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USB suddenly died, system started to freeze a lot

 
 
Indi
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-15-2007
I have Acer Travelmate 4052 laptop with Centrino 1.6 Ghz processor, I
took Hardisk from my PC to copy some data to my laptop and for that I
bought a 3.5 inch casing which came along with an adaptor. It went
well for a hour and copied some data but after that a message popup
saying POWER SURGE ON USB HUB and pulled the usb connector and
connector to the other remaing two ports alternatively but same
message. When I restarted my computer and try to connect as usual my
microsoft usb mouse, my system froze, nothing worked alt+crtl+del,
nothing, so restarted but same problem on other ports as well. I
reinstalled the USB controller but to no use, I updated the BIOS,
enable - disable USB legacy support and USB Mass Storage suporrt from
the BIOS but to no use. I tried to reinstall the same Winxp pro with
integrated SP2 which was earlier on the system but it froze too,
sometimes at intial copying of files after formating, sometimes at 34
min remaining screen, then at 9 min, and 5 min remaining to complete
the setup.

I consulted one very popular laptop repair shop and the technician
told me that it is a very common problem with computer and especially
laptops and your Intel 82801 DBM chip has to be replaced, there is no
alternative, and he was not sure whether it will be ok again, if not
he said then I have to replace the motherboard. As it was a costly
step, I tried many forum for help but to no avail. Nothing helped me
at all.

Finally, as I system as out of warranty and being a electronic
hobbiest myself, I took apart my laptop and tried something really
stupid. I placed my system in front of the airconditioner and
restarted the 39 min installation process and walla it did completed
successfully. Then I installed all the drivers successfully, I didnt
tried the USB at all that time but I noticed that my CPU was
constantly at 100% as the system was at IDLE state. I was sure about
any virus or malware as firstly after installing windows with SP2 i
updated the hotfixes and critical updates from AUTOPATCHER then
installed the Internet security suite then connected to internet to
update it, so I scanned and as expected nothing showed up. Then I
tried the SysInternal which is now owned by Microsoft, the Process
Explorer as no doubt the System was slow to 25% of its original speed,
I try to figure out by searching the running thread from Process
Explorer then I saw 4 threads which were taking all the CPU usage and
to no surprise these were USBPORT.SYS+0x5fe6 (ALL FOUR), when I try to
kill these threads, access was denied so I suspend them all and my cpu
immediately comes to actual idle state 2-5%.

I have not found any cure so far please help me. My system boots very
very slow then I have to wait for the desktop things to appear so that
I can open the Process Explorer to shut those USB threads and then I
can work.

Is it really the DBM chip fault which I read somewhere as Intel
SouthBridge 82801 DB ICH4-M. As I explained I tried everything so far
as I am a network engineer myself and electronic hobbiest so far
whatever I could, I tried but nothing. I even tried the PCMCIA usb
card, it did work once with mouse but didnt worked again. I asked the
same technician he said how can this PCMCIA card will work as it only
changes the Interface, controller on the motherboard still is the same
which has to work.

I tried to find the schematic so that I can check the voltages across
the MOBO but only could find the service manual that too for
Travelmate 290 which has identical motherboard.

Please please help me, I am sure that Google group can help me out
here.

INDI

 
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Pen
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-16-2007
Indi wrote:
> I have Acer Travelmate 4052 laptop with Centrino 1.6 Ghz processor, I
> took Hardisk from my PC to copy some data to my laptop and for that I
> bought a 3.5 inch casing which came along with an adaptor. It went
> well for a hour and copied some data but after that a message popup
> saying POWER SURGE ON USB HUB and pulled the usb connector and
> connector to the other remaing two ports alternatively but same
> message. When I restarted my computer and try to connect as usual my
> microsoft usb mouse, my system froze, nothing worked alt+crtl+del,
> nothing, so restarted but same problem on other ports as well. I
> reinstalled the USB controller but to no use, I updated the BIOS,
> enable - disable USB legacy support and USB Mass Storage suporrt from
> the BIOS but to no use. I tried to reinstall the same Winxp pro with
> integrated SP2 which was earlier on the system but it froze too,
> sometimes at intial copying of files after formating, sometimes at 34
> min remaining screen, then at 9 min, and 5 min remaining to complete
> the setup.
>
> I consulted one very popular laptop repair shop and the technician
> told me that it is a very common problem with computer and especially
> laptops and your Intel 82801 DBM chip has to be replaced, there is no
> alternative, and he was not sure whether it will be ok again, if not
> he said then I have to replace the motherboard. As it was a costly
> step, I tried many forum for help but to no avail. Nothing helped me
> at all.
>
> Finally, as I system as out of warranty and being a electronic
> hobbiest myself, I took apart my laptop and tried something really
> stupid. I placed my system in front of the airconditioner and
> restarted the 39 min installation process and walla it did completed
> successfully. Then I installed all the drivers successfully, I didnt
> tried the USB at all that time but I noticed that my CPU was
> constantly at 100% as the system was at IDLE state. I was sure about
> any virus or malware as firstly after installing windows with SP2 i
> updated the hotfixes and critical updates from AUTOPATCHER then
> installed the Internet security suite then connected to internet to
> update it, so I scanned and as expected nothing showed up. Then I
> tried the SysInternal which is now owned by Microsoft, the Process
> Explorer as no doubt the System was slow to 25% of its original speed,
> I try to figure out by searching the running thread from Process
> Explorer then I saw 4 threads which were taking all the CPU usage and
> to no surprise these were USBPORT.SYS+0x5fe6 (ALL FOUR), when I try to
> kill these threads, access was denied so I suspend them all and my cpu
> immediately comes to actual idle state 2-5%.
>
> I have not found any cure so far please help me. My system boots very
> very slow then I have to wait for the desktop things to appear so that
> I can open the Process Explorer to shut those USB threads and then I
> can work.
>
> Is it really the DBM chip fault which I read somewhere as Intel
> SouthBridge 82801 DB ICH4-M. As I explained I tried everything so far
> as I am a network engineer myself and electronic hobbiest so far
> whatever I could, I tried but nothing. I even tried the PCMCIA usb
> card, it did work once with mouse but didnt worked again. I asked the
> same technician he said how can this PCMCIA card will work as it only
> changes the Interface, controller on the motherboard still is the same
> which has to work.
>
> I tried to find the schematic so that I can check the voltages across
> the MOBO but only could find the service manual that too for
> Travelmate 290 which has identical motherboard.
>
> Please please help me, I am sure that Google group can help me out
> here.
>
> INDI
>

Why don't you believe the repairman? All the symptoms and the error
message certainly point to the USB controller. The only risk you take is
that the motherboard has a further problem.
 
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Paul
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-16-2007
Pen wrote:
> Indi wrote:
>> I have Acer Travelmate 4052 laptop with Centrino 1.6 Ghz processor, I
>> took Hardisk from my PC to copy some data to my laptop and for that I
>> bought a 3.5 inch casing which came along with an adaptor. It went
>> well for a hour and copied some data but after that a message popup
>> saying POWER SURGE ON USB HUB and pulled the usb connector and
>> connector to the other remaing two ports alternatively but same
>> message. When I restarted my computer and try to connect as usual my
>> microsoft usb mouse, my system froze, nothing worked alt+crtl+del,
>> nothing, so restarted but same problem on other ports as well. I
>> reinstalled the USB controller but to no use, I updated the BIOS,
>> enable - disable USB legacy support and USB Mass Storage suporrt from
>> the BIOS but to no use. I tried to reinstall the same Winxp pro with
>> integrated SP2 which was earlier on the system but it froze too,
>> sometimes at intial copying of files after formating, sometimes at 34
>> min remaining screen, then at 9 min, and 5 min remaining to complete
>> the setup.
>>
>> I consulted one very popular laptop repair shop and the technician
>> told me that it is a very common problem with computer and especially
>> laptops and your Intel 82801 DBM chip has to be replaced, there is no
>> alternative, and he was not sure whether it will be ok again, if not
>> he said then I have to replace the motherboard. As it was a costly
>> step, I tried many forum for help but to no avail. Nothing helped me
>> at all.
>>
>> Finally, as I system as out of warranty and being a electronic
>> hobbiest myself, I took apart my laptop and tried something really
>> stupid. I placed my system in front of the airconditioner and
>> restarted the 39 min installation process and walla it did completed
>> successfully. Then I installed all the drivers successfully, I didnt
>> tried the USB at all that time but I noticed that my CPU was
>> constantly at 100% as the system was at IDLE state. I was sure about
>> any virus or malware as firstly after installing windows with SP2 i
>> updated the hotfixes and critical updates from AUTOPATCHER then
>> installed the Internet security suite then connected to internet to
>> update it, so I scanned and as expected nothing showed up. Then I
>> tried the SysInternal which is now owned by Microsoft, the Process
>> Explorer as no doubt the System was slow to 25% of its original speed,
>> I try to figure out by searching the running thread from Process
>> Explorer then I saw 4 threads which were taking all the CPU usage and
>> to no surprise these were USBPORT.SYS+0x5fe6 (ALL FOUR), when I try to
>> kill these threads, access was denied so I suspend them all and my cpu
>> immediately comes to actual idle state 2-5%.
>>
>> I have not found any cure so far please help me. My system boots very
>> very slow then I have to wait for the desktop things to appear so that
>> I can open the Process Explorer to shut those USB threads and then I
>> can work.
>>
>> Is it really the DBM chip fault which I read somewhere as Intel
>> SouthBridge 82801 DB ICH4-M. As I explained I tried everything so far
>> as I am a network engineer myself and electronic hobbiest so far
>> whatever I could, I tried but nothing. I even tried the PCMCIA usb
>> card, it did work once with mouse but didnt worked again. I asked the
>> same technician he said how can this PCMCIA card will work as it only
>> changes the Interface, controller on the motherboard still is the same
>> which has to work.
>>
>> I tried to find the schematic so that I can check the voltages across
>> the MOBO but only could find the service manual that too for
>> Travelmate 290 which has identical motherboard.
>>
>> Please please help me, I am sure that Google group can help me out
>> here.
>>
>> INDI
>>

> Why don't you believe the repairman? All the symptoms and the error
> message certainly point to the USB controller. The only risk you take is
> that the motherboard has a further problem.


Most of the reported failures on USB ports, have been on ICH5 chips.
I haven't seen a report of an ICH4, but they are mentioned in the
blurb below.

The only page mentioning this problem is archived here. This page used
to be available directly on the Gigabyte site, but I cannot find it since
their FAQ section was redesigned. The archived copy is messed up, possibly
by being in a double byte format that was not recognized by the archiver.
Anyway, if you download the page, load into Wordpad and remove the
characters that should not be there, this is what it reads.

http://web.archive.org/web/200512221...AQ/FAQ_456.htm

"The ICH4/5 SouthBridge chipset on my Intel motherboard
appears damaged or "burnt". How did this happen?

The GIGABYTE Global RMA Service Center has recently become aware
of the randomly occurring risk to ICH4/5 SouthBridge chipsets on
Intel motherboards to become damaged or "burnt" when a USB device
is connected. Please read the following paragraphs to learn more
about this issue.

Why did this happen?

There are three likely causes:

Accumulated static electricity from the human body may have been
transmitted to the ICH4/5 SouthBridge chipset when connecting a
USB device if it has not been "grounded". A connected USB device
does not have any static electricity protection. Accumulated
static electricity in a front-panel USB port that is not properly
"grounded" with the PC casing.

Usage Tips

- Avoid touching the USB connector.
- Release static electricity within your USB device by touching
the USB connector to any metal surface before plugging it into
your computer.
- Use rear-panel USB ports on your PC whenever possible.
- Use a three-pronged electrical cord to connect a power supply
to your PC.
- Use only approved or certified power supplies."

So it is possible for the USB ports to fail. But your symptoms
aren't exactly the same as others I've read of. Usually a USB
port failure results in one of two things. Either the chip is
burned and the computer will not POST again. The second type of
failure, results in dead USB ports (no response when devices are
plugged in), but from the software/OS side of things, the OS
thinks everything is fine with the ports - no complaints at
all (mainly because no connected devices can be detected).

The picture at the top of this page, is a latchup failure on
an ICH5. The burn mark is right above where the USB pads get
their source of power.

http://www.abxzone.com/forums/showthread.php?t=84122

Replacing a Southbridge is not a trivial task. It is a BGA,
with many solder contacts on the bottom. The old chip has to
be removed, and a new one put in place. You would not want
to disturb other stuff, next to the Southbridge, while doing
the repair. This page describes the process. And even with
the proper technology, you only get about three tries to
get this right, before the motherboard must be thrown away.
And the kicker, for a hobbyist, is the last step listed here,
is Xray inspection. While BGA soldering has a low defectivity
rate (very very few bad joints), a proper manufacturing facility
does Xray inspection to ensure a proper job.

http://www.solder.net/technical/bga.asp

What happens if you disable the USB ports in the BIOS ?
Are parts of your laptop reliant on the USB working,
to be able to use the machine ? If so, it could be
that replacing the Southbridge is the best solution.

HTH,
Paul
 
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Dudley Pumperdinkel
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-16-2007
Life is only so long..New computers are often
very reasonably priced..



"Indi" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed) oups.com...
>I have Acer Travelmate 4052 laptop with Centrino 1.6 Ghz processor, I
> took Hardisk from my PC to copy some data to my laptop and for that I
> bought a 3.5 inch casing which came along with an adaptor. It went
> well for a hour and copied some data but after that a message popup
> saying POWER SURGE ON USB HUB and pulled the usb connector and
> connector to the other remaing two ports alternatively but same
> message. When I restarted my computer and try to connect as usual my
> microsoft usb mouse, my system froze, nothing worked alt+crtl+del,
> nothing, so restarted but same problem on other ports as well. I
> reinstalled the USB controller but to no use, I updated the BIOS,
> enable - disable USB legacy support and USB Mass Storage suporrt from
> the BIOS but to no use. I tried to reinstall the same Winxp pro with
> integrated SP2 which was earlier on the system but it froze too,
> sometimes at intial copying of files after formating, sometimes at 34
> min remaining screen, then at 9 min, and 5 min remaining to complete
> the setup.
>
> I consulted one very popular laptop repair shop and the technician
> told me that it is a very common problem with computer and especially
> laptops and your Intel 82801 DBM chip has to be replaced, there is no
> alternative, and he was not sure whether it will be ok again, if not
> he said then I have to replace the motherboard. As it was a costly
> step, I tried many forum for help but to no avail. Nothing helped me
> at all.
>
> Finally, as I system as out of warranty and being a electronic
> hobbiest myself, I took apart my laptop and tried something really
> stupid. I placed my system in front of the airconditioner and
> restarted the 39 min installation process and walla it did completed
> successfully. Then I installed all the drivers successfully, I didnt
> tried the USB at all that time but I noticed that my CPU was
> constantly at 100% as the system was at IDLE state. I was sure about
> any virus or malware as firstly after installing windows with SP2 i
> updated the hotfixes and critical updates from AUTOPATCHER then
> installed the Internet security suite then connected to internet to
> update it, so I scanned and as expected nothing showed up. Then I
> tried the SysInternal which is now owned by Microsoft, the Process
> Explorer as no doubt the System was slow to 25% of its original speed,
> I try to figure out by searching the running thread from Process
> Explorer then I saw 4 threads which were taking all the CPU usage and
> to no surprise these were USBPORT.SYS+0x5fe6 (ALL FOUR), when I try to
> kill these threads, access was denied so I suspend them all and my cpu
> immediately comes to actual idle state 2-5%.
>
> I have not found any cure so far please help me. My system boots very
> very slow then I have to wait for the desktop things to appear so that
> I can open the Process Explorer to shut those USB threads and then I
> can work.
>
> Is it really the DBM chip fault which I read somewhere as Intel
> SouthBridge 82801 DB ICH4-M. As I explained I tried everything so far
> as I am a network engineer myself and electronic hobbiest so far
> whatever I could, I tried but nothing. I even tried the PCMCIA usb
> card, it did work once with mouse but didnt worked again. I asked the
> same technician he said how can this PCMCIA card will work as it only
> changes the Interface, controller on the motherboard still is the same
> which has to work.
>
> I tried to find the schematic so that I can check the voltages across
> the MOBO but only could find the service manual that too for
> Travelmate 290 which has identical motherboard.
>
> Please please help me, I am sure that Google group can help me out
> here.
>
> INDI
>



 
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w_tom
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-17-2007
Why do you keep posting this same message in multiple newsgroups?
Some in the other newsgroups AND Paul in this group have provided
useful answers.

Normally USB controllers are separate from USB transceivers. Your's
(I believe) integrate both functions meaning that static electric
damage may be more likely.

Adding to Paul's post is this recommendation. Room humidity must be
maintained so that static electric shocks do not exist. Otherwise
many electronic devices can start failing even weeks or months later.

Static electric protection in all appliances should be sufficient.
And then the human must provide another layer of protection - ie
sufficient humidity - so that static electric discharges do not
occur. (No contradiction exists in those two sentences).

If a Super IO Intel chip is replaceable, then it is socketed? I
doubt it. Chances are the entire motherboard needs replacement OR (as
posted by Penny in another newsgroup) the USB functions are disabled
(so that it stops creating interrupts) and a USB peripheral card is
installed.

At this point, it is assumed a USB power surge is now understood -
and not what you originally had assumed..

On May 15, 7:02 pm, Indi <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> I have Acer Travelmate 4052 laptop with Centrino 1.6 Ghz processor, I
> took Hardisk from my PC to copy some data to my laptop and for that I
> bought a 3.5 inch casing which came along with an adaptor. It went
> well for a hour and copied some data but after that a message popup
> saying POWER SURGE ON USB HUB and pulled the usb connector and
> connector to the other remaing two ports alternatively but same
> message. When I restarted my computer and try to connect as usual my
> microsoft usb mouse, my system froze, nothing worked alt+crtl+del,
> nothing, so restarted but same problem on other ports as well. I
> reinstalled the USB controller but to no use, I updated the BIOS,
> enable - disable USB legacy support and USB Mass Storage suporrt from
> the BIOS but to no use. I tried to reinstall the same Winxp pro with
> integrated SP2 which was earlier on the system but it froze too,
> sometimes at intial copying of files after formating, sometimes at 34
> min remaining screen, then at 9 min, and 5 min remaining to complete
> the setup.
>
> I consulted one very popular laptop repair shop and the technician
> told me that it is a very common problem with computer and especially
> laptops and your Intel 82801 DBM chip has to be replaced, there is no
> alternative, and he was not sure whether it will be ok again, if not
> he said then I have to replace the motherboard. As it was a costly
> step, I tried many forum for help but to no avail. Nothing helped me
> at all.
>
> Finally, as I system as out of warranty and being a electronic
> hobbiest myself, I took apart my laptop and tried something really
> stupid. I placed my system in front of the airconditioner and
> restarted the 39 min installation process and walla it did completed
> successfully. Then I installed all the drivers successfully, I didnt
> tried the USB at all that time but I noticed that my CPU was
> constantly at 100% as the system was at IDLE state. I was sure about
> any virus or malware as firstly after installing windows with SP2 i
> updated the hotfixes and critical updates from AUTOPATCHER then
> installed the Internet security suite then connected to internet to
> update it, so I scanned and as expected nothing showed up. Then I
> tried the SysInternal which is now owned by Microsoft, the Process
> Explorer as no doubt the System was slow to 25% of its original speed,
> I try to figure out by searching the running thread from Process
> Explorer then I saw 4 threads which were taking all the CPU usage and
> to no surprise these were USBPORT.SYS+0x5fe6 (ALL FOUR), when I try to
> kill these threads, access was denied so I suspend them all and my cpu
> immediately comes to actual idle state 2-5%.
> ...


 
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Indi
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-18-2007
On May 17, 3:28 am, w_tom <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> Why do you keep posting this same message in multiple newsgroups?
> Some in the other newsgroups AND Paul in this group have provided
> useful answers.
>
> Normally USB controllers are separate from USB transceivers. Your's
> (I believe) integrate both functions meaning that static electric
> damage may be more likely.
>
> Adding to Paul's post is this recommendation. Room humidity must be
> maintained so that static electric shocks do not exist. Otherwise
> many electronic devices can start failing even weeks or months later.
>
> Static electric protection in all appliances should be sufficient.
> And then the human must provide another layer of protection - ie
> sufficient humidity - so that static electric discharges do not
> occur. (No contradiction exists in those two sentences).
>
> If a Super IO Intel chip is replaceable, then it is socketed? I
> doubt it. Chances are the entire motherboard needs replacement OR (as
> posted by Penny in another newsgroup) the USB functions are disabled
> (so that it stops creating interrupts) and a USB peripheral card is
> installed.
>
> At this point, it is assumed a USB power surge is now understood -
> and not what you originally had assumed..
>
> On May 15, 7:02 pm,Indi<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>
>
> > I have Acer Travelmate 4052 laptop with Centrino 1.6 Ghz processor, I
> > took Hardisk from my PC to copy some data to my laptop and for that I
> > bought a 3.5 inch casing which came along with an adaptor. It went
> > well for a hour and copied some data but after that a message popup
> > saying POWER SURGE ON USB HUB and pulled the usb connector and
> > connector to the other remaing two ports alternatively but same
> > message. When I restarted my computer and try to connect as usual my
> > microsoft usb mouse, my system froze, nothing worked alt+crtl+del,
> > nothing, so restarted but same problem on other ports as well. I
> > reinstalled the USB controller but to no use, I updated the BIOS,
> > enable - disable USB legacy support and USB Mass Storage suporrt from
> > the BIOS but to no use. I tried to reinstall the same Winxp pro with
> > integrated SP2 which was earlier on the system but it froze too,
> > sometimes at intial copying of files after formating, sometimes at 34
> > min remaining screen, then at 9 min, and 5 min remaining to complete
> > the setup.

>
> > I consulted one very popular laptop repair shop and the technician
> > told me that it is a very common problem with computer and especially
> > laptops and your Intel 82801 DBM chip has to be replaced, there is no
> > alternative, and he was not sure whether it will be ok again, if not
> > he said then I have to replace the motherboard. As it was a costly
> > step, I tried many forum for help but to no avail. Nothing helped me
> > at all.

>
> > Finally, as I system as out of warranty and being a electronic
> > hobbiest myself, I took apart my laptop and tried something really
> > stupid. I placed my system in front of the airconditioner and
> > restarted the 39 min installation process and walla it did completed
> > successfully. Then I installed all the drivers successfully, I didnt
> > tried the USB at all that time but I noticed that my CPU was
> > constantly at 100% as the system was at IDLE state. I was sure about
> > any virus or malware as firstly after installing windows with SP2 i
> > updated the hotfixes and critical updates from AUTOPATCHER then
> > installed the Internet security suite then connected to internet to
> > update it, so I scanned and as expected nothing showed up. Then I
> > tried the SysInternal which is now owned by Microsoft, the Process
> > Explorer as no doubt the System was slow to 25% of its original speed,
> > I try to figure out by searching the running thread from Process
> > Explorer then I saw 4 threads which were taking all the CPU usage and
> > to no surprise these were USBPORT.SYS+0x5fe6 (ALL FOUR), when I try to
> > kill these threads, access was denied so I suspend them all and my cpu
> > immediately comes to actual idle state 2-5%.
> > ...- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -


Thanks guys for your help and support, regarding the multiposting, I
was not aware about that I thought that all these forum are not inter
linked so thought of putting the query in different forum, sorry about
that.

About the southbridge chip I have downloaded the detailed specs about
the controller chip from the Intel it shows that it not only runs USB,
but also Audio and modem, LAN interface, IDE.ATA channel, PCI card
bus. then I think all should not work like the USB. I tried to update
the latest chipset drivers I remained at 0% tried several times but
same results. I tried the original chipset drivers and same result. So
individually I installed the .inf files like ICH4-core, ICH4-USB, ICH4-
IDE, etc. but no use. After disabling system threads from process
explorer namely USBPORT.SYS (4of them) I system works well no hanging,
speed is good too but ofcourse without the USB. I read on many forums
that there is a bug regarding the USB in SP2 and latest updates. I
tried to remove all the USB*.SYS files and then installed the
individual inf files but to no use. So what should I do, should I get
it checked from the some well qualified technician. They charge around
Rs 4500 for replacing the DBM chip, they have got the proper
instruments and tools for replacing this chip, done by an automated
machine. There are few of those machines that is why they charge so
much but they will put a new chip as well.

I saw some ic chips along with two 150 mf 50v miniature capicitors
with each usb port on my board, but according to one good friend of
mine who is also a good hardware techinician, that there is very
remote possibility that those capcitors or voltage controller chip are
at fault as these protections are often seen in desktop pcs and can
prevent DBM chip but on laptops all the usb ports are directly
connected to the USB controller chip itself, so need to replace the
82801DBM chip.
Please suggest

 
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w_tom
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      05-19-2007
On May 18, 5:18 pm, Indi <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> I saw some ic chips along with two 150 mf 50v miniature capicitors
> with each usb port on my board, but according to one good friend of
> mine who is also a good hardware techinician, that there is very
> remote possibility that those capcitors or voltage controller chip are
> at fault as these protections are often seen in desktop pcs and can
> prevent DBM chip but on laptops all the usb ports are directly
> connected to the USB controller chip itself, so need to replace the
> 82801DBM chip.


You are assuming protection? The USB spec is quite specific on
what must be on each USB port so that power-on current does not create
a USB interrupt and the message "Power surge...".

Just using the limited information from your post, it sounds like
the current sensing circuit inside that Super IO chip is damaged.
Therefore the Super IO chip will output constant interrupts - leaving
CPU too busy to answer bogus requests.

That cited USB software problem may actually be a problem with
threshold levels for some USB ports. It would have nothing to do with
your failure. Software leaves some USB designs too sensitive to short
duration current surges that would otherwise be ignored. IOW it would
have nothing to do with your problem.

Of course, this is why more responsible computer manufacturers
provide comprehensive hardware diagnostics - for free. Without
information from that diagnostic, then we are only speculating.

Speculating that the power monitor circuit for the USB port in that
Super IO chips is defective, then USB interrupts must be disabled so
as to stop talking constantly to the CPU. It is accomplished by
disabling the USB functions in that chip (or replacing the chip). But
this is only speculation. If it works, the speculation may be
correct. Is that solution good enough? Can you install a USB port
card to replace that Super IO USB port? If so, problem solved.

Meanwhile, address reasons for possible static electric charges.
This may have been the 'canary in a coal mine'.

 
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Paul
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      05-19-2007
Indi wrote:

> Thanks guys for your help and support, regarding the multiposting, I
> was not aware about that I thought that all these forum are not inter
> linked so thought of putting the query in different forum, sorry about
> that.
>
> About the southbridge chip I have downloaded the detailed specs about
> the controller chip from the Intel it shows that it not only runs USB,
> but also Audio and modem, LAN interface, IDE.ATA channel, PCI card
> bus. then I think all should not work like the USB. I tried to update
> the latest chipset drivers I remained at 0% tried several times but
> same results. I tried the original chipset drivers and same result. So
> individually I installed the .inf files like ICH4-core, ICH4-USB, ICH4-
> IDE, etc. but no use. After disabling system threads from process
> explorer namely USBPORT.SYS (4of them) I system works well no hanging,
> speed is good too but ofcourse without the USB. I read on many forums
> that there is a bug regarding the USB in SP2 and latest updates. I
> tried to remove all the USB*.SYS files and then installed the
> individual inf files but to no use. So what should I do, should I get
> it checked from the some well qualified technician. They charge around
> Rs 4500 for replacing the DBM chip, they have got the proper
> instruments and tools for replacing this chip, done by an automated
> machine. There are few of those machines that is why they charge so
> much but they will put a new chip as well.
>
> I saw some ic chips along with two 150 mf 50v miniature capicitors
> with each usb port on my board, but according to one good friend of
> mine who is also a good hardware techinician, that there is very
> remote possibility that those capcitors or voltage controller chip are
> at fault as these protections are often seen in desktop pcs and can
> prevent DBM chip but on laptops all the usb ports are directly
> connected to the USB controller chip itself, so need to replace the
> 82801DBM chip.
> Please suggest
>


In terms of investigative techniques, I might try booting Knoppix
(knopper.net). It is a Live Linux distribution, and you can boot into
the Linux operating system, without installing anything on the hard
drive. You might see how Linux behaves when it sees your broken
USB hardware. Perhaps that might give some idea if interrupts
are stuck. Knoppix is available as a 700MB .iso download, and you
burn it to a CD. As Knoppix boots, you can see text messages on
the screen.

The repair price of Rs 4500, is as far as I can tell, about $110 USD
or so. If I tried to replace an ICH4-M locally in town, the place I'd
take it would charge 5x to 10x that much. If you went to Taiwan,
you could likely get a better price than Rs 4500, because they do them in
volume. My local operation has to pay for staff, that are not
busy most of the time.

There is always some risk when replacing a chip, especially something
with the ball count on the bottom like an ICH4-M Southbridge. So there
is the possibility that the motherboard will no longer work when they
are finished. As I said, at the best of times, a circuit board can
withstand about three chip replacements of that type, in the same
location on the board. Depending on the solder profile used, the
PCB might not even stand one replacement. So the skill of the operators,
and their familiarity with cheap PCB materials, will decide the
outcome.

For the 5x to 10x I might pay for the repair, the local facility has
an X-ray machine, and they do check the quality of the repair. If
properly prepared, the defectivity of BGA soldering is low enough,
that you could likely get away without X-ray inspection, but it
is part of a professional, factory quality job.

So, if the Rs 4500 repair job fails, you could still be looking at
a motherboard replacement. There is little else in the USB path
that could fail.

I understand you can get electrostatic protection devices for
USB designs, but a typical motherboard might not be using them.
An Intel paper I was reading, claimed their chip technology has
the ability to withstand many thousands of volts of ESD. Since
Intel has never stated anything publicly about this problem,
I can only speculate why customers are seeing these failures.
The pad technology used by Intel, is good enough to use without
adding any external devices, except in the most extreme
circumstances. In fact, I would have expected to see more
inferior chip technologies to fail (as not everyone has as
good a design as Intel), and yet we don't see the same problems
elsewhere. Which suggests to me, that the Intel designs of
that era, had a problem of some sort. This is one reason I
don't use the USB ports on my motherboard that has an ICH5R
Southbridge.

So, spend the Rs 4500. If the repair does not work, the
replacement laptop motherboard is probably three times
that price, so the gamble is probably a worthwhile one.
Have you priced a replacement motherboard ? How expensive
would that be in local currency ? Basically, you are
gambling on the skill level of the people who claim they
can remove and replace a BGA. And you'll still need to find
a replacement ICH4-M. They probably stopped making those
a few years ago. So you need to find a stock of them somewhere.
I doubt I could find one if I needed it. A manufacturing plant
that makes laptops would be likely to still have them (for
doing the same kind of rework that you are attempting).

Paul
 
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