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Getting a MAC code from ISP?

 
 
Kenny
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      12-12-2006
My daughter tried to sign up with TalkTalk here in the UK.
Despite many phone calls to them she was never able to get connected. They
then started billing her for a service which she never had so she stopped
the direct debit.
Tried to sign up with another ISP but was told that TalkTalk has control of
the line and she needs a MAC code from them. Problem is that they won't
give it to her.
She has called them many times and e-mailed, they keep on telling her that
they will send the MAC code out to her but don't.
This has been going on for months. She has a BT line but her telephone
service is supplied by the Post Office. She has contacted both of these and
was told that without the MAC code ther's nothing they can do.
From the enquiries I have made it seems that ISP's are under no obligation
to supply a MAC code, some have signed up to a voluntary agreement to do so
but many haven't. Also Ofcom are looking into the whole question of MAC
codes.
It seems to me that there's something wrong when an ISP can keep control of
someone's phone line and block internet access and apparently there's
nothing one can do about it.
I don't know where she would stand if she took legal advice, this would cost
money and may turn out fruitless.
I have suggested she changes her phone number, there would be a charge for
this but would it work?
Anyone else had similar problems getting a MAC code and what did they do
about it?

--
Kenny Cargill


 
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Whiskers
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Posts: n/a
 
      12-12-2006
On 2006-12-12, Kenny <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
> My daughter tried to sign up with TalkTalk here in the UK.
> Despite many phone calls to them she was never able to get connected. They
> then started billing her for a service which she never had so she stopped
> the direct debit.
> Tried to sign up with another ISP but was told that TalkTalk has control of
> the line and she needs a MAC code from them. Problem is that they won't
> give it to her.
> She has called them many times and e-mailed, they keep on telling her that
> they will send the MAC code out to her but don't.
> This has been going on for months. She has a BT line but her telephone
> service is supplied by the Post Office. She has contacted both of these and
> was told that without the MAC code ther's nothing they can do.
> From the enquiries I have made it seems that ISP's are under no obligation
> to supply a MAC code, some have signed up to a voluntary agreement to do so
> but many haven't. Also Ofcom are looking into the whole question of MAC
> codes.
> It seems to me that there's something wrong when an ISP can keep control of
> someone's phone line and block internet access and apparently there's
> nothing one can do about it.
> I don't know where she would stand if she took legal advice, this would cost
> money and may turn out fruitless.
> I have suggested she changes her phone number, there would be a charge for
> this but would it work?
> Anyone else had similar problems getting a MAC code and what did they do
> about it?


Did your daughter agree to the 12 or 18-month minimum initial contract
period? This article in 'The Register'
<http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/09/29/talktalk_lets_customers_leave/>
suggests that it is possible to escape, but it doesn't explain how.

--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~
 
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beenthere
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Posts: n/a
 
      12-12-2006

"Kenny" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> My daughter tried to sign up with TalkTalk here in the UK.
> Despite many phone calls to them she was never able to get connected.
> They then started billing her for a service which she never had so she
> stopped the direct debit.
> Tried to sign up with another ISP but was told that TalkTalk has control
> of the line and she needs a MAC code from them. Problem is that they
> won't give it to her.
> She has called them many times and e-mailed, they keep on telling her that
> they will send the MAC code out to her but don't.
> This has been going on for months. She has a BT line but her telephone
> service is supplied by the Post Office. She has contacted both of these
> and was told that without the MAC code ther's nothing they can do.
> From the enquiries I have made it seems that ISP's are under no obligation
> to supply a MAC code, some have signed up to a voluntary agreement to do
> so but many haven't. Also Ofcom are looking into the whole question of
> MAC codes.
> It seems to me that there's something wrong when an ISP can keep control
> of someone's phone line and block internet access and apparently there's
> nothing one can do about it.
> I don't know where she would stand if she took legal advice, this would
> cost money and may turn out fruitless.
> I have suggested she changes her phone number, there would be a charge for
> this but would it work?
> Anyone else had similar problems getting a MAC code and what did they do
> about it?
>

One article here Kenny

http://www.the-scream.co.uk/forums/t23260.html

They`ve got you by the short and. ...
And they don`t want to let go.

It normally take 1-2 weeks to get the change done Even
when you`ve got the code.

It`s a beetch.


 
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Bucky Breeder
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Posts: n/a
 
      12-12-2006
"Kenny" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
news:(E-Mail Removed):

> My daughter tried to sign up with TalkTalk here in the UK.
> Despite many phone calls to them she was never able to get connected.
> They then started billing her for a service which she never had so she
> stopped the direct debit.
> Tried to sign up with another ISP but was told that TalkTalk has control
> of the line and she needs a MAC code from them. Problem is that they
> won't give it to her.
> She has called them many times and e-mailed, they keep on telling her
> that they will send the MAC code out to her but don't.
> This has been going on for months. She has a BT line but her telephone
> service is supplied by the Post Office. She has contacted both of these
> and was told that without the MAC code ther's nothing they can do.
> From the enquiries I have made it seems that ISP's are under no
> obligation to supply a MAC code, some have signed up to a voluntary
> agreement to do so but many haven't. Also Ofcom are looking into the
> whole question of MAC codes.
> It seems to me that there's something wrong when an ISP can keep control
> of someone's phone line and block internet access and apparently there's
> nothing one can do about it.
> I don't know where she would stand if she took legal advice, this would
> cost money and may turn out fruitless.
> I have suggested she changes her phone number, there would be a charge
> for this but would it work?
> Anyone else had similar problems getting a MAC code and what did they do
> about it?



Sounds like some shoddy business practices from here. In the USA the company
denying any citizen communications access could be fined by our FCC, and sued
for denying access until any dispute was resolved appropriately. In some
jurisdictions this could be a criminal discrimination with regards to access
of a public service. Of course, to interest a lawyer in a lawsuit, there
would have to be money involved, thus there would have to damages shown which
would be commensurate with monitary remedy. Some cases, when all the facts
are revealed, the situation may rise to the level that "would shock the
conscienciousness" of reasonable and prudent person/s, thus a solicitor may
take the case contingent upon an award of the court for remedy, fees and
costs.

I know you're in the UK and things operate a little differently there, but
Internet access does follow some general physical rules.

MAC = "Media Access Control"

It's a hardware address that simply and uniquely identifies each node of a
network...

Everything that accesses the internet has a MAC address: computers via the
wire that provides the internet service and plugs into a port which is part
of a card, and that card has a unique MAC address.

Routers have a unique MAC address, and on most routers you can "Clone" the
MAC address to any alpha-numerical value within the range designated for MAC
addresses...

To find your machines MAC address in Win2kNTXP:

Start > Run > type cmd in the text box > OK = Command Prompt Window

Type ipconfig/all then Enter

The 12-digit Physical Address is the same as the machine's MAC address;
formated like this:

00-EA-75-41-7F-A6 (numbers 0-9 and letters A-F)

That should help you obtain what is your [daughter's] MAC address on the
machine with which the internet would be accessed. Actually, it's on the
network card or dial-up card, or router, or whatever is actually accessing
the internet on behalf of your machine. So, in simplist of terms, you could
actually buy another dial-up or ethernet access card, change it out with the
one in your machine, to have a whole new MAC address for ~$10 USD.


Best wishes to all for a safe and joyous holiday season.

--

"When you come to the end of all the light you know,
and it's time to step into the darkness of the unknown,
'faith' is knowing that one of two things shall happen:
either you will be given something solid to stand on,
or you will be taught to fly." - Edward Teller (1908-2003)
 
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beenthere
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Posts: n/a
 
      12-12-2006

"Bucky Breeder" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
message news:Xns989750E8AF78FWeeZurD@216.151.153.21...
> "Kenny" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> news:(E-Mail Removed):
>

SNIPPED some
>
> MAC = "Media Access Control"
>

The MAC talked about here Bucky is::

What is a MAC code?
MAC stands for Migration Authorisation Code. It is issued by your broadband
provider and is used to seamlessly switch from one provider to another
without having to wait weeks to cease your line and re-register with another
provider

bw from OJ, and have a great Xmas.


 
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Bucky Breeder
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Posts: n/a
 
      12-12-2006
"beenthere" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
news:eEyfh.6029$(E-Mail Removed):

>
> "Bucky Breeder" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> message news:Xns989750E8AF78FWeeZurD@216.151.153.21...
>> "Kenny" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
>> news:(E-Mail Removed):
>>

> SNIPPED some
>>
>> MAC = "Media Access Control"
>>

> The MAC talked about here Bucky is::
>
> What is a MAC code?
> MAC stands for Migration Authorisation Code. It is issued by your
> broadband provider and is used to seamlessly switch from one provider to
> another without having to wait weeks to cease your line and re-register
> with another provider
>
> bw from OJ, and have a great Xmas.



Bummer! They've hijacked the poor souls' internet access as well as a
commonly known acronym... Maybe a world court action would be in order
here? Well, if not, this has got to be an absolute abuse of a system over
which there should be some government oversight - or else a company could
shut down operations and refuse to give the code to all [Episcopalians] of
any group - wrongfully. I was hoping he could just look-up his own info
and screw the bastards, you know?

Maybe the suggestions on the legal foundations may help organize their
presentation and get some quick legal help, because this really seems
abominable, even if there are some pending contract issues to be resolved.
There's no practical reason to deny access whilst other disputes are
getting worked out appropriately.

So much for the UK being a "first-world" country? <shu-u-u-u-udder> (o;


Best wishes to all for a safe and joyous holiday season.

--

"When you come to the end of all the light you know,
and it's time to step into the darkness of the unknown,
'faith' is knowing that one of two things shall happen:
either you will be given something solid to stand on,
or you will be taught to fly." - Edward Teller (1908-2003)
 
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old man
Guest
Posts: n/a
 
      12-12-2006
Its a problem which recently featured on BBC
Ofcom stated they don't have any rules which could force the issue, and as
such this needs rectifying.
I wonder what would happen if a 'small claims' was issued, would they fight
it? - not that it helps
Theres nothing you can do about it, in the short term, other than having BT
put in a new line

"Kenny" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed)...
> My daughter tried to sign up with TalkTalk here in the UK.
> Despite many phone calls to them she was never able to get connected.

They
> then started billing her for a service which she never had so she stopped
> the direct debit.
> Tried to sign up with another ISP but was told that TalkTalk has control

of
> the line and she needs a MAC code from them. Problem is that they won't
> give it to her.
> She has called them many times and e-mailed, they keep on telling her that
> they will send the MAC code out to her but don't.
> This has been going on for months. She has a BT line but her telephone
> service is supplied by the Post Office. She has contacted both of these

and
> was told that without the MAC code ther's nothing they can do.
> From the enquiries I have made it seems that ISP's are under no obligation
> to supply a MAC code, some have signed up to a voluntary agreement to do

so
> but many haven't. Also Ofcom are looking into the whole question of MAC
> codes.
> It seems to me that there's something wrong when an ISP can keep control

of
> someone's phone line and block internet access and apparently there's
> nothing one can do about it.
> I don't know where she would stand if she took legal advice, this would

cost
> money and may turn out fruitless.
> I have suggested she changes her phone number, there would be a charge for
> this but would it work?
> Anyone else had similar problems getting a MAC code and what did they do
> about it?
>
> --
> Kenny Cargill
>
>



 
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Whiskers
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Posts: n/a
 
      12-12-2006
On 2006-12-12, Bucky Breeder <(E-Mail Removed)>
wrote:
> "beenthere" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
> news:eEyfh.6029$(E-Mail Removed):
>
>>
>> "Bucky Breeder" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
>> message news:Xns989750E8AF78FWeeZurD@216.151.153.21...
>>> "Kenny" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in
>>> news:(E-Mail Removed):
>>>

>> SNIPPED some
>>>
>>> MAC = "Media Access Control"
>>>

>> The MAC talked about here Bucky is::
>>
>> What is a MAC code?
>> MAC stands for Migration Authorisation Code. It is issued by your
>> broadband provider and is used to seamlessly switch from one provider to
>> another without having to wait weeks to cease your line and re-register
>> with another provider
>>
>> bw from OJ, and have a great Xmas.

>
>
> Bummer! They've hijacked the poor souls' internet access


No they haven't; it seems that they may have failed to provide the
particular service she contracted for (or they have provided it but failed
to help the customer to get it working). That particular telephone line
is temporarily not available for a competitor to use for providing a DSL
service, but it can still be used for analogue voice and data.
"Broadband" is not an 'inalienable right', and many people are too far
from the telephone exchange for DSL to work anyway. Internet access in
the home or office is not an 'inalienable right', come to that, although
the former state telco is obliged to provide voice services to anyone who
asks - and to swallow the costs.

There are too many unknown factors in this particular case for anyone to
to make more than vague suggestions. TalkTalk have had a lot of adverse
publicity in the UK since they launched their 'Free broadband for life'
offer, and (surprise surprise) got lots of applications - too many to
handle.

No crime has been committed. At most, there would be a civil case over
'breach of contract' - and it's not clear which party is in breach, here.

> as well as a
> commonly known acronym...


MAC for 'migration authorisation code' is ubiquitous throughout the UK DSL
market. I don't know who coined the term, and I agree that it's silly to
clash with 'media access control'.

> Maybe a world court action would be in order here?


Hardly. A local 'Small Claims Court' perhaps.

> Well, if not, this has got to be an absolute abuse


No it isn't; it's a contract between an incompetent service provider and a
naive customer.

> of a system over
> which there should be some government oversight -


There is. However, widespread DSL services are so new in the UK that
there is not yet any specific regulation or legislation concerning
transfer of a customer's telephone line from one DSL provider to another.
The MAC system devised by the industry normally works well enough, but
there is a growing list of cases where it hasn't for one reason or
another, so both the industry and government are under increasing pressure
to devise a more flexible and enforceable arrangement.

> or else a company could
> shut down operations and refuse to give the code to all [Episcopalians] of
> any group - wrongfully. I was hoping he could just look-up his own info
> and screw the bastards, you know?


Discrimination in business on the grounds of race, religion, and some
other things, is illegal. There is no suggestion that this s happening
anyway.

It is not practical for end users to control the connections that are made
within the telco's exchange and which require the mutual co-operation of
the telco and the various DSL providers.

Until very recently we had a state monopoly telephone system, and the
basic infrastructure and legislation still reflects that.

> Maybe the suggestions on the legal foundations may help organize their
> presentation and get some quick legal help, because this really seems
> abominable, even if there are some pending contract issues to be resolved.
> There's no practical reason to deny access whilst other disputes are
> getting worked out appropriately.


Access to the internet and to telephony is not being denied or prevented.
All there is, is a dispute over whether or not a particular service has
been provided and paid for.

> So much for the UK being a "first-world" country? <shu-u-u-u-udder> (o;


You have imagined far more into this than exists.

--
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
-- Whiskers
-- ~~~~~~~~~~
 
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why?
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Posts: n/a
 
      12-12-2006

On Tue, 12 Dec 2006 12:08:11 -0000, Kenny wrote:

>My daughter tried to sign up with TalkTalk here in the UK.
>Despite many phone calls to them she was never able to get connected. They
>then started billing her for a service which she never had so she stopped
>the direct debit.
>Tried to sign up with another ISP but was told that TalkTalk has control of
>the line and she needs a MAC code from them. Problem is that they won't
>give it to her.


This was mentioned in a recent article in the UK. computer press, as you
say ....

<snip>

>From the enquiries I have made it seems that ISP's are under no obligation
>to supply a MAC code, some have signed up to a voluntary agreement to do so
>but many haven't. Also Ofcom are looking into the whole question of MAC
>codes.


That won't be for 2 or 3 years yet.

>It seems to me that there's something wrong when an ISP can keep control of
>someone's phone line and block internet access and apparently there's
>nothing one can do about it.


The article mentioned all of what you said and, your best bet may be,

Accept the deal the ISP offers, otherwise you have to apply to another
ISP for thier package and wait the 2-3 weeks for a connection.

>I don't know where she would stand if she took legal advice, this would cost
>money and may turn out fruitless.


They did say IIRC, no point in going to CAB wither.

>I have suggested she changes her phone number, there would be a charge for
>this but would it work?
>Anyone else had similar problems getting a MAC code and what did they do
>about it?


You will most likely want to check the UK telecoms newsgroup(s), The UK
ADSL/Broadband forums, a couple are -


Learn all about transfering your broadband ISP at broadband.co.uk. ...
Contact your current provider and request a MAC code to transfer they
may haggle ...
www.broadband.co.uk/changeprovider.jsp - 13k - Cached - Similar pages

Broadband - help.com:- the leading broadband review and news site in the
UK.
www.broadband-help.com/


UK legal, see the 2 group names
http://www.usenet.org.uk/newsgroups.html


Me
 
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why?
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Posts: n/a
 
      12-12-2006

On Tue, 12 Dec 2006 12:08:11 -0000, Kenny wrote:

>My daughter tried to sign up with TalkTalk here in the UK.
>Despite many phone calls to them she was never able to get connected. They
>then started billing her for a service which she never had so she stopped
>the direct debit.

<snip>

NG - uk.telecom.broadband , quite a few threads.


This must be a joke page then, it's easy to move to TT.

http://www.talktalk.co.uk/talktalk/s...BHELP.BBSPLIST
If you already have broadband from someone else, it's easy to switch to
TalkTalk Broadband, and we'll do our best to switch your connection
without interruption.

* A MAC code (Migration Authorisation Code) is a 17 to 18 digit code
that we need to transfer you between broadband providers with minimal
interuption to your broadband service. Mac Codes usually begin with
"BBIP" or "FTIP" (e.g. BBIP 12344321/AB12C).
* If we haven't requested a MAC code from you yet, don't worry, we
will contact you when one is needed.
* To get your MAC code, simply contact your current broadband
provider. Don't worry, it's standard procedure to ask for it and their
customer services will know what to do.
* Please note that cable operators (NTL, Telewest) and a very small
number of non-cable broadband providers do not provide MAC codes. To
join TalkTalk you'll need to disconnect from their service, make sure
you have an active BT line installed and then come back to us.
* For further details, please see our MAC Code FAQ.


It'a already in uk.legal

ISP, requested a MAC code
.... code and a mobile contract?) MACs are issued by BT to the ISP who
pass ... They decided
to cut me off, even though I had arranged transfer to Zen, with the MAC.
....
uk.legal - Feb 5, 2:37 am by SID - 13 messages - 11 authors




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