70-292 & 70-296 Woes

Hi all,

Failed both these by less than 75 today, so feeling pretty down. Wished I'd
looked harder at Google beforehand, seems lots of people with similar
background to me have been having a tough time with these.... Stupid thing
is I didn't find them too terrible - I have agonised longer over some of the
exams I took for my NT4 MCSE than I did with these (and that's not to say I
went in there expecting to pass).

Anyway, not looking for sympathy as such (although feel free to commiserate
;-> ), but I am looking for some further study tips. I used the Exam Cram
books (and was getting 90% on all the test sections....), but would be
interested in recommendations/advice from those who've passed these exams
and thought their study stuff made a good contribution to their success.

Oh, and isn't it annoying how you don't get to see your weak bits anymore??
Like I have weeks free to go over it all again

TIA,

Rich.

Richard Harris

You don't mention how much hands on you have with Windows 2003.

For me I found that the MS Press book for 70-292/70-296 was very good to
supplement my hands on with Windows 2003. The book has a number of good labs
to follow. Also I read the security book for 70-299 as the Windows 2003
exams focus much more on security and all the pertinent chapters in the free
downloadable Windows 2003 Server Deployment Kit available at the link below.

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsserv...deploykit.mspx

Having said that I had been using Windows 2003 extensively in my home lab
for at least six months before I took 70-292/79-296. I spent enough time
with each objective to be very comfortable with them an learned a lot from
troubleshooting and fixing my failed configurations. I can not emphasize
enough how important it is to know the intricacies of dns, all types of
trusts, Group Policy, Software Installation, security policy,
authentication, domain/forest functional levels, integration with Windows
2000/NT4.0, etc.

Dns in particular is a huge topic and in Windows 2003 the possibilities are
almost endless - conditional forwarding, AD partitions, secondary zones,
stub zones, integrating with Bind, zone transfers, AD replication, secure
updates, troubleshooting tools, DHCP's role, root hints, internet name
resolution, etc. One needs to know how to and has experience creating a
Windows 2000 and Windows 2003 forest with child domains, configure external
and forest trusts, and insure that all computers in all forests can resolve
dns names of computers in all forests that are connected via trusts. Until
one has done such and lived through the headaches and failures they do not
appreciate the complexity of such dns configuration and the best way to do
it for the parameters given.

Good luck on your second try. --- Steve


"Richard Harris" <> wrote in message
news:...
> Hi all,
>
> Failed both these by less than 75 today, so feeling pretty down. Wished
> I'd looked harder at Google beforehand, seems lots of people with similar
> background to me have been having a tough time with these.... Stupid thing
> is I didn't find them too terrible - I have agonised longer over some of
> the exams I took for my NT4 MCSE than I did with these (and that's not to
> say I went in there expecting to pass).
>
> Anyway, not looking for sympathy as such (although feel free to
> commiserate ;-> ), but I am looking for some further study tips. I used
> the Exam Cram books (and was getting 90% on all the test sections....),
> but would be interested in recommendations/advice from those who've passed
> these exams and thought their study stuff made a good contribution to
> their success.
>
> Oh, and isn't it annoying how you don't get to see your weak bits
> anymore?? Like I have weeks free to go over it all again
>
> TIA,
>
> Rich.
>

Steven L Umbach

Steve,

Thanks for responding, and yes, I should've said how much I work with W2K3 -
doh!

OK, well, fiddled with it from beta/RC stage, then first real commercial
experience was a couple of SBS2003 installations (I know, I know.... ;->)
early 2004. Changed jobs in October 2004 and then into the stuff with a
vengeance ever since! I have done lots of consultancy/design study work for
clients, and currently I am working on a 2500 user/20 server NT4 migration
to a pristine domain using ADMT/ADC and containing a two-node Exchange 2003
cluster.

Being someone who believes in being able to put his money where his mouth is
(especially as clients are paying) I have put a reasonable amount of effort
and my own time into staying abreast of the product and its capabilites so
that I don't develop *tunnel vision*. I often try out things in a
four-virtual machine domain on my laptop.

I suppose I might have been lulled into a false sense of security becuase I
was getting 90% in all the section tests and high 70's% in the practice
exams in the books I have - guess I now need 100% in the sections and early
90's% in the practice exams!!!!

Cheers,

Rich.



"Steven L Umbach" <> wrote in message
news:%...
> You don't mention how much hands on you have with Windows 2003.
>
> For me I found that the MS Press book for 70-292/70-296 was very good to
> supplement my hands on with Windows 2003. The book has a number of good
> labs to follow. Also I read the security book for 70-299 as the Windows
> 2003 exams focus much more on security and all the pertinent chapters in
> the free downloadable Windows 2003 Server Deployment Kit available at the
> link below.
>
> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsserv...deploykit.mspx
>
> Having said that I had been using Windows 2003 extensively in my home lab
> for at least six months before I took 70-292/79-296. I spent enough time
> with each objective to be very comfortable with them an learned a lot from
> troubleshooting and fixing my failed configurations. I can not emphasize
> enough how important it is to know the intricacies of dns, all types of
> trusts, Group Policy, Software Installation, security policy,
> authentication, domain/forest functional levels, integration with Windows
> 2000/NT4.0, etc.
>
> Dns in particular is a huge topic and in Windows 2003 the possibilities
> are almost endless - conditional forwarding, AD partitions, secondary
> zones, stub zones, integrating with Bind, zone transfers, AD replication,
> secure updates, troubleshooting tools, DHCP's role, root hints, internet
> name resolution, etc. One needs to know how to and has experience creating
> a Windows 2000 and Windows 2003 forest with child domains, configure
> external and forest trusts, and insure that all computers in all forests
> can resolve dns names of computers in all forests that are connected via
> trusts. Until one has done such and lived through the headaches and
> failures they do not appreciate the complexity of such dns configuration
> and the best way to do it for the parameters given.
>
> Good luck on your second try. --- Steve
>
>
> "Richard Harris" <> wrote in message
> news:...
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Failed both these by less than 75 today, so feeling pretty down. Wished
>> I'd looked harder at Google beforehand, seems lots of people with similar
>> background to me have been having a tough time with these.... Stupid
>> thing is I didn't find them too terrible - I have agonised longer over
>> some of the exams I took for my NT4 MCSE than I did with these (and
>> that's not to say I went in there expecting to pass).
>>
>> Anyway, not looking for sympathy as such (although feel free to
>> commiserate ;-> ), but I am looking for some further study tips. I used
>> the Exam Cram books (and was getting 90% on all the test sections....),
>> but would be interested in recommendations/advice from those who've
>> passed these exams and thought their study stuff made a good contribution
>> to their success.
>>
>> Oh, and isn't it annoying how you don't get to see your weak bits
>> anymore?? Like I have weeks free to go over it all again
>>
>> TIA,
>>
>> Rich.
>>
>
>

Richard Harris

Well it certainly sounds like you are very familiar with Windows 2003 and
Active directory! However the exams sometimes focus on situations that you
probably would never see in the real world and you need to be prepared for
such. Like I said be sure to concentrate on everything dns for every
possible scenario. Unless you have a real long drive to a test center I
would not take both exams on the same day and cram on the objectives for
each specific exam before taking them. The Exam Cram books are so so in my
opinion and not meant to be the main study guide no matter what your
experience level. The MS Press book comes with Measure UP tests that I
thought were pretty good. If you time it right you could take advantage of
the free retakes if you fail again. I hope you don't but that certainly cuts
down on the financial pain. I found the following links helpful though I
took the "old" 70-292. --- Steve

http://mcpmag.com/reviews/exams/arti...itorialsID=105
http://www.mcpmag.com/reviews/exams/...itorialsID=106

"Richard Harris" <> wrote in message
news:...
> Steve,
>
> Thanks for responding, and yes, I should've said how much I work with
> W2K3 - doh!
>
> OK, well, fiddled with it from beta/RC stage, then first real commercial
> experience was a couple of SBS2003 installations (I know, I know.... ;->)
> early 2004. Changed jobs in October 2004 and then into the stuff with a
> vengeance ever since! I have done lots of consultancy/design study work
> for clients, and currently I am working on a 2500 user/20 server NT4
> migration to a pristine domain using ADMT/ADC and containing a two-node
> Exchange 2003 cluster.
>
> Being someone who believes in being able to put his money where his mouth
> is (especially as clients are paying) I have put a reasonable amount of
> effort and my own time into staying abreast of the product and its
> capabilites so that I don't develop *tunnel vision*. I often try out
> things in a four-virtual machine domain on my laptop.
>
> I suppose I might have been lulled into a false sense of security becuase
> I was getting 90% in all the section tests and high 70's% in the practice
> exams in the books I have - guess I now need 100% in the sections and
> early 90's% in the practice exams!!!!
>
> Cheers,
>
> Rich.
>
>
>
> "Steven L Umbach" <> wrote in message
> news:%...
>> You don't mention how much hands on you have with Windows 2003.
>>
>> For me I found that the MS Press book for 70-292/70-296 was very good to
>> supplement my hands on with Windows 2003. The book has a number of good
>> labs to follow. Also I read the security book for 70-299 as the Windows
>> 2003 exams focus much more on security and all the pertinent chapters in
>> the free downloadable Windows 2003 Server Deployment Kit available at the
>> link below.
>>
>> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsserv...deploykit.mspx
>>
>> Having said that I had been using Windows 2003 extensively in my home lab
>> for at least six months before I took 70-292/79-296. I spent enough time
>> with each objective to be very comfortable with them an learned a lot
>> from troubleshooting and fixing my failed configurations. I can not
>> emphasize enough how important it is to know the intricacies of dns, all
>> types of trusts, Group Policy, Software Installation, security policy,
>> authentication, domain/forest functional levels, integration with Windows
>> 2000/NT4.0, etc.
>>
>> Dns in particular is a huge topic and in Windows 2003 the possibilities
>> are almost endless - conditional forwarding, AD partitions, secondary
>> zones, stub zones, integrating with Bind, zone transfers, AD replication,
>> secure updates, troubleshooting tools, DHCP's role, root hints, internet
>> name resolution, etc. One needs to know how to and has experience
>> creating a Windows 2000 and Windows 2003 forest with child domains,
>> configure external and forest trusts, and insure that all computers in
>> all forests can resolve dns names of computers in all forests that are
>> connected via trusts. Until one has done such and lived through the
>> headaches and failures they do not appreciate the complexity of such dns
>> configuration and the best way to do it for the parameters given.
>>
>> Good luck on your second try. --- Steve
>>
>>
>> "Richard Harris" <> wrote in message
>> news:...
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> Failed both these by less than 75 today, so feeling pretty down. Wished
>>> I'd looked harder at Google beforehand, seems lots of people with
>>> similar background to me have been having a tough time with these....
>>> Stupid thing is I didn't find them too terrible - I have agonised longer
>>> over some of the exams I took for my NT4 MCSE than I did with these (and
>>> that's not to say I went in there expecting to pass).
>>>
>>> Anyway, not looking for sympathy as such (although feel free to
>>> commiserate ;-> ), but I am looking for some further study tips. I used
>>> the Exam Cram books (and was getting 90% on all the test sections....),
>>> but would be interested in recommendations/advice from those who've
>>> passed these exams and thought their study stuff made a good
>>> contribution to their success.
>>>
>>> Oh, and isn't it annoying how you don't get to see your weak bits
>>> anymore?? Like I have weeks free to go over it all again
>>>
>>> TIA,
>>>
>>> Rich.
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

Steven L Umbach

Hi Richard
Here's a little platitude I spout when people fail...

I keep seeing people saying "I failed 070-xxx" and like them I *hate*
to fail. I failed my first exam in six years on the 2003 track so even
old hands come unstuck once in a while.

The truth hurts and I had to go back and look at what I did when I was
passing exams and start doing it again. Here are my recommendations:

Testkings are not the way to get through the exam. What I propose here
will help you not only get this one but all the other exams you want
to pass in the future.

Here's a step by step to ensure that you pass:

Step-by-step




1. Improve your study techniques and find a style that ensures you
remember the maximum of everything you read / do / memorize.

I recommend getting Colin Rose and Brian Tracy's Accellerated Learning
as a starting point. It gets posted on usenet every so often but if
like me you get benefit from it you could even buy it over the
internet for $60 or so.

Here's the 7 Audio CD set with workbook (not the $10 promo tape)
http://www.briantracy.com/catalog/pr...1&CategoryID=7

Be warned this may take you a couple of weekends to master - but the
investment in time means greater retention means better chance to
pass... You get out what you put in.




2. Put in the hours.

I appreciate this sounds trite (its not meant to). I spend on average
about 40-60 hours on home study before each exam using techniques I
picked from 1. above that suit my learning preferences. Some people
can clear exams much quicker - I am a slow reader.

3. Download the exam outline from Microsoft's Learning Web Site.

You can get them from links like this:
http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mc...spx?orderby=ID

Click here for list of MS exams and objectives this will give you
areas to ensure that you focus on.




4. Allow for cross-syllabus questions.

As the exam numbers rise on the 2000 and 2003 track you will be
expected to be able to answer questions on partner exams as well as
exams preceding the one you are taking. For example, before you take
290 make sure that you have also studied the material for 291 and dont
forget the 290 material when you take 291.

When you take 293 make sure you remind yourself of the 290 and 291
materials as well as making sure you've studied 294 before you take
293. When taking 294 make sure you remind yourself of 290, 291 and
293. For 297 make sure you do more than revise the preceding four
exams - look to step 5 as well. MS like to check you know the breadth.




5. Ensure that you "over-learn".

Dont just do the minimum study to get through, over learning makes you
faster in the exam as well as more confident. A really great
over-learning source is the freely downloadable resource guides from
MS.

Comment on other peoples' questions on the forum.
QUOTE (Froggie114 @ Jan 15 2005, 08:42 PM)
.... by researching and trying to answer questions posted by other
members. ... You wouldn't believe how much I have learned this way


Click here for links to all MS 2003 Server Resource Guide Downloads
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsserv...deploykit.mspx

For all your exams look up all the areas on the exam syllabus and scan
the relevant files you downloaded from above. The most important of
all these is


http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=4719 Designing and Deploying
Directory and Security Services






6. Practice your exam technique.

Reading the question that is there. For example when you read the
question emphasise the word "not" so you register it as you read.

Identify the right and wrong answers. If a question asks you which of
the following is true, be sure before you answer and move on that all
the other options other than the one you chose are untrue.

Choose from likely candidates. If you have a multiple select identifiy
and eliminate any item that is just noise or a filler before selecting
your choices from the remaining answers.

Identify what will be asked before you read the body of the question.
This is easier than it sounds, reading the answers first then the body
of the question will focus your mind on finding the right answer.

Read the last sentence (the one with the question mark).

QUOTE (Froggie114 @ Jan 15 2005, 08:41 PM)
.... I read the last sentence of the question (the one that usually has
a question mark at the end), then all the answers. Out of four
answers, there usually are two that would make you laugh ... After I
mentally strike those two out, I go back to the actual text of the
question, and read it throughly to find out which one of the two I
have left is the right one....

If there are more, or there are multiple possible answers, they
usually combine to form a couple of different scenarios. So I group
them in my mind, and I go back to the question, and read it thoroughly
to find out which of the possible scenarios is stated there.
....





7. Use the "free resources" such as technet support webcasts.

go to
http://www.google.com/microsoft

and query for "webcast" and the name of your topic such as "webcast"
"2003" "zone delegation" "DNS"

It is my opinion that MS invest a lot in webcasts to explain their
technologies and as such ignoring them (especially as they are free)
is a recipe for failure. You can download many old webcasts or stream
them over dial up if that is all you have.

either way - free resources.

As an aside I wonder if it would be possible just on the free
materials MS post on their website to pass any microsoft exam ? My
guess is yes!









This is a guaranteed recipe for success (not only in the exam but in
the technical interviews that follow as you progress up the career
ladder).

I hope you choose items 1-7 - but whichever route you take, good luck!






On Thu, 7 Jul 2005 20:45:46 +0100, "Richard Harris"
<> wrote:

>Hi all,
>
>Failed both these by less than 75 today, so feeling pretty down. Wished I'd
>looked harder at Google beforehand, seems lots of people with similar
>background to me have been having a tough time with these.... Stupid thing
>is I didn't find them too terrible - I have agonised longer over some of the
>exams I took for my NT4 MCSE than I did with these (and that's not to say I
>went in there expecting to pass).
>
>Anyway, not looking for sympathy as such (although feel free to commiserate
>;-> ), but I am looking for some further study tips. I used the Exam Cram
>books (and was getting 90% on all the test sections....), but would be
>interested in recommendations/advice from those who've passed these exams
>and thought their study stuff made a good contribution to their success.
>
>Oh, and isn't it annoying how you don't get to see your weak bits anymore??
>Like I have weeks free to go over it all again
>
>TIA,
>
>Rich.
>

+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_ +_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_ +_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_
Sergeant Hartwell Says:
You will not say a word! You will not speak unless spoken to! Do you ladies understand me?
(Sir! Yes! Sir!).
From this point forward you will eat, think and dream Windows Server 2003! Do you maggots understand?
(Sir! Yes! Sir!)
We are in a war, Gentlemen! The future of the free world depends on you people becoming Microsoft certified! You each will become a MCSE! Every time you see a router that isnt RRAS you will kill it! What are you going to do ladies?
(Kill! Kill! Kill!).
+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_ +_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_ +_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_

Marlin Munroe (The PFY)

Ya know, I usually just make obnoxious comments here and there, sprinkle in
a little overblown opinion and the like.

But I actually have to simply say that this was a pretty darn good comment,
full of useful insights and suggestions.

wow...<g>

--
RL (speachless) Coppedge, MCSE/MCDBA/MCT
NorthEast Ohio
www.RLCoppedge.com
RLCoppedge <around> hotmail <not dash, but...> com

"Marlin Munroe (The PFY)" <> wrote in message
news:...
> Hi Richard
> Here's a little platitude I spout when people fail...
>
> I keep seeing people saying "I failed 070-xxx" and like them I *hate*
> to fail. I failed my first exam in six years on the 2003 track so even
> old hands come unstuck once in a while.
>
> The truth hurts and I had to go back and look at what I did when I was
> passing exams and start doing it again. Here are my recommendations:
>
> Testkings are not the way to get through the exam. What I propose here
> will help you not only get this one but all the other exams you want
> to pass in the future.
>
> Here's a step by step to ensure that you pass:
>
> Step-by-step
>
>
>
>
> 1. Improve your study techniques and find a style that ensures you
> remember the maximum of everything you read / do / memorize.
>
> I recommend getting Colin Rose and Brian Tracy's Accellerated Learning
> as a starting point. It gets posted on usenet every so often but if
> like me you get benefit from it you could even buy it over the
> internet for $60 or so.
>
> Here's the 7 Audio CD set with workbook (not the $10 promo tape)
> http://www.briantracy.com/catalog/pr...1&CategoryID=7
>
> Be warned this may take you a couple of weekends to master - but the
> investment in time means greater retention means better chance to
> pass... You get out what you put in.
>
>
>
>
> 2. Put in the hours.
>
> I appreciate this sounds trite (its not meant to). I spend on average
> about 40-60 hours on home study before each exam using techniques I
> picked from 1. above that suit my learning preferences. Some people
> can clear exams much quicker - I am a slow reader.
>
> 3. Download the exam outline from Microsoft's Learning Web Site.
>
> You can get them from links like this:
> http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mc...spx?orderby=ID
>
> Click here for list of MS exams and objectives this will give you
> areas to ensure that you focus on.
>
>
>
>
> 4. Allow for cross-syllabus questions.
>
> As the exam numbers rise on the 2000 and 2003 track you will be
> expected to be able to answer questions on partner exams as well as
> exams preceding the one you are taking. For example, before you take
> 290 make sure that you have also studied the material for 291 and dont
> forget the 290 material when you take 291.
>
> When you take 293 make sure you remind yourself of the 290 and 291
> materials as well as making sure you've studied 294 before you take
> 293. When taking 294 make sure you remind yourself of 290, 291 and
> 293. For 297 make sure you do more than revise the preceding four
> exams - look to step 5 as well. MS like to check you know the breadth.
>
>
>
>
> 5. Ensure that you "over-learn".
>
> Dont just do the minimum study to get through, over learning makes you
> faster in the exam as well as more confident. A really great
> over-learning source is the freely downloadable resource guides from
> MS.
>
> Comment on other peoples' questions on the forum.
> QUOTE (Froggie114 @ Jan 15 2005, 08:42 PM)
> ... by researching and trying to answer questions posted by other
> members. ... You wouldn't believe how much I have learned this way
>
>
> Click here for links to all MS 2003 Server Resource Guide Downloads
> http://www.microsoft.com/windowsserv...deploykit.mspx
>
> For all your exams look up all the areas on the exam syllabus and scan
> the relevant files you downloaded from above. The most important of
> all these is
>
>
> http://go.microsoft.com/fwlink/?LinkId=4719 Designing and Deploying
> Directory and Security Services
>
>
>
>
>
>
> 6. Practice your exam technique.
>
> Reading the question that is there. For example when you read the
> question emphasise the word "not" so you register it as you read.
>
> Identify the right and wrong answers. If a question asks you which of
> the following is true, be sure before you answer and move on that all
> the other options other than the one you chose are untrue.
>
> Choose from likely candidates. If you have a multiple select identifiy
> and eliminate any item that is just noise or a filler before selecting
> your choices from the remaining answers.
>
> Identify what will be asked before you read the body of the question.
> This is easier than it sounds, reading the answers first then the body
> of the question will focus your mind on finding the right answer.
>
> Read the last sentence (the one with the question mark).
>
> QUOTE (Froggie114 @ Jan 15 2005, 08:41 PM)
> ... I read the last sentence of the question (the one that usually has
> a question mark at the end), then all the answers. Out of four
> answers, there usually are two that would make you laugh ... After I
> mentally strike those two out, I go back to the actual text of the
> question, and read it throughly to find out which one of the two I
> have left is the right one....
>
> If there are more, or there are multiple possible answers, they
> usually combine to form a couple of different scenarios. So I group
> them in my mind, and I go back to the question, and read it thoroughly
> to find out which of the possible scenarios is stated there.
> ...
>
>
>
>
>
> 7. Use the "free resources" such as technet support webcasts.
>
> go to
> http://www.google.com/microsoft
>
> and query for "webcast" and the name of your topic such as "webcast"
> "2003" "zone delegation" "DNS"
>
> It is my opinion that MS invest a lot in webcasts to explain their
> technologies and as such ignoring them (especially as they are free)
> is a recipe for failure. You can download many old webcasts or stream
> them over dial up if that is all you have.
>
> either way - free resources.
>
> As an aside I wonder if it would be possible just on the free
> materials MS post on their website to pass any microsoft exam ? My
> guess is yes!
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> This is a guaranteed recipe for success (not only in the exam but in
> the technical interviews that follow as you progress up the career
> ladder).
>
> I hope you choose items 1-7 - but whichever route you take, good luck!
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, 7 Jul 2005 20:45:46 +0100, "Richard Harris"
> <> wrote:
>
>>Hi all,
>>
>>Failed both these by less than 75 today, so feeling pretty down. Wished
>>I'd
>>looked harder at Google beforehand, seems lots of people with similar
>>background to me have been having a tough time with these.... Stupid thing
>>is I didn't find them too terrible - I have agonised longer over some of
>>the
>>exams I took for my NT4 MCSE than I did with these (and that's not to say
>>I
>>went in there expecting to pass).
>>
>>Anyway, not looking for sympathy as such (although feel free to
>>commiserate
>>;-> ), but I am looking for some further study tips. I used the Exam Cram
>>books (and was getting 90% on all the test sections....), but would be
>>interested in recommendations/advice from those who've passed these exams
>>and thought their study stuff made a good contribution to their success.
>>
>>Oh, and isn't it annoying how you don't get to see your weak bits
>>anymore??
>>Like I have weeks free to go over it all again
>>
>>TIA,
>>
>>Rich.
>>
>
> +_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_ +_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_ +_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_
> Sergeant Hartwell Says:
> You will not say a word! You will not speak unless spoken to! Do you
> ladies understand me?
> (Sir! Yes! Sir!).
> From this point forward you will eat, think and dream Windows Server 2003!
> Do you maggots understand?
> (Sir! Yes! Sir!)
> We are in a war, Gentlemen! The future of the free world depends on you
> people becoming Microsoft certified! You each will become a MCSE! Every
> time you see a router that isnt RRAS you will kill it! What are you going
> to do ladies?
> (Kill! Kill! Kill!).
> +_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_ +_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_ +_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_

RL \(Bob\) Coppedge, MCSE/MCDBA/MCT

"RL (Bob) Coppedge, MCSE/MCDBA/MCT" <RLCoppedge around hotmail not-dash-but
com> wrote in message news:0uCdnbqD2NKIPEzfRVn-...
> Ya know, I usually just make obnoxious comments here and there, sprinkle
> in a little overblown opinion and the like.
>
> But I actually have to simply say that this was a pretty darn good
> comment, full of useful insights and suggestions.
>
> wow...<g>

Seconded. Marlin, keep that posting handy and re-post it every once in a
while. You never know, the less clueless might actually read it and benefit
from it.

Frisbee®

On Mon, 11 Jul 2005 08:45:05 -0400, "Frisbee®"
<> wrote:

>"RL (Bob) Coppedge, MCSE/MCDBA/MCT" <RLCoppedge around hotmail not-dash-but
>com> wrote in message news:0uCdnbqD2NKIPEzfRVn-...
>> Ya know, I usually just make obnoxious comments here and there, sprinkle
>> in a little overblown opinion and the like.
>>
>> But I actually have to simply say that this was a pretty darn good
>> comment, full of useful insights and suggestions.
>>
>> wow...<g>
>
>Seconded. Marlin, keep that posting handy and re-post it every once in a
>while. You never know, the less clueless might actually read it and benefit
>from it.
>

Fris
a compliment like that is as worthy as a flame from Sven (for those of
us that still remember his gentle charms) or the original Consultant®.

Cheers
just tryin' to make a difference my own way
Cheers
Marlin


+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_ +_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_ +_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_
Sergeant Hartwell Says:
You will not say a word! You will not speak unless spoken to! Do you ladies understand me?
(Sir! Yes! Sir!).
From this point forward you will eat, think and dream Windows Server 2003! Do you maggots understand?
(Sir! Yes! Sir!)
We are in a war, Gentlemen! The future of the free world depends on you people becoming Microsoft certified! You each will become a MCSE! Every time you see a router that isnt RRAS you will kill it! What are you going to do ladies?
(Kill! Kill! Kill!).
+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_ +_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_ +_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_+_

Marlin Munroe (The PFY)

On Thu, 7 Jul 2005 20:45:46 +0100, "Richard Harris"
<> wrote:

>Hi all,
>
>Failed both these by less than 75 today, so feeling pretty down. Wished I'd
>looked harder at Google beforehand, seems lots of people with similar
>background to me have been having a tough time with these.... Stupid thing
>is I didn't find them too terrible - I have agonised longer over some of the
>exams I took for my NT4 MCSE than I did with these (and that's not to say I
>went in there expecting to pass).
>
>Anyway, not looking for sympathy as such (although feel free to commiserate
>;-> ), but I am looking for some further study tips. I used the Exam Cram
>books (and was getting 90% on all the test sections....), but would be
>interested in recommendations/advice from those who've passed these exams
>and thought their study stuff made a good contribution to their success.
>
>Oh, and isn't it annoying how you don't get to see your weak bits anymore??
>Like I have weeks free to go over it all again
>
>TIA,
>
>Rich.
>

Did you have equipment problems during the exam ? I'd be happy if I
could take the exam witrhout the exam freezing up between questions
(on one occassion for up to 10 minutes) or crashing.

My background:

I am MCSE on NT and W2K, have worked with Windows NT since
version 3.51, and have worked in the industry for over 15
years. I have been working with Windows 2003 (deploying and
supporting) for over a year. I have extensive clustering
experience (both 03 and W2K).

I have taken the exam TWICE and have failed both times with a score of
650. On the results sheet, can some explain the "areas I need to
improve section" to me ? Even though I got the same score, on the
second exam results sheet, I had several bars all the way to the right
(100%) (with the other bars at 75% or more). It was DIFFERENT than
the first exam results. (which one area was all the way to the right
(100%), and the others were 75% or more). Go figure !

Each time I took the exams, I had equipment problems- once I had
freeze ups (continuosly) and the other, the exam actually crashed (3
times). There is nothing like seeing "Application is Terminating"
while trying to answer a question (especially a simulation question).
As a reult, I have scoring concerns (wouldn't you?). When I completed
each exam, I actually thought I had passed both times. The second
time around I know I missed two question, and I am fairly sure they
were the only ones I missed (I know the product that well, as I have
been studying for this exam for the past 2 months).

I took MS 2297A back in December (what a waste of time). I also
purchased the Sybex upgrade book (and read the entire thing, in terms
of prepartion- it was worthless to me). I am making a 3rd attempt
next week. To prepare, I bought additional study material from
preplogic. I am close to aceing the sample tests- hopefully this will
help me pass. My goal was to expose myself to as much obscure
material as possible- so far it's working- this material is very
obscure.

Each time I took the exam, it seemed as if it was heavily weighted in
one area or another- for instance the first time it was almost all DNS
questions - no kidding, about 75%, which was riduculous in my opinion.
The second time was almost entirely Terminal Services/RDP questions,
but it was a *little* more balanced.

I really wished I had followed the same path as one of my colleagues-
he took both the exams last year, a week after they came out. He said
70-292 was a joke, as he completed it in 15 minutes. He also said
70-296 was a little more diffcult. As for 70-292 being easy, this is
no longer the case for sure.

I have read about many folks with failures on this exam (since
December that is). In fact, I have read about several W2K MCT's that
have failed several times (including one that took 70-292 4 times
before he passed it). What I do not understand is very simple- if
Microsoft really wants to certify the cream fo the crop (and that is
all), why not give a hands on exam (for example- break a server
solution and expect someone to figure out what is wrong, and fix it
within a certain time period). I'd much prefer this than being
quizzed on scenerios that I will NEVER encounter, or over material
that I would look up anyway ? After all, can some be expected to
memorize the switches for every command available in the OS ? Isn't
that what the '/?' parameter is for anyway ?

Oh I forgot - the main obective here- it's money- right ?
The more folks they fail, the more money they collect on training
material and exam retakes- right ?

I'm sorry to sound so pessimistic, but I am very disgusted after this
experience. After all, in my past MS exam experiences, I only failed
1 exam. (70-240 does not count- that was also ridculous- I failed that
because I was hungry and exhausted, as 4.5 hours is a long time for a
test- but that's another story- and it wasn't like I did not know the
material- I took the 4 individual exams within two weeks of that
horror story and did very well... including a perfect score on the
server exam- go figure !)

Wish me luck. I have actually pondered hanging it up after this last
attempt, after all I don't need the stress (nor the certification for
my job, as I have years of experience). Perhaps, I should consider
the Linux road long term (maybe a Redhat Cert) ?

Roeking,

MCSE on NT and Windows 2000.

ROEKing

On Thu, 25 Aug 2005 21:29:36 -0400, ROEKing <>
wrote:

>On Thu, 7 Jul 2005 20:45:46 +0100, "Richard Harris"
><> wrote:
>
>>Hi all,
>>
>>Failed both these by less than 75 today, so feeling pretty down. Wished I'd
>>looked harder at Google beforehand, seems lots of people with similar
>>background to me have been having a tough time with these.... Stupid thing
>>is I didn't find them too terrible - I have agonised longer over some of the
>>exams I took for my NT4 MCSE than I did with these (and that's not to say I
>>went in there expecting to pass).
>>
>>Anyway, not looking for sympathy as such (although feel free to commiserate
>>;-> ), but I am looking for some further study tips. I used the Exam Cram
>>books (and was getting 90% on all the test sections....), but would be
>>interested in recommendations/advice from those who've passed these exams
>>and thought their study stuff made a good contribution to their success.
>>
>>Oh, and isn't it annoying how you don't get to see your weak bits anymore??
>>Like I have weeks free to go over it all again
>>
>>TIA,
>>
>>Rich.
>>
>
>Did you have equipment problems during the exam ? I'd be happy if I
>could take the exam witrhout the exam freezing up between questions
>(on one occassion for up to 10 minutes) or crashing.
>
>My background:
>
> I am MCSE on NT and W2K, have worked with Windows NT since
> version 3.51, and have worked in the industry for over 15
> years. I have been working with Windows 2003 (deploying and
> supporting) for over a year. I have extensive clustering
> experience (both 03 and W2K).
>
>I have taken the exam TWICE and have failed both times with a score of
>650. On the results sheet, can some explain the "areas I need to
>improve section" to me ? Even though I got the same score, on the
>second exam results sheet, I had several bars all the way to the right
>(100%) (with the other bars at 75% or more). It was DIFFERENT than
>the first exam results. (which one area was all the way to the right
>(100%), and the others were 75% or more). Go figure !
>
>Each time I took the exams, I had equipment problems- once I had
>freeze ups (continuosly) and the other, the exam actually crashed (3
>times). There is nothing like seeing "Application is Terminating"
>while trying to answer a question (especially a simulation question).
>As a reult, I have scoring concerns (wouldn't you?). When I completed
>each exam, I actually thought I had passed both times. The second
>time around I know I missed two question, and I am fairly sure they
>were the only ones I missed (I know the product that well, as I have
>been studying for this exam for the past 2 months).
>
>I took MS 2297A back in December (what a waste of time). I also
>purchased the Sybex upgrade book (and read the entire thing, in terms
>of prepartion- it was worthless to me). I am making a 3rd attempt
>next week. To prepare, I bought additional study material from
>preplogic. I am close to aceing the sample tests- hopefully this will
>help me pass. My goal was to expose myself to as much obscure
>material as possible- so far it's working- this material is very
>obscure.
>
>Each time I took the exam, it seemed as if it was heavily weighted in
>one area or another- for instance the first time it was almost all DNS
>questions - no kidding, about 75%, which was riduculous in my opinion.
>The second time was almost entirely Terminal Services/RDP questions,
>but it was a *little* more balanced.
>
>I really wished I had followed the same path as one of my colleagues-
>he took both the exams last year, a week after they came out. He said
>70-292 was a joke, as he completed it in 15 minutes. He also said
>70-296 was a little more diffcult. As for 70-292 being easy, this is
>no longer the case for sure.
>
>I have read about many folks with failures on this exam (since
>December that is). In fact, I have read about several W2K MCT's that
>have failed several times (including one that took 70-292 4 times
>before he passed it). What I do not understand is very simple- if
>Microsoft really wants to certify the cream fo the crop (and that is
>all), why not give a hands on exam (for example- break a server
>solution and expect someone to figure out what is wrong, and fix it
>within a certain time period). I'd much prefer this than being
>quizzed on scenerios that I will NEVER encounter, or over material
>that I would look up anyway ? After all, can some be expected to
>memorize the switches for every command available in the OS ? Isn't
>that what the '/?' parameter is for anyway ?
>
>Oh I forgot - the main obective here- it's money- right ?
>The more folks they fail, the more money they collect on training
>material and exam retakes- right ?
>
>I'm sorry to sound so pessimistic, but I am very disgusted after this
>experience. After all, in my past MS exam experiences, I only failed
>1 exam. (70-240 does not count- that was also ridculous- I failed that
>because I was hungry and exhausted, as 4.5 hours is a long time for a
>test- but that's another story- and it wasn't like I did not know the
>material- I took the 4 individual exams within two weeks of that
>horror story and did very well... including a perfect score on the
>server exam- go figure !)
>
>Wish me luck. I have actually pondered hanging it up after this last
>attempt, after all I don't need the stress (nor the certification for
>my job, as I have years of experience). Perhaps, I should consider
>the Linux road long term (maybe a Redhat Cert) ?
>
>Roeking,
>
>MCSE on NT and Windows 2000.


Well, so much for attempt #3.

For the life of me I am trying to figure out how you can get the SAME
EXACT SCORE 3 times (650). What I don't understand is when the bars
on the scoresheet are almost 100% (they are 100% in 3 areas), yet I
still failed.

Go figure.

Microsoft, YOU WIN.

I give up on 70-292. I will consider taking the 4 individual exams
next year ( I have no more time to do this right now). 70-292 is
absolutely ridiculous (there are questins that are quite frankly
absurd). To prepare for the latest attempt, I bought preplogic (what
a waste of time and money) and took the tests EVERY DAY FOR THE PAST
TWO WEEKS. Each time I took one of those exams, I get a score in the
900's. What a waste of time ! - I want my two weeks back !!!

Oh well... maybe next year. OR, maybe not, maybe Linux.

Roeking
MCSE on NT and Windows 2000. (and only NT & 2000 !)

ROEKing