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Subject: Re: IP Address Questions
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"Luke O'Malley" <> wrote in message
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> Luke O'Malley wrote:
>> Hi
>>
>> Perhaps you can help. I have three computers and they are attached
>> to a router. Do they all have the same IP address? If someone
>> hooked onto my wireless system would they have the same IP address?
>
> No, and no. No two devices can have the same IP address, otherwise
> it
> simply no workee. Most routers hand out private IP addresses that
> are
> something like 192.168.0.2 or some variation. If someone else
> attaches
> to your network, they'll need a unique IP address to function. Want
> to
> explain in more detail what you think is going on?
>
>
> Thank you for your reply. It clears up my question partially. How
> would I go about determining if one of my neighbors is using my
> internet connection.


Why don't you just lock down your connection and be done with it?

On Sun, 19 Aug 2007 00:06:38 GMT, Luke O'Malley
<> wrote:

>A million years ago I got a dos version with a modem. Then I
>purchased an updated one. Since then it sold to two companies. I
>think symantec has it now

God, please get a program that quotes properly.
--
To reply via e-mail, remove The Obvious from my e-mail address.

Luke O'Malley wrote:
> Thank you for your reply. It clears up my question partially. I am
very upset about a situation I am going through.

The way you are posting right now is completely wrong. Stop it.

> If some one was trying to detect which of these computers was
downloading, would it be possible?

The short answer in the context that you are meaning when you are asking
your question is 'No.'

It /would/ be possible for you to monitor your own router's activity
/if/ it could keep proper logs and /if/ you had some logging software
and /if/ you knew how to use it. But I suspect that most of those 'ifs'
are not true.

But, it would not be possible for someone 'external' to your LAN who
could only see the activity of your IP 67.80.251.169. All of the
activities of all of the computers on the network would look like the
activity of that one IP. Your network functions as a 'single unit' in
terms of how its activities on the internet look.

> (I think I have a neighbor using my connection!)

That is highly likely, especially if you don't have your wireless router
secured. Wireless rustling is considered a 'legitimate' sport by some.
Those 'some' think that if someone like you in the neighborhood is
making a wireless connectivity freely available for them to use, then
they should just use it.

> I received a notice from my IP that Universal claims that I am
downloading a copyrighted file - that I am not downloading.

You can be taken to court and you can be sued for the activities which
take place on your insecure wireless network. You are responsible for
all of the activity which is taking place on the IP address which is
'leased' to you.

> I would expect that Universal should be able to determine which of my
neighbors is using my connection. Am I right?

No. You are wrong.


--
Mike Easter

>
> Thank you for your reply. It clears up my question partially.
>
> This is what I am driving at: my IP sent me an email that Universal
> claims that I am downloading a copyrighted film that I am not
> downloading. I have no idea where they got this info from. Then I
> thought maybe someone is tapping into my wireless router. I thought
> that Universal should be able to distinguish my three computers and
> another intruder. That is the basis of my question.

No, they cannot do that -- look past your router and determine which
private LAN IP or Local Area Network IP a computer is using on the router.

But, your wireless network can be hacked on the wireless with someone with
their computer joining your network, obtaining a DHCP IP/private LAN IP
from the DHCP Server on the router or they just went and got a static LAN IP
on your router and used it

If your wireless network is so attacable that someone can join it on the
wireless side, they will have access to the Internet just like any other
machine (your own machines) that are connected to the router wired or
wireless will have, with each having their own unique IP on the LAN becuase
the DHCP server on the router issued a DHCP IP to the computer or they just
used a staic IP on the router. In either case of what IP is being used a
DHCP IP the router gave the machine or the hacker went and got a static IP
from your router, they have access to the Internet with the machine.

>
> I thought for my simple mind that the answer would be something
> like, "No, it impossible to distinguish which of the 'four'
> computers is downloading the file." or "Yes, Universal, if the
> exerted themselves more could determine that it wasn't one of my
> three computers."
>
> The next question is how can I prevent someone from accessing my
> wireless router?

Universal can be looking at your WAN IP/Internet facing IP which is one IP
that doesn't change if you have a BB or DSL connection. The WAN IP is the IP
the ISP assigns to your modem (for lack of better words) and the router is
connected to the modem using that WAN IP.

If a computer is connected to the modem without the router being there, then
it's using that WAN IP from the modem. The WAN means Wide Area
Network/Internet and the WAN/IP is the public facing IP that is used to send
traffic to/from the Internet from one computer or network of computers in
the case of computers connected to the router, and everyone can see that
WAN/public facing Internet/IP on the Internet.

NAT is mapping technology that allows a single IP the WAN/IP to be used by
many machines having a private LAN IP on the router in this case. NAT knows
how to map the traffic back to the LAN IP/machine connected to the router.

http://www.homenethelp.com/web/explain/about-NAT.asp

No one can see past NAT to see what machine on the LAN has a private LAN/IP
or what machine it is on your network that is doing it, like 192.168.1.100
if a machine has the IP on the LAN. But they all can see that WAN/IP IP on
the Internet and the can record that WAN/IP.

On Sat, 18 Aug 2007 13:26:55 GMT, Luke O'Malley wrote:

>Hi

Your replies are hard to follow, your nice (I do remember PCP) app is
adding the msg headers and not quoting correctly and wrecking the line
wrap.

>Perhaps you can help. I have three computers and they are attached
>to a router. Do they all have the same IP address? If someone
>hooked onto my wireless system would they have the same IP address?

I think it's (thread) still at the, you are asking about stoping somone
using the wireless connection.

A couple of links reposted in 24HSHD every so often,
http://netsecurity.about.com/cs/wire...aa112203_2.htm
http://compnetworking.about.com/od/w...fisecurity.htm

Most wireless routers should allow you to enter the MAC address (1)
http://www.webopedia.com/TERM/M/MAC.html
of systems to allow, with a check box deny all others.

You (generally) find the MAC address on a WIndows OS PC from the command
prompt with the command

ipconfig/all

There is a line, under the adapter type

Physical Address. . . . . . . . . : 00-0E-0C-9C-6E-FB

[ sometimes format may be different for different vendors, alternatives
are 00:0E:0C:9C:6E:FB , 000E0C9C6EFB or 000E.0C9C.6EFB ]

Do this for each wireless PC and set your addresses to allow only those
over the wireless connection. Of course you should also take simple
precautions like using a non default SSID, not broadcasting the SSID a
lot of routers this is a default. Turning on encryption and using a key
only known to you.

My Belkin wireless router will also display active leases, hostname and
MAC address, as mentioned you get IP addresses 192.168.0.2, 0.3 etc. If
1 of those showed up as a MAC that wan't mine I would know.

The other thing I did was to change the router DCHP pool from the
default (whatever it was 100 addresses) to 2 , i.e. 192.168.0.2 and 0.3,
the other PCs are all wired and set manually to fixed address
192.168.0.10 and above.

This means the pool of DHCP for wired / wireless connections is only 2
addresses. That on it's own is easier to manage.

A few other features of the belkin are

Setting access times via IP addresses, and port. It would allow 1 to
block port 80 web browsing but allow mail to work.

I bought an access point, disabled all wireless clients from connecting.
This means insted of -

wireless laptop - router

I have to do

mobile laptop - (hardwired) access point - router
or
wireless laptop - bridge mode access point - router

The router is set to only allow the access point via it's MAC address.
The pain of this was the initial extra power and configuring 2 wireless
devices and extra connection for the AP. It does work.


1 setting the Belkin doesn't have is the ability to redice the power
levels to cut down the range, this may help as well.

>Thanks in advance
>
>Luke
>

Me

On 2007-08-19, Luke O'Malley <> wrote:
> On 2007-08-18, Whiskers <> wrote:
>> On 2007-08-18, Luke O'Malley <> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi
>>>
>>> Perhaps you can help. I have three computers and they are attached
>>> to a router. Do they all have the same IP address? If someone
>>> hooked onto my wireless system would they have the same IP address?
>>>
>>> Thanks in advance
>>>
>>> Luke
>>
>> The public IP number of the internet connection from which you
>> posted your
>> article is 67.80.251.169 and anyone using the internet from that
>> connection will have the same public IP number. If there is more
>> than one
>> machine on your local network, then your router will allocate a
>> local IP
>> number (probably 192.168.x.y where x and y are numbers between 0 and
>> 254)
>> to each one (and one to itself too) and your router will take care of
>> sorting out which incoming stuff from the internet is meant for
>> which local
>> computer.
>
> Thank you for your reply. It clears up my question partially. If
> some one was trying to detect which of these computers was
> downloading, would it be possible? (I think I have a neighbor using
> my connection!)

Look for ethernet cables that connect to your router but don't lead to one
of the computers you want to have using your internet connection.

If your router has a 'wireless' facility, turn it off if you aren't using
it yourself. If you want to use the wireless facility yourself, then you
should use your router's "MAC filter" settings to prevent any computer
from getting a connection unless you have entered the MAC number of its
wireless network card into the list of permitted users. Also make sure
that you have changed the password for the router from the default it left
the factory with! It's safest to use an ethernet connection for the
computer you use to make such settings, especially as it seems that your
network is already 'compromised'.

Some routers offer additional security features for wireless access, such
as requiring a password from the user (or the machine) before any machine
can connect.

Please try to find the settings for your newsreader to

1) Quote correctly
2) include an attribution line
3) not include all the headers of the article being replied to
4) use plain text only, not 'multipart/mixed'

as your replies are very difficult to make sense of.

--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~

> The next question is how can I prevent someone from accessing my
> wireless router?
>

I missed that part.

You can follow some of the things in the link for what it's worth. It will
most likely stop the average Joe Blow home user a next door neighbor as an
example from accessing your wireless network.

http://compnetworking.about.com/od/w...fisecurity.htm

But someone with some expertise was coming after your wireless, then it may
not stop he or she, and the measures are just a bumps in the road he or she
ran over.

The other thing you can do if the router you have can produce logs and you
can use something like Wallwatcher is review the logs to see traffic leaving
your router by LAN IP and what remote IP(s) WAN/IP(s) the machines are
connecting to.

You should know all the LAN IP(s) your machines are using, and if you see an
IP other than the IP(s) for your machines in the logs, then you'll know
someone is on your wireless LAN using it, at least you'll see the activity.

http://sonic.net/wallwatcher/

On Sun, 19 Aug 2007 01:11:20 GMT, Luke O'Malley
<> wrote:

>Thank you for your reply. It clears up my question partially. How
>would I go about determining if one of my neighbors is using my
>internet connection. I received a notice to stop downloading a file
>I was not downloading, and Universal wants me to contact them to
>indicated that the problem has been solved. I would think that they
>would have been able to determine which neighbor it might be. What
>do you think?
>
Make sure your router is secure.
If you are still worried someone has access to your connection then
try a scan. This stuff is free and should show all connections to your
router
http://www.radmin.com/products/utilities/ipscanner.php

Luke O'Malley wrote:

> Thank you for such a thorough and thoughtful reply.

Get a good look, because I'm getting ready to killfile your posts so
that you will become invisible. The way you are still posting is
completely unacceptable. I asked you to stop it but you ignored that
request. If you post that way anymore, you won't be getting any replies
from me, and probably a lot of other people will ignore you as well, if
they aren't already.

> I don't usually post questions with this reader. I was totally
unaware of what other people were seeing.

After you were informed, you should have immediately ceased, but you
didn't.

> I did find a setting that let me eliminate headers, but someone
suggested a bunch more that could
not find.

Then why did you continue to post like that?

> I suppose I should use Outlook Express for questions.

If OE is the only newsreader you know how to use correctly, then that's
the one you should use.


--
Mike Easter