«

rightly said..

--

Regards,

Hermit Dave
(http://hdave.blogspot.com)
<WKidd> wrote in message news:...
> IT developers are like the journeyman sailors of the 18th century. We sign
> up with the first ship that comes to port looking for an able seaman,
> experience a shipwreck or two, survive (or even participate in) a good
> mutiny, occasionally find ourselves languishing unemployed in some port,
and
> dream of one day being master or even commander of our own vessel.
> WKidd
>
> "The Poster Formerly Known as Kline Sphere" <.> wrote in message
> news:...
> > >My advice to anyone just getting started would be to first finish their
> > >degree (4 years will suffice)
> >
> > too right.
> >
> > > It
> > >doesn't matter which development shop, a good observer can learn
lessons
> > >even from a bad shop.
> >
> > although the reputation of the 'bad shop', as you put it, travels with
> > you has well....
> >
> > Kline Sphere (Chalk) MCNGP #3
>
>

Yohoho and A Bottle Of Rum!!!


"Hermit Dave" <> wrote in message
news:...
> rightly said..
>
> --
>
> Regards,
>
> Hermit Dave
> (http://hdave.blogspot.com)
> <WKidd> wrote in message news:...
> > IT developers are like the journeyman sailors of the 18th century. We
sign
> > up with the first ship that comes to port looking for an able seaman,
> > experience a shipwreck or two, survive (or even participate in) a good
> > mutiny, occasionally find ourselves languishing unemployed in some port,
> and
> > dream of one day being master or even commander of our own vessel.
> > WKidd
> >
> > "The Poster Formerly Known as Kline Sphere" <.> wrote in message
> > news:...
> > > >My advice to anyone just getting started would be to first finish
their
> > > >degree (4 years will suffice)
> > >
> > > too right.
> > >
> > > > It
> > > >doesn't matter which development shop, a good observer can learn
> lessons
> > > >even from a bad shop.
> > >
> > > although the reputation of the 'bad shop', as you put it, travels with
> > > you has well....
> > >
> > > Kline Sphere (Chalk) MCNGP #3
> >
> >
>
>

Geoff wrote:

> No company in their right mind would be interested in
> employing someone who does not have the proper on the job
> experience within the company's area of expertise. It is
> giving people false hope suggesting otherwise.
>

I disagree. I think a URL aimed at a site you made yourself is better
than having nothing at all to show a company.

Of course, you can bring in code samples to show off some work you did,
but they really like to see the end result - especially when web sites
are involved.

It should be non-trivial in order to have some value, and preferably a
site that uses a back-end database.

The use a a data access layer, and a business object layer, would be
pluses - especially for an entry-level developer. This would show that
you're ready to do "real work".

I totally agree that paid experience is worth more, but if you have no
experience at all, you need to show what you can do in order to get
that first job.

I can't imagine getting a job in ASP.NET if you have nothing at all to
show a company. Jobs are too tight now for that to happen. Of course,
you might get lucky, but I wouldn't plan on getting this lucky.

Eric

>It should be non-trivial in order to have some value

indeed if it solves real world business problems.

However, the difference between a noddy web site for some two bit
company, produced for nothing, showing pretty pictures, is somewhat
different than a 'real world' business solution which securely handles
hundreds or thousands of business transactions actions an hour.

Kline Sphere (Chalk) MCNGP #3

A large percentage of experienced developers are only involved in one aspect
of a project lifecycle, for example maintenace programming, GUI design or
database development. If you asked them to develop even a simple data driven
website from front to back, including gathering requirements from the
client, then they would drop the ball. Therefore, if someone demonstrated to
me that they personally built a website from front to back for even a small
business or non-profit, then that would be significant.

<Eric> wrote in message news:...
> Geoff wrote:
>
> > No company in their right mind would be interested in
> > employing someone who does not have the proper on the job
> > experience within the company's area of expertise. It is
> > giving people false hope suggesting otherwise.
> >
>
> I disagree. I think a URL aimed at a site you made yourself is better
> than having nothing at all to show a company.
>
> Of course, you can bring in code samples to show off some work you did,
> but they really like to see the end result - especially when web sites
> are involved.
>
> It should be non-trivial in order to have some value, and preferably a
> site that uses a back-end database.
>
> The use a a data access layer, and a business object layer, would be
> pluses - especially for an entry-level developer. This would show that
> you're ready to do "real work".
>
> I totally agree that paid experience is worth more, but if you have no
> experience at all, you need to show what you can do in order to get
> that first job.
>
> I can't imagine getting a job in ASP.NET if you have nothing at all to
> show a company. Jobs are too tight now for that to happen. Of course,
> you might get lucky, but I wouldn't plan on getting this lucky.
>
> Eric

>A large percentage of experienced developers are only involved in one aspect
>of a project lifecycle

Very true for freelance people, but not for salaried people.

Kline Sphere (Chalk) MCNGP #3

www.steptall.com

well i provided the client with a way to keep modify home page image and not
i dont know what the heck she's doing...
the images are all different sizes in whole lot of backgrounds... but yes
from requirements to design and dev...

the UI (look) was done by a friend.. i am not good with colours

--

Regards,

Hermit Dave
(http://hdave.blogspot.com)
<WKidd> wrote in message news:...
> A large percentage of experienced developers are only involved in one
aspect
> of a project lifecycle, for example maintenace programming, GUI design or
> database development. If you asked them to develop even a simple data
driven
> website from front to back, including gathering requirements from the
> client, then they would drop the ball. Therefore, if someone demonstrated
to
> me that they personally built a website from front to back for even a
small
> business or non-profit, then that would be significant.
>
> <Eric> wrote in message news:...
> > Geoff wrote:
> >
> > > No company in their right mind would be interested in
> > > employing someone who does not have the proper on the job
> > > experience within the company's area of expertise. It is
> > > giving people false hope suggesting otherwise.
> > >
> >
> > I disagree. I think a URL aimed at a site you made yourself is better
> > than having nothing at all to show a company.
> >
> > Of course, you can bring in code samples to show off some work you did,
> > but they really like to see the end result - especially when web sites
> > are involved.
> >
> > It should be non-trivial in order to have some value, and preferably a
> > site that uses a back-end database.
> >
> > The use a a data access layer, and a business object layer, would be
> > pluses - especially for an entry-level developer. This would show that
> > you're ready to do "real work".
> >
> > I totally agree that paid experience is worth more, but if you have no
> > experience at all, you need to show what you can do in order to get
> > that first job.
> >
> > I can't imagine getting a job in ASP.NET if you have nothing at all to
> > show a company. Jobs are too tight now for that to happen. Of course,
> > you might get lucky, but I wouldn't plan on getting this lucky.
> >
> > Eric
>
>

that was done sometime last year when i gave 315

--

Regards,

Hermit Dave
(http://hdave.blogspot.com)
"Hermit Dave" <> wrote in message
news:ucxH$...
> www.steptall.com
>
> well i provided the client with a way to keep modify home page image and
not
> i dont know what the heck she's doing...
> the images are all different sizes in whole lot of backgrounds... but yes
> from requirements to design and dev...
>
> the UI (look) was done by a friend.. i am not good with colours
>
> --
>
> Regards,
>
> Hermit Dave
> (http://hdave.blogspot.com)
> <WKidd> wrote in message news:...
> > A large percentage of experienced developers are only involved in one
> aspect
> > of a project lifecycle, for example maintenace programming, GUI design
or
> > database development. If you asked them to develop even a simple data
> driven
> > website from front to back, including gathering requirements from the
> > client, then they would drop the ball. Therefore, if someone
demonstrated
> to
> > me that they personally built a website from front to back for even a
> small
> > business or non-profit, then that would be significant.
> >
> > <Eric> wrote in message news:...
> > > Geoff wrote:
> > >
> > > > No company in their right mind would be interested in
> > > > employing someone who does not have the proper on the job
> > > > experience within the company's area of expertise. It is
> > > > giving people false hope suggesting otherwise.
> > > >
> > >
> > > I disagree. I think a URL aimed at a site you made yourself is better
> > > than having nothing at all to show a company.
> > >
> > > Of course, you can bring in code samples to show off some work you
did,
> > > but they really like to see the end result - especially when web sites
> > > are involved.
> > >
> > > It should be non-trivial in order to have some value, and preferably a
> > > site that uses a back-end database.
> > >
> > > The use a a data access layer, and a business object layer, would be
> > > pluses - especially for an entry-level developer. This would show that
> > > you're ready to do "real work".
> > >
> > > I totally agree that paid experience is worth more, but if you have no
> > > experience at all, you need to show what you can do in order to get
> > > that first job.
> > >
> > > I can't imagine getting a job in ASP.NET if you have nothing at all to
> > > show a company. Jobs are too tight now for that to happen. Of course,
> > > you might get lucky, but I wouldn't plan on getting this lucky.
> > >
> > > Eric
> >
> >
>
>