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How to read a floppy disk formatted to 240Kb?

 
 
~misfit~
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      09-07-2003

"Uncle StoatWarbler" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news(E-Mail Removed)...
> On Sat, 06 Sep 2003 15:40:27 +1200, ~misfit~ wrote:
>
> >> Look for a DOS program called "alien" which should be able to read the
> >> discs.
> >>
> >> The problem after then will be decoding whatever file format was used

> >
> > Any further info on this proggy Uncle? Googling for 'alien' and 'DOS'

and
> > 'disk utility' variously brings up millions of pages, none of which seem

to
> > be of help.

>
> http://www.melbpc.org.au/pcupdate/9503/9503article5.htm
>
> I downloaded my version of it from SIMTEL about 10 years ago...


Thank you kind sir.
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~misfit~



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Uncle StoatWarbler
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      09-07-2003
On Sat, 06 Sep 2003 15:40:27 +1200, ~misfit~ wrote:

>> Look for a DOS program called "alien" which should be able to read the
>> discs.
>>
>> The problem after then will be decoding whatever file format was used

>
> Any further info on this proggy Uncle? Googling for 'alien' and 'DOS' and
> 'disk utility' variously brings up millions of pages, none of which seem to
> be of help.


http://www.melbpc.org.au/pcupdate/9503/9503article5.htm

I downloaded my version of it from SIMTEL about 10 years ago...


 
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Gavin Tunney
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      09-07-2003
On Sun, 7 Sep 2003 13:25:48 +1200, "~misfit~"
<misfit@'SPAMTRAP'orcon.net.nz> wrote:

<snip>
>Thanks Gav. I'm sure now it's the disks themselves. I got the old
>wordpocessor working, it's going fine. I can put a normal floppy in and it
>asks it I want to 'initialise' it (which I think is Brother-speak for
>format) and if I click yes it takes about five minutes and then reports
>240kb free. I can type and save to this disk just fine. If I remove the
>disk from the drive, re-insert it and then hit 'file' it reads the contents
>of the disk.
>
>However, when I put one of the older disks in (and some of them are 3M
>1.44MB, just re-formatted I guess) it spins noisilly for a while and then
>asks if I want to initialise it. I think that, because they got wet, the
>bits of protective papery stuff each side of the substrate inside the disk
>package have swollen and, if they weren't stuffed before they probably are
>now. Either that or her brother has wiped them. I see a bit of paper in the
>printer part of it with his name on it and a bit of mumbo-jumbo. Even the
>system disks that came with it are unreadable. (Spreadsheet and thesarus).
>
>I did find a web-page that said this model's disks (there were two others in
>the series) are not compatible with PCs
>
>I've got them back in the hot-water cupboard but I don't hold out much hope
>now. I think the data, even if it hadn't previously been erased, is history.
>The disks were write-protected though. Now the machine itself is working
>fine I don't think I need to worry about a PC-based answer.
>
>Cheers mate, thanks for the offer.


They may still be recoverable Shaun, all depends on whether the
machine uses a standard type of floppy drive in that the stepping of
the heads is compatible so the tracks are readable by a normal drive.

When you load a floppy in any device it will try to read the file
system in a manner the device is programmed to understand. If it
can't recognise the file system it just assumes the disk isn't
formatted. Could be that the boot sector or other part of the file
structure is unreadable, doesn't mean the data has disappeared though.
Disk utilities don't care about the file structure, they just read the
disk directly & copy the entire disk to a file.

If you image the disk as a 1.44mb file then the data should be in a
whole pile of same-sized chunks within that file, with big spaces in
between each chunk. If the files were saved in a logical format you
can use 'replace' in Wordpad to remove the spaces & (hopefully) have
your text in a legible order that you can then copy & paste.

Most disk utilities can image a floppy with bad sectors by skipping
the bad sectors & filling that bit of the file with blanks....might
lose some text there but not much.

GT
 
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~misfit~
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      09-07-2003

"Ian Boag" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> Now that you can write a disk, why not put a bit of stuff on to a
> disketter, then try out your utilities etc on that one.


That makes sense. Thanks Ian.
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~misfit~



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~misfit~
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      09-07-2003

"Gavin Tunney" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> On Sun, 7 Sep 2003 13:25:48 +1200, "~misfit~"
> <misfit@'SPAMTRAP'orcon.net.nz> wrote:
>
> <snip>


--
~misfit~
>
> They may still be recoverable Shaun, all depends on whether the
> machine uses a standard type of floppy drive in that the stepping of
> the heads is compatible so the tracks are readable by a normal drive.
>
> When you load a floppy in any device it will try to read the file
> system in a manner the device is programmed to understand. If it
> can't recognise the file system it just assumes the disk isn't
> formatted. Could be that the boot sector or other part of the file
> structure is unreadable, doesn't mean the data has disappeared though.
> Disk utilities don't care about the file structure, they just read the
> disk directly & copy the entire disk to a file.
>
> If you image the disk as a 1.44mb file then the data should be in a
> whole pile of same-sized chunks within that file, with big spaces in
> between each chunk. If the files were saved in a logical format you
> can use 'replace' in Wordpad to remove the spaces & (hopefully) have
> your text in a legible order that you can then copy & paste.
>
> Most disk utilities can image a floppy with bad sectors by skipping
> the bad sectors & filling that bit of the file with blanks....might
> lose some text there but not much.


OK, thanks Gavin. I still have them in the hot-water cupboard as they are
very noisy when inserted into a drive, the 'packing' around the disk proper
has swollen due to moisture.

This machine multi-boots and I have 98SE on it, I guess I can use a DOS
utility form there? Any recomendations as to what to use and where to get
it? (Or I can google it)

Cheers,
--
~misfit~



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Nicholas Sherlock
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      09-07-2003
~misfit~ wrote:
> OK, thanks Gavin. I still have them in the hot-water cupboard as they
> are very noisy when inserted into a drive, the 'packing' around the
> disk proper has swollen due to moisture.


So.. what you're saying is:

"I just put my slightly damp disks into the nice, warm, dark incubator so I
can see how many bacteria I can get to grow on the surface of the disk"?

Cheers,
Nicholas Sherlock


 
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Gordon
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      09-07-2003
On Sun, 07 Sep 2003 08:39:24 +1200, T.N.O wrote:

> "Aaron Lawrence" wrote
>> Thanks for changing your posting name again, asshat

>
> asshat??? wtf?


Asphalt spelt wrong?


--
Gordon

Google knows where to find things, ask at http://www.google.com
Works for me, will work for you, so be it.

 
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Kristofer Clayton
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      09-07-2003
On Sun, 7 Sep 2003 08:39:24 +1200, "T.N.O" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>"Aaron Lawrence" wrote
>> Thanks for changing your posting name again, asshat

>
>asshat??? wtf?
>

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=asshat

--
Kristofer Clayton (KJClayton)
Gisborne, New Zealand
 
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Gavin Tunney
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      09-07-2003
On Sun, 7 Sep 2003 16:07:47 +1200, "~misfit~"
<misfit@'SPAMTRAP'orcon.net.nz> wrote:

<snip>
>
>OK, thanks Gavin. I still have them in the hot-water cupboard as they are
>very noisy when inserted into a drive, the 'packing' around the disk proper
>has swollen due to moisture.
>

Ouch. Hopefully the noise isn't something scratching against the disk
surface.

>This machine multi-boots and I have 98SE on it, I guess I can use a DOS
>utility form there? Any recomendations as to what to use and where to get
>it? (Or I can google it)
>
>Cheers,


I mostly use Nortons Diskedit which comes with Norton Utilities, can
probably find an early version on the 'net easy enough. Need the file
called diskedit.exe and the runtime library, older libraries are
usually nlib100.rtl.

Diskedit isn't very good at recovering from bad sectors, can hang or
cancel out instead of skipping the sector. Worth a try....I've had
pretty good success with it.

If the stepper motors in the drives are compatible in the way they
place the heads over tracks you'll get the data off, else it will just
be a big empty file. 256k isn't good arithmetic compared with 1.44mb,
hopefully it's just an arbitrary figure & the drives are compatible.

GT



 
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~misfit~
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Posts: n/a
 
      09-07-2003

"Gavin Tunney" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> On Sun, 7 Sep 2003 16:07:47 +1200, "~misfit~"
> <misfit@'SPAMTRAP'orcon.net.nz> wrote:
>
> <snip>
> >
> >OK, thanks Gavin. I still have them in the hot-water cupboard as they are
> >very noisy when inserted into a drive, the 'packing' around the disk

proper
> >has swollen due to moisture.
> >

> Ouch. Hopefully the noise isn't something scratching against the disk
> surface.


It just sounds like they are being pinched slightly between the layers of
protecting material.

> >This machine multi-boots and I have 98SE on it, I guess I can use a DOS
> >utility form there? Any recomendations as to what to use and where to get
> >it? (Or I can google it)
> >
> >Cheers,

>
> I mostly use Nortons Diskedit which comes with Norton Utilities, can
> probably find an early version on the 'net easy enough. Need the file
> called diskedit.exe and the runtime library, older libraries are
> usually nlib100.rtl.
>
> Diskedit isn't very good at recovering from bad sectors, can hang or
> cancel out instead of skipping the sector. Worth a try....I've had
> pretty good success with it.
>
> If the stepper motors in the drives are compatible in the way they
> place the heads over tracks you'll get the data off, else it will just
> be a big empty file. 256k isn't good arithmetic compared with 1.44mb,
> hopefully it's just an arbitrary figure & the drives are compatible.


It's actually 240KB. The one document I found on the 'net said that the
disks in this machine aren't compatable with PC disk drives. All later
models are. Just my luck

Thanks again Gav.
--
~misfit~



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