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Re: Addition of ".home" to the range of sub-domains available in NZ

 
 
Jay
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      07-27-2003
Lennier wrote:

> What do you think about adding ".home" to the currently available list of
> sub-domains ".net", ".co", ".org" etc?
>
> That way when affordable broadband arrives here in NZ people will be able
> to get a domain name that would be more suited to domestic use.
>


When affordable broadband does eventually arrive in NZ (if ever)
then your ISP will assign you an IP address which may change from
time to time. So you wont be able to have a simple static domain anyhow.
You will get the (email) domain that your ISP assigns you.

If you want your own domain then you would have to make special
arrangement with your ISP - in your dreams for home broadband.

So, you will have your domain hosted somewhere like the USA where
it is the most affordable. In which case you can chose whatever domain
you like.

Does that answer your question?

 
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Matthew Poole
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      07-27-2003
In article <(E-Mail Removed)>, http://www.velocityreviews.com/forums/(E-Mail Removed) wrote:
>On Sun, 27 Jul 2003 10:19:12 +1000, Jay <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

*SNIP*
>When IPv6 really arives there will be *millions* of IP addresses

Per person. IPv6 is 2^128 addresses, which is a number so enormous that
there's not actually a word for it.

>available. It's unclear (to me anyway) what effects that would have,
>but I suspect that there will be no need for dynamic IP addresses as
>we understand them today. The ISPs and telcos will find other ways to
>monitor and control bandwidth usage.
>

The numbers I've seen are along the lines of a /48 for every person
currently alive - A /48 is 65535*18,446,744,073,709,551,616 (ie: one
REALLY, REALLY, _REALLY_ enormous number) addresses. Even if it were
only a /64 per person, which seems must more realistic, there are
18,446,744,073,709,551,616 addresses in a /64.

In view of that, there's no need for an ISP to worry about dynamic
addressing. Static addresses for everyone

--
Matthew Poole Auckland, New Zealand
"Veni, vidi, velcro...
I came, I saw, I stuck around"

My real e-mail is mattATp00leDOTnet
 
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Enkidu
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      07-27-2003
On Sun, 27 Jul 2003 10:19:12 +1000, Jay <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>Lennier wrote:
>
>> What do you think about adding ".home" to the currently available list of
>> sub-domains ".net", ".co", ".org" etc?
>>
>> That way when affordable broadband arrives here in NZ people will be able
>> to get a domain name that would be more suited to domestic use.
>>

>
>When affordable broadband does eventually arrive in NZ (if ever)
>then your ISP will assign you an IP address which may change from
>time to time. So you wont be able to have a simple static domain anyhow.
>You will get the (email) domain that your ISP assigns you.
>
>If you want your own domain then you would have to make special
>arrangement with your ISP - in your dreams for home broadband.
>
>So, you will have your domain hosted somewhere like the USA where
>it is the most affordable. In which case you can chose whatever domain
>you like.
>
>Does that answer your question?
>

Yes, but the answer is wrong.

You can have your own Domain Name right now. I do, and it's easy,
especially if you don't want to host the actual website and mail
yourself. All you need to do is point your DNS entries for your mail
to your mailbox at the ISP, and the entry for your website at the IP
address where it is hosted. Your ISP *will* help you with this,
especially if the DNS is hosted with them. Otherwise places like
www.registerdirect.co.nz will allow you to maintain your own records
in their DNS (and they will provide mailboxes too). (I've never used
RegisterDirect and I have no connection with them).

So my Domain Name is cliffp.com. It is hosted in NZ. I have my email
sent to my ISP, Actrix, through @cliffp.com (via a mail redirect where
I host my DNS). The guys at Actrix sorted that for me. I don't
currently have a Website but if I did, I could get the DNS (hosted in
NZ remember) pointed at it. If I hosted it at Actrix, I'm sure the
guys there would set up their end for me.

Basically, it doesn't matter where in the world you are situated, you
can have any legitimate Domain Name that you like. I could have
cliffp.ru (where they don't have an intermediate level.)

When IPv6 really arives there will be *millions* of IP addresses
available. It's unclear (to me anyway) what effects that would have,
but I suspect that there will be no need for dynamic IP addresses as
we understand them today. The ISPs and telcos will find other ways to
monitor and control bandwidth usage.

Cheers,

Cliff
--

Signed and sealed with Great Seal of the Executive
Council of the Internet, by The Master of The Net.
 
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Ewen McNeill
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      07-27-2003
In article <(E-Mail Removed)>,
Enkidu <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>You can have your own Domain Name right now. I do, and it's easy,
>especially if you don't want to host the actual website and mail
>yourself. All you need to do is point your DNS entries for your mail
>to your mailbox at the ISP, and the entry for your website at the IP
>address where it is hosted. [....]
>So my Domain Name is cliffp.com. It is hosted in NZ. I have my email
>sent to my ISP, Actrix, through @cliffp.com (via a mail redirect where
>I host my DNS). The guys at Actrix sorted that for me.


That'd definitely be the way to do it: direct the mail to a mail server,
such as one at an ISP, which is always available. I know a few people
with their own domains that do that -- direct the mail at their ISP's
mail server (after arranging it at the ISP) and it seems to work well.

Curiously cliffp.com seems to be set up somewhat differently from what
you describe:

-=- cut here -=-
ewen@basilica:~ $ host -t MX cliffp.com
cliffp.com mail is handled by 40 mail.web.co.nz.
cliffp.com mail is handled by 10 mail.cliffp.com.
ewen@basilica:~ $ host mail.cliffp.com
mail.cliffp.com has address 203.79.66.21
ewen@basilica:~ $ host 203.79.66.21
21.66.79.203.in-addr.arpa domain name pointer 203-79-66-21.adsl-wns.paradise.net.nz.
-=- cut here -=-

which seems to be directing the mail at an ADSL modem serviced through
Paradise, and then with a fall back to some businesses mail server if
the first mail server isn't available.

The disadvantage of a setup like what seems to be in place for cliffp.com,
is that when the ADSL connection is down (or the server behind it is
down/unreachable) there'll be a few attempts to deliver mail to it, before
it fails over to the backup server. Which results in wasted traffic,
and failure reports in the logs of whoever is sending the mail.

If it only happens occassionally it's no big deal. But if the ADSL
connection is often/usually down and/or the mail server behind it is
often/usually down, it means that the mail always has to "noisly" fail
over to the backup mail server.

Generally pointing the primary MX at a server that is often/usually down
is discouraged. "Mail bagging" and the like is a more appropriate way
to get SMTP-on-demand style delivery of mail on the occassions when it
is up, rather than making every mail server try and fail to deliver
to the often/usually down server first.

Not that I've noticed this happening or anything....

Ewen

--
Ewen McNeill, (E-Mail Removed)
 
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Jay
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      07-27-2003
Enkidu wrote:

> On Sun, 27 Jul 2003 10:19:12 +1000, Jay <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>>Lennier wrote:
>>
>>> What do you think about adding ".home" to the currently available list
>>> of sub-domains ".net", ".co", ".org" etc?
>>>
>>> That way when affordable broadband arrives here in NZ people will be
>>> able to get a domain name that would be more suited to domestic use.
>>>

>>
>>When affordable broadband does eventually arrive in NZ (if ever)
>>then your ISP will assign you an IP address which may change from
>>time to time. So you wont be able to have a simple static domain anyhow.
>>You will get the (email) domain that your ISP assigns you.
>>
>>If you want your own domain then you would have to make special
>>arrangement with your ISP - in your dreams for home broadband.
>>
>>So, you will have your domain hosted somewhere like the USA where
>>it is the most affordable. In which case you can chose whatever domain
>>you like.
>>
>>Does that answer your question?
>>

> Yes, but the answer is wrong.
>
> You can have your own Domain Name right now. I do, and it's easy,
> especially if you don't want to host the actual website and mail
> yourself.


Of course you can. But that wasn't what I was saying.
The op was obviously wanting to have a .home domain so he
could run own domain locally. Not pointing to an external hosting site.

> All you need to do is point your DNS entries for your mail
> to your mailbox at the ISP, and the entry for your website at the IP
> address where it is hosted. Your ISP *will* help you with this,
> especially if the DNS is hosted with them.


You ISP doesn't need to help with hosting your domain elsewhere.

> Otherwise places like
> www.registerdirect.co.nz will allow you to maintain your own records
> in their DNS (and they will provide mailboxes too). (I've never used
> RegisterDirect and I have no connection with them).


And there are dynamic ones too ...

 
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DPF
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      07-27-2003
On Sun, 27 Jul 2003 07:35:09 GMT, (E-Mail Removed) (Matthew Poole)
wrote:

>In article <(E-Mail Removed)>, (E-Mail Removed) wrote:
>>On Sun, 27 Jul 2003 10:19:12 +1000, Jay <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

>*SNIP*
>>When IPv6 really arives there will be *millions* of IP addresses

>Per person. IPv6 is 2^128 addresses, which is a number so enormous that
>there's not actually a word for it.


On the contrary there is indeed. The number is:

three hundred and forty undecillion, two hundred and eight two
decillion, three hundred and sixty six nonillion, nine hundred and
twenty octillion and nine hundred and thirty eight septillion.

>The numbers I've seen are along the lines of a /48 for every person
>currently alive - A /48 is 65535*18,446,744,073,709,551,616 (ie: one
>REALLY, REALLY, _REALLY_ enormous number) addresses. Even if it were
>only a /64 per person, which seems must more realistic, there are
>18,446,744,073,709,551,616 addresses in a /64.


A mere 18 quintillion, 446 quadrillion, 744 trillion, 73 billion, 709
million and 500 thousand.

DPF
--
E-mail: (E-Mail Removed)
ICQ: 29964527
MSN: (E-Mail Removed)
 
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Jay
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      07-27-2003
Lennier wrote:

> On Sun, 27 Jul 2003 20:46:34 +1000, Jay wrote:
>
>>> You can have your own Domain Name right now. I do, and it's easy,
>>> especially if you don't want to host the actual website and mail
>>> yourself.

>>
>> Of course you can. But that wasn't what I was saying. The op was
>> obviously wanting to have a .home domain so he could run own domain
>> locally. Not pointing to an external hosting site.

>
> If, for example, I had a domain name "my-surname.home.nz", and IF I had a
> static IP address, I could point the DNS entry at the static IP address
> and could then run my own email servers, my own webserver, my own
> colaboration server, and my own DNS server - and have people who were
> outside of my own LAN be able to look at my webserver (provided, of
> course, that it was not within my firewall) and also send me email direct
> to my own email server.


I do something like that, however, I rely on an external hosting
site for my domain. So instead of running a full domain, I run
a masqueraded domain. From inside it looks exactly like my domain.
From the outside it exists elsewhere. My dns server mirrors the
external domain, plus it has private internal definitions.

On odd occasions I have pointed mx records at my (static) ip, but
most of the time it is much more convenient to use the external
site which has a staff to look after things 24/7.

It is also a simple matter to redirect http traffic from your
external site, if you so wish. But most of the time you gain
nothing, except people will encounter a slower bandwidth
than your external hosting site (esp. uplink which is usually a lot
slower than the other direction). Not to mention when you do
a large download you are going to interfere with traffic coming to
your site unless you take special precautions.

>
> That way I would no longer have to rely on my ISP's servers, and would
> even be able to host email for other people.
>
> Wouldn't this be true if I had a static IP address, and a registered
> domain name which pointed to my static IP address?


It is one thing to have a static IP but remember that the static
IP is assigned to your ISP. It belongs to the ISP's domain.
But if you buy a business account then you will get your static IP
and you will be able to host your domain, and run your proper dns
server - but it will cost extra.

>
> Besides all this... what about the idea of having a ".home" subdomain to
> complement the ".co" and ".org" and ".net" etc subdomains in NZ that are
> already available?


Since you'll probably need a business account how about .biz?

 
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Jay
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      07-27-2003
Lennier wrote:

> On Sun, 27 Jul 2003 22:14:15 +1000, Jay wrote:
>
>>> Besides all this... what about the idea of having a ".home" subdomain to
>>> complement the ".co" and ".org" and ".net" etc subdomains in NZ that are
>>> already available?

>>
>> Since you'll probably need a business account how about .biz?

>
> Given that I was talking about domestic use, and given that NZ already has
> ".co" for commercial use don't you think that ".biz" is redundant?
>


I never created .biz, someone else did.
It isn't my fault so don't blame me.

> Is it really not possible to be assigned a static IP from one's ISP and
> register a domain with some registrar somewhere, and get that domain
> pointing to one's static IP number?


A domain must have an IP address.
When you buy a domain you get IP address(es).
Normally when you sign up to an ISP you get an IP address that
belongs to the ISPs domain.

Unless you pay more money.

 
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Enkidu
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      07-28-2003
On Sun, 27 Jul 2003 09:47:47 +0000 (UTC), (E-Mail Removed) (Ewen
McNeill) wrote:
>
>Curiously cliffp.com seems to be set up somewhat differently from what
>you describe:
>

Now there's a surprise! It's supposed to be only temporary.

Thanks for the info though. That's really useful. It may nudge me into
setting it up as a permanently on connection.

Cheers,

Cliff
--

Signed and sealed with Great Seal of the Executive
Council of the Internet, by The Master of The Net.
 
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Enkidu
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      07-28-2003
On Sun, 27 Jul 2003 20:46:34 +1000, Jay <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>Of course you can. But that wasn't what I was saying.
>The op was obviously wanting to have a .home domain so he
>could run own domain locally. Not pointing to an external hosting site.
>

Fair call.
>>
>> All you need to do is point your DNS entries for your mail
>> to your mailbox at the ISP, and the entry for your website at the IP
>> address where it is hosted. Your ISP *will* help you with this,
>> especially if the DNS is hosted with them.

>
>Your ISP doesn't need to help with hosting your domain elsewhere.
>

True. They will need to help you with the mail thing though.

>> Otherwise places like
>> www.registerdirect.co.nz will allow you to maintain your own records
>> in their DNS (and they will provide mailboxes too). (I've never used
>> RegisterDirect and I have no connection with them).

>
>And there are dynamic ones too ...


Mmm, I don't really trust them. I'd rather pay a few bucks and do it
properly.

Cheers,

Cliff
--

Signed and sealed with Great Seal of the Executive
Council of the Internet, by The Master of The Net.
 
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