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Followup - /who/ invented VHS - Sony or JVC?

 
 
thanatoid
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      01-01-2008
I am following up to a thread from a long time ago in which I
said that Sony invented VHS and sold it to JVC because Sony
considered its quality unacceptably low, and that JVC made it
cheap, called themselves "The Inventors Of VHS" and made it the
predominant home format.

Someone responded and pointed to a Wikipedia article in which it
says that Sony developed the basic principles of a " video tape
cassette for home use (a considerable improvement in ease-of use
over their now " reel-to-reel format), invited a bunch of
people to take a look at its prototypes (sounds a little like
Xerox giving billions away by having /some people/ over to look
at their unmarketable and useless GUI and mouse), and that while
Sony then developed Betamax, JVC invented VHS based on most of
the principles that Sony came up with, and specifically that
Sony DID NOT invent VHS.

As everyone knows, Wikipedia can be edited by anyone.
(Interesting how such an admirable attempt at, shall we call it,
"informational democratorship", is showing serious cracks...
Most of the articles I looked at in the last few weeks are
either requesting citations or are *closed* due to "lack of
verifiable sources" or "vandalism"...)

Anyway, while generally I find Wikipedia very useful, nothing
found there is necessarily the ultimate truth, just like nothing
in any book is, nor anything /anyone/ say about /anything/.

And, I have just run across a Sony ad from 1979. You can find it
in alt.binaries.test.gogo

It rather clearly states, more than once, that Sony invented
BOTH systems. In fact what appears to be the rejected Sony VHS
deck prototype appears in the background. I do not recall JVC or
anyone suing Sony for that ad and the statements it contains
(nor do I think that Sony or Mr. Morita would run a blatantly
fraudulent ad). I was quite involved with video production
between 75 and 85 and I am pretty sure I would have known (and
not forgotten) had anything like that happened.

So what is the deal then? WHO invented VHS?

(Having, one could say, "hard proof" in the form of the Sony ad
I am not going into the subtleties of whether coming up with all
the essential principles of the " video cassette system - and
having others see and use them - does not in fact constitute
"invention" of all formats based on those principles, regardless
of the exact shape of the tape travel path and the size of the
cassette shell.)

--
The only cure for stupidity is death.
The only cure for brilliance is death.
The only cure for love is death.
The only cure for hate is death.
Indifference needs no cure.
The only cure for life is death.
{ 2007 thanatoid}
 
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Synapse Syndrome
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      01-01-2008
"thanatoid" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:Xns9A17E6C0B10FBthanexit@66.250.146.158...
>I am following up to a thread from a long time ago in which I
> said that Sony invented VHS and sold it to JVC because Sony
> considered its quality unacceptably low, and that JVC made it
> cheap, called themselves "The Inventors Of VHS" and made it the
> predominant home format.
>
> Someone responded and pointed to a Wikipedia article in which it
> says that Sony developed the basic principles of a " video tape
> cassette for home use (a considerable improvement in ease-of use
> over their now " reel-to-reel format), invited a bunch of
> people to take a look at its prototypes (sounds a little like
> Xerox giving billions away by having /some people/ over to look
> at their unmarketable and useless GUI and mouse), and that while
> Sony then developed Betamax, JVC invented VHS based on most of
> the principles that Sony came up with, and specifically that
> Sony DID NOT invent VHS.
>
> As everyone knows, Wikipedia can be edited by anyone.
> (Interesting how such an admirable attempt at, shall we call it,
> "informational democratorship", is showing serious cracks...
> Most of the articles I looked at in the last few weeks are
> either requesting citations or are *closed* due to "lack of
> verifiable sources" or "vandalism"...)
>
> Anyway, while generally I find Wikipedia very useful, nothing
> found there is necessarily the ultimate truth, just like nothing
> in any book is, nor anything /anyone/ say about /anything/.
>
> And, I have just run across a Sony ad from 1979. You can find it
> in alt.binaries.test.gogo
>
> It rather clearly states, more than once, that Sony invented
> BOTH systems. In fact what appears to be the rejected Sony VHS
> deck prototype appears in the background. I do not recall JVC or
> anyone suing Sony for that ad and the statements it contains
> (nor do I think that Sony or Mr. Morita would run a blatantly
> fraudulent ad). I was quite involved with video production
> between 75 and 85 and I am pretty sure I would have known (and
> not forgotten) had anything like that happened.
>
> So what is the deal then? WHO invented VHS?
>
> (Having, one could say, "hard proof" in the form of the Sony ad
> I am not going into the subtleties of whether coming up with all
> the essential principles of the " video cassette system - and
> having others see and use them - does not in fact constitute
> "invention" of all formats based on those principles, regardless
> of the exact shape of the tape travel path and the size of the
> cassette shell.)



Why don't you discuss this on the Talk page for the Wikipedia VHS article?
Might be more people that would be interested in this. It seems very
strange for this fact not to be well known about if it were true.

ss.


 
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Synapse Syndrome
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      01-01-2008
By the way.. where did you find that advert?

ss.


 
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Flyer
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      01-01-2008

"thanatoid" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:Xns9A17E6C0B10FBthanexit@66.250.146.158...

> So what is the deal then? WHO invented VHS?
>
> (Having, one could say, "hard proof" in the form of the Sony ad
> I am not going into the subtleties of whether coming up with all
> the essential principles of the " video cassette system - and
> having others see and use them - does not in fact constitute
> "invention" of all formats based on those principles, regardless
> of the exact shape of the tape travel path and the size of the
> cassette shell.)
>


can't remember who started the VHS/Betamax wars, but I do remember the
Philips VCS system, which used 1" tape, I bought a Grundig using this format
in the mid 70's, and only junked it a few years ago

P.


 
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Blinky the Shark
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      01-01-2008
Synapse Syndrome wrote:

> "thanatoid" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:Xns9A17E6C0B10FBthanexit@66.250.146.158...
>>I am following up to a thread from a long time ago in which I
>> said that Sony invented VHS and sold it to JVC because Sony
>> considered its quality unacceptably low, and that JVC made it
>> cheap, called themselves "The Inventors Of VHS" and made it the
>> predominant home format.
>>
>> Someone responded and pointed to a Wikipedia article in which it
>> says that Sony developed the basic principles of a " video tape
>> cassette for home use (a considerable improvement in ease-of use
>> over their now " reel-to-reel format), invited a bunch of
>> people to take a look at its prototypes (sounds a little like
>> Xerox giving billions away by having /some people/ over to look
>> at their unmarketable and useless GUI and mouse), and that while
>> Sony then developed Betamax, JVC invented VHS based on most of
>> the principles that Sony came up with, and specifically that
>> Sony DID NOT invent VHS.


Re Sony developing a cassette format to replace open reel video tape, they
already had the U-matic cassette format on the market for a few years
before either Beta or VHS appeared; it used helical scanning, as did Beta
and VHS.


--
Blinky
Killing all posts from Google Groups
The Usenet Improvement Project - http://improve-usenet.org

 
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thanatoid
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      01-01-2008
"Synapse Syndrome" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote
in news:(E-Mail Removed):

> By the way.. where did you find that advert?
>
> ss.


It was posted (not sure why, along with an ad for an early
version of what was to become the famous Technics SL-1200
turntable) among a bunch of "misc" Playboy stuff in one of the
Playboy groups about 10-20 days ago. I actually remember seeing
it in print IN 1979, but not sure where. It probably appeared in
a variety of magazines - ranging from New Yorker and Esquire to
Playboy - as most Sony ads did around that time.

Your suggestion about Wiki-discussing this was MOST reasonable.
I actually considered doing it, and went to Wikipedia. For SOME
reason, the articles I read this time use the term "developed"
rather than invented (as applied to JVC's work) or use an even
more vague term. I certainly admit JVC developed and improved
VHS, not to mention Sony showed the first example of its utter
lack of comprehension of the consumer mind (and POCKET), so
greatly at odds with its once-great innovative spirit, and - as
everyone knows - basically killed Betamax with their own hands.

So I am just going to drop it. Besides, the Sony of today is not
even worth defending or fighting for.


--
Needless to say, I disdain such idiocies as Xmas and New Year's,
but I'd thought I'd play along just once...

thanatoid's New Year's Resolutions.

01. Stop posting good advice to help newsgroups.
02. Stop posting stupid advice to help newsgroups.
03. Drive to see the Grand Canyon and then to Las Vegas, buy a
gun.
04. Gamble a little in a desperate attempt to fit in for once.
05. Hire 5 of the best looking Las Vegas hookers and have a 3
hour orgy.
06. Have a king-size eggs and bacon and hashbrowns with onions
breakfast.
07. Return to hotel room, put gun in mouth and pull trigger.
 
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thanatoid
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Posts: n/a
 
      01-01-2008
"Flyer" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
news:(E-Mail Removed):

>
> "thanatoid" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:Xns9A17E6C0B10FBthanexit@66.250.146.158...
>
>> So what is the deal then? WHO invented VHS?
>>
>> (Having, one could say, "hard proof" in the form of the
>> Sony ad I am not going into the subtleties of whether
>> coming up with all the essential principles of the "
>> video cassette system - and having others see and use them
>> - does not in fact constitute "invention" of all formats
>> based on those principles, regardless of the exact shape
>> of the tape travel path and the size of the cassette
>> shell.)
>>

>
> can't remember who started the VHS/Betamax wars, but I do
> remember the Philips VCS system, which used 1" tape, I
> bought a Grundig using this format in the mid 70's, and
> only junked it a few years ago
>
> P.


I never actually /saw/ one of those but I remember reading about
it. I believe the cassette was square. But I don't think it
could have used 1" tape. 1" (AKA "C" format" tape) was used in
"portable" pro video recorders (the Nagra ad for a large-
dictionary-sized unit slung from the shoulder of a nice-looking
woman with a semi-Afro haircut comes to mind) and a 7" reel of
it could only hold about 15 or 30 minutes of material. I am too
lazy to check right now but I believe the Grundigs used " tape
- as all the systems developed around then did. The trend was
always for things to get smaller and more portable - from 2"
Quadraplex refrigerator-size video recorders to 3/4" mini-U-
Matic cassettes (medium hard-cover book size, 20 minutes) to
Betamax/VHS to Hi-8 etc.

[a little later]

Found a video tape recorder museum page (there's a link to it in
Wikipedia on one of the VTR formats pages). Your VCS cassettes
were not square (I confused it with another format which was
/almost/ square) but DID use " tape, recording on a " portion
of it on one side and then the other half after flipping the
cassette over.


--
Needless to say, I disdain such idiocies as Xmas and New Year's,
but I'd thought I'd play along just once...

thanatoid's New Year's Resolutions.

01. Stop posting good advice to help newsgroups.
02. Stop posting stupid advice to help newsgroups.
03. Drive to see the Grand Canyon and then to Las Vegas, buy a
gun.
04. Gamble a little in a desperate attempt to fit in for once.
05. Hire 5 of the best looking Las Vegas hookers and have a 3
hour orgy.
06. Have a king-size eggs and bacon and hashbrowns with onions
breakfast.
07. Return to hotel room, put gun in mouth and pull trigger.
 
Reply With Quote
 
Synapse Syndrome
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      01-01-2008
"thanatoid" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:Xns9A18A422DFF1Bthanexit@66.250.146.158...
>
> It was posted (not sure why, along with an ad for an early
> version of what was to become the famous Technics SL-1200
> turntable) among a bunch of "misc" Playboy stuff in one of the
> Playboy groups about 10-20 days ago.


Could you repost that Technics 1200 advert in that binary group please.

ss.


 
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thanatoid
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Posts: n/a
 
      01-02-2008
"Synapse Syndrome" <(E-Mail Removed)>
wrote in news:(E-Mail Removed):

> "thanatoid" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:Xns9A18A422DFF1Bthanexit@66.250.146.158...
>>
>> It was posted (not sure why, along with an ad for an early
>> version of what was to become the famous Technics SL-1200
>> turntable) among a bunch of "misc" Playboy stuff in one of
>> the Playboy groups about 10-20 days ago.

>
> Could you repost that Technics 1200 advert in that binary
> group please.
>
> ss.


Done.


--
Needless to say, I disdain such idiocies as Xmas and New Year's,
but I'd thought I'd play along just once...

thanatoid's New Year's Resolutions.

01. Stop posting good advice to help newsgroups.
02. Stop posting stupid advice to help newsgroups.
03. Drive to see the Grand Canyon and then to Las Vegas, buy a
gun.
04. Gamble a little in a desperate attempt to fit in for once.
05. Hire 5 of the best looking Las Vegas hookers and have a 3
hour orgy.
06. Have a king-size eggs and bacon and hashbrowns with onions
breakfast.
07. Return to hotel room, put gun in mouth and pull trigger.
 
Reply With Quote
 
Synapse Syndrome
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      01-02-2008
"thanatoid" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:Xns9A18C1239E061thanexit@66.250.146.158...
>>>
>>> It was posted (not sure why, along with an ad for an early
>>> version of what was to become the famous Technics SL-1200
>>> turntable) among a bunch of "misc" Playboy stuff in one of
>>> the Playboy groups about 10-20 days ago.

>>
>> Could you repost that Technics 1200 advert in that binary
>> group please.
>>
>> ss.

>
> Done.


Cheers

ss.


 
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