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hard drive migration - turning into a major PITA

 
 
Brendan
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      06-19-2005
On Sun, 19 Jun 2005 21:52:17 +1200, Peter Huebner wrote:

> In article <(E-Mail Removed)> ,
> http://www.velocityreviews.com/forums/(E-Mail Removed)am says...
>>
>> Why five partitions. What do you gain by this?

>
> I am collating 3 drives with a total of 7 partitions. 3 of those I am
> amalgamating since they're mostly archived files plus the mail drive
> which goes by its sharename anyway (as far as the server is concernet)
> and not by drive letter. The other partitions are there to preserve
> paths in software. I can't be shagged to go through all my software with
> a fine toothed comb and reset all the paths for working directories et
> cetera.
>
>> Ghost will have no trouble at all if you just ghost the old drive and
>> load the image onto the new one. Try that.
>>

>
> My situation with Ghost is a bit embarrasing. I bought it 'new' via
> trademe, as part of Norton Sysworks Premier. It's legit, no probs,
> activates fine. Should've had a separate boot CD with it for Ghost, but
> didn't. The seller claims never to've heard about the separate boot disk
> and I cannot really refute him since I've seen quite a few complaints on
> webforums that people bought the same software package and didn't get
> the boot CD in the box.
> One guy said he took it back to the shop and they opened every box on
> the shelf and none had the boot CD. Go figure. So one thing I cannot do
> with my bloody 'Ghost' is to burn a disk image and restore it from the
> 'recovery environment'.
> Haven't been able to find an .iso of that disk; not that I've looked all
> THAT hard. Doesn't seem to be on Symantec's site anyhow.
>
> I'll see if I can find another way around that drive letter problem.
>
> -P.


Peter, have your new and old hard drive installed, and boot into Ghost. Use
ghost to clone the old drive over to the new - you should be able to do
this without making an image file (unless they have changed things). Turn
off, Disconnect the old drive, set the new to primary master, and boot up.

Make a boot floppy, and copy the dos ghost exe over onto it. Experiment
until it works. You could even make a bootable cd with nero the same way
but more room if needed.

No need for extra partitions to fix your old apps: you can assign those
drive letters to an existing partition. E.g. one partition can have
multiple drive letters.


Really, you should just bite the bullet and re-install from the ground up.
The whole setup, apps and all. Just copy over your docs and non exe's.
You've already spent more time and effort trying to do it the other way and
it still isn't working and even if it does you are going to have a bloody
mess.

Reinstalling will also get rid of the accumulated crap of years hidden in
windows system directories.

--

.... Brendan

369 +(4752)- [X]

<Beeth> Girls are like internet domain names, the ones I like are already
taken.
<honx> well, you can stil get one from a strange country


Note: All my comments are copyright 20/06/2005 3:14:07 a.m. and are opinion only where not otherwise stated and always "to the best of my recollection". www.computerman.orcon.net.nz.
 
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Lawrence DčOliveiro
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      06-19-2005
In article <(E-Mail Removed). nz>,
Peter Huebner <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>I am collating 3 drives with a total of 7 partitions. 3 of those I am
>amalgamating since they're mostly archived files plus the mail drive
>which goes by its sharename anyway (as far as the server is concernet)
>and not by drive letter. The other partitions are there to preserve
>paths in software.


Why didn't you mount them all into a single directory structure off the
"C:" drive letter to begin with? I understand from responses to my "Can
Dimdows do this..." thread that this is a piece of cake.
 
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Peter Huebner
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      06-19-2005
In article <(E-Mail Removed)>, (E-Mail Removed)
says...
>
> Really, you should just bite the bullet and re-install from the ground up.
> The whole setup, apps and all. Just copy over your docs and non exe's.
> You've already spent more time and effort trying to do it the other way and
> it still isn't working and even if it does you are going to have a bloody
> mess.
>
> Reinstalling will also get rid of the accumulated crap of years hidden in
> windows system directories.
>


Excellent advice, with the one hitch that it would stuff up my Delphi
environment. I've installed a couple of components, that get integrated
in a funny way, and if I don't integrate them _exactly_ the same way
next time, my code is going to be rooted. I cannot afford that.
Rather shag around with XP boot problems for 3 days than going through
hundreds of hours worth of code trying to fix references that have been
put there automatically when I included the components in the 'make
file' equivalent but won't remove automatically. Much bigger mess.

It may eventually come to that, though ...

I've tried again, wiped the new drive, ghosted original boot drive
(fat32 b.t.w.) without drive letter being allocated but that still
hasn't fixed it. I see I actually have Ghost 2003 on the installation CD
as well so I may try to use that, and do the whole operation from the
dos level rather than from Windows. I've already said in another post
that I cannot boot into Ghost 9 recovery environment for some stupid
reason [expletives deleted].

-P.
 
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Peter Huebner
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      06-19-2005
In article <(E-Mail Removed)>, ldo@geek-
central.gen.new_zealand says...
>
> Why didn't you mount them all into a single directory structure off the
> "C:" drive letter to begin with? I understand from responses to my "Can
> Dimdows do this..." thread that this is a piece of cake.
>


Part of this is simply because the machine grew over the years, started
with 1 drive, acquired another, and yet another.

Part 2 of the reason is that I like to keep system/program drive
separate from data/workspace partitions to minimize fragmentation.
I have some very high turnover things going that would soon make the
sytem drive perform like a pile of fungus if I didn't keep them
separate. I.m.o.

-P.
 
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~misfit~
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      06-20-2005
Brendan wrote:
> On Sun, 19 Jun 2005 13:02:30 +1200, ~misfit~ wrote:
>
>>> 5 Partitions ??? I'd have had a 5 gig C: and the rest as d:.

>>
>> This is what I did, but then had to re-size it to 8GB. I like to put
>> certain apps on the C: drive, apps like AV etc. 8GB isn't too big to
>> back-up.

>
> 8gb is ok. I will allow it


As the C: drive is at the begining of the drive I have my (fixed size)
swapfile there for speed and it takes a bit of space. Also, 5GB was fine
until SP1 and 2. They take nearly as much space as XP itself.

>>> Yes.
>>>
>>> 1. Install the 250 as the master drive on the primary controller.
>>> Put the old boot drive as the slave.
>>>
>>> 2. Boot into ghost. Select to clone the WHOLE ****ing (old) DRIVE,
>>> partition table, mbr, the whole thing - to the 250. From DOS. Not
>>> windows.

>>
>> Here I differ. I would install the 250 as a slave, make a partition
>> on it the same size, or slightly bigger than the old C: drive, then
>> copy C: to that with ghost. (Leave the rest of the drive unallocated
>> for now. Then the old C: drive can be removed, the new one put in
>> it's place and other drive's contents copied over to partitions
>> created within XP. Always worked for me, reactivation not required.

>
> This did not work when Peter tried it.


Very strange.

> When you did it, were you using proper NTFS drives or partitions
> converted from original DOS ones ?


I've done both. This is my standard method of migrating drives. As I have a
few machines made from parts when one gets a new drive it often means that
the 'old' drive goes down the chain so to speak, each machine getting an
upgrade. I use Ghost 2003, installed on C: and just set it and let it do
it's thing. Select partition to be copied and target partition and it
reboots and ~15 minutes later (depending on partition size) it's all done.
Switch drives and jumpers if needed and Robert's one of your parent's
siblings. No booting from floppy or anything like that. Works perfectly, the
only Norton software I ever use anymore.

I've done it maybe 5 or 6 times without a problem.
--
~misfit~


 
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Lawrence DčOliveiro
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Posts: n/a
 
      06-20-2005
In article <(E-Mail Removed). nz>,
Peter Huebner <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>In article <(E-Mail Removed)>, ldo@geek-
>central.gen.new_zealand says...
>>
>> Why didn't you mount them all into a single directory structure off the
>> "C:" drive letter to begin with? I understand from responses to my "Can
>> Dimdows do this..." thread that this is a piece of cake.

>
>Part of this is simply because the machine grew over the years, started
>with 1 drive, acquired another, and yet another.


I've done that with Unix/Linux machines. Because *nix forces you to
merge everything into a single directory structure anyway, you naturally
learn to think that way. The result was that new drives could be added,
and stuff migrated from older to newer drives, with minimal disruption.

This doesn't seem to be a characteristic of Windows systems.

>Part 2 of the reason is that I like to keep system/program drive
>separate from data/workspace partitions to minimize fragmentation.
>I have some very high turnover things going that would soon make the
>sytem drive perform like a pile of fungus if I didn't keep them
>separate. I.m.o.


That's fine. You logically partition things on that basis. But how those
logical partitions map to physical disk areas is an entirely separate
matter, and it should be possible to manage it separately.

By the way, interesting that Windows is the only system in common use
today where you need to worry about filesystem fragmentation on an
ongoing basis.
 
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Peter Huebner
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      06-20-2005
>
> > This did not work when Peter tried it.

>
> Very strange.
>
> > When you did it, were you using proper NTFS drives or partitions
> > converted from original DOS ones ?

>
> I've done both. This is my standard method of migrating drives. As I have a
> few machines made from parts when one gets a new drive it often means that
> the 'old' drive goes down the chain so to speak, each machine getting an
> upgrade. I use Ghost 2003, installed on C: and just set it and let it do
> it's thing. Select partition to be copied and target partition and it
> reboots and ~15 minutes later (depending on partition size) it's all done.
> Switch drives and jumpers if needed and Robert's one of your parent's
> siblings. No booting from floppy or anything like that. Works perfectly, the
> only Norton software I ever use anymore.
>
> I've done it maybe 5 or 6 times without a problem.
> --


Well, I finally found out where the problem was. I had the new drive on
the wrong IDE port! B*&@y stupid!
'T was master but plugged into IDE2 instead of IDE1 ... and of course
every time I switched the drives I made the same mistake again. So it
wasn't the drive letters atall, XP was just looking to boot from
nowhere. <sigh>

So, when I finally checked for that after the third drive copy with
slightly different parameters it went away without further ado.



Thanks for all the input, everybody, it kept me sane and eventually one
of the posts made me look in the right place again (I'd thought of it in
the very beginning, and then got side-tracked)!

cheers, -Peter
 
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Gordon
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      06-20-2005
On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 11:32:08 +1200, Peter Huebner wrote:

> I see I actually have Ghost 2003 on the installation CD
> as well so I may try to use that, and do the whole operation from the
> dos level rather than from Windows.


Yep, why make it hard on your self.

 
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~misfit~
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      06-20-2005
Peter Huebner wrote:

> Well, I finally found out where the problem was. I had the new drive
> on the wrong IDE port! B*&@y stupid!
> 'T was master but plugged into IDE2 instead of IDE1 ... and of course
> every time I switched the drives I made the same mistake again. So it
> wasn't the drive letters atall, XP was just looking to boot from
> nowhere. <sigh>
>
> So, when I finally checked for that after the third drive copy with
> slightly different parameters it went away without further ado.
>
>
>
> Thanks for all the input, everybody, it kept me sane and eventually
> one of the posts made me look in the right place again (I'd thought
> of it in the very beginning, and then got side-tracked)!


Good news! Glad you got it sorted Peter.
--
~misfit~


 
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Brendan
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      06-20-2005
On Mon, 20 Jun 2005 12:43:43 +1200, ~misfit~ wrote:

>> 8gb is ok. I will allow it

>
> As the C: drive is at the begining of the drive I have my (fixed size)
> swapfile there for speed and it takes a bit of space. Also, 5GB was fine
> until SP1 and 2. They take nearly as much space as XP itself.


I have my swap on a physically separate 80gb drive which is largly un-used,
and I defragged it too.

>> This did not work when Peter tried it.

>
> Very strange.


I thought so, but have had simular fun myself. Take Peter's problems, and
add to that migration to SATA drives - which are often NOT recognised by
many of these apps.

e.g. Acronis would not see them, yet Ghost would. My images were in acronis
format... (like the boot sector recovery app it can install)

e.g. Windows installer decided SATA drives are not bootable when PATA
drives are installed.

>> When you did it, were you using proper NTFS drives or partitions
>> converted from original DOS ones ?

>
> I've done both. This is my standard method of migrating drives. As I have a
> few machines made from parts when one gets a new drive it often means that
> the 'old' drive goes down the chain so to speak, each machine getting an
> upgrade. I use Ghost 2003, installed on C: and just set it and let it do
> it's thing. Select partition to be copied and target partition and it
> reboots and ~15 minutes later (depending on partition size) it's all done.
> Switch drives and jumpers if needed and Robert's one of your parent's
> siblings. No booting from floppy or anything like that. Works perfectly, the
> only Norton software I ever use anymore.
>
> I've done it maybe 5 or 6 times without a problem.


Maybe it depends on the exact version of ghost you use...

I think a whole drive clone SHOULD work. That it apparently does not means
there is likely some driver being loaded who does not like the new drive
geometry.

Ummm.... Clone the whole drive, THEN reinstall windows over the top of it.
This should re-set the drivers to the new geometry. Probably. BUT: it might
also break peters awkward delphi stuff. Try it and see Peter.

Another thing: Install VM ware, and run your delphi stuff from IT, it
directly accessing your old drive and booting from it. You might have to
play with drivers in the VM ware XP though.

Finally, and only because it has not been said already:

Format c:, install Linux.

Sorry. Had to be done. Rituals have to observed or we all suffer.

--

.... Brendan

1660 +(3490)- [X]

<DigiGnome> Real life should have a ****ing search function, or something.
<DigiGnome> I need my socks.


Note: All my comments are copyright 20/06/2005 3:42:24 p.m. and are opinion only where not otherwise stated and always "to the best of my recollection". www.computerman.orcon.net.nz.
 
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