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Sigma's SD14 Postponed

 
 
Scott W
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      12-08-2006

Peter A. Stavrakoglou wrote:
> "Alfred Molon" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
> news:(E-Mail Removed) ...
> > In article <(E-Mail Removed). com>, Scott
> > W says...
> >
> >> Many of us are surprised that they are trying this one more time given
> >> how few of their other digital cameras they managed to sell.

> >
> > Why can't they make a camera with a decent pixel count, let's say at
> > least 8-10 MP?

>
> Because the Foveon 3.4 MP performs as well as a 6 MP Bayer. The SD14
> performs as well as a 10 MP Bayer. You can't compare a Bayer MP count to a
> Foveon MPcount.


For the moment let's take it as a given that the 3.4 MP Foveon performs
as well as a 6MP Bayer, then would you not expect the 4.6 MP Foveon to
perfrom about like a 8.1 MP Bayer?

After all the two ratios would then be the same.

In the test shots I have seen on dpreview the SD10 seems to come in
just a bit behind the 10D, at least to my eye, and the SD10 is way
behind the 30D.

The Foveon does better in capturing detail on a pixel level but it is
pushing it to even call it a 2 to 1 advantage. And then what you are
left with is a sensor that also has artifact issues.

Scott

 
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Scott W
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      12-08-2006

Rich wrote:

> But didn't the released Sigma SD9 and 10 have colour and other problems
> at least as bad as Leica? There was no solution for them that I recall.


The Sigma cameras might not be the best at color but they do not have
the rather large defect that the Leica M8 has.

Scott

 
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JohnR66
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      12-08-2006
"Scott W" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:(E-Mail Removed) ups.com...
>
> Peter A. Stavrakoglou wrote:
>> "Alfred Molon" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
>> news:(E-Mail Removed) ...
>> > In article <(E-Mail Removed). com>,
>> > Scott
>> > W says...
>> >
>> >> Many of us are surprised that they are trying this one more time given
>> >> how few of their other digital cameras they managed to sell.
>> >
>> > Why can't they make a camera with a decent pixel count, let's say at
>> > least 8-10 MP?

>>
>> Because the Foveon 3.4 MP performs as well as a 6 MP Bayer. The SD14
>> performs as well as a 10 MP Bayer. You can't compare a Bayer MP count
>> to a
>> Foveon MPcount.

>
> For the moment let's take it as a given that the 3.4 MP Foveon performs
> as well as a 6MP Bayer, then would you not expect the 4.6 MP Foveon to
> perfrom about like a 8.1 MP Bayer?
>
> After all the two ratios would then be the same.
>
> In the test shots I have seen on dpreview the SD10 seems to come in
> just a bit behind the 10D, at least to my eye, and the SD10 is way
> behind the 30D.
>
> The Foveon does better in capturing detail on a pixel level but it is
> pushing it to even call it a 2 to 1 advantage. And then what you are
> left with is a sensor that also has artifact issues.
>
> Scott
>

One of the biggest faults of the Bayer sensor is the poor color resolution
due to the spatially arranged color filtered CCD. Thankfully the world is
not bright RBG colors! The stacked Foveon RGB sensors sound ideal but
required lots of boost for the channels and color accuracy falls to pieces
at higher ISOs and noise is an issue. Sounds like another physical
limitation just like tiny sensors at high ISO.
John


 
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Randall Ainsworth
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      12-08-2006
In article <(E-Mail Removed) .com>,
Scott W <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> Of course that is not setting the bar very high


True...I've got a QuickTake 200 that will almost equal a Sigma...at
least it's built better.
 
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Randall Ainsworth
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      12-08-2006
In article <(E-Mail Removed)>, Alfred
Molon <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> Why can't they make a camera with a decent pixel count, let's say at
> least 8-10 MP?


Because they prefer to go with oddball technology that doesn't work.
 
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Randall Ainsworth
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      12-08-2006
In article <Q22eh.85$(E-Mail Removed)>, Peter A. Stavrakoglou
<(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> Because the Foveon 3.4 MP performs as well as a 6 MP Bayer. The SD14
> performs as well as a 10 MP Bayer. You can't compare a Bayer MP count to a
> Foveon MPcount.


Uh...your tinfoil needs adjusting.
 
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John McWilliams
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      12-08-2006
Scott W wrote:
> Peter A. Stavrakoglou wrote:
>> "Alfred Molon" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
>> news:(E-Mail Removed) ...
>>> In article <(E-Mail Removed). com>, Scott
>>> W says...
>>>
>>>> Many of us are surprised that they are trying this one more time given
>>>> how few of their other digital cameras they managed to sell.
>>> Why can't they make a camera with a decent pixel count, let's say at
>>> least 8-10 MP?

>> Because the Foveon 3.4 MP performs as well as a 6 MP Bayer. The SD14
>> performs as well as a 10 MP Bayer. You can't compare a Bayer MP count to a
>> Foveon MPcount.

>
> For the moment let's take it as a given that the 3.4 MP Foveon performs
> as well as a 6MP Bayer, then would you not expect the 4.6 MP Foveon to
> perfrom about like a 8.1 MP Bayer?


Arithmetic, not to mention math, have been often lacking in discussions
about the Foveon sensor.

--
john mcwilliams
 
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nospam
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      12-08-2006
In article <(E-Mail Removed)>, John
McWilliams <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:

> Arithmetic, not to mention math, have been often lacking in discussions
> about the Foveon sensor.


so very true
 
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Peter A. Stavrakoglou
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      12-08-2006
"nospam" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
news:071220061648536113%(E-Mail Removed)...
> In article <Q22eh.85$(E-Mail Removed)>, Peter A. Stavrakoglou
> <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote:
>
>> "Alfred Molon" <(E-Mail Removed)> wrote in message
>> news:(E-Mail Removed) ...
>> > In article <(E-Mail Removed). com>,
>> > Scott
>> > W says...
>> >
>> >> Many of us are surprised that they are trying this one more time given
>> >> how few of their other digital cameras they managed to sell.
>> >
>> > Why can't they make a camera with a decent pixel count, let's say at
>> > least 8-10 MP?

>>
>> Because the Foveon 3.4 MP performs as well as a 6 MP Bayer.

>
> not in objective tests it doesn't. the sd9/10 'look' as good, but the
> 'detail' is mainly due to the lack of an anti-alias filter and
> sharpening in the raw processor than any difference in the sensor.
>
>> The SD14
>> performs as well as a 10 MP Bayer.

>
> neat. the camera won't ship for thre months and you already know how
> well it will work.


I've seen photos from preproduction models, I know what I'm talking about.

> the sd-14 also costs twice what the 10mp bayer cameras do. what
> exactly is the motivation to spend more money and obtain similar
> results? not to mention that the competition excels in other ways,
> such as in-body stabilization, more capable auto-focus, etc.
>
>> You can't compare a Bayer MP count to a
>> Foveon MPcount.

>
> of course you can.



 
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kinga202NOSPAM@hotmail.com
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      12-08-2006

Kinon O'Cann wrote:
> For all the Sigmaphiles out there, the SD14 has been postponed due to a
> glitch that could not be fixed by software changes.
>
> http://www.dpreview.com/news/0612/06...4postponed.asp
>
> No comment...


Maybe the truth is the new type sensor does not produce the goods, and
photo *quality* is no better than what is around offered by others...

K202

 
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