does not cover damage due to
>external causes including improper use, problems with electrical power,
>accident, neglect, alteration, repair, improper installation, or
>improper testing."
>H.O.G. is bullshitting.

Alteration ie:removing the heatpad, and improper installation ie: not
using the supplied pad.

On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 14:42:15 +1200, "H.O.G" <> wrote in
<news: >:

> On Sun, 21 Aug 2005 14:33:02 +1200, shannon <> spoke
> these fine words:
>
>>> In reality, AMD are pretty reasonable about this. It is usually pretty
>>> easy to tell whether an inappropriate compound has been used which
>>> could have contributed to the failure.
>>>
>>> Unlike idiots like misfit, I don't make this sort of thing up. I hold
>>> a Gold Certification from AMD, and knowledge of this is one of the
>>> things tested during the Certification Exam, as others here can no
>>> doubt attest.
>>
>>I think you embellished the actual situation with a dire warning of the
>>consequences, and now you are back pedalling.
>>There is no mention of voiding the warranty in the documentation
>>supplied with the processor, and suitable thermal compounds and
>>aftermarket coolers not made by AMD are sold by computer part vendors
>>with the recommendation that they are suitable for AMD processors. The
>>warranty could only be void if overheating due to an incorrect cooling
>>system was the cause of the failure, not an automatic consequence of
>>using a different but correct type of heat transfer compound as clearly
>> stated by the OP.
>
> No, I am not back pedalling, and no I am not "bullshitting" as you so
> aloquently put it in another post.
>
> Fact is, using a non-AMD Approved cooling solution voids the warranty
> on an AMD processor. It doesn't matter what "computer part vendors"
> say. It doesn't matter what is and isn't available. What matters is
> that AMD say using an alternative cooling solution other than the one
> that is supplied with the processor is regarded as inappropriate use,
> and voids the warranty. Period. You must use the cooling solution
> provided by AMD in the box the processor comes in. It really isn't
> very hard to understand, and if you do a little research you will find
> that I am completely correct.
>
> As I said, this is not just an opinion, but something that is taught
> as part of the Gold Certification Programme from AMD. You must know
> this to achieve Gold Certification.
>
> I would think an apology from people like you and ~misfit~ for calling
> me names for stating a fact would be appropriate, but history tells me
> not to hold my breath.

Reasonable Question: On what basis are you assuming that the CPU I am
working with is an AMD device?

--
Regards,
Nicolaas.


.... All bleeding stops ... eventually.