«

On Fri, 23 Jul 2004 02:07:29 +1200, JedMeister wrote:

> you can never argue
> with a stupid person.

Excellent, that is the third variation.

The other two

Never argue with a fool, people may not be able to tell the difference

Argue with a fool; now there are two fools.

"Stephen Worthington" <> wrote in message
news:...
> On Fri, 23 Jul 2004 07:25:37 +1200, "Nicholas Sherlock"
> <> wrote:
>
> >Jason M wrote:
> >> I don't understand why the owner of the number in the Cook Islands
> >> cannot be traced and prosecuted for fraud
> >
> >Because often you are agreeing to a legal agreement when you click "Yes,
I
> >want to install this dialer". None of the dialers I've come across
install
> >without prompt.
> >
> >Cheers,
> >NIcholas Sherlock
>
> Wrong, a lot of them use a "Close window" button or the like to
> install from. Unless you read the source of the web page, you do not
> know what a button will do to you.

Which is most likely how I had one.

E. Scrooge

On Fri, 23 Jul 2004 11:36:24 +1200, Patrick Dunford
<> wrote:

>
>Disputes Tribunal resolutions are not enforceable though
>
Yes and no. It is up to you (generally) to do the legwork and track
down the miscreant. They are useless if the other guy does a runner.
If you know where they are, you can apply at the court for enforcement
action.
OTOH, I would love to be there when the baliffs turn up at Telstra's
office and start siezing assets!
Geoff

Gordon wrote:
>>you can never argue
>>with a stupid person.

> Never argue with a fool, people may not be able to tell the difference
> Argue with a fool; now there are two fools.

and another.
Never argue with a fool, they'll drag you down to their level and beat
you with experience.

On 23 Jul 2004 19:14:13 -0500, geoffm
<> wrote:

>On Fri, 23 Jul 2004 11:36:24 +1200, Patrick Dunford
><> wrote:
>
>>
>>Disputes Tribunal resolutions are not enforceable though
>>
> Yes and no. It is up to you (generally) to do the legwork and track
>down the miscreant. They are useless if the other guy does a runner.
>If you know where they are, you can apply at the court for enforcement
>action.
> OTOH, I would love to be there when the baliffs turn up at Telstra's
>office and start siezing assets!

It doesn't really matter, Telstra won't have many new customers
judging by the recent complaints in the newsgroups. If they are not
reading newsgroups, then they are not competant to supply ISP services
at least. If they try to get my business they will get an earful from
me.

On Fri, 23 Jul 2004 15:19:31 +1200, Patrick Dunford
<> wrote:

>In article <>,
>says...
>
>> Better they require a human to press numbers on thier phone to connect
>> with these numbers, using dtmf that way will prevent auto dialing of
>> these numbers thou and thats probably against some bloody international
>> convention.
>
>Really? How does the phone network tell the difference between a human
>and a machine?
I set up a machine with xp and when it asked for an outside line
number i put 08.
For the dialup to my provider I entered the number minus the 08.
If a dialer hijacks the machine it puts 08 in front of its own number
..

Gerry wrote:
> I set up a machine with xp and when it asked for an outside line
> number i put 08.
> For the dialup to my provider I entered the number minus the 08.
> If a dialer hijacks the machine it puts 08 in front of its own number

only if it doesnt just pass the phone number straight to the comm port.

On Thu, 22 Jul 2004 23:23:26 +1200, "E. Scrooge" <scrooge@*shot.co.nz
(*sling)> wrote:

>
>"Jason M" <> wrote in message
>news:.. .
>> On Thu, 22 Jul 2004 21:44:03 +1200, "E. Scrooge" <scrooge@*shot.co.nz
>> (*sling)> wrote:
>>
>> >What happened is on my Telecom account it shows a call to the Cook
>Islands -
>> >of course such calls are well known among other places that trojans use.
>> --snip--
>> >The small bill to the Cook Islands has been wiped, but if it happens
>again I get
>> >charged. Telecom wouldn't send out a new invoice, but told me to just
>cross
>> >the charge out on the original one I've got.
>>
>> Was the number Cook Islands 0068 238872?
>> I know an elderly couple who have had a dialler call that number at a
>> cost of hundreds of dollars, and Telstra have insisted that they pay
>> or they will list them on Baycorp.
>> All the searches I have done indicate that people have just paid the
>> bill and put a toll-bar on their phoneline.
>>
>> I don't understand why the owner of the number in the Cook Islands
>> cannot be traced and prosecuted for fraud, and Telstra along with
>> them. If the Cook Islands govt doesn't want to do that then NZ should
>> stop sending them $12 million in aid each year.
>
>That's the number all right. I'm sure if I still had it the bill would've
>been a lot more than $1.45 - especially if it could call out while the modem
>was in use on the Net.
>Since it's a malicious phone number telecom should be able to block that
>number, same with Telstra for their customers.

I have been informed that Telstra have now refunded a $160 charge for
a Cook Islands dialler, but still claim that their charges for the
calls were legitimate, and that future calls will not be credited.

> On Thu, 22 Jul 2004 23:23:26 +1200, "E. Scrooge" <scrooge@*shot.co.nz
> (*sling)> wrote:
>
> >
> >"Jason M" <> wrote in message
> >news:.. .
> >> On Thu, 22 Jul 2004 21:44:03 +1200, "E. Scrooge" <scrooge@*shot.co.nz
> >> (*sling)> wrote:
> >>
> >> >What happened is on my Telecom account it shows a call to the Cook
> >Islands -
> >> >of course such calls are well known among other places that trojans use.
> >> --snip--
> >> >The small bill to the Cook Islands has been wiped, but if it happens
> >again I get
> >> >charged. Telecom wouldn't send out a new invoice, but told me to just
> >cross
> >> >the charge out on the original one I've got.
> >>
> >> Was the number Cook Islands 0068 238872?
> >> I know an elderly couple who have had a dialler call that number at a
> >> cost of hundreds of dollars, and Telstra have insisted that they pay
> >> or they will list them on Baycorp.
> >> All the searches I have done indicate that people have just paid the
> >> bill and put a toll-bar on their phoneline.
> >>
> >> I don't understand why the owner of the number in the Cook Islands
> >> cannot be traced and prosecuted for fraud, and Telstra along with
> >> them. If the Cook Islands govt doesn't want to do that then NZ should
> >> stop sending them $12 million in aid each year.
> >
> >That's the number all right. I'm sure if I still had it the bill would've
> >been a lot more than $1.45 - especially if it could call out while the modem
> >was in use on the Net.
> >Since it's a malicious phone number telecom should be able to block that
> >number, same with Telstra for their customers.

How do you know it is a malicious phone number scrooge? It could be a
legitimate number that just happens to get these calls.