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Broadband next to the main trunk line.

 
 
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      10-24-2004
On Sun, 24 Oct 2004 18:41:21 +1300, Waylon Kenning wrote:

> So English being taught in schools is a problem, my question to you
> is, how should we fix it, and why isn't this solution you propose
> happening in schools?


Teach phonics.

Teach Māori to all students to written and spoken fluency by 6th form.

Teach Latin to all students to written fluency, and to "A" stream students
also to spoken fluency, by 6th form, with all 7th form "A" stream classes
being conducted in Lingua Latina.

(Latin is still in sufficiently common use in some European countries that
some current affairs radio programmes are actually being broadcast in
Latin)

Update the written form of English to follow closer to the spoken form of
Received English.

Require students to attain at least 60% (both exams and course work) in
reading, writing, and comprehension, before progressing to the next year.

Require two spoken (either Maori, English or Latin) presentations per
student per term from 3rd form through to 7th form.

Require a higher standard of tuition from teachers, including a class
size of absolutely no greater than 15 students (preferably not greater
than 12 students) per class.

And, of course an appropriate increase in funding - education is too
important to go penny-pinching.


Divine

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      10-24-2004
On Sun, 24 Oct 2004 18:44:06 +1300, wrote:

> When commenting on others' spelling or grammar it is considered good
> form to use a spell checker. Otherwise you run the risk of looking
> incompetant (sic).


Yeah yeah - I knew that word was not correctly spelt, but I couldn't
be bothered to dig out the dictionary.


Divine

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      10-24-2004
On Sun, 24 Oct 2004 21:33:03 +1300, Chris Mayhew wrote:

> And in case your going <snip>


What?


Divine

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      10-24-2004
On Sun, 24 Oct 2004 16:51:24 +1300, Gordon wrote:

> We have at present refuse and refuse. See?


The difference being one of syllabic stress - something which the written
form of English cannot address.


Divine

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      10-24-2004
On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 02:10:24 +1300, nick wrote:

>> LOL - next minute you'll be suggesting that people should say "the apple
>> green" instead of "the green apple"!
>>

>
> apple is not a verb


Duh!

You miss my point.

English syntax is not entirely rigid. Word order, within certain limits
CAN be changed for emphasis.

And in certain circumstances the adjective can also follow the noun - such
as in poetry.


Divine

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      10-24-2004
On Mon, 25 Oct 2004 02:12:47 +1300, Dave - Dave.net.nz wrote:

> *aside*: has anyone read anything on the studies into why the chch area
> on NZ seems to be getting an Aussie accent? or how "txting" is
> a/effecting(#) the english language?
>
> # - I've never been able to figure out which letter goes before "ffect"


"Effect" - as in special effects, as in effective - as in actively doing.

"Affect" - as in affection, as in affectation - something passively done.

One may affect a change of something, effective from X date.


Divine

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Waylon Kenning
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      10-24-2004
It seems like Mon, 25 Oct 2004 02:36:33 +1300 was when
"(E-Mail Removed)" <(E-Mail Removed)> said Blah blah
blah...

>Teach phonics.

May work, Readingmaster, that Ms. Paul of infomercial fame was
peddling seemed to help the little kids on the ad. Then again, the ab
flex seemed to give good results for something that was just some
elastic.

>Teach M?ori to all students to written and spoken fluency by 6th form.

While I personally believe more people should learn Maaori, myself
included, I don't think forcing them to do it will help. After all, if
they fail, you just gonna keep them in 3rd form Maaori until they
leave high school?

>Teach Latin to all students to written fluency, and to "A" stream students
>also to spoken fluency, by 6th form, with all 7th form "A" stream classes
>being conducted in Lingua Latina.
>
>(Latin is still in sufficiently common use in some European countries that
>some current affairs radio programmes are actually being broadcast in
>Latin)

Isn't Latin the language so hard to use that near no one uses it
anymore? More to the fact, isn't Latin so hard to use that some empire
actually gave up using it? And why force people to learn Latin? Oh,
something I just thought of. Students at your school in say 6th form
are doing English, Maori and Latin. That leaves three subject spaces
for every other language, science, math, technology, art and design
subject. I don't think the kids will be accepting that...

>Update the written form of English to follow closer to the spoken form of
>Received English.

This is a good idea, yet this process takes time.

>Require students to attain at least 60% (both exams and course work) in
>reading, writing, and comprehension, before progressing to the next year.

Some students wont be able to do it. Plain and simple. What happens to
them, 4th year 5th formers?

>Require two spoken (either Maori, English or Latin) presentations per
>student per term from 3rd form through to 7th form.

This may be feasible. However, a lot of work goes into creating a
presentation, which leaves little time to do any other work in class.

>Require a higher standard of tuition from teachers, including a class
>size of absolutely no greater than 15 students (preferably not greater
>than 12 students) per class.

I doubt this will happen.

>And, of course an appropriate increase in funding - education is too
>important to go penny-pinching.

I fully agree with you there.
--
Regards,
Waylon Kenning.

1st Year B.I.T. WelTec
 
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Dave - Dave.net.nz
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      10-24-2004
http://www.velocityreviews.com/forums/(E-Mail Removed) wrote:
>>apple is not a verb


> Duh!
> You miss my point.
> English syntax is not entirely rigid. Word order, within certain limits
> CAN be changed for emphasis.


"Google" wasn't a verb... but now is.
language evolves.

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Dave - Dave.net.nz
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      10-24-2004
(E-Mail Removed) wrote:
>>*aside*: has anyone read anything on the studies into why the chch area
>>on NZ seems to be getting an Aussie accent? or how "txting" is
>>a/effecting(#) the english language?
>># - I've never been able to figure out which letter goes before "ffect"


> "Effect" - as in special effects, as in effective - as in actively doing.
> "Affect" - as in affection, as in affectation - something passively done.
> One may affect a change of something, effective from X date.


you missed the part about me not caring if it was right or not... I just
dont care, if 95% of people get what I mean, it's close enough for me.

to go around correcting people must lose you a hell of a lot of
potential friends... it'd be like someone clipping you round the ear for
not sitting straight in your chair every 5 mins, I'd turn around and
deck you... and not because I lack the ability to use correct language,
but that you'd be a pain in the arse, and deserve it.

--
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Dave - Dave.net.nz
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      10-24-2004
gonna take on some of this inline.

Waylon Kenning wrote:
>>Teach M?ori to all students to written and spoken fluency by 6th form.


> While I personally believe more people should learn Maaori, myself
> included, I don't think forcing them to do it will help. After all, if
> they fail, you just gonna keep them in 3rd form Maaori until they
> leave high school?


usually with holdback teaching there is something like a 3 year limit.

> Oh,
> something I just thought of. Students at your school in say 6th form
> are doing English, Maori and Latin. That leaves three subject spaces
> for every other language, science, math, technology, art and design
> subject. I don't think the kids will be accepting that...


dunno what others think, but change the school day to 7hrs(8:30 - 4pm
with 15,30,15 breaks)

>>Require students to attain at least 60% (both exams and course work) in
>>reading, writing, and comprehension, before progressing to the next year.


> Some students wont be able to do it. Plain and simple. What happens to
> them, 4th year 5th formers?


Pass rates dont really need to be changed, the exams/tests just need to
be harder.
See above for the holdback times.

>>Require a higher standard of tuition from teachers, including a class
>>size of absolutely no greater than 15 students (preferably not greater
>>than 12 students) per class.


> I doubt this will happen.


me too, although I learned maori in a class of 6 and it was sensational,
absolutly brilliant, any time that the teacher was needed to assist with
anything, she was right there, sitting around a "communal table" that we
used rather than traditional desk/blackboard style teaching.

>>And, of course an appropriate increase in funding - education is too
>>important to go penny-pinching.


> I fully agree with you there.


e'gad, Im starting to show my age, but I agree with you guys on this
wholeheartedly, in my experience, education sucks in this country, I
dont know what it is like overseas, but surely it cant be any worse?

--
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